374 réponses à ce sujet

[smudboy]

Warfister wrote...
There you go again with the hostility, you want my argument? Your videos were low quality, horrible sound, snarky,opinionated spin doctored trash of a wanna be game critic that served no purpose other than to try and toot your own horn and possibly rile up fans who like the game. Just about anyone could see the plot holes if they look close enough, but most people probably aren't so offended by the problems with ME2 that they waste time making crappy youtube videos about them.

Friends, friends.  Truly you can do better than this?  Attacking the means of production, not the content?  That's like saying Ecael is a 2D hack because of its/his/her/whatever improper use of the marquee tool.

Just about anyone could see the plot holes?  Perhaps.  But could they all make entertaining videos discussing it?

Addtionally, can you now make any kind of argument here?  I'm still waiting.  Again, you're addressing my character, and now my ability to make videos, but not the content of them.  Truly if you can do better, exhalting the game play, or the plot: nothing is stopping you.

Do continue.

But like i said previously, everyone is entitled to their opinion, and you're certainly free to waste your time however you like, its your attitude that stinks, you simply cannot have a conversation on these boards without attacking anyone that has a differing opinion than yours.You are pretty much a troll , you have nothing constructive to say and cannot argue without insult or pathetic attempts at sarcasm. You are not asking for debate , you are looking to incite, what do you expect when you post something like this on the forums of a game? that fans of it will not come to it's defense? You open yourself up to criticism when you post this , just as the game devs open themselves to criticism when they release a game, you have to take the good with the bad.

What attitude?  I'm argumentative.

You attack my character, I attack you right back.

I'm not exactly asking for debate, but if you wish to provide one, go right ahead.

If you wish to argue my video editing skills suck, well, sure.  I guess they do.  I don't personally care.  Apparently they offend you, just as much as the content.  Maybe I can call you a nice guy, and you'd get offended at that, too?

smudboy can do no right.

Ecael should make a motivational over that.

I'm sure you will have some super witty comments and insults in reply , or tell me to **** off or whatever other gems you come up with that are as original as your videos. Have a great day.

What?  That's why we have this: Anti-plot hole!

[Warfister]

What content? the snarky,opinionated ,spin doctored trash of a wanna be game critic? Or do you only read the parts that you think you can make a witty reply to? As to me making a video extolling the virtues of ME2 , there is no need, the game's sales speak for themselves, hell, they got your money.



I guarantee if you were to change your attitude and be more open to others ideas, you would find much less hostility here, there is nothing wrong with making videos or critiques,but there is something wrong with being hostile towards anyone that critiques your "work".All facets of your work are open to criticism, the sound, the content, the production , all of it.If you can't hear what someone is saying there isnt much point in watching it. No one expects proffessional editing or 5.1 surround, but an audible voice with good articulation would be a good start.

[smudboy]

Warfister wrote...
What content? the snarky,opinionated,

Yes, if you like.

spin doctored trash of a wanna be game critic?

No.

Who's a wanna be game critic?

I made videos on the plot, and some E3 and TV shows.  Never did I critique the game, give it a score, say how good/bad a certain game play element was.

I'm all about the plots, yo.

Or do you only read the parts that you think you can make a witty reply to? As to me making a video extolling the virtues of ME2 , there is no need, the game's sales speak for themselves, hell, they got your money.

No I read all of your deliciousness in its entirety.  Also between the lines.  In between raisin glosettes.  NOM NOM NOM.

I guarantee if you were to change your attitude and be more open to others ideas, you would find much less hostility here, there is nothing wrong with making videos or critiques,but there is something wrong with being hostile towards anyone that critiques your "work".All facets of your work are open to criticism, the sound, the content, the production , all of it.If you can't hear what someone is saying there isnt much point in watching it. No one expects proffessional editing or 5.1 surround, but an audible voice with good articulation would be a good start.

I'm argumentative.  Eez about eet.

