15168 réponses à ce sujet

[Arijharn]

Maybe it is just me who see's Sarah Walker as the super-spy and Miranda Lawson as a co-ordinator then

[fongiel24]

Ieldra2 wrote...

I wouldn't try to fix numbers, but I agree with your reasoning. "Regulars"...hmm. As a tendency, yes, but  not too much so for reasons already mentioned. My guess would be that some of her contacts are a little more than just that. "Contacts with benefits", so to speak. That would incur little additional security risk.

So she's like a ME Jay Leno ? This would definitely fall in the category of a hobby you wouldn't expect, although my idea of Miranda is that she's a crotch rocket girl. Maybe they could include a list of attempted traffic stops and unanswered tickets from Illium law enforcement.

As I read this, I find it's surprisingly easy to imagine Miranda in her loyalty outfit on a tuned-up motorcycle. I wonder if these things still exist in the ME universe.

Yeah, as you and Elyvern have pointed out, trying to place numbers is tricky. As for "regulars", I don't think Miranda would randomly pick guys up at bars, but she might run across people in her work - like contacts as you suggest - that interest her. If she liked them, she might come back. They wouldn't be so regular that their encounters would be a routine, but they're "regulars" as in she might look them up next time she's in town.

Miranda's outfit already reminds me of a motorcycle getup. Add a jacket and a helmet and she's pretty much set. If I could draw, that would be the classic image of her I'd depict - Miranda escaping from a job on a futuristic motorcycle, long hair blowing in the wind. With her superior reflexes and balance, I'll bet she's an exceptional rider too.

[t3HPrO]

Arijharn wrote...

So what sort of evolution do people want to see come ME3 in their characters relationship with Miranda? I'm not sure honestly but I can tell you what I don't want to see:

- Miranda and Shep settling down
- Shephard eclipsing and surpassing Miranda (more of a sharing I guess in personality strength, although not in the same way)
- Miranda and Shep splitting up
- Oriana dying (if anything could break Miranda; this would be it imo)
- Shephard not dealing with his own pass, and Miranda not helping him (I'm sick of being basically the one to which the world revolves... well, not 'sick' insomuch as I want a bit of variety)
- The Reapers winning (ha! just had to put that in... although I think it would actually be awesome if you stuffed up something in ME3 that could have this result as a flow on effect... sorta like how if you didn't prepare for the SM it actually becomes a SM)

Hmm, I can't think of anything else I'm patently against :S Maybe I'm just not thinking hard enough! (And I'm too busy watching the last episode of Chuck)

I agree with everything else except your 1st one. I WANT to see Shep and Miri settling down. And besides, after all that fighting, all the 2 of them would want to do is settle down. Just ask any vet out there what he really wants, and it'll be peace and settling down with someone he loves.

[t3HPrO]

fongiel24 wrote...

Yeah, as you and Elyvern have pointed out, trying to place numbers is tricky. As for "regulars", I don't think Miranda would randomly pick guys up at bars, but she might run across people in her work - like contacts as you suggest - that interest her. If she liked them, she might come back. They wouldn't be so regular that their encounters would be a routine, but they're "regulars" as in she might look them up next time she's in town.

Miranda's outfit already reminds me of a motorcycle getup. Add a jacket and a helmet and she's pretty much set. If I could draw, that would be the classic image of her I'd depict - Miranda escaping from a job on a futuristic motorcycle, long hair blowing in the wind. With her superior reflexes and balance, I'll bet she's an exceptional rider too.

I agree that Miranda wouldn't pick up random guys in bars. She'd most likely have one night stands with people she already knows(i.e. contacts, but not colleagues as she doesn't like workplace romances). And Miranda's loyalty outfit just needs short shorts instead of those leggings and a helmet and she's a biker chick. And someone should do a fanart of Miri, Yvonne Strahovski and Megan Fox all in the same place, working on the same bike, and they're all in biker chick attire. That would be HAWT. Make it happen.

Modifié par t3HPrO, 08 octobre 2010 - 08:13 .

