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[flexxdk]

Lenimph wrote...

So speculation, why do you guys think Leliana fell in love with Marjolaine in the first place?

GAH! Third time I hit the "previous page" - button on this darned mouse... <_<

Since Leliana's mother died when she was young, I think that Leliana never had someone who could love her like a mother could love her children. It wouldn't surprise me that Marjolaine knew this (in one of her conversations, Leliana stated that Marjolaine was a "listening ear in times of need" (or something like that)), and took advantage of it by offering Leliana, in a sense, that "mother's love" she never had in exchange for becoming a bard. Or, as I see it, becoming Marjolaine's pawn in the game.


Or, as others have said before me, because of Leliana's weakness, vulnerability and / or innocence that Marjolaine took (or didn't took) advantage of, yadda yadda, blablabla. You know the drill.


Or Marjolaine was bored and drunk and felt like doing random stuff.

Modifié par Whacka, 18 septembre 2010 - 02:26 .

[Viva la France]

Well I think there is a chance Marj may of loved Lel, but after playing the DLC, I think Marj was using love to control people. Why I think this? the priest. Marj talked about the fun she had betweenher and the priest admitted it felt so right. So Marj knew how to manipulate people. Now as far as Raliegh (spelled wrong) Idk what his deal was. At the end of the dlc I felt bad for Lel, because Marj didn't show any sorrow towards betraying Lel, just failure.

So overall, I think Marj used Lel for her own purposes. We know Marj was married to a rich noblemen, so maybe she had her fun and did away with him too.


Anyone know where I can find the correct dialogue for the post marj convo with males.  I got her to stop saying the female line to my males, but now she just treats him like a friend in that convo.

Modifié par Viva la France, 18 septembre 2010 - 09:41 .

[Viva la France]

Whacka wrote...

Lenimph wrote...

So speculation, why do you guys think Leliana fell in love with Marjolaine in the first place?

GAH! Third time I hit the "previous page" - button on this darned mouse... <_<

Since Leliana's mother died when she was young, I think that Leliana never had someone who could love her like a mother could love her children. It wouldn't surprise me that Marjolaine knew this (in one of her conversations, she stated that Marjolaine was a "listening ear in times of need" (or something like that)), and took advantage of it by offering Leliana, in a sense, that "mother's love" she never had in exchange for becoming a bard. Or, as I see it, becoming Marjolaine's pawn in the game.

Or, as others have said before me, because of Leliana's weakness, vulnerability and / or innocence that Marjolaine took (or didn't took) advantage of, yadda yadda, blablabla.
You know the drill.

and this too.

[wickedgoodreed]

Marjolaine definitely uses love to control people (so does Leliana), but I think there is a distinction between doing that to one of your marks in "the game" like Dorothea and doing that to someone who actually knows who you are and who you work with in and out every day, presumably for years. The idea that Marjolaine is only using her seems too black and white to me, though it certainly is easy to believe she is capable of being that cold, calculating and evil. Still, I like throwing a little bit of complexity into it.

Personally, I have a strong distaste for the theory that she was with Marjolaine in some sort of twisted attempt to replace her desire for an abandoned mother's love. Mostly because to me it smacks of Freudian psychology and the idea that homosexuality is just a neurosis caused by a failure to successfully resolve the Oedipus complex. Though I suppose the beauty of the game and the way it is written is that character exposition is left perfectly vague enough to tell a good story while still leaving room for multiple valid interpretations.

[Viva la France]

I think overall its open for rp, we saw cold Marj, but we never saw the Marj that took Lel in. It is possible Marj had feelings for Lel, afterall she did teach Lel everythhing she knew. But personally from reading the codexs in the DLC, Lel says noone really knew Marj outside from being a bard. So in my opinion Marj used her winning personality on people, whos to say Lel was her only apprentice. I mean Lel is pretty easy to lie to when it comes to love, during the triangles she'll believe your lie even though she has proof against you. Espically Morrigan/ Leliana triangle, she saw Morrigan walk seductively to your tent and still believed you. Idk about Leliana/ Alistair, my fem wardens usually romance Zev or Lel. Oh yea, Le/ Zev will believe your lie even though Zev told her you were intimate.