What hostility?  You're one big fluffy happy fellow.  You big lug.   Look at all those wonderfully grammatic sentences of yours!  They bring happy tears to my cold, dark soul.

Luckily I didn't voice the Marketing of Errors vid.  But you think it's one big pile of hogwash.  Yup.  We're arguing how rubbish it is.  Or arguing nothing.  Or something?  Well whatever works for you.

*looks for argument*

*psst it's supposed to be funny.*

[ZJR7621]

Why the hell do people think that everything will go smooth when they hate on a game.(Especially on its forum!)...this isnt gameinformer no one wants to hear the opinion of some D-bag thinking his opinion is worth two ****s.

[Ecael]

smudboy wrote...

Ecael wrote...

adam_grif wrote...

The probes are programmed to land on the other side, take photos, then jump back to the O4 relay.

So the probes will also have an onboard Reaper tech AI and a Joker clone to navigate the debris field that the probes will be "bullrushing" into upon exiting?

Huh?

Probe, comm buoy, other ship, satellite, etc.

Upon entering the relay, whatever you send will rush directly forward into the debris field. Joker and EDI working together barely made it through - how could a probe even make it past the initial debris to scout the area?

Ecael should make a motivational over that.

Actually, I don't make motivationals (despite there being a 200-page thread for that).

:innocent:

Motivationals are simply unoriginal on the internet, much like people's complaining of BioWare (and people have been complaining using YouTube ever since the website started).

[Khayness]

smudboy wrote...

Who's a wanna be game critic?

You'd get to play games for a living, and all you have to do is to conjure up some nonsense in a condescending way. I totally would!

[Tooneyman]

Argumentative is a good thing, as long as it not over emphasied. This way you don't loose the people in the argument. haha, but really its always fun to make fun of things period. If I was serious all the time about Mass effect the game would be fun anymore right?

[smudboy]

Ecael wrote...
Upon entering the relay, whatever you send will rush directly forward into the debris field. Joker and EDI working together barely made it through - how could a probe even make it past the initial debris to scout the area?

A small object is considerably more maneuverable in space than a large one (watch the video where Joker does his thing.  Loads of room for a probe-sized object to maneuver on AI.)  Let alone being smaller = smaller target.  The issue would be power of its thrust in relation to the velocity it achieves after decelerating from "relay space."  I don't recall EDI doing anything then.  I'm not sure how two "entities" would each control piloting at the same time.

Actually, I don't make motivationals (despite there being a 200-page thread for that).

[Ecael]

smudboy wrote...

A small object is considerably more maneuverable in space than a large one (watch the video where Joker does his thing.  Loads of room for a probe-sized object to maneuver on AI.)  Let alone being smaller = smaller target.  The issue would be power of its thrust in relation to the velocity it achieves after decelerating from "relay space."  I don't recall EDI doing anything then.  I'm not sure how two "entities" would each control piloting at the same time.

That doesn't mean motorcycles and bicycles don't get hit by or run into cars, though.

EDI knows more about the Omega-4 relay than we are told, as she is constantly deciphering the data from the Disabled Collector Vessel. She can plot possible paths through the debris field while Joker makes the human decisions of which route to take - after all, some routes may be subjectively more dangerous than others, and Joker's job is to not get the Normandy totaled by the end.

[InvaderErl]

Won't the defense drones pick up the probe approaching and just take it out?

Meaning you don't get any data AND the Collectors know you're coming now and its fair for them to expect the Collectors will be able to detect it since they've proven they can see straight through the Normandy's stealth systems.

Modifié par InvaderErl, 10 juin 2010 - 07:42 .

[smudboy]

Ecael wrote...

smudboy wrote...

A small object is considerably more maneuverable in space than a large one (watch the video where Joker does his thing.  Loads of room for a probe-sized object to maneuver on AI.)  Let alone being smaller = smaller target.  The issue would be power of its thrust in relation to the velocity it achieves after decelerating from "relay space."  I don't recall EDI doing anything then.  I'm not sure how two "entities" would each control piloting at the same time.