[Jebel Krong]

Arijharn wrote...

Maybe it is just me who see's Sarah Walker as the super-spy and Miranda Lawson as a co-ordinator then

no i agree with that - whilst she can and does do the covert ops bit, she's so much more than that, hence running projects like lazarus. In-game she mentions it's not her first - "they give me my resources and tell me to do it" to paraphrase as best i can just now (before my 2nd cup of coffee in the morning and i actually wake up properly). 

i also disagree with the promiscuity - especially if you are more inclined to think of Miranda as more an 'ops' person - too many liasons would be a security risk. sure some would happen given the nature of the job, and others because of need, but i don't think anyone in that profession would risk hooking up with 'contacts' etc. it would get messy (maybe one if he was an old friend, but it's not like she has those). actually i think she'd be more inclined to experiment on security guards/scientists etc when growing up, before she ran away, than after.

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 08 octobre 2010 - 08:25 .

[t3HPrO]

Jebel Krong wrote...

i also disagree with the promiscuity - especially if you are more inclined to think of Miranda as more an 'ops' person - too many liasons would be a security risk. sure some would happen given the nature of the job, and others because of need, but i don't think anyone in that profession would risk hooking up with 'contacts' etc. it would get messy (maybe one if he was an old friend, but it's not like she has those). actually i think she'd be more inclined to experiment on security guards/scientists etc when growing up, before she ran away, than after.

I think Miranda would have been barred from any contact with males before she ran away. Honestly speaking, I think her father assigned female bodyguards to protect her to minimize the 'risk' of her having her virginity gone. So in that case, her first sexual experience would've been with a woman. And yes, Miranda is highly focused on her job, so she would view every hookup she has as a potential security risk, and thus she wouldn't have many as she would prefer to circumvent those potential breaches. Once again bringing me to my hypothesis that she masturbates often, and does it a lot more than she has sex.

And I wish someone would do a fanart of Miranda, Yvonne and Megan Fox working on the same bike in their respective biker chick attire already.

[snfonseka]

Jebel Krong wrote...

Arijharn wrote...

Maybe it is just me who see's Sarah Walker as the super-spy and Miranda Lawson as a co-ordinator then

no i agree with that - whilst she can and does do the covert ops bit, she's so much more than that, hence running projects like lazarus. In-game she mentions it's not her first - "they give me my resources and tell me to do it" to paraphrase as best i can just now (before my 2nd cup of coffee in the morning and i actually wake up properly). 

i also disagree with the promiscuity - especially if you are more inclined to think of Miranda as more an 'ops' person - too many liasons would be a security risk. sure some would happen given the nature of the job, and others because of need, but i don't think anyone in that profession would risk hooking up with 'contacts' etc. it would get messy (maybe one if he was an old friend, but it's not like she has those). actually i think she'd be more inclined to experiment on security guards/scientists etc when growing up, before she ran away, than after.

I don't see her as her super spy (may be because of the comical approch of Chuck). For me Miranda is much more better as a field operative.

[Arijharn]

I don't think she's had a sexual experience with a woman not necessarily because she against it, but probably because the thought never really entered her mind. I know it was originally planned that Miranda was bisexual, but they removed that from the game, so I wouldn't say you could use that potentially as the basis of the claims.



I wonder how we started talking about masturbation and Miranda though, other than of course that it's well, the very definition of hawt. Sorry, male thing here, moving along.

[t3HPrO]

I just had to post this.


Miri's assets are still better.

Modifié par t3HPrO, 08 octobre 2010 - 08:47 .

[Ieldra]

t3HPrO wrote...
I agree with everything else except your 1st one. I WANT to see Shep and Miri settling down. And besides, after all that fighting, all the 2 of them would want to do is settle down. Just ask any vet out there what he really wants, and it'll be peace and settling down with someone he loves.

