674 réponses à ce sujet

[Arttis]

i did not see the word promise

[Azazel005]

While i am unsurprised that things got heated in here, there is some disappointing amounts of sensationlism. I agree with Mr Woo's appraisal that they seem "Damned either way". I have bene unimpressed with the choice that was made which was one of substantial silence on the matter though. Victor's update is appreciated, and being updated every month or so as the project progresses would continue to be appreciated.



I think that is a reasonable expectation, everyone is limited by financial considerations and human limits. I don't expect anything outside being informed as much as possible. I may not be necessarilly happy with the news, I may want it 'ALL NOW' or what not that is my problem as the consumer and there is nothing you can be expected to do about that.



A steady stream of information I think is all a lot of people want, those that wish to be upset and target such announcements with arguments and demands simply clutter the field, which I suppose the forum rules prohibit correct? Perhaps a tougher policy on that would allow information to be revealed without feeling like "Artillery" needs to be navigated.

[Branji]

ladydesire: I don't know how Bioware does things, but with most companies it's the developer who fixes the bugs, then they send it to the one who ported it. So it should be Bioware fixes bugs; send bug fixes to Edge of Reality; Bioware & EoR make sure things are okay; patch sent for approvals; fans get patch. (I think that's the proper order other companies use, I could be wrong.)





Arttis: you really need to read the posts earlier in this thread. They explain why fans are unhappy (especially console). Very short version: Bioware kept claiming fixing bugs and "working on it". Yet no results for 7 months. Then they announced a whopping 3 bugs fixed. Bioware brought this on themselves.



Hopefully everything will work out.

[Branji]

By the way, they don't have to use the word "promise".

[contown]

Will any of the serious ending glitches be fixed?

[Arttis]

another whopping 5 bug fixes could come out in the next month.

Give them time they could be working on a ton of things all at once.

I still say over reaction

[Arttis]

Branji wrote...

By the way, they don't have to use the word "promise".

imo for it to be a promise you need the word promise:P

[Azazel005]

Branji wrote...

ladydesire: I don't know how Bioware does things, but with most companies it's the developer who fixes the bugs, then they send it to the one who ported it. So it should be Bioware fixes bugs; send bug fixes to Edge of Reality; Bioware & EoR make sure things are okay; patch sent for approvals; fans get patch. (I think that's the proper order other companies use, I could be wrong.)


Arttis: you really need to read the posts earlier in this thread. They explain why fans are unhappy (especially console). Very short version: Bioware kept claiming fixing bugs and "working on it". Yet no results for 7 months. Then they announced a whopping 3 bugs fixed. Bioware brought this on themselves.

Hopefully everything will work out.

I understand people being discontent, but what are you really expecting to achieve here? They are at least giving some information and attatchment, it really has reached a point where you walk away or accept it. Irrespective of whether you think Bioware has been lazy or ineffiecient, uncaring or any other descriptor you can't make them work faster.

Discontant voiced, opinion stated.

[BrunoB1971]

Arttis wrote...

another whopping 5 bug fixes could come out in the next month.
Give them time they could be working on a ton of things all at once.
I still say over reaction

No Bioware and EA has enough people and enough money to hire an entire team of people to redo the whole darn game if they want to.

Their prority is to make cash as  all companies want and need to do. The original game was released then some dlc's then an expansion pack then some more dlc's. It is not hard to see that their main motivation is to generate revenue. Again it is a company and they have to answer to their shareholders and make them money.

patching is a money drain because it is basically paying people to fix things that wont generate revenue.

But the 2 sides of the coin is if you patch it will cost you money and you fix the game, people are happy and you buy more from them cause you're happy.

If you leave the product in state of abandonware then people are unhappy and decide to go on to better things.

But as humans we always fall for hype and succomb to promise of a miraculous product that will change our world and entertain us beyond anything we have seen before, yet again we will buy the flawed product and yet again the company will make money and fools out of us.

The hype machine is already rolling, Dragon age 2 is already announced, yet it may be still vaporware as we speak but yet again, people bite on the bait and have in mind that companies can't do no wrong because they had a few major successes.

We have to grow out of this mentality, we have to look at each prodcut on its own merit and not on the company's good name and luck so far.

