161 réponses à ce sujet

[Arttis]

Hey we can be good stay at home dads.

[Mordaedil]

Feraele wrote...

LOL! I've been married for 18 and don't think my hubby is "that" much of a pig...well not now anyways hehe

There are some good men out there, but they are as rare as good women. So, it's a balance.


If we're going to have sexual rape that offends the average male comfort zone, it'd almost have to be either a form of sodomy or some sort of pornographic form they are not accustomed to. Vore comes to mind, but that turns some men on as well, so I'm at a loss.

[Agent Verona]

Feraele wrote...

How can we be the "weaker" sex...I don't see it. We do all the nurturing, care for family, education..etc. Physically we don't have "upper body" strength but there are some things that we can do that you as a male cannot do, I don't see females as weak by any means, and many times we can best you in conversation as well. *wink*

Yeah, I gotta call you on the 'nuturing, care for the family' part right there. My brother in law is a stay at home dad. And he's probably gunna stay that way because there's no way for him to get a better job then my sister. He obliterates my mean sister in the nurturing catagory. AND he's still very manly and stuff.

[Agent Verona]

...You were the one who made it seem like only women could take care of children. But maybe you just phrased it badly.

[Agent Verona]

Feraele wrote...

Finn Malcolm wrote...

...You were the one who made it seem like only women could take care of children. But maybe you just phrased it badly.

No thats not what I meant...in general yes, most times we have that job, I guess I was talking about child bearing..things like that, but trying to be subtle about it.  lol  so much for that.

Anyhoo....I still think realism contributes alot to a storyline in an RPG...and by that I mean some sex, some nudity and other things that contribute to draw the player in.   I am NOT talking about graphic anything.   Although graphic violence these days seems to be more acceptable than anything else...in video games and movies.

Alright then, that I understand. Glad to have cleared that up.

Graphic violence is so boring now. I'm only in my 20's, so I grew up around it pretty constantly and am compleatly spent on blood and gore. I'm all for romance though, I'm one of those annoying mushy girls who get's drawn into the romantic subplots.

[Baelin Firestorm]

Finn Malcolm wrote...

Feraele wrote...

Finn Malcolm wrote...

...You were the one who made it seem like only women could take care of children. But maybe you just phrased it badly.

No thats not what I meant...in general yes, most times we have that job, I guess I was talking about child bearing..things like that, but trying to be subtle about it.  lol  so much for that.

Anyhoo....I still think realism contributes alot to a storyline in an RPG...and by that I mean some sex, some nudity and other things that contribute to draw the player in.   I am NOT talking about graphic anything.   Although graphic violence these days seems to be more acceptable than anything else...in video games and movies.

Alright then, that I understand. Glad to have cleared that up.

Graphic violence is so boring now. I'm only in my 20's, so I grew up around it pretty constantly and am compleatly spent on blood and gore. I'm all for romance though, I'm one of those annoying mushy girls who get's drawn into the romantic subplots.

Ever play Final Fantasy 10 or 10-2? Hate to admit it, but both of those games got to me. Hit the "mushy" nerve, big time!

[Arttis]

Never played X-2 fully through but i have for X and i cared little for yuna...if only she would have just married the guy save me so much trouble...

[Agent Verona]

Baelin Firestorm wrote... Ever play Final Fantasy 10 or 10-2? Hate to admit it, but both of those
games got to me. Hit the "mushy" nerve, big time!

OH GOD. I couldent even finish FF 10-2. My brain like.....Died. It was like a Spice Girls RPG.

Modifié par Finn Malcolm, 21 octobre 2009 - 10:05 .

[Arttis]

So you didnt like it either...and i thought someone said it was for the female audience...

[Baelin Firestorm]

Arttis wrote...

So you didnt like it either...and i thought someone said it was for the female audience...

I'm a big fan of brand loyalty. If I play a game and like it, I'll more than likely play any sequels even if they start to pale in comparison to the predecessors. As mentioned before, I've been playing games for many years, so I've played / experienced pretty much everything.

[Arttis]

Ive played a ton of games ranging from final fantasy to tenchu or tenchi cant remember.

Probably played 300 different console games and tons of demos...

[KmAI]

Deviija wrote...

