9726 réponses à ce sujet

[Giggles_Manically]

Yes I used WinRAR because Charasen recomended it. Was that the right one to use?

[adneate]

Someone posted in the Nathanial thread, the Leliana thread must maintain it's dominate position over that thread at all times.

[epoch_]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

While I tried to get it to work nothing happened, even though I just pasted them all in without a folder. Its so annoying that only about half the mods I have gotten seem to work.

Use the da:o mod manager. Download the .override version of the mod. Drag and drop the override to the mod manager. Done.

[Giggles_Manically]

adneate wrote...

Someone posted in the Nathanial thread, the Leliana thread must maintain it's dominate position over that thread at all times.

Sorry but Mel_reduux may come in here soon since I flamed her over her lovely Leliana pic. Tempted to post one of the meaner alistair pics I have but thought better of it.

[Giggles_Manically]

epoch_ wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

While I tried to get it to work nothing happened, even though I just pasted them all in without a folder. Its so annoying that only about half the mods I have gotten seem to work.

Use the da:o mod manager. Download the .override version of the mod. Drag and drop the override to the mod manager. Done.

I actually PMed Charsen and have to delete a few party event.dlg files in some of my other mods to use it, I asked which ones speciffically and am waiting. It is a monument to a how annoying EA is with how many damn bugs there are in the ending. Literally I hit about 5 game breaking ones.

[adneate]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

adneate wrote...

Someone posted in the Nathanial thread, the Leliana thread must maintain it's dominate position over that thread at all times.

Sorry but Mel_reduux may come in here soon since I flamed her over her lovely Leliana pic. Tempted to post one of the meaner alistair pics I have but thought better of it.

I hope that doesn't happen nobody wins when that sort of stuff goes down. Some of the people in the Alistair thread hate Leliana, so what? Their inability to derive enjoyment from something isn't a result of "wrongthink" it's personal preference. I can't enjoy Zevran as a character because he reminds me of people who I don't like, I wish I could enjoy the character but I can't, who goes out to purposely find less things in life to enjoy.

[Sarah1281]

nerdage wrote...

That's a bit extreme, she just tells you about her experiences of elves, being pretty much raised by an Orlesian noble that's probably all she knows of elves. Maybe she put it a bit clumsily but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to be offended by it, but I always found the Dalish a bit touchy I suppose.

I'm sorry but being offput by the revelation that someone that you might have been attracted to is racist against you (and not realizing that you are racist does not make you any less racist nor does being informed of this mean that you are automatically going to change all of your subconscious racism immediately) and having it kill the attraction is not extreme.

[Master Shiori]

It's fine is people dislike a certain character as long as they don't go off badmouthing him.



Personally, I dislike a few DA:O companions as well, but avoid commenting on them.

I prefer to spend my time discussing the ones that I do enjoy, like Leliana and Morrigan.

[Giggles_Manically]

Sarah1281 wrote...

nerdage wrote...

That's a bit extreme, she just tells you about her experiences of elves, being pretty much raised by an Orlesian noble that's probably all she knows of elves. Maybe she put it a bit clumsily but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to be offended by it, but I always found the Dalish a bit touchy I suppose.

I'm sorry but being offput by the revelation that someone that you might have been attracted to is racist against you (and not realizing that you are racist does not make you any less racist nor does being informed of this mean that you are automatically going to change all of your subconscious racism immediately) and having it kill the attraction is not extreme.

Sarah please do not take offense but Leliana is far from racist. I have actually met and talked to actual racists and she does not act like them at all, when  confronted about what she actually thinks she changes her mind and apologizes, no actual racist person would ever do that. This is coming from a guy who got invited to a skin head meeting in grade 9 because I got a buzzcut, and I thought hey "the cool kids invited me somewhere neat" Then I was all like oh nuggets this is somewhere where I shouldnt be. Or from having to listen to anti-immigrant speeches from my Grandmother for the 2 hour drive to Edmonton.

A true racist is motivated deep down by fear and mistust, plus a good deal of ignorance about what actually goes on with another race, or ethnicity. I have family who hit on all three of these ,Leliana on the other hand qualifies only according to the last one. PLus the fact that she is willing to get into a relationship with an elf testifies to the fact that she changes her ways in the end. My Peace and COnflict prof is smiling right now I bet.

I did get a little annoyed by that but she does apologize quite nicely in the end. Sadly if you take it so badly you serve as a rather good example of a thin-skinned and easily offended individual.  I am not trying to be rude but if Leliana is a racist, then Zathrian is a moderate and open minded role model


 

[Giggles_Manically]

Master Shiori wrote...

It's fine is people dislike a certain character as long as they don't go off badmouthing him.

Personally, I dislike a few DA:O companions as well, but avoid commenting on them.
I prefer to spend my time discussing the ones that I do enjoy, like Leliana and Morrigan.

My sister hates Alistair for dumping in front of the Landsmeet, then calling her a dirty little, infertile elf mage in front of all her friends, according to her. She really got angry with him and cant stand him at all. The only Bioware game where I actually liked all of the companions is Jade Empire.