That doesn't mean motorcycles and bicycles don't get hit by or run into cars, though.

EDI knows more about the Omega-4 relay than we are told, as she is constantly deciphering the data from the Disabled Collector Vessel. She can plot possible paths through the debris field while Joker makes the human decisions of which route to take - after all, some routes may be subjectively more dangerous than others, and Joker's job is to not get the Normandy totaled by the end.

Sure.  But motorcycles and bicycles don't work in a 3D vacuum, nor have the maneuverability.  (Just watch the vid.  A probe sized object has loads of room.  And if you lose a probe?  Launch another: maybe with better/stronger pushy thingies sci-fi calls thrusters.  Maybe code one to just stop.  The larger the mass and surface area, the more difficult it is to turn left and right in outer space.)

I'm sure EDI is more sophisticated than other AI's out there.  But making an AI that plots a course that doesn't hit another object in outer space isn't that complicated (I mean we're talking about a few things here, but in the ME universe it's quite basic.)

[jgordon11]

Wouldn't sending a probe be kind of useless because of the following outcomes:

1. ends up in a blackhole
2. probably can't use normal ftl communications b/c every kind of radiation would be absorbed by surrounding black holes (you are in the galactic core although cerberus doesn't know that)
3. possible limits of the quantum entanglement communications if used, perhaps is only good for human communication and not great at communicating large datastreams. I know still able to communicate with illusive man in station, but is possible.
4. destroyed on impact to surrounding debris field
5. destroyed almost instantly by occulus before any data can be recorded and collectors are alerted of attempts to cross relay
Seems to me since every attempt to cross the relay has so far failed which probably included some probe attempts unless people are seriously not that curious. To equip multiple probes with quantum entanglement communications (which you probably dont think is even necessary due to not knowing destination) and all the necessary systems to send them across the relay to just have them destroyed consistently without any knowledge gained seems like not the best idea and a waste of money especially since you probably know that it will fail like every attempt before you has.
Why didn't they probe after they got the IFF? b/c they're whole crew got kidnapped and making probes that could do all of that and handle the reaper IFF without killing itself might be a little difficult to do quickly (there is a time factor here).

Modifié par jgordon11, 10 juin 2010 - 08:47 .

[glacier1701]

jgordon11 wrote...

Wouldn't sending a probe be kind of useless because of the following outcomes:

1. ends up in a blackhole
2. probably can't use normal ftl communications b/c every kind of radiation would be absorbed by surrounding black holes (you are in the galactic core although cerberus doesn't know that)
3. possible limits of the quantum entanglement communications if used, perhaps is only good for human communication and not great at communicating large datastreams. I know still able to communicate with illusive man in station, but is possible.
4. destroyed on impact to surrounding debris field
5. destroyed almost instantly by occulus before any data can be recorded and collectors are alerted of attempts to cross relay
Seems to me since every attempt to cross the relay has so far failed which probably included some probe attempts unless people are seriously not that curious. To equip multiple probes with quantum entanglement communications (which you probably dont think is even necessary due to not knowing destination) and all the necessary systems to send them across the relay to just have them destroyed consistently without any knowledge gained seems like not the best idea and a waste of money especially since you probably know that it will fail like every attempt before you has.
Why didn't they probe after they got the IFF? b/c they're whole crew got kidnapped and making probes that could do all of that and handle the reaper IFF without killing itself might be a little difficult to do quickly (there is a time factor here).

1. The whole debris field shows that you dont end up in a black hole. That field is not protected unlike the base apparently.
2. FTL communication is through the relay. If SHIPS can move around then comms will not be a problem because that movement means you are not near the black hole.
3. You wouldnt use quantum entanglement - after all that is expensive and probes need to be cheap because in a way you expect that they will get totalled.
4. If you are sending all the time the fact that a probe MIGHT get destroyed by hitting debris will at least give you something. That is when you go through you already know that you had better be ready to avoid the debris field. If we hadnt had such a good pilot as Joker we'd have been toast because we went in blind.
5.If the probe survived then yes that is going to be something that could happen. There is always some risk in recon. The problem though is that while the Collectors know we can come through they do not know WHEN we might come through. Besides whats to stop us from following up with 'guided' bombs? Even if some got totalled on the debris it would take that debris out of our way or out of the way of follow up missiles. And now they really got problems - they have to be constantly on the alert for our missile attacks which could suddenly be a fleet invasion.