I like how everything is suddenly about the woman and female nudity specifically. Female prostitutes, females being raped, females being naked... If we're doing nudity and mature situations, then it can easily be applied to men just as easily as women. It bothers me when a topic that is broad an encompassing like mature situations, nudity, and the evolution of the gaming medium, seemingly ends up turning a narrow focus on simply women being naked and/or victimized in the hypotheticals. I'm all for mature and adult situations, but not if it is going to revolve solely around one gender over another.

Not to be rehashing but effectively the issue is that the squeakiest wheel gets the oil, and gaming companies are most effective at tuning out the squeeak of women.

In the most primitive terms
Hetero gamer man sees a dong, gets up in arms, flails about his new sexual identity trauma. Did this make him gay? Complains to friends about how gay the game is, and then bang : You lose out on an entire market of tarded bros.

Hetero female gamer sees boob or various other nudity, rolls their eyes about a male dominated market or makes some kind of forum post pointing it out but largely will still buy it because they know bioware at least tries to give the appearance of said boob context. (Its not like its some kind of keanu reeves vampire orgy movie)

Homosexual Male/Female seem largely dismissed and marginalized while occasionally being thrown a token relationship or two.. but not too much as angry hetero gamer man may start squirming.. blogging and talking about how "perverse"(See example) the genre is getting because it includes men who kiss, rather than chainmail bikini'd damsels and various other victims and steriotypes that don't talk much so he can thrust whatever ideals he wants them to represent onto them.

[gethsemani87]

There are some easy social mechanics in the works here too. First of all, most gamers are guys. Thus, including naked women is more effective than including naked men. There's also the fact that most of the groups (not all of them) that disagree with seeing nudity and sex in games also believe in that sin is hereditary on the female side and that a good woman is a chaste woman as not to tempt men.



As for women as the victims that Devija wrote about, this is where it really gets interesting. There are several studies that have been made about who people sympathise the most with. As it turns out, a young adult woman crying provokes the most emotional engagement in all age and gender categories. A young adult woman in danger also invokes the most emotional response and willingness to help from all categories.



So what? you ask me now. It is simply clever marketing. More people in the target audience will be "aroused" by naked women than naked men. And more people all around will be interested in a game that has trailers showing women in danger rather than men.

[dragoager]

So the main points of maturity rating for a video game discussed in this thread predominantly revolve around sex.



1. How much skin is too much?



2. Women taking a more dominant role in their character's love life, and not just being reduced to objects of conquest for a strong male lead (i.e. blond bikini clad bubble heads who can only say "yes" and "tee hee")



3. Homosexuality and transsexualism in general.



I wonder if there are achievements for your character having more than one sexual partner...... a Farm-a sutra if you will. How much "grinding" would it take?

[SheffSteel]

Won't somebody please talk to the children?

I think that a lot of the trouble that western society has with "mature themes" (okay, sex and violence) is closely related to how that society treats its children. There is a very common conception that children need to be protected from adult things. Partly this is based on the fact that children just won't understand, and may be upset by them, but partly too I think parents just don't want to make the effort. Taking time to sit down with junior and explain that some people enjoy casual sex with strangers, and sometimes people do violent and bloody murder, etc. is a lot harder than avoiding the issue entirely. Companies such as Walmart make it much easier to do this, through their policy of not stocking adult products - not even music CDs with "Parental Advisory" stickers. TV networks likewise are very cautious about what they will broadcast, and hedge their shows with very conservative rating / warning labels.

I'm glad that Bioware has the 'nads to (1) show us some real life, death, and love (2) not make a big thing about it.

[Eshaye]

Arttis wrote...

So you didnt like it either...and i thought someone said it was for the female audience...

It's not geared at any gender at all. The FF community has a rather equal number of male and female fans. FF10-2 is different and actually was geared at girls with all the mini games, gurl powa and one of the endings has the ending some people wanted in 10, a happy one.

FF can be really different from each other which is part of the allure. FF11 doesn't count as being part of the regular series because it's online, it plays like Everquest, the original, it's really slow and there's a good chance you'll be lost not knowing what to do or where to go for some time... XD

Anyway what? Adult content?

