15168 réponses à ce sujet

[Ieldra]

fongiel24 wrote...
I really need to play the other LIs. People keep talking about how much more gratuitous Miranda's was and I have no idea what they're talking about. The only other romance scene I've seen is Tali's, which would logically be more muted.

Gratuitous? People who say that have no idea what that really is.
Having said that, the scene did appear somewhat more sexualized than the ME1 scenes in spite of showing less. There was more romance and more erotic tension in the ME1 scenes, while there is more romance and erotic tension in both of Miranda's ME2 scenes that lead up to the final one. I guess the final act can feel as a letdown to some for that reason.

[Nightwriter]

jtav wrote...

The problem with "Who said anything about love?" is that the dialogue option is marked as "Love?" Most people would take that as leading to some variation on "Wait a minute. Did you just say you're in love with me?" The fact that it doesn't leads me to believe the line wasn't entirely a joke.

Omg, this. When I saw the "Love?" option I got so excited, I picked it immediately.

I was like, "Love? Really? Really? What? Tell me more!"

And then of course I was horrified.

[Nightwriter]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

And would this happen to be prompted by a certain thread in the storyline forum that made you say you might possibly like Liara/Miranda?

Nope. Though it's funny you'd notice that post, lol.

Just logged onto the Tali website. They started a Miranda thread there.

Some of the things they said made me think of this.

The Tali website? Where's that? I'd like to see what they have to say about Miranda....

http://talizorah.org/forum/index.php

[Ieldra]

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

The problem with "Who said anything about love?" is that the dialogue option is marked as "Love?" Most people would take that as leading to some variation on "Wait a minute. Did you just say you're in love with me?" The fact that it doesn't leads me to believe the line wasn't entirely a joke.

Omg, this. When I saw the "Love?" option I got so excited, I picked it immediately.

I was like, "Love? Really? Really? What? Tell me more!"

And then of course I was horrified.

Yes, that's a problem. But that kind of problem is not indicative of the romance - it's a general problem of the way the dialogue wheel works. I always save before I use a conversation option I don't know, because the result can be an unpleasant surprise. Everywhere in the game, not only in the romances.

[jtav]

I don't know if "gratuitous" is the right word but I could almost hear the designers going "Look, boys! The game's resident sex object is exposing her bra. You may drool now." I think there really is a gender difference going on here because the best reaction I can muster to the romance is "It's okay, I guess. Now can we get back to the parts of her character that actually interest me?"

[Nightwriter]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

That's the impression I got. You have to actually make a serious effort not to make this romance meaningless and sexual, which is disturbing.

I disagree with you here. Perhaps it's a gender thing, but I found it very easy to play this romance and not find it meaningless. Having sex in it doesn't mean it's meaningless. And really, I like that there's sex in it. I recall that I said I find it dishonest to downplay the importance of the physical (see the Miranda Manifesto) against one's own better knowledge, and I stand by that.

And for everyone: I also think we shouldn't over-criticize things just for the sake of criticism. That's what much of this debate appears like to me at this point. There are things I'd have preferred otherwise in Miranda's romance, but as a whole I like it.

What I do *not* like is Miranda's default outfit for the reasons already mentioned. But that has nothing to do with the romance.

Well I don't really feel like I'm criticizing it just for the sake of criticism. This is something that really bugs me. I mean a disturbing number of people get the impression the romance is just about sex, and for good reason.

If you pick paragon options it comes off like a stupid fling. I hate that. Having a sexual element to it is okay, but I feel that element should be isolated to scenes like the kiss scene, which is all about sexual tension.

After that I'm really just looking for meaning and emotion from the character interaction. The sex scene totally falls flat on this. Yes, it's hot, but I'd rather it be meaningful then hot.

[Caihn]

A disturbing number of people get the impression the romance is just about sex, and for STUPID reason.

[jtav]

Maybe, but the number is large enough that either the designers failed in conveying what they wanted or they wanted it to be a fling.

[Nightwriter]

I got the impression the romance was just about sex the first time through, and it really bothered me. I got this impression mostly from the elevator dialogue.

[Caihn]

jtav wrote...

Maybe, but the number is large enough that either the designers failed in conveying what they wanted or they wanted it to be a fling.

They don't failed, because I don't think it's a fling and I'm not the only one.
The problem is most of the people who appreciate Miranda and her romance have left the forum, and I understand why. 

Modifié par Yannkee, 17 août 2010 - 01:37 .

[Nightwriter]

Seriously, my Shepard was actually hurt - yes, hurt - by the elevator dialogue. His poor little feelings were crushed. He was thinking, "Is this all this is to you? Sex? But... but I have the warm fuzzy feelings for you." Then he became panicked when he found himself responding just as coyly.

[jtav]

I appreciate Miranda's character. My problems here are with the romance. They're separate things.

[Caihn]

Ok so because some people have feelings to each other, they can't have fun together ? *facepalm*

Modifié par Yannkee, 17 août 2010 - 01:51 .

[Caihn]

jtav wrote...

I appreciate Miranda's character. My problems here are with the romance. They're separate things.

I like both. And I wouldn't like a soapy romance like Tali.

[Nightwriter]

Now wait a minute, Tali's romance isn't "soapy". It's very sweet, I think Miranda's could take a leaf out of Tali's romance.

[Ieldra]

Yannkee wrote...

jtav wrote...
I appreciate Miranda's character. My problems here are with the romance. They're separate things.

I like both. And I wouldn't like a soapy romance like Tali.

Very much this.