We dont know that time is a factor until after we finally board the Base. While it is HARD losing your crew in the end stopping the Collectors/Reapers is the goal. Choices have to be made and people die (and this is what did NOT come out of the game) and that is part and parcel of the ongoing war (or should be if BioWare had bothered to put that in as part of plot/story). Think how much more tension there would have been if the choice YOU had to make was to recon and lose people OR not recon and rush in blind losing other people. None of this life or death decision making was ever present. Who do you sacrifice and who do you save? Nope all we got was bullrush in and only after we get to the Base do we find that time was a factor. How much better would it have been if we knew before hand that time mattered (unlike the whole of the game)?

[FourSixEight]

jgordon11 wrote...

Wouldn't sending a probe be kind of useless because of the following outcomes:

1. ends up in a blackhole
2. probably can't use normal ftl communications b/c every kind of radiation would be absorbed by surrounding black holes (you are in the galactic core although cerberus doesn't know that)
3. possible limits of the quantum entanglement communications if used, perhaps is only good for human communication and not great at communicating large datastreams. I know still able to communicate with illusive man in station, but is possible.
4. destroyed on impact to surrounding debris field
5. destroyed almost instantly by occulus before any data can be recorded and collectors are alerted of attempts to cross relay
Seems to me since every attempt to cross the relay has so far failed which probably included some probe attempts unless people are seriously not that curious. To equip multiple probes with quantum entanglement communications (which you probably dont think is even necessary due to not knowing destination) and all the necessary systems to send them across the relay to just have them destroyed consistently without any knowledge gained seems like not the best idea and a waste of money especially since you probably know that it will fail like every attempt before you has.
Why didn't they probe after they got the IFF? b/c they're whole crew got kidnapped and making probes that could do all of that and handle the reaper IFF without killing itself might be a little difficult to do quickly (there is a time factor here).

People have theorized that the Omega-4 Relay simply rips apart anything that doesn't have the IFF, and presumably that debris is sent flying into the Tartarus Field. That, or there's some very advanced weapon in the Field that automatically locks onto and smashes to bits anything that doesn't disrupt their friend-foe targeting systems.

If that's the case, then sending a probe would be a waste of valuable time and resources that could be spent actually getting inside the Tartarus Field. Or maybe Cerberus is just afraid poking the Relay too much will cause a Collector fleet to come pouring out, hence the swift surgical strike the Normandy provides.

Modifié par FourSixEight, 10 juin 2010 - 09:15 .

[jgordon11]

glacier1701 wrote...

jgordon11 wrote...

Wouldn't sending a probe be kind of useless because of the following outcomes:

1. ends up in a blackhole
2. probably can't use normal ftl communications b/c every kind of radiation would be absorbed by surrounding black holes (you are in the galactic core although cerberus doesn't know that)
3. possible limits of the quantum entanglement communications if used, perhaps is only good for human communication and not great at communicating large datastreams. I know still able to communicate with illusive man in station, but is possible.
4. destroyed on impact to surrounding debris field
5. destroyed almost instantly by occulus before any data can be recorded and collectors are alerted of attempts to cross relay
Seems to me since every attempt to cross the relay has so far failed which probably included some probe attempts unless people are seriously not that curious. To equip multiple probes with quantum entanglement communications (which you probably dont think is even necessary due to not knowing destination) and all the necessary systems to send them across the relay to just have them destroyed consistently without any knowledge gained seems like not the best idea and a waste of money especially since you probably know that it will fail like every attempt before you has.
Why didn't they probe after they got the IFF? b/c they're whole crew got kidnapped and making probes that could do all of that and handle the reaper IFF without killing itself might be a little difficult to do quickly (there is a time factor here).