I think it's nice we get games with more mature themes and scenes more and more. It's been years since we tried to educate non gamers that they should really pay attention to the labels just like music and movies. Give it another 10 years and this won't be such an issue anymore, people as a mass are just slow to learn.

[Whist Darkblade]

Well, to start off with. It is just plain unnatural for a man to stay home and raise the kids. Think of your parents, and grandparents. They turned out better than the people of my generation could ever even hope to be (im almost 21), but this i would say goes up to include 30 year olds.



The main reason is because, as the years have come and gone, things have been easier to get. You see kids in middle school and coming into highschool, with stick arms. No im not saying that im some ripped body-builder, but ive asked these kids "have you ever raked the yard, or cut the grass?" and they say no, then they would go onto say that their dad stayed home and did all of that work



And i was like WHAT!!!!!!!! Obviously the matriarch of the house should never have to do physically demanding jobs like that. Not because she couldn't but because she has other skills. (like cooking and cleaning, and caring for the kids)



Now, when the dad stays home, the kids do get another perspective but generally if a man is to overly emotional, then he demeans himself, and sets a poor example for his offspring. Being emotional in-of-itself is not bad. but think of how much a of a better place this would be if people did not complain about how poorly their lives are going?



In terms of like, "oh wow, i wish i had a new car. or my wife looks so ugly, why did i ever marry this dumb broad (it can go the other way to)" People complain about things that arent nessacary. IF you have a disease or cancer or something like that, then you have a right to complain but please dont. You demean yourself by doing that. Im not saying that it is easy, but realize that it could still EVEN be worse!

[Whist Darkblade]

I have diverged from what my main point was. If the dad stays home, then the children get the impression that the dad staying home is okay, and it is not. The reason is becuase it is UNNATURAL! Im not saying that the guy cant stay home, but it is not what is in the best intrest of the children.



Now, factor this in with videogames. If parents play these "mature" games around their children, the violence or mature matierial whatever it may be, WILL scar their minds, it WILL!!!!!!! Now, ive wrote 3 25+ page research papers, detialing the psychological effects of violence and sex on young children (19 and under).



Mature games are rated Mature for a reason. And if parents dont monitor what they are allowing their kids to play, watch, or even listen to (this includes at friends house's) then they themselves dont deserve to be called "parents"



Mature content, or at least a mature approach to rpg's (the goal of any character-based videogame, movie, story, etc) is to get the audience to identify with the presented characters and associate on a mental level with the choices they make. So it is essential to have a mature approach





THANKS BIOWARE!!!!!!

[greatestjourney]

Whoa, I just joined 2 minutes ago and I found a hugely misogynistic post. It's not unnatural for a guy to stay home and raise kids and the woman doesn't automatically have cooking and cleaning as their "skills".

[AClockworkMelon]

Whist Darkblade wrote...

I have diverged from what my main point was. If the dad stays home, then the children get the impression that the dad staying home is okay, and it is not. The reason is becuase it is UNNATURAL! Im not saying that the guy cant stay home, but it is not what is in the best intrest of the children.

What the hell are you talking about?

Now, factor this in with videogames. If parents play these "mature" games around their children, the violence or mature matierial whatever it may be, WILL scar their minds, it WILL!!!!!!! Now, ive wrote 3 25+ page research papers, detialing the psychological effects of violence and sex on young children (19 and under).

What the hell are you talking about? For every two bit scientist in need of work who makes a report on how violent videogames and exposure to nudity scar children, there's another who disagrees. Personally, I think it's ludicrous to think that seeing an exposed female nipple (as if it's different at all from a male nipple) will somehow harm your child. If the child is old enough to connect a ****** with sex and not be repulsed by it, the sexual change within that child has already begun.

Mature games are rated Mature for a reason. And if parents dont monitor what they are allowing their kids to play, watch, or even listen to (this includes at friends house's) then they themselves dont deserve to be called "parents"

Well at least here you don't sound like a crazy person.

Mature content, or at least a mature approach to rpg's (the goal of any character-based videogame, movie, story, etc) is to get the audience to identify with the presented characters and associate on a mental level with the choices they make. So it is essential to have a mature approach

I spoke too soon.

THANKS BIOWARE!!!!!!

No. Thank YOU.