962 réponses à ce sujet

[Bozorgmehr]

m14567 wrote...

I wouldn't be surprised if warp explosions became adept only.

That would make the Adept more powerful compared to the other classes, but I'd consider it a step backwards in terms of gameplay.

The ME2 Adept is already king of the warpbomb. A fully upgraded Sentinel with both Jack and Morinth/Samara (fully upgraded and with 25% CD reduction bonuses) can detonate (roughly) the same number of Warp bombs as an Adept can without a squad!

Having an insta-cast (version / evolution of) Singularity and Stasis would be enough imo - the weapons department will be covered in ME3 - no more restrictions on weapons

Modifié par Bozorgmehr, 11 juin 2011 - 08:01 .

[Bozorgmehr]

Well Singularity is too slow in ME2, it's only reliably going to hit your target at medium-close range; I liked Liara's version better, instant and target is always trapped in the middle (Shep's version sometimes pushes enemies out of the AoE

I haven't seen many biotic powers in action at E3, but I do like the increased projectile speed. I'm slightly worried about the increased movement/game speed though. ME2's pace was just about right to be able to use all powers (including squad) on the fly (no pausing). When things go faster it will be harder to use powers without becoming less effective in combat.

More info about biotics would be nice, but I doubt we'll know more anytime soon. I'm really looking forward to the gameplay-class-vids.

[Locutus_of_BORG]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

The ME2 Adept is already king of the warpbomb. A fully upgraded Sentinel with both Jack and Morinth/Samara (fully upgraded and with 25% CD reduction bonuses) can detonate (roughly) the same number of Warp bombs as an Adept can without a squad!

This I did not know. Always felt my Sentinel was faster, but never timed it. I can see it though.

I haven't seen many biotic powers in action at E3, but I do like the increased projectile speed. I'm slightly worried about the increased movement/game speed though. ME2's pace was just about right to be able to use all powers (including squad) on the fly (no pausing). When things go faster it will be harder to use powers without becoming less effective in combat.

This will just be a matter of getting used to, imo. Remember that Adepts will get melee biotic combos as well, which aren't likely to eat into cooldown times (melee attacks are now divided into light and heavy attacks, depending of button tap duration... all this, in addition to Stasis, Pull and Throw..).

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 11 juin 2011 - 08:33 .

[mcsupersport]

It looked to me that the powers were going around 2-3 times faster than ME2. It is going to be interesting to see how they handle all the powers and balance going forward. With some of the maps I saw in the videos the Adept will be a monster unless the cooldowns are longer because of the shear number of open areas to drop enemies off the map......unless their rocket boots protect them...hmmm, scary. There was a scene in one of the videos that someone mistook a singularity being dropped into two Geth for a Shepard charging them....if that gives you an idea of the speeds the biotics are moving.

@:47 mark of the Fall of Earth on the ME3 homepage.

Modifié par mcsupersport, 11 juin 2011 - 08:32 .

[Bozorgmehr]

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...

Bozorgmehr wrote...

The ME2 Adept is already king of the warpbomb. A fully upgraded Sentinel with both Jack and Morinth/Samara (fully upgraded and with 25% CD reduction bonuses) can detonate (roughly) the same number of Warp bombs as an Adept can without a squad!

This I did not know. Always felt my Sentinel was faster, but never timed it. I can see it though.

The math is simple. Sentinels are limited by squad cooldowns > Pull can be used every 9 - 45% = 4.95 seconds. That's 12 Warp bombs per minute. Adepts need Pull (3 - 40% = 1.8 s) and Warp (6 - 40% = 3.6 s) > 1.8 + 3.6 = 5.4 seconds. That's 11 Warp bombs per minute.

@ mcsupersport

Yeah, everything goes very fast. I can't tell which powers are being used, lol.

Modifié par Bozorgmehr, 11 juin 2011 - 08:41 .