1. The whole debris field shows that you dont end up in a black hole. That field is not protected unlike the base apparently.
2. FTL communication is through the relay. If SHIPS can move around then comms will not be a problem because that movement means you are not near the black hole.
3. You wouldnt use quantum entanglement - after all that is expensive and probes need to be cheap because in a way you expect that they will get totalled.
4. If you are sending all the time the fact that a probe MIGHT get destroyed by hitting debris will at least give you something. That is when you go through you already know that you had better be ready to avoid the debris field. If we hadnt had such a good pilot as Joker we'd have been toast because we went in blind.
5.If the probe survived then yes that is going to be something that could happen. There is always some risk in recon. The problem though is that while the Collectors know we can come through they do not know WHEN we might come through. Besides whats to stop us from following up with 'guided' bombs? Even if some got totalled on the debris it would take that debris out of our way or out of the way of follow up missiles. And now they really got problems - they have to be constantly on the alert for our missile attacks which could suddenly be a fleet invasion.

We dont know that time is a factor until after we finally board the Base. While it is HARD losing your crew in the end stopping the Collectors/Reapers is the goal. Choices have to be made and people die (and this is what did NOT come out of the game) and that is part and parcel of the ongoing war (or should be if BioWare had bothered to put that in as part of plot/story). Think how much more tension there would have been if the choice YOU had to make was to recon and lose people OR not recon and rush in blind losing other people. None of this life or death decision making was ever present. Who do you sacrifice and who do you save? Nope all we got was bullrush in and only after we get to the Base do we find that time was a factor. How much better would it have been if we knew before hand that time mattered (unlike the whole of the game)?

1. The whole point of the reaper IFF was so that we did land in the safe zone and not a black hole.  If you don't have that then you end up like the ships in the debris field or those are just the lucky ones who made it into the safe zone by chance and were then killed by collectors.  EDI like actually explains the whole thing to you saying that there is a small safe zone that normal mass relay jumps can't always get in due to the amount of drift (too much drift = death). 
2. Ok then there are no comm buoys, so no normal FTL communications or need reaper IFF to access it mass relay communications, so regardless probes can't communicate anything they find back.  So probes are useless.
3. Yeah they probably wouldn't but if they did, just trying to show that there are mutliple reasons why they didn't just send a probe in.
4. Without reaper IFF we would either end up in a black holes gravity well (= your ****ed) or in the massive debris field and still screwed anyways.  The whole point of the reaper IFF was that we could make ACCURATE jumps through the omega 4 relay to the small safe zone (EDI tells you this).  But oh yeah since the reapers probably would be like oh lets put a comm buoy here in our secret base that anyone could use and even you said they wouldn't use quantum entanglement then the probe would arrive and promptly be destroyed by occulus without ever being able to get its message off.  Hence no one has ever been heard since they cross (destroyed either through failed jump or destroyed by collectors and no way of sending off message).
5. So a probe gets lucky and makes it into the safe zone, then is destroyed by occulus, but oh no it can't communicate b/c no comm buoy so still useless.

...the point i was making was that time becomes a factor once your crew is kidnapped which is also right when you are able to go through the mass relay.  My point was that the didn't probe because to replicate IFF and install it on probes to send out would take a while.  A probe with reaper IFF might have been able to communicate back, but at that time there was a time constraint not to mention collectors could continue their work.  Also another reason is that perhaps the reaper IFF could only be successfully integrated into a ship with an advanced AI like EDI to prevent it from completely disabling their ship.

Regardless: Probe without reaper IFF is destroyed by jump or makes it by shear luck and is destroyed anyways and is still unable to communicate back to other side of relay.  SO not using probes is not a plot hole...

Also guided bombs seriously?...  I don't even want to list the ways that clearly just wouldn't work at all.