Personally, people will hate me for this, but I like Marjolaines character. She reminds me of Borgia from Assassins Creed 2. I want to draw a Leliana Auditore picture. lol

[wickedgoodreed]

Well, in defense of Leliana, seeing Morrigan walk into your Warden's tent, while suspicious is hardly conclusive evidence of anything. And with Zevran, it's your word against his. So her giving the person she is in a relationship with, cares for, and trusts the benefit of the doubt doesn't seem that unreasonable. You don't get away with lying to her for long either, from what I gather. Leliana is smart enough to figure things out eventually.



Oh and shame on you for using and manipulating Leliana like that after everything Marjolaine put her through!

[Viva la France]

So what do you guys think Alistair thinks of the relationship between the M!Warden and Leliana. I know he was worried about him and Morrigan. I know he was jealous of the Fem Warden and Lel but his manhood thought it was hawt. lol

Anyone know if ejoslins Leliana changes are able with Damodder, I used Damodder to install dialogue tweaks

Modifié par Viva la France, 18 septembre 2010 - 06:01 .

[flexxdk]

Viva la France wrote...

So what do you guys think Alistair thinks of the relationship between the M!Warden and Leliana. I know he was worried about him and Morrigan. I know he was jealous of the Fem Warden and Lel but his manhood thought it was hawt. lol

I don't know what Alistair would think about the relationship between Leliana and a male Warden. I just can't image what his opinion would be...

[Zjarcal]

Viva la France wrote...

So what do you guys think Alistair thinks of the relationship between the M!Warden and Leliana. I know he was worried about him and Morrigan.

There's no difference in what he thinks. He's pretty indifferent about it.

[ozsras]

Ah, yes "Marjoline", we have dismissed this claim. Sorry, sorry I couldn't resist.



Anyway, I don't think it was a mother's love or innocence that had Leliana looking to Marjoline for romance. Leliana says that for most of her adult life she was a bard, before that she was with Lady Ceicily who raised her. But this is Orlais, Leliana would have been exposed to "the game" even if she wasn't apart of it because she lived with Ceicily. And she did learn some minstrel type arts from Ceicily as well. Leliana probably met Marjoline through Ceicily's connections with the rest of the nobles. (Marj had married a noble man) Since Leli said "most of my adult life" I assumed that she met Marj in her early twenties - either after Ceicily died or when Ceicily was in poor health. I don't see Leliana as a virgin when she meets Marj either - mainly because of the lifestyle she led with Ceicily. Orlais is far more open about homosexuality especially their nobility plus they are pretty lax about sexuality in general (this is just my assumption from the codexes and dialogue I've heard) than Ferelden.



Anyway, I think what probably attracted Leliana to Marj was first and foremost Marj love of adventure and playing games. Probably to Leli she didn't think of the repercussions of Marj's actions or who was hurt by them, I mean she was raised in that nobility herself so *everyone* did it and it wasn't a big deal. It was only after Marj turned on her and what happened to Tug and the rest that she realized the effect of Marj (and her) actions. Perhaps Marj did love or at least care for Leliana, as playmate in the game and just for fun, but I just don't see Marj *loving* Leliana. Well maybe she did in her own way but I don't think it was very healthy. Ultimately Marj was all about her survival no matter what - and she left Leliana to Captain Whatshisface and after that? There's no way I'll let Marj live in any of my games after *that*. Sorry Marj but you gonna *pay* for that.

[flexxdk]

I'll just stick with my theory that Marjolaine was bored and drunk and felt like doing random stuff. 

(In fact, it is more of a joke theory, as I don't really care if Leliana loved Marjolaine...)

ozsras wrote...
Ultimately Marj was all about her survival no matter what - and she left Leliana to Captain Whatshisface and after that?