[Tony Gunslinger]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

Yeah, you're probably right. Kaidan is a Sentinel and is likely equipped with both Warp and Overload to handle all defenses (I doubt he gets Reave). A squadie with Warp, Throw, Overload and Cryo Blast? would be great. Mirande 2.0

I'm very curious about what Kaiden has up his sleeve. Assuming Miranda (if she will be a squadmate) already have Overload/Warp, it would be redundant for Kaiden to have the same. Throw/CryoBlast/Warp? Incinerate/Throw and perhaps a new power? Ack... too much speculation.

[goofyomnivore]

Tony Gunslinger wrote...

Bozorgmehr wrote...

Yeah, you're probably right. Kaidan is a Sentinel and is likely equipped with both Warp and Overload to handle all defenses (I doubt he gets Reave). A squadie with Warp, Throw, Overload and Cryo Blast? would be great. Mirande 2.0

I'm very curious about what Kaiden has up his sleeve. Assuming Miranda (if she will be a squadmate) already have Overload/Warp, it would be redundant for Kaiden to have the same. Throw/CryoBlast/Warp? Incinerate/Throw and perhaps a new power? Ack... too much speculation.

They could change previous character's powers. Liara didn't have Warp from LotSB. Instead she had "Lift Orb" in the demo. IIRC.

However I think Kaidan will get Throw for sure. Heck in ME1 he tells you a story about how he used "throw" to snap a Turian's neck.

[XavierVN]

 NICKjnp wrote...

Don't worry....Kaidan will likely have warp and throw.

Then I worry!  Kaidan died in Virmire!! D:

So do you think powers will have global countdown? Because on one of the vid shepard uses a frag grenade while on AR, so it made me wonder if they are going on separate cooldowns. Also it appears certain "powers" have a limited amount of uses, like frags grenades, as they had a number over their icon. If you check the vids when they brought up the power wheel Shepard's Frag Grenades had a count of 4, and Liara´s Lift Orb also has a number over it. Also it looks like defenses still prevent biotics from working, on the livestream Q/A trailer when liara casts throw on a centurion he is only staggered and thrown back a little, albeit loosing some shielding, although I am not sure how much of the shielding was stripped by throw, as when the power hit the centurion his shielding was around 3/4 and shepard was firing at him.But they were playing on casual so...

Anyways I hope the adept will continue to be awesome. By the way do you think the adept is going to be hurt by the reduced number of squadmates?

[Locutus_of_BORG]

iOnlySignIn wrote...

Bozorgmehr wrote...

The math is simple. Sentinels are limited by squad cooldowns > Pull can be used every 9 - 45% = 4.95 seconds. That's 12 Warp bombs per minute. Adepts need Pull (3 - 40% = 1.8 s) and Warp (6 - 40% = 3.6 s) > 1.8 + 3.6 = 5.4 seconds. That's 11 Warp bombs per minute.

Yes, but the Sentinel can bring 2 squadmates with Pull- that way the only cooldown limit will be the Sentinel's own Warp, which is on a 3 second cooldown. There is also the squadmate power cooldown reset with Tech Armor that you can exploit.

On the other hand, Adept can bring squadmates with Warp, or even non-Biotic squadmates to help with ammo power/defense stripping.

Honestly the Sentinel+Jack+Samara setup is a bit gimmicky, which is why (1) Samara will likely not be a squadmate in ME3; (2) There will probably be more solo missions in ME3 like Arrival.

In reality though, I don't think there would ever be a situation where you actually need more than 10 Warp Bombs per minute. Not unless there is a constant fly in of boxed gifts like the Azure Landing (goons flying in in tightly packed sky cars).

So by the numbers, Sentinels edge out Adepts by just a bit (more in 'real world' conditions, given projectile travel time), but Adepts are self sufficient.. :scratchshead:

Sentinel+Jack+Samara is kinda gimmicky. I preferred Sentinel+Samara+Miranda on my last playthrough of that class.

I agree that raw warp bomb frequency becomes less important from Hardcore and onwards, since widespread protections make them less effective, and the time it takes to strip multiple enemy defenses usually leaves plenty of time for power cooldowns.