[Liquidcz]

Sarah1281 wrote...

nerdage wrote...

That's a bit extreme, she just tells you about her experiences of elves, being pretty much raised by an Orlesian noble that's probably all she knows of elves. Maybe she put it a bit clumsily but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to be offended by it, but I always found the Dalish a bit touchy I suppose.

I'm sorry but being offput by the revelation that someone that you might have been attracted to is racist against you (and not realizing that you are racist does not make you any less racist nor does being informed of this mean that you are automatically going to change all of your subconscious racism immediately) and having it kill the attraction is not extreme.

Because she doesn't apologize after that discussion >.<

Edit: basically what Giggles said. What Leliana says to an elf is quite inconsiderate, but you are totally overreacting.

Modifié par Liquidcz, 14 juin 2010 - 08:47 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Liquidcz wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

nerdage wrote...

That's a bit extreme, she just tells you about her experiences of elves, being pretty much raised by an Orlesian noble that's probably all she knows of elves. Maybe she put it a bit clumsily but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to be offended by it, but I always found the Dalish a bit touchy I suppose.

I'm sorry but being offput by the revelation that someone that you might have been attracted to is racist against you (and not realizing that you are racist does not make you any less racist nor does being informed of this mean that you are automatically going to change all of your subconscious racism immediately) and having it kill the attraction is not extreme.

Because she totally doesn't apologize after that discussion.

Get the ZDF, there is a bug present that for some reasons stops her from apologizing if you are in a relationship, while if you arent she does apologize.

[Liquidcz]

Giggles_Manically wrote...
Get the ZDF, there is a bug present that for some reasons stops her from apologizing if you are in a relationship, while if you arent she does apologize.

I have a spare sarcasm detector, if you don't have one 

[Giggles_Manically]

Liquidcz wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...
Get the ZDF, there is a bug present that for some reasons stops her from apologizing if you are in a relationship, while if you arent she does apologize.

I have a spare sarcasm detector, if you don't have one 

aaaahhhhh

Modifié par Seagloom, 26 juin 2010 - 10:21 .

[Nerdage]

I think from now on we should use a different font colour to indicate sarcasm, is there a sarcastic colour?

[adneate]

Yellow?

Yellow Is Totally Sarcastic!

Modifié par adneate, 14 juin 2010 - 09:13 .

[Sarah1281]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

nerdage wrote...

That's a bit extreme, she just tells you about her experiences of elves, being pretty much raised by an Orlesian noble that's probably all she knows of elves. Maybe she put it a bit clumsily but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to be offended by it, but I always found the Dalish a bit touchy I suppose.

I'm sorry but being offput by the revelation that someone that you might have been attracted to is racist against you (and not realizing that you are racist does not make you any less racist nor does being informed of this mean that you are automatically going to change all of your subconscious racism immediately) and having it kill the attraction is not extreme.

Sarah please do not take offense but Leliana is far from racist. I have actually met and talked to actual racists and she does not act like them at all, when  confronted about what she actually thinks she changes her mind and apologizes, no actual racist person would ever do that. This is coming from a guy who got invited to a skin head meeting in grade 9 because I got a buzzcut, and I thought hey "the cool kids invited me somewhere neat" Then I was all like oh nuggets this is somewhere where I shouldnt be. Or from having to listen to anti-immigrant speeches from my Grandmother for the 2 hour drive to Edmonton.

A true racist is motivated deep down by fear and mistust, plus a good deal of ignorance about what actually goes on with another race, or ethnicity. I have family who hit on all three of these ,Leliana on the other hand qualifies only according to the last one. PLus the fact that she is willing to get into a relationship with an elf testifies to the fact that she changes her ways in the end. My Peace and COnflict prof is smiling right now I bet.

I did get a little annoyed by that but she does apologize quite nicely in the end. Sadly if you take it so badly you serve as a rather good example of a thin-skinned and easily offended individual.  I am not trying to be rude but if Leliana is a racist, then Zathrian is a moderate and open minded role model

I've met racists, too, and it's ridiculous that you phrased your meeting them as some sort of novelty. I think everyone has. Racism does not have to be motivated by fear or hatred and can merely be rooted in ignorance. Racism is simply viewing or treating someone different based on their race. One of the responses you can have to that is:
PC: You may not be cruel but you still see us differently.
Leliana: I...I did not realize that. It is so strange, how long-held beliefs just seem natural and...right. Like there is no other way to feel. (VO: Apologetic and awkward)
Or, to translate: 'God, you're right, I am racist against elves but I didn't mean to be!'

Do you really think that all racists are as extreme as skinheads? She admits that she is racist right there and so me echoing what she says isn't being extreme. And what does Zevran have to do with Leliana's racism? It's kind of a non-sequitur.

I get that you guys really like the character and don't want to think anything bad about her but she comes to realize that she is racist. It is one of her flaws. To her credit, she does work to change this but it's still there and won't be as easy as 'I never realized I was racist. From this moment on I will never think of elves and humans differently or treat them differently again.'