EA and Bioware's only intent is to get your money at this point. They have proven that very point by putting out product priority before fixing the original game priority.

The evidence is not hard to see and fanboys have to realize this.

the only way to react in a really mature way about this is not to argue at each other in this forum but to just hit them where it hurts the most, their wallet.

There are tons of games out there waiting to be discovered, studios begging for a chance and willing to go the extra mile to please you. We have to stop having that sort of drug like addiction to one specific game or allegience to a company and check out other venues of entertainment.

Many people here do want to see the game suceeed and i have stated this many times over. But corporate greed got in the way of the dream and the wrong leadership is running the show right now. We cannot change that.

That is how it is...pointing fingers at each other here is fruitless, it will not produce anything concrete. Word of mouth and expressing your opinion with honesty and fair judgment onto other areas of the world wide web will produce far more reaching results than bickering here about something that might never come.

I told people that the BBB will listen to complaints if they seem validated. A lot of people here have fair complaints and they have stated them. Why not take the time to file in a complaint that would "maybe" generate some type of results.

This is a forum, it is like writting on a piece of paper. No one here as to honor anything they say because this site can be shut down and disappear in a matter of seconds but if you do make your voice heard thru real live human bureucratic means then "maybe " your concern will be looked at and not dismissed as rant but legitimate concerns.

I invite people to think about the best way to make their opinions "really" count...


nuff said for now....

[ladydesire]

Branji wrote...

ladydesire: I don't know how Bioware does things, but with
most companies it's the developer who fixes the bugs, then
they send it to the one who ported it. So it should be Bioware
fixes bugs; send bug fixes to Edge of Reality; Bioware & EoR
make sure things are okay; patch sent for approvals; fans get
patch. (I think that's the proper order other companies use, I
could be wrong.)

Many of the script bugs that we (PC users) got fixed could have, and probably should have, been included in the Title updates that came out when Return to Ostagar was released, since those should be the same no matter what the hardware is (if I understand how the DA toolset works properly); I'm almost positive that Bioware would have made any fixes like that available to EoR for inclusion in it. Why they didn't get included, only those involved know, and they aren't telling.

[Zy-El]

I think you guys are neglecting an important part of the development chain. Yes, it starts with the source code change from Bioware then goes to Edge of Reality for conversion to the consoles. But lastly, it has to then get by Micro$oft, $ony and Nonetendo's collective QA process before they'll allow any updates to their respective platforms. This approval process by the big companies could take weeks or even a month or two.

[ladydesire]

BrunoB1971 wrote...

Arttis wrote...

another whopping 5 bug fixes could come out in the next
month.
Give them time they could be working on a ton of things all at
once.
I still say over reaction

No Bioware and EA has enough people and enough money to
hire an entire team of people to redo the whole darn game if
they want to.

If this was true, then they wouldn't have laid people off 4 or 5 months ago, and EA wouldn't have turned off a bunch of authentication servers for older games. We need to stop looking at part of the picture when looking at businesses.

[Apex Sammoth]

Feraele wrote...

Apex Sammoth wrote...

Will this actually fix the performance issues on the PC version ? I mean I been waiting since Nov for the %100 processor issue, CTD, just to name a few. My PC has been tested over and over, all games I own run great on it and I am well above the Recommend specs. As Of Right now I have un- installed DOA because of the lack of support for the game. You guys gathered info for it last year and nothing has been fixed. Yet you "Bioware" didn't waste any time putting out DLC and Expansions. Niether I have bought thx to the lack of support for the core game. In other words would I be wasting my time on reinstalling the game again just to find out the patch did nothing like the 1.03 patch did ?

Bug fixer team is separate and apart from the DLC and Expansion teams.     Bug fixer team is working on fixes for all three platforms, which after its been found, run through tests,   recreated..etc  then they have to run it by Sony's certification, or Microsoft or Nintendo.     Thats the part that takes time,  and if the "fixed bug" fails one of those three certifications..then its back to the drawing board....til its fixed again..and sent through all the necessary processes.

If it was only PC, or only console..then I assume the bug fixes would be out alot faster, being that its all three platforms...this is what takes the longest.   Some bugs are specific to a platform, some affect all...