You mean Commander Harwen Raleigh?

[Lenimph]

Viva la France wrote...

 I know he was jealous of the Fem Warden and Lel but his manhood thought it was hawt. lol

Yeah sure he thought it was hot but he was too much of a pu$sy/hypocrite to join in and let me have my fun.  The more I think about his lame excuse the more I slowly start hating him more and more...
 He can have a threesome with the warden and random pirate lady but someone he actually knows? Haha that's funny...<_<
As if I was going to pick him over Leliana, who I felt actually needed my warden in an emotional sense. 

Modifié par Lenimph, 18 septembre 2010 - 06:59 .

[Johnny Pothead]

Lenimph wrote...

Viva la France wrote...

 I know he was jealous of the Fem Warden and Lel but his manhood thought it was hawt. lol

Yeah sure he thought it was hot but he was too much of a pu$sy/hypocrite to join in and let me have my fun.  The more I think about his lame excuse the more I slowly start hating him more and more...
 He can have a threesome with the warden and random pirate lady but someone he actually knows? Haha that's funny...<_<
As if I was going to pick him over Leliana, who I felt actually needed my warden in an emotional sense. 

rofl
like morrigan was to much of a **** to join in.  All i'm saying is if your a male, Alistair is pretty much going to die a virgin.  I mean your warden is pretty much getting laid and he is being all "I was raised in the chantry."

anyway the only comment he makes about the warden is his gossip and 1 banter


[*]Alistair: So... this thing you and him have going? Doesn't that violate your vows?
[*]Leliana: What? What kind of question is that to just blurt out? What do we "have going"?
[*]Alistair: Yes, I'm that blind. I so totally did not see you ogling each other before.
[*]Leliana: He was not ogling me. Was he? Was he really ogling me?
[*]Alistair: Now that you say it, I'm not sure. Maybe he wasn't ogling you. I don't know... I could always ask him...
[*]Leliana: You can't do that! Could you? You couldn't do that...
[*]Alistair: I could. But I won't. Next thing you'll have me pulling his hair and passing him love letters.
[*]Leliana: I... just mind your own business. How inappropriate!

[Johnny Pothead]

and Marjolaine is hawt she can have an affair with me anyday

[Lenimph]

Johnny Pothead wrote...

Lenimph wrote...

Viva la France wrote...

 I know he was jealous of the Fem Warden and Lel but his manhood thought it was hawt. lol

Yeah sure he thought it was hot but he was too much of a pu$sy/hypocrite to join in and let me have my fun.  The more I think about his lame excuse the more I slowly start hating him more and more...
 He can have a threesome with the warden and random pirate lady but someone he actually knows? Haha that's funny...<_<
As if I was going to pick him over Leliana, who I felt actually needed my warden in an emotional sense. 

rofl
like morrigan was to much of a **** to join in.  All i'm saying is if your a male, Alistair is pretty much going to die a virgin.  I mean your warden is pretty much getting laid and he is being all "I was raised in the chantry."

[*]

At least Morrigan has the excuse that she hates Leliana. But Alistair really just says he couldn't do that. Does he tell the warden it's because he couldn't stand but being with anyone else but her? No, instead he openly admits how big of a wimp he is...  

Modifié par Lenimph, 18 septembre 2010 - 07:18 .

[Johnny Pothead]

my males couldn't stand morrigan

my females couldnt stand alistair

why are the bi options so much better then the straight ones. dam.

[Zjarcal]

Lenimph wrote...

Viva la France wrote...

 I know he was jealous of the Fem Warden and Lel but his manhood thought it was hawt. lol

Yeah sure he thought it was hot but he was too much of a pu$sy/hypocrite to join in and let me have my fun.  The more I think about his lame excuse the more I slowly start hating him more and more...
 He can have a threesome with the warden and random pirate lady but someone he actually knows? Haha that's funny...<_<
As if I was going to pick him over Leliana, who I felt actually needed my warden in an emotional sense. 