You mention her having a relationship with an elf? Why not? They are "pleasing to look at" after all and since her racism is not motivated in hatred - although if you've seen the Dalish conversation where she talks about Dalish kidnapping and dragging away women and children then there may be some fear - she could overlook that when falling in love.

You don't have to go deciding that I must be thin-skinned (not like that has anything to do with this either as that means that Leliana's remarks can still be seen as offensive) just because I would not want to date someone racist against me. That's perfectly reasonable just as your deciding that since she's well-meaning you can overlook it and try to help her past her racism.

[Sarah1281]

Liquidcz wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

nerdage wrote...

That's a bit extreme, she just tells you about her experiences of elves, being pretty much raised by an Orlesian noble that's probably all she knows of elves. Maybe she put it a bit clumsily but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to be offended by it, but I always found the Dalish a bit touchy I suppose.

I'm sorry but being offput by the revelation that someone that you might have been attracted to is racist against you (and not realizing that you are racist does not make you any less racist nor does being informed of this mean that you are automatically going to change all of your subconscious racism immediately) and having it kill the attraction is not extreme.

Because she doesn't apologize after that discussion >.<

Edit: basically what Giggles said. What Leliana says to an elf is quite inconsiderate, but you are totally overreacting.

Are you honestly telling me that the fact that someone is racist against me (even if they don't mean to be and haven't realized it until I point it out but then agree that they are) making me decide to not pursue a romantic relationship with someone even though I will still try to be friends with them is overreacting? 

[Nerdage]

Literally I guess you're right, but the word 'racism' has certain connotations that just don't seem right (that's what  I meant by "extreme"). I can only think of two times that she mentions your being an elf, and I don't think either of those times does she actually talk about her opinions short of saying "I'm supprised your an elf", which I didn't think was worth getting upset about. I always thought the only reason she apologized was becasue they give you pretty much no option but to act really hurt, which always annoyed me.

Modifié par nerdage, 14 juin 2010 - 09:56 .

[adneate]

I thought they said she was being racist but her racism was motivated by ignorance and societal conformity rather than a deep rooted personal hatred. I suppose I can understand if that takes away any romantic feelings, but it's not severe and she does say she was wrong in her beliefs. Honestly it could go either way at that point, you might decide what she said was sufficient and be able to continue a relationship or it might change your view of the character for the rest of the game. I can't imagine a Dalish getting involved with a human on any level since they are among the most xenophobic people around, and getting involved with them would go against an entire childhood of racial indoctrination.

[Liquidcz]

Sarah1281 wrote...
Are you honestly telling me that the fact that someone is racist against me (even if they don't mean to be and haven't realized it until I point it out but then agree that they are) making me decide to not pursue a romantic relationship with someone even though I will still try to be friends with them is overreacting? 

Yes it is, and I underlined the part why I think so. She doesn't show her racism again after that, so from that we can safely assume she reconsidered her stance towards the elves.

[Sarah1281]

Well you know how it is: if you love a character enough you will find a way for your character to be on good terms with them/date them even if that confuses those who are not as much of a fan.

[Sarah1281]

Liquidcz wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...
Are you honestly telling me that the fact that someone is racist against me (even if they don't mean to be and haven't realized it until I point it out but then agree that they are) making me decide to not pursue a romantic relationship with someone even though I will still try to be friends with them is overreacting? 

Yes it is, and I underlined the part why I think so. She doesn't show her racism again after that, so from that we can safely assume she reconsidered her stance towards the elves.

It is unreasonable to hold it against her forever and yes, you can probably assume that given she admits that this isn't right that she makes an effort. It does not mean that she can completely change an entire lifetimes worth of beliefs that quickly and it is unreasonable to expect it to.

If any romantic feelings you could have had for her is killed in the conversation because you realize that she is racist and never reawaken then that's hardly unreasonable.

[Liquidcz]

Well now I'm looking at the conversation in the toolset, and she doesn't even say that it's her view on the elves. She barely describes the position of elves in Orlais. She doesn't say that she finds elves pleasing to look at, or that they deserve such position, or anything like that. It's sad that the only possible PC's reactions are the butthurt ones.

[adneate]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Well you know how it is: if you love a character enough you will find a way for your character to be on good terms with them/date them even if that confuses those who are not as much of a fan.

I honestly don't know what you want people to say other than "You are 100% right about everything Sarah." People have said how they feel about, they've done so in a rational way and you respond with "Your all too blind to see the truth I'm dishing out." The Dalish one is harsher it does make people uncomfortable and it can be reasonable that it would turn a character off to her romantically. All they've added is that they think it is also reasonable for a character to decide a person can change bigoted views and offer forgiveness to a person. If you believe that a person doesn't deserve a second chance then don't give it out, some people have said that they believe a person like Leliana offered forgiveness and a relationship can be formed if it is so desired. That doesn't sound like blind unrational devotion.