Just read what Stanley wrote. 

I'm just going to say this once because I am not going to get into a consumer debate with anyone. I don't care who does what at Bioware. They have resources "My Money And Others" that are spent and divided into part of a company just like any other company. There Lack of Resources dedicated to these problems is by far "Crap" These problems have been present since NOV 2009. I will not as I said  "not buy anything  DLC Expansions untill the core is fixed". I do understand how the patching system works. I was just stating if this upcomming fix actually going to fix anything. Seeming that 1.03 did NOTHING. I have been through this before on this DOA forums before with people who just "assume" that others dont understand how a patch gets done.

[Arttis]

The new patch gave let me get an achievement.

If you are at lvl 19 and gain 2 levels then lvl to 21 you do not get the achievement for lvl 20 rogue/mage/warrior

now i do get it

so it fixed something for me at least.

[mofofofo]

um can i finish the game without it crashing now or is the archdemon guaranteed crash still in game?

[13Dannyboy13]

Wicked 702 wrote...
None of the "fixes" that the patch notes for the PC versions detail are in the console "patches". Console patches for Xbox have so far: 1: Broken Specializations (Supposed fixed achievements), 2: Fixed the broken specializations, 3: Prepared game for Awakenings (1.03, without all the gameplay changes of the PC version like the dex bug, added plenty new bugs), and 4: Prepared game for Darkspawn Chronicles.

PS3 users have gotten one additional patch that fixed the crashing issues introduced by last month's PSN firmware update. Otherwise, pretty similar to the Xbox patches.

So explain to me exactly what they've "fixed" so far. Please, I'd love to know. OHHHH, wait. I almost forgot who I'm talking to. (Sarcasm) The guy who doesn't need facts to make a point. Funny how you call it a "small little clique" yet the vast majority of posts in this here thread (and many others) are people WITH PROBLEMS.

Facinating.....

This is the issue that has most people upset, during the time that those patches mentioned above were released, the only response we got in all that time was a quick "we're looking into it, and only at the same time as new dlc was being released. This has led people to believe that they only read the forums right near dlc time for some quick PR damage control, to try and get more people to buy the dlc. Whether or not that's the case, the fact that the same response was given for the last seven months with nothing to show for it except silence after the dlc was released just reinforced this thinking. People that are upset have every right to be, some of us have lost hundreds of hours and multiple characters, had characters made useless from other bugs, and a main stat that hasn't worked properly since day one.
That being said, this thread is definitely a step in the right direction, it's nice to have at least a little info on what is being fixed. This should have been done months ago though, even a  thread just for devs to come on once a week or something to keep people updated would have gone a long way to easing peoples anger. The worry now though, is just how long will this patch take to come out, it's been almost eight months already and we just get word now that something is being worked on.
What they do next is going to influence how a lot of people view this game and the company in general, hopefully it will be a great patch, released in a timely manner, and we will see more threads like this much sooner when there are bugs that need addressing.

[less_than_three]

Really, here is my *personal* take of this annoucement.

- I *liked* DA:O A lot.
- I *liked* 1.02b and earlier patches
- Patch 1.03 was a huge regression, and deeply hated it.

After 3+ months the regression was not acknowledged by Bioware. That's 3 months of being silent while a show stopping regression made its way into the product. I'm referring specifically to the varioius bugs posted within this forum as well as others which include CTD's, pickpocketing, etc. There were various other bugs as well concerning consoles which I really don't know much about being that I played on PC.

- The above alone also leads me to believe that there really isn't a QA team.
- Additionally my emails to EA/Bioware have gone unanswered.

I like the fact that they have a patch coming down the pipe, but for many people the damage is already done. People are pissed for many reasons, but for *me*, it's the lack of response from EA/Bioware.

All they *had* to do was acknowledge the problem and provide regular updates to the fixing of those problems. That's it! Not 3 months down the road (for PC, longer for consoles), That's all they had to do.

Instead, they released a new DLC, announced DA2, and prolly other things I'm missing. The game is broken...period. It should have been their priority to fix in. It clearly wasn't.