@Nightwriter:
Tali's romance *is* soapy. And even if you don't agree, the same style wouldn't fit Miranda at all.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 17 août 2010 - 02:23 .

[Caihn]

Ieldra2 wrote...
 
@Nightwriter:
Tali's romance *is* soapy. And even if you don't agree, the same style wouldn't fit Miranda at all.

^this

I'm currently watching EA press conference, two big announcements from Bioware expected. I hope something for the Mass Effect franchise.

[Nightwriter]

Well define soapy. I found it touching. You can understand how I want some meaningfulness like that in Miranda's romance.

[Caihn]

Sorry but to me, Miranda's romance is more meaningful than Tali's romance. I think other romance scenes are no match for the "promise me not to die" scene.


Mass Effect 2 coming for PS3 <_< I would expect something on the DLC

Modifié par Yannkee, 17 août 2010 - 03:07 .

[Jebel Krong]

great, not only have i lost 2 weeks of screenshots and mass effect stuff because i lost my usb drive, but now mass effect 2 is coming to the ps3.... spoiling any hope i had of a decent expansion pack next year....

[Caihn]

Yes, I don't like this news too. They should focus on something more important (DLCs, Expansions, ME3).

[tommyt_1994]

Hey Miranda fans, just dropping in to ask a quick question about the kiss scene. Mainly what I wanted to ask is, do most of you guys(and gals) prefer it around here to the other dialogue? I kinda think it's inappropriate if you let her go on about only being able to take credit for her mistakes and then saying it, the first time the line shows up seems much more appropriate for a little harmless teasing.

On the other hand, if you don't go for the kiss, you get the "admire your body" lines, which some see as only sex driven but Shep does say "I can't admire your body or your mind?". So it has that going for it I guess.

The main reason I dropped by to ask is to form my own conclusion for my current canon Shep who may be romancing Miranda, and I want to avoid the romance seeming like a fling. So I definetly won't be taking the "Love?" line, even though I know it was a joke to lighten the mood, and I'll be choosing the hug dialogue. So all that's really left is this scene. I'm strongly leaning towards the kiss scene, but outside opinions are always nice.

Thanks

Edited for my unparalleled indecisiveness

Modifié par tommyt_1994, 17 août 2010 - 04:43 .

[Caihn]

tommyt_1994 wrote...

Hey Miranda fans, just dropping in to ask a quick question about the kiss scene. Mainly what I wanted to ask is, do most of you guys(and gals) prefer it around here to the other dialogue? I kinda think it's inappropriate if you let her go on about only being able to take credit for her mistakes and then saying it, the first time the line shows up seems much more appropriate for a little harmless teasing.

On the other hand, if you don't go for the kiss, you get the "admire your body" lines, which some see as only sex driven but Shep does say "I can't admire your body or your mind?". So it has that going for it I guess.

The main reason I dropped by to ask is to form my own conclusion for my current canon Shep who will be romancing Miranda, and I want to avoid the romance seeming like a fling. So I definetly won't be taking the "Love?" line, even though I know it was a joke to lighten the mood, and I'll be choosing the hug dialogue. So all that's really left is this scene. I'm strongly leaning towards the kiss scene, but outside opinions are always nice.

Thanks

For the romance I always choose :

- You always bring up your genetic tailoring. It really bothers you, doesn't it?

- I can't admire your body or your mind? You give your father too much credit. Yeah, he gave you gifts, but you can be proud of what you've done with them. 

- You wouldn't, huh?  The only thing I regret here is that they don't kiss each other.

- I care about you Miranda, and I think you care about me (this line is only available if you choose the "I can't admire your body or your mind?" in the previous conversation, so it definitely kill the idea of Shepard only interesting in her body)

- It doesn't matter. What matters is how we feel.

- It doesn't work that way. We could all be dead this time tomorrow. So if it's not worth it...

Modifié par Yannkee, 17 août 2010 - 03:40 .

[PrinceLionheart]

Nightwriter wrote...

Now wait a minute, Tali's romance isn't "soapy". It's very sweet, I think Miranda's could take a leaf out of Tali's romance.

Ehhh, Tali's romance was really mostly fanservice to all the Talimancers. Which, of course, works out good for them, but I'm not a Talimancer so I wasn't feeling it.

[Elyvern]

tommyt_1994 wrote...

Hey Miranda fans, just dropping in to ask a quick question about the kiss scene. Mainly what I wanted to ask is, do most of you guys(and gals) prefer it around here to the other dialogue? I kinda think it's inappropriate if you let her go on about only being able to take credit for her mistakes and then saying it, the first time the line shows up seems much more appropriate for a little harmless teasing.

On the other hand, if you don't go for the kiss, you get the "admire your body" lines, which some see as only sex driven but Shep does say "I can't admire your body or your mind?". So it has that going for it I guess.

The main reason I dropped by to ask is to form my own conclusion for my current canon Shep who will be romancing Miranda, and I want to avoid the romance seeming like a fling. So I definetly won't be taking the "Love?" line, even though I know it was a joke to lighten the mood, and I'll be choosing the hug dialogue. So all that's really left is this scene. I'm strongly leaning towards the kiss scene, but outside opinions are always nice.

Thanks

Personally, i always opt for the kiss scene, because it's just that more dynamic. The "admire your body" lines just creep me out no matter how I look at it. Getting Miranda flustered is just pure win, and really won me the heart of Yvonne Strahovski in that scene, because she was so convincingly flummoxed at how you blindside her. It's obvious she  wasn't thinking of a romantic entanglement with Shepard at all - follow that up with the hug scene, and I don't see how you can imagine it as a fling. My two cents anyway.