Possibly we can shape our epilogue through our in-game decisions. I can't imagine Bioware wouldn't want to give us more than one outcome. My Shepard and Miranda would have an extended vacation, but after that would want to do meaningful work they're good at. With the galaxy not in immediate danger, their work could be meaningful without involving killing and blowing things up every day. The outcome I have sketched upthread - mounting a big expedition into unknown regions of the galaxy - would have elements of both. Mostly it would be quiet enough with times of excitement in-between. I also think Miranda and Shepard would get on each other's nerves if continuously living and working together. You probably think differently, but as I said I hope for being able to shape our epilogues. What I would dislike a lot is to be restricted to the settling-down option.

[Arijharn]

I don't believe the notion that 'absence makes the heart grow fonder' because in my experience at least, that has never hold true, but I agree that constant time together would just grate.

[fongiel24]

If ME3's epilogues are just going to be done like DAO's, where it's just text, I'd actually they rather leave epilogues out of ME3 altogether. Just have the finishing scene and then cut to credits. That way everyone can imagine their own epilogue without people screaming about canon and OOC. It would also keep Bioware's options open for future ME titles, whether they include Shepard and Miranda or not.

[t3HPrO]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Possibly we can shape our epilogue through our in-game decisions. I can't imagine Bioware wouldn't want to give us more than one outcome. My Shepard and Miranda would have an extended vacation, but after that would want to do meaningful work they're good at. With the galaxy not in immediate danger, their work could be meaningful without involving killing and blowing things up every day. The outcome I have sketched upthread - mounting a big expedition into unknown regions of the galaxy - would have elements of both. Mostly it would be quiet enough with times of excitement in-between. I also think Miranda and Shepard would get on each other's nerves if continuously living and working together. You probably think differently, but as I said I hope for being able to shape our epilogues. What I would dislike a lot is to be restricted to the settling-down option.

I agree. To each his/her own. And I think that BW will give us the option to craft our own ending from say...5 possible outcomes. They'd BETTER. Or else...



Miri's coming for you.

[Ieldra]

snfonseka wrote...
I don't see her as her super spy (may be because of the comical approch of Chuck). For me Miranda is much more better as a field operative.

Since I have no difficulty at all putting Sarah Walker out of my mind, I have no problem with that image. And apart from the super part, for which Miranda actually qualifies more than Sarah (biotics, anyone), I can't see the terms describing vastly different occupations. Miranda is not *restricted* to that template, that's the difference. She's scientist, project coordinator and a few other things. But the "black ops operative" part is the one I find the most fascinating.

[Jebel Krong]

if i had written the dossier it'd have been:

mission reports - maybe 1 from lazarus, but more focused on other 'projects' and cerberus activities known by the SB, perhaps those affecting other intelligence agencies of other species, showing a more galactic side to their activities (as hinted at in me1 with all the "research" bases). As miranda would be among the most competent cerberus agents, it makes sense that she would be assigned the higher-profile missions and would link her (& cerberus) more closely to galactic events again.

list of miranda sightings and possible cerberus aliases. perhaps some mention of possible contact information too - SB would certainly still be working on cracking Cerberus.

transcript of communication with Oriana - it's a good idea and grounds Miranda again, making her more human with the family connection, but i wouldn't have written such a, well childish conversation, though as i'm not (and never was) a teenage girl (Oriana), i guess that's hard for me to judge objectively.

Journal extract from Cerberus back-ups, relating to Miranda's changing opinion of Shepard - you just need fragments really, but with a few dates/events would help the particularly quick in-game thawing of her character a bit.

medical report pertaining to unspecified treatment Miranda received (which leaves it nicely open to be injury or biotic-related rather than stupid infertility rubbish) - keeping it vague, means it can be explored later, but not necessarily so.

more flimsy/funny things i'd have included:

a half-report on Miranda's shopping habits on Omega/Citadel by a SB tail, along the lines of 'drinks with contact @ Afterlife', 'sushi on her own in the market', 'receipt for items paid cash credits Sel's Sex shop', 'unknown upgrade bought @ kenn's salvage', 'operative reports tail lost near entrance to clinic zone', 'contact with operative lost near omega clinic...' end.

subscriptions to 'Perfect Weddings', 'Grazia 2183', 'Salarian Science Journal' and 'Asari biotics'.