I'm not going to say "you fanbois this/that", because I *was* one. You can only be a fan until they spit in your face, which they've done. How anyone is defending EA/Bioware at this point is beyond me. "The game works.....but you have to do.....", doesn't fly with me. If I need to do something extraordinary to get it to run, then it's broke. Do I have a workaround to get the game to run? Yes, but that doesn't mean I have *working* game. It's broke.

#######
## Opinion
#######
Personally, I would expect this to be an eye opener for those that had put faith into EA/Bioware like I had done in the past. Credible companies would do everything to retain their user base. This to me just means their less credible which in turn would make me think twice about purchasing anything more from them. I don't know what everyone else's plans are, but personally I probably won't be buying anymore DLC's, Awakenings, DA2, anything else from EA/Bioware without it being marked down to a couple of bucks. 1) The special unique items that come from DLC's ARE NOT worth this much hassle. 2) The lack of response from techs/devs/bioware/ea/whomever is no good 3) I'm pissed.

Anyways, sorry about the rant. Good gaming everyone.

Modifié par less_than_three, 09 juin 2010 - 04:14 .

[GithCheater]

The customer is usually right (especially when not irate and abusive).

I believe that Bioware started to turn a corner and become more organized regarding patching about one month after the 1.03 patch ... starting with this thread (asking for more community support) on all tech support forums (including Mac):

http://social.biowar...9/index/2155818

Any further ranting and flaming about the time frame prior to this post serves no constructive purpose and continues to poison Bioware's work environment. It is water over the bridge and nothing can be done to reclaim prior lost time. Also, please remember that it until took 2 months after the 1.02a patch was issued before the buggy 1.03 patch was issued.

Furthermore, I believe that the issuance of this current announcement thread last Friday is also a positive development.

I believe that before the above "tech support" topic was started two months ago, that Bioware was overwhelmed with a variety of issues and that the culmination of these multiple issues ended up with Bioware spinning their wheels somewhat and trying to do too much at once. For example, I believe that the following issues destructively synergized and might have left Bioware stunned like a "deer in the headlights":

1. Bioware slammed for 8 month DAO delay (it was not ready) and accused of selling out to consoles.
2. Social site was overwhelmed and buggy after DAO release.
3. RTO's scheduled "holiday season" release did not happen.
4. A major bug in a title update further delays RTO, and ultimately delays the PS3 release of RTO even more.
5. Awakening (and patch 1.03) is released on time, but with many bugs.
6. Finally, Bioware's "bizarre" Bazaar ultimately resulted in an apology from Ray and Greg.

At about the time of Ray and Greg's apology, the above linked tech support thread was issued.

I believe that Bioware is now making slow but steady progress on a patch, and have not abandoned maintenance of DAO. Obviously, this patch will not be released "NOW NOW NOW", especially considering the 1.03 snafu. I think Bioware is being extra cautious to avoid a buggy 1.04 patch.

The current poisonous state of this social site is not constructive and certainly does not help develop a proper patch.

Modifié par GithCheater, 09 juin 2010 - 04:28 .

[less_than_three]

GithCheater,

Any further ranting and flaming about the time frame prior to this post serves no constructive purpose and continues to poison Bioware's work environment.

I'll agree certainly that it isn't constructive for BIOWARE/EA, but keep in mind this is a community forum, and stuff like this matters to the community. The community is pissed and they are venting. Where else do you propose the community vent their frustrations? If you have a better place, then certainly let's consider it. Maybe EA/Bioware should create a pissed off customers forum.



The bugs have been known now for MONTHS, and I really don't think BIOWARE/EA need to search that hard to find them. If you like I can point to, oh I don't know, thousands of responses to various bugs at this point? Hell, they don't even need to search the forums, all they need to do is PLAY THE GAME. QA comes to mind.

I believe that Bioware is now making slow but steady progress on a patch, and have not abandoned maintenance of DAO.

I agree with this statement with one exception. Maintenance of DAO should have come first, before awakenings, RTO, etc. The perception that people ultimately have come to is EA/BIOWARE being greedy. Perception is huge, and the perception that everyone has is for lack of better words; "WTF?".

The current poisonous state of this social site is not constructive and certainly does not help develop a proper patch.