[smudboy]

jgordon11 wrote...
1. The whole point of the reaper IFF was so that we did land in the safe zone and not a black hole.  If you don't have that then you end up like the ships in the debris field or those are just the lucky ones who made it into the safe zone by chance and were then killed by collectors.  EDI like actually explains the whole thing to you saying that there is a small safe zone that normal mass relay jumps can't always get in due to the amount of drift (too much drift = death). 

Hmm?  If the whole point of the IFF is to correct for drift, then the ships that made it were either extremely lucky, or had some kind of IFF solution of their own.  Without that, there wouldn't be any ships exactly where the Normandy winds up.

2. Ok then there are no comm buoys, so no normal FTL communications or need reaper IFF to access it mass relay communications, so regardless probes can't communicate anything they find back.  So probes are useless.

And what's wrong with using a probe that returns?  Or a comm buoy?  Or a combo of both?

(This is a similar argument to the whole ship upgrade issue: you just press a button, spend some minerals, and boom, upgrade.  Wouldn't it have made sense for it to be a mission/quest of itself?)

3. Yeah they probably wouldn't but if they did, just trying to show that there are mutliple reasons why they didn't just send a probe in.

No, if they did, then great; we have a quantum-entanglement probe, and no need for a comm buoy/have the thing return.

4. Without reaper IFF we would either end up in a black holes gravity well (= your ****ed) or in the massive debris field and still screwed anyways.  The whole point of the reaper IFF was that we could make ACCURATE jumps through the omega 4 relay to the small safe zone (EDI tells you this).  But oh yeah since the reapers probably would be like oh lets put a comm buoy here in our secret base that anyone could use and even you said they wouldn't use quantum entanglement then the probe would arrive and promptly be destroyed by occulus without ever being able to get its message off.  Hence no one has ever been heard since they cross (destroyed either through failed jump or destroyed by collectors and no way of sending off message).

We could?  More like "we don't know."  All the better reason to test.

5. So a probe gets lucky and makes it into the safe zone, then is destroyed by occulus, but oh no it can't communicate b/c no comm buoy so still useless.

This is the same point you made before.  I failt to see the complexity of having a probe be a comm buoy, or having the probe be programmed to return.  Or a combination of the two.

...the point i was making was that time becomes a factor once your crew is kidnapped which is also right when you are able to go through the mass relay.  My point was that the didn't probe because to replicate IFF and install it on probes to send out would take a while.  A probe with reaper IFF might have been able to communicate back, but at that time there was a time constraint not to mention collectors could continue their work.  Also another reason is that perhaps the reaper IFF could only be successfully integrated into a ship with an advanced AI like EDI to prevent it from completely disabling their ship.

That is not an issue of time.  That is an issue of motivation.

It would not take a grand amount of time, considering TIM does it on multiple ships if you preserve the base and get the worst ending.  Aside from also negating your other point of the IFF going "helter skelter" on a probe, you already have a working one after the whole Joker mission fiasco.

Regardless: Probe without reaper IFF is destroyed by jump or makes it by shear luck and is destroyed anyways and is still unable to communicate back to other side of relay.  SO not using probes is not a plot hole...

Who said it was a plot hole?

Also guided bombs seriously?...  I don't even want to list the ways that clearly just wouldn't work at all.

And why not?  Your whole argument is the probes are going to get destroyed/not communicate/not work.  So if we launch a piece of ordinance directly into the debris, the kablooie.  Debris gone.  Ditto with the Oculus (depending on range.)  Hell, send a dozen.  Then send some probes.

(I swear the concept of sending in probes has been used in all the Stargate series in virtually every episode.)

[Ecael]

smudboy wrote...

(I swear the concept of sending in probes has been used in all the Stargate series in virtually every episode.)

Then we shall use the Ewoks Hanar to defeat the Reapers.

I saw the concept in Star Wars.

[InvaderErl]

smudboy wrote...

And why not?  Your whole argument is the probes are going to get destroyed/not communicate/not work.  So if we launch a piece of ordinance directly into the debris, the kablooie.  Debris gone.  Ditto with the Oculus (depending on range.)  Hell, send a dozen.  Then send some probes.