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 08 octobre 2010 - 09:04 .

[Jebel Krong]

t3HPrO wrote...

I think Miranda would have been barred from any contact with males before she ran away. Honestly speaking, I think her father assigned female bodyguards to protect her to minimize the 'risk' of her having her virginity gone.

it's possible, but with her father being a big player in the military-industrial complex, if Miranda's training or upbringing involved society, corporate workings and politics, espionage etc then she'd still be mixing with men - even if it was just security guards in non-critical areas or a high-society boy, i could certainly see Miranda taking advantage of that, for herself (experience) and to provoke a reaction (her father, possibly) and for a laugh. hell her father may even have encouraged one or two in the name of helping the business - pillow talk and all... he was building a dynasty after all, not a family.

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 08 octobre 2010 - 09:09 .

[t3HPrO]

Jebel Krong wrote...

it's possible, but with her father being a big player in the military-industrial complex, if Miranda's training or upbringing involved society, corporate workings and politics, espionage etc then she'd still be mixing with men - even if it was just security guards in non-critical areas or a high-society boy, i could certainly see Miranda taking advantage of that, for herself (experience) and to provoke a reaction (her father, possibly) and for a laugh. hell her father may even have encouraged one or two in the name of helping the business - pillow talk and all... he was building a dynasty after all, not a family.

Uh...I might have missed that. Was Miri's father a big player in the defence industry? I don't quite think so. And according to Miranda, any rebellion would lead to massive consqeuences so she probably wouldn't risk provoking the father for fear of retaliation. And if she wanted a reaction, she'd do it with another girl just to give her father an even more massive heart attack. God only knows what he did to her. And I don't think Miranda's father exposed her to boys, especially given his draconian rules against intercourse. So yes, Miranda most likely had her first sexual experience with a woman.

[t3HPrO]

Jebel Krong wrote...

it's possible, but with her father being a big player in the military-industrial complex, if Miranda's training or upbringing involved society, corporate workings and politics, espionage etc then she'd still be mixing with men - even if it was just security guards in non-critical areas or a high-society boy, i could certainly see Miranda taking advantage of that, for herself (experience) and to provoke a reaction (her father, possibly) and for a laugh. hell her father may even have encouraged one or two in the name of helping the business - pillow talk and all... he was building a dynasty after all, not a family.

And not to mention she was younger than 18 when she ran. Her conversation at Minuteman seemed to indicate that she joined up as an underage girl. And I think law in the future still says that having intercourse with a girl below 18 is verboten. I think.

[Jebel Krong]

you only have to be 16 to have sex in most countries, even now. the game didn't expressly specify what age she was when she ran, only that she was relatively young. it is expressly stated that her father was involved in the alliance military-industry and one of the big-backers of cerberus until she ran away and joined. how do you know what her father's attitude was - to anything - during her upbringing?

[Arijharn]

There is no 'set' age limit in some countries I think. A 16year old is capable of giving consent but I think if you're 21 or 25 years or older it's considered statutory rape I think here in Australia. I don't really know for sure, I'm very rusty with law, having only really studied Trade Practices and some minor dabbling in Intellectual Property.



I think she might grown close to some of her contacts over the years (maybe even Niket, depending on how close they kept... or it was a mutual crush at least), but I doubt she'd have sex as a means of getting back at her father.

[t3HPrO]

Jebel Krong wrote...

you only have to be 16 to have sex in most countries, even now. the game didn't expressly specify what age she was when she ran, only that she was relatively young. it is expressly stated that her father was involved in the alliance military-industry and one of the big-backers of cerberus until she ran away and joined. how do you know what her father's attitude was - to anything - during her upbringing?

He was said to have been extremely oppressive and controlling. And I agree with Arjharn. She wouldn't have sex just to ****** off her father, she's above that. And I don't think Miranda had anything more than friendship with Niket. I didn't get the 'mutual crushers' vibe when she talked about him. Also, she didn't really care about him much, once again indicating she only saw him as her only friend. Sure, Niket might've had a crush on Miri, but it wasn't reciprocated by Miranda.