So you wanted to share Leli and Alistair... at the same time?

Poor Leli.

[ozsras]

Whacka wrote...

I'll just stick with my theory that Marjolaine was bored and drunk and felt like doing random stuff. 

(In fact, it is more of a joke theory, as I don't really care if Leliana loved Marjolaine...)

ozsras wrote...
Ultimately Marj was all about her survival no matter what - and she left Leliana to Captain Whatshisface and after that?

You mean Commander Harwen Raleigh?

Yeah, Raleigh. Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

I don't harden Leliana now, I did it once but honestly the threesome isn't that great and my Leliana romanced Wardens are quite posessive.

[Johnny Pothead]

I just got the dialogue tweaks mod and kissed Lel in front of Morrigan

Lel: mmmmmmmmmmmmm
Morrigan: I DO NOT SHARE
Lel: maybe not

I was like is Lel that scared of Morrigan.  I was like whats the worse Morrigan going to do to Lel, turn her into a frog.   And only LI Lel will get physical with is Zev. Idk why. she said she'll think about it.

Modifié par Johnny Pothead, 18 septembre 2010 - 07:29 .

[Johnny Pothead]

ozsras wrote...

Whacka wrote...

I'll just stick with my theory that Marjolaine was bored and drunk and felt like doing random stuff. 

(In fact, it is more of a joke theory, as I don't really care if Leliana loved Marjolaine...)

ozsras wrote...
Ultimately Marj was all about her survival no matter what - and she left Leliana to Captain Whatshisface and after that?

You mean Commander Harwen Raleigh?

Yeah, Raleigh. Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

I don't harden Leliana now, I did it once but honestly the threesome isn't that great and my Leliana romanced Wardens are quite posessive.

yea the threesome sucked, I usually do the foursome.

[wickedgoodreed]

ozsras wrote...
Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

Indeed!  Where are the Marjolaine decapitation pics when you need them?

*searches* I know there were some earlier in this thread that were very cathartic...

EDIT: A ha! Here they are: Die Marjolaine, die! Thanks to Zjarcal for the glorious blow-by-blow replay.

Modifié par wickedgoodreed, 18 septembre 2010 - 07:54 .

[Johnny Pothead]

wickedgoodreed wrote...

ozsras wrote...
Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

Indeed!  Where are the Marjolaine decapitation pics when you need them?

*searches* I know there were some earlier in this thread that were very cathartic...

Is it just me or is Marjolaine hawt? just saying.

[wickedgoodreed]

Johnny Pothead wrote...

wickedgoodreed wrote...

ozsras wrote...
Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

Indeed!  Where are the Marjolaine decapitation pics when you need them?

*searches* I know there were some earlier in this thread that were very cathartic...

Is it just me or is Marjolaine hawt? just saying.

Um...If you find women who both figuratively and literally stab you in the back and then persistently try to have you killed attractive, then...sure! 

[Johnny Pothead]

wickedgoodreed wrote...

Johnny Pothead wrote...

wickedgoodreed wrote...

ozsras wrote...
Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

Indeed!  Where are the Marjolaine decapitation pics when you need them?

*searches* I know there were some earlier in this thread that were very cathartic...

Is it just me or is Marjolaine hawt? just saying.

Um...If you find women who both figuratively and literally stab you in the back and then persistently try to have you killed attractive, then...sure! 

she wouldn't be the first girl to stab you in the back in DA...................*cough* Anora *cough*

[ozsras]

wickedgoodreed wrote...

ozsras wrote...
Bad enough betraying Leiana and using her like that but to throw her to the wolves like that? Die Marj, die.

Indeed!  Where are the Marjolaine decapitation pics when you need them?

*searches* I know there were some earlier in this thread that were very cathartic...

I think they are way back in the thread, but yes *very* cathartic. And the things that are implied about what happens to Leliana during her time of captivity... Oh yes, Marj you must die. Usually I play sane, reasonable characters but when Marj shows up...yeah sane and reasonable go out the window.