You're talking about some pretty ****ing massive explosions to do that kind of damage in space.

I don't even know if the Mass Effect universe has weapons on that scale.

[smudboy]

Ecael wrote...

smudboy wrote...

(I swear the concept of sending in probes has been used in all the Stargate series in virtually every episode.)

Then we shall use the Ewoks Hanar to defeat the Reapers.

I saw the concept in Star Wars.

Sorry I have no idea wtf you're talking about, but I think you're just trying to be funny.

The idea that a Stargate is a door to another world, that no one has been before, is pretty darned similar to the idea of the Omega-4 relay.

[smudboy]

InvaderErl wrote...

smudboy wrote...

And why not?  Your whole argument is the probes are going to get destroyed/not communicate/not work.  So if we launch a piece of ordinance directly into the debris, the kablooie.  Debris gone.  Ditto with the Oculus (depending on range.)  Hell, send a dozen.  Then send some probes.

You're talking about some pretty ****ing massive explosions to do that kind of damage in space.

I don't even know if the Mass Effect universe has weapons on that scale.

You mean nukes?

Yes.

[InvaderErl]

Nukes don't do a lot of damage in space, at least in terms of area of effect, on account of the vacuum.

Modifié par InvaderErl, 10 juin 2010 - 10:54 .

[Ecael]

smudboy wrote...

Ecael wrote...

smudboy wrote...

(I swear the concept of sending in probes has been used in all the Stargate series in virtually every episode.)

Then we shall use the Ewoks Hanar to defeat the Reapers.

I saw the concept in Star Wars.

Sorry I have no idea wtf you're talking about, but I think you're just trying to be funny.

The idea that a Stargate is a door to another world, that no one has been before, is pretty darned similar to the idea of the Omega-4 relay.

So this "Stargate" you speak of, is it a prequel to Mass Effect 1?

[jgordon11]

smudboy, if returning probes work then why has no ship EVER returned from the omega 4 relay? If a probe could get there and return unharmed then why couldn't the tons of ships which were destroyed. You need the reaper IFF to do it otherwise you die. Cerberus is aware of the fact that if anything/anyone goes beyond the omega 4 relay is never heard from again only the collectors are able to do this. Thats why he sends you into the trap because he knows that falling into their trap is the only way for the collectors to actually let you find this stuff out about the IFF.

Why wouldn't a probe work after we have the IFF?
The IFF could not be replicated due to advanced technology so we only have one at this point and near future. IFF to work and not screw up systems would require an advanced AI to control it (dangerous and wasteful). So would still need special communications as conventional equipment wouldn't work without comm buoy network. All of that takes time and shepard has the one ship that possibly can travel across the relay, is super advanced and can fight the collectors and has super duper commandos to take them out. Sounds like its a good idea to go in after all theyve been preparing for this the whole game. So why waste more time with designing and creating super probes while your crew dies a terrible death or just get it done. The value of the probe compared with the resources necessary is really not that high. Either the opposition is too great and were ****ed anyways collectors would be unable to be stopped or it works b/c normandy is the most advanced ship in existence.

Also who said it was a plot hole? You kind of did in plot analysis 4 out of 6 you mention this same exact concept.

Also guided missiles... So cerberus should design missiles with their own sensor array, targeting computer and everything that a ship has to target an unknown target as well as their own reaper IFF. Sounds like you just want to send a ship in. Also guided missiles get through relay without all of that stuff magically and hit debris and make smaller debris. You'd have to send like tons of missiles to do anything and that would have to be with reaper IFF all in them for them to even get there.

Modifié par jgordon11, 10 juin 2010 - 11:14 .

[InvaderErl]

Just to comment before somebody says computer targeting on guided missiles can make it through the debris field, a huge part of the reason the Normandy made it through was because of Joker's skill.



As EDI essentially said, a computer cannot make up for the human element.