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 12 juin 2011 - 03:46 .

[mcsupersport]

The thing to remember is you can bring other classes along to actually increase the Warp bombs by the entire squad if you are an Adept. The numbers were only for Shepard doing everything, not the squad total output. An adept team should be able to turn 15-20 warp bombs in a minute, at optimum output. Not that anything in game will require that or even be really feasible probably but by the numbers Adept smokes Sentinel in warp bombing. As it should.

[CaolIla]

If you optimize your squad for every mission it should be possible to basically warpbomb your way through it. for instance: take mordin and jack/samara with you on the side mission where you have to disable the mech production line and it's just pure warpbomb fun.
But i still like throwing them around more and to see how they drop in the distance.

I really like this thread, adept is my favorite class and without the advices gathered here I would have had more frustration playing on insanity as adept,
I'm doing an adept run right now and I'm still enjoying the game and discover new things.
I'm not using any medigel or hw weapons in my run so I basically just get problems if my teammates go down and enemies close in too much.
I think I'm gonna take the shotgun as an additional weapon because of that, the collector base will be my next mission.

Two missions were problematic so far: the smuggled crates mission on lvl 13 and the colossus mission while trying to use the left way. I tried it at least ten times yesterday and gave up after that.
After searching for some advice on the forum today, I tried the right way once and I instantly made it.

I was so close to actually use medigel and or hw before that ; )
And I actually did it twice just to record it.  www.youtube.com/watch

Adept is the class I'm gonna play first in ME3, that's for sure. 
 

[Sailears]

^ Safely and nicely played!

I don't think I'd have the patience to not use medigel in combat, and have to wait for defences to recharge.

You look like you'd do well with the viper.

Modifié par Curunen, 28 juin 2011 - 05:04 .

[Locutus_of_BORG]

Hopefully biotic projectiles will be sped up in ME3 so we can use the Viper better at range.

[CaolIla]

Curunen wrote...

^ Safely and nicely played!

I don't think I'd have the patience to not use medigel in combat, and have to wait for defences to recharge.

You look like you'd do well with the viper.

Thanks, yeah I sure like my cover and it shows ; ) And the fight against the colossus itself just goes on and on, thank god my squaddies were already dead when I finally had to kick his ass  


The Viper is the fast firing sniper right? I actually never really played that one and since I also finally want to beat the Object Rho fight I took the shotgun to lame with my GPS... It might work.... I hope... maybe...

I read the viper is one of the best weapons in regard of stripping defenses and ammo but again I mostly get my   ass handed to me because enemies get to close... if I'm wrong and it won't work in the Object Rho mission, I think I'm just gonna cry a bit and try it again with a different char. Still some month left till ME3 so why not 

Modifié par CaolIla, 29 juin 2011 - 05:58 .

[lastpatriot]

Folks, I'm just starting a FemShep as an Adept using stasis as my special ability but I'm not certain the best build to use. Could you all give me a bit of advice on where I should put my points?

Thanks!

Oh... and I plan on going nemesis with a more aggressive style of play.

Modifié par lastpatriot, 29 juin 2011 - 11:55 .

[Locutus_of_BORG]

^I used a Bastion build with the idea of focusing on physics combos to get instakills. I maxed Singularity, Warp and Throw, partially levelled Pull (lvl2) and Shockwave (lvl3) and took Stasis and the Mattock as my bonuses. This build was meant to be a more passive build that would stay in the mid-range to strip defenses, but ended being alright for decently aggressive play b/c of Stasis.

According to the wiki, going w/o Stasis apparently makes Nemesis a better option. I've done a Nemesis build before (only difference is I prob maxed Pull and left out Shockwave, and took Shotgun training), but I didn't really know what I was doing back then, so I can't really tell you how it stacks up with my Bastion.

What I can say is that Heavy Singularity is probably better than Wide Singularity, and that it's probably better to use Singularity to lock down single enemies than groups. I did the opposite with my Wide Singularity, using it as big shield and/or to cc big groups, which was only moderately successful... ATM IDK what's the best way to cc multiple enemies with the Adept, or if this class should just stick to cc'ing individuals.