[Ieldra]

t3HPrO wrote...

Jebel Krong wrote...

it's possible, but with her father being a big player in the military-industrial complex, if Miranda's training or upbringing involved society, corporate workings and politics, espionage etc then she'd still be mixing with men - even if it was just security guards in non-critical areas or a high-society boy, i could certainly see Miranda taking advantage of that, for herself (experience) and to provoke a reaction (her father, possibly) and for a laugh. hell her father may even have encouraged one or two in the name of helping the business - pillow talk and all... he was building a dynasty after all, not a family.

Uh...I might have missed that. Was Miri's father a big player in the defence industry? I don't quite think so. And according to Miranda, any rebellion would lead to massive consqeuences so she probably wouldn't risk provoking the father for fear of retaliation. And if she wanted a reaction, she'd do it with another girl just to give her father an even more massive heart attack. God only knows what he did to her. And I don't think Miranda's father exposed her to boys, especially given his draconian rules against intercourse. So yes, Miranda most likely had her first sexual experience with a woman.

Canonically, Miranda's father is an extremely wealthy businessman in an unspecified kind of business. He's so wealthy that the Eclipse mercs in Miranda's LM refer to him as "the richest guy on Earth", which may not be literally true, but should show the kind of world she's grown up in. Activities in these circles definitely involve a lot of socializing, politics, intrigue and espionage. That he's in the defence industry is something I introduced in my fanfic but it seems to have taken hold.

How much freedom Miranda has had exactly for "assignments" with men is pure speculation, except I'd say that it likely wasn't much, like in every other aspect of her life. "Draconian rules against intercourse" are plausible, but mentioned nowhere, and if Miranda is as capable as we tend to imagine her, she'd have found a way around that. I don't think she'd start something with a girl if she didn't care for that in the first place (and canonically, it's at least implied she doesn't). In my fanfic, she had an affair with Niket that rarely went anywhere "interesting" because of surveillance by her father's security, but nothing more. She'd have been interested in more, but it just wasn't important enough to risk the consequences of being discovered. I count that most plausible, but any speculation between "nothing" and something similar to Jebel Krong's scenario, minus the provocation part, is valid.
 

Modifié par Ieldra2, 08 octobre 2010 - 10:24 .

[Ieldra]

Jebel Krong wrote...
It is expressly stated that her father was involved in the alliance military-industry and one of the big-backers of cerberus until she ran away and joined. how do you know what her father's attitude was - to anything - during her upbringing?

It is? Where is that information that her father was involved in the defence industry? I thought I made that up. I only know that he was one of the big backers of Cerberus.

Her father's attitude was "extremely controlling", as Miranda tells you. The "impossible demands" she mentions also hints that she might have had very little free time. She'd still have taken some here and there, but I think we can take it as a given she didn't have much of a life unconnected to her training/work, which would have involved some socializing, but under controlled conditions most of the time. 

Modifié par Ieldra2, 08 octobre 2010 - 10:32 .

[Jebel Krong]

unless i'm imagining it, she specifically mentions her father's business in the alliance military machine in the 1st/2nd conversation on the normandy (when she mentions him being one of cerberus' backers).

[Jebel Krong]

t3HPrO wrote...

He was said to have been extremely oppressive and controlling. And I agree with Arjharn. She wouldn't have sex just to ****** off her father, she's above that. And I don't think Miranda had anything more than friendship with Niket. I didn't get the 'mutual crushers' vibe when she talked about him. Also, she didn't really care about him much, once again indicating she only saw him as her only friend. Sure, Niket might've had a crush on Miri, but it wasn't reciprocated by Miranda.

actually being so oppressive and controlling would have driven her to do exactly that - rebellious children and all that (either you don't remember being one, or unusually weren't or don't have any yourself ). i agree re niket though, i certainly didn't catch any romantic edge to their relationship.