There are 60+ forum postings in just these two forums detailing technical problems:



http://social.biowar...4/index/1626900

http://social.biowar...4/index/2803211



Poisonous? Absolutely. Warranted? Absolutely.

[Arttis]

I quite use to games with bugs never getting fixed.

But then im use to console games.

[Ildaron]

Arttis wrote...

I quite use to games with bugs never getting fixed.
But then im use to console games.

Because you find a lack of quality acceptable does not mean the rest of us are willing to depart our hard earned money for a game lacking in value. A bug ridden game without the hint of support (in progress is a meme now for a good portion of those posting on these fourms) is something of which I (and others it seems) is not something that is very valuable.

[Arrtis]

Ildaron wrote...

Arttis wrote...

I quite use to games with bugs never getting fixed.
But then im use to console games.

Because you find a lack of quality acceptable does not mean the rest of us are willing to depart our hard earned money for a game lacking in value. A bug ridden game without the hint of support (in progress is a meme now for a good portion of those posting on these fourms) is something of which I (and others it seems) is not something that is very valuable.

its good that you want better but how your going about it is not very good.
THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU WANT
you guys got your point across continuing imo
only serves to hurt you

[Ildaron]

Arrtis wrote...

Ildaron wrote...

Arttis wrote...

I quite use to games with bugs never getting fixed.
But then im use to console games.

Because you find a lack of quality acceptable does not mean the rest of us are willing to depart our hard earned money for a game lacking in value. A bug ridden game without the hint of support (in progress is a meme now for a good portion of those posting on these fourms) is something of which I (and others it seems) is not something that is very valuable.

its good that you want better but how your going about it is not very good.
THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU WANT
you guys got your point across continuing imo
only serves to hurt you

Actually it doesn't hurt me. There are other games, franchieses, and hobbies which desire my money. I can very easily spend my money on those things (and shall). Bioware only hurts itself in not supporting its customers, ailinating its customers, and not realizing the so called vocal minority doesn't speak  just here on the fourms. It is along the lines of writting a letter to complain about any product, for every one person who is complaining there is likely 1000 who do not. To be fair the same could be said about those who are still trying to defend the game. Bad press however spreads faster then good press and is remembered more then good press.

[Arrtis]

So then go if there are other options for you?

Focusing on the bad for no real reason does not make sense.

I suppose not everyone makes sense in thier actions.

spreading bad press because you didnt get everything the exact way you want it makes some sense i suppose.

Then again people get way too damn serious about games.

/half the bugs reported could be easily happen because of overheating/

They have given us a patch and yet people complain.Oh well forums have never been the best place to get a good idea how things stand unless your able to pull off what the tali fans can.

[Bahlgan]

But as humans we always fall for hype and succomb to promise of a miraculous product that will change our world and entertain us beyond anything we have seen before, yet again we will buy the flawed product and yet again the company will make money and fools out of us.

This, right here! Wanna know the sad thing about this? There is no way to get around it. There will always be monopolistic companies which will drain others' blood, sweat, and tears, and the only people who really CAN do anything about it are the global economic fat cats who choose to keep digging into the flesh and skulls of the defenseless and the weak.



In this case, I feel as if not only myself, but others (most of which have it worse than I do) have indeed paid our blood, and more importantly time, in order to pay for a product which was considered the best RPG game of the year (2009). Working on a degree in gaming design and was hoping I could find a company to work for whose job (other than profit, of course) was to use their legendary skills to amaze the vast crowds of those seeking entertainment. I certainly know which company I will not intend to work for at this point, despite my thanks for their releasing of a patch of merely three fixes. Sure sure, go ahead fanboys, bring that "there will be more later" **** to me, to which I reply: You can never take anything for granted; not the air you breathe, not the existence of your dear parents, or not even your own identity. Trust me, I lost all three at one point, but am not willing to discuss publicly. You can be damn certain that assuming there actually WILL be more, a concept more believable to lose than your oxygen supply, is foolish.



With that said, as biased as I may be atm, I am done with my opinions here, unless someone cares to shoot me down. I have seen too many complaints at this point to be nice about it and just cannot any longer give others the impression I like to donate money instead of purchasing products.