Hope my limited experience still helped.

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 29 juin 2011 - 03:44 .

[PnXMarcin1PL]

lastparot - stasis (even 1 point on it) will be very good for extremely aggressive style of play. Everything else what I would have said, have already been said above. I know it, but I'm not sure about vanguard stasis though.
Would stasis be any good for Claymore Vanguard, anyway ?
Also, is that really you Locutus? look at 0:07 of this video

[Locutus_of_BORG]

PnXMarcin1PL wrote...

Would stasis be any good for Claymore Vanguard, anyway ?

Probably not, since it's the slowest of the 1pt. wonders. It also doesn't really synergize smoothly with Charge imo.

However, Kronner's shown that Slam is pretty awesome on Charge-heavy Vanguards.

Stasis works on cc-oriented Vanguards though, since they play more similarly to Adepts.

Also, is that really you Locutus? look at 0:07 of this video

Yeah, I had a few gigs here and there, including the whole Wolf 359 thing... I remember it pretty well - it was a lot harder than it looked on the vids.

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 29 juin 2011 - 08:59 .

[Kaylord]

Just a note on Arrival: Being an Adept in a solo mission was very difficult for me. I was so used to overload shields and toss enemies about, that I found myself suddenly and very violently overrun in that solo mission. Of course it is doable, but I suddenly felt like a 1-st level whimp again and not the all-powerful bowling-tossing Adept I was used to at that point.

[CoffeeHolic93]

Okay, after ditching the class god knows how many times, I think I'm ready to give the adept a go on insanity. Any early game builds/tips? :3

[Locutus_of_BORG]

^ In no particular order, this is what I've learned from this thread:

Once defenses are stripped, biotics are pretty much supreme; sometimes sending ppl into space or dropping them into bottomless pits is better than a Warp combo.

Singularity is crucial but slow, so don't ignore Pull.

Throw is your friend.

Cooldown speed is key.

Guns are still important.

Stasis cures all ills.

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 30 juin 2011 - 04:05 .

[mcsupersport]

With the time reduction on insanity if you want to hold anyone for any length of time with Singularity you will NEED the heavy version, because before that it burns out incredibly quickly when protected enemies hit it.
Area Pull is actually really good, because if you have managed to strip a guy in the middle of 4 others you don't actually have to hit him to get him to float up to explode. If you are running regular single guy pull, then you have to hit the guy without protections.
Heavy throw actually does decent damage to shields, and with a 3 sec or less cool, it is worth it to use especially as a reload animation cancel to speed up reloads, not to mention why not use it and save some ammo.
Pull should be your number one mechanic for floating enemies to explode or toss off the map. Also look around maps and realize that any time an enemy hits "out of bounds" he dies. As an example, the turbine area of Mordin recruitment, if you have the wind blowing or just an area with a drop you can float an enemy and let them fall to die or be blown away by the wind. Also all the little squares in Mordins mission that you can drop into cover on are usually empty in the middle so if a guy falls down it they die. There are bunches of areas like this, ie Miranda's loyalty mission has instakills on all the cargo lane areas,

[kstarler]

As far as build tips go, Adept is the only class where I don't focus on building each skill as I go, but tend to spread out more points and then build each skill as needed. For instance, I will generally put 3 points in Singularity, 3 points in Mastery, 3 points in Warp, and 1 point in Pull to start, and then start to work up from there. This opens up some options, and at lower levels will be enough to handle most enemies.

Also, squad mates are very important in the early game to cover up where the Adept is lacking. For instance, leveling Unstable Warp on Miranda can allow you to ignore Warp to start with, so that you can focus on something else. Remember that the Adept doesn't reach full potential until later in the game (around level 20), so it's important to build an effective team that will shore up some of the early weaknesses.

Finally, even after you start to max your skills, it's still useful to bring along squad mates who can help with generating biotic combos or stripping defenses, because it can make combat much more fluid, and reduce the need to play from cover.