15168 réponses à ce sujet

[Alessar]

AltimusZero wrote...

I don't think Miranda will ever replace TIM. Plus I don't think it would make much sense. Shadow Broker and TIM although similar are different in their presentation. While few saw the Shadow Broker, many saw TIM. Plus TIM is all about presentation; the man has the star that's going to implode soon in the background for a reason. If TIM fell so would Cerberus IMO, I highly doubt Miranda could gain that kind of support and respect. With the Shadow Broker, only a certain number of people will ever know there was ever a switch.

Nobody had ever seen the shadow broker until Liara and Shep broke through, but your point about TIM being known by many isn't right. Only his most trusted have seen him. There's a reason for him being the illusive man.

Anyways the whole broker thing is already taken up by Liara, making Miranda the head of something like that would just be redundant. I rather have her as my xo.

Modifié par Alessar, 18 octobre 2010 - 05:55 .

[Ieldra]

Elyvern wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
As for Miranda being harder to win over if we kept the base in ME3, I don't think that will happen. Her loyalty to TIM is shaken whether you keep the base or destroy it. Only if you keep it she doesn't act on it because there would be no point.  

Can anyone clarify this for me? I believe there are actually two opportunities for the player to decide if they want to destroy or keep the base, and the Illusive man interjection actually takes place after the first. I can't access the game right now. In my last playthrough, I chose keeping the base at the first opportunity, and I don't recall Miranda saying that betrayal line. if anyone can confirm that for me, it would be great, because it would mean there's a good chance she doesn't even express any doubts at all at the end.  Also, it wouldn't account for players that don't bring Miranda into the final fight still.

No, you can't decide on your own that you want to keep the base (something that bugs me to no end, since it was such an obvious opportunity to learn more about the Reapers), it doesn't matter what you say at that point, you always default to "I'm going to blow this up." Stupid, stupid Shepard.

But you do have two opportunities to answer: after TIM interjects, you can either agree with him immediately, ask "What would you do with it" or something as the neutral option, or decline. Miranda only says the betrayal line if you agree with TIM at this point (maybe also if you immediately decline, but I wouldn't know that). Anyway, if you choose the - at that point more intelligent because careful - neutral option, then Miranda says nothing. After that, you can then make your final decision. So you can complete this without the infamous betrayal comment

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 octobre 2010 - 08:48 .

[fongiel24]

I would be sad to see TIM go down. He's a ruthless, untrustworthy bastard but I think he's a fantastic quasi-villain. Based on the number of setbacks Cerberus can take and still keep going, I would argue that he's actually a pretty good choice to lead Cerberus as well. I'm hoping a TIM-led Cerberus will continue to be featured in future ME games and media. A "kinder and gentler" Miranda-led Cerberus just wouldn't be the same.

Mox Ruuga wrote...

I also don't think she'll be recruitable, but then again I don't think anyone beyond the Virmire Survivor will be. Some of the more popular ones could get the sort of "single mission squaddie" roles Liara had in LotSB, and Miranda has a good chance of being included in that bunch, IMO.

Oh god... if the only returning squadmate in ME3 turns out to be the VS and all my favourites end up just making cameos, I think that would be enough to make me check out of the series altogether. Kaidan is growing on me, but unfortunately I always sacrifice him (I actually kill the character I like on Virmire because I feel it's a 'good' death and Bioware's treatment of the VS in ME2 sucked), which would leave me with Ashley. Having to hear Ashley talk for 30-40+ hours with no option to pitch her the way DA gave us an option to ditch party members would drive me insane.

Modifié par fongiel24, 18 octobre 2010 - 08:41 .

[Ieldra]

Nadya2 wrote...
my male shep always romance Miranda, no matter if i play paragon or renegade miranda always be the number one choice for him. i liked her way way better than ashley williams.

Yes, me too. I do like Ashley a lot, but Miranda....it's more than eight months since ME2 came out, and I still think Miranda as a character could have been made to my specifications. The problem is that I still haven't managed to play a ME2 game where my Shepard stayed with Ashley. I'd like to have one, but once the romance options come up in ME2, I can't say no.
Instead, I have replayed one of my ME1 Shepards from Virmire onwards and made sure Ashley doesn't survive, since I don't want a romance conflict in ME3.

[jtav]

On the other hand, I admit the idea of having Kaidan and Miranda fighting together makes me all warm inside. I'd like that for ME3 very much. Who cares if it's not a balanced squad? My prediction is that no LI from either game will be permanently recruitable, but it's not what I want by a longshot. I had entirely too much fun watching Liara and Miranda team up.

[jtav]

I still haven't managed to romance Jack or Tali. I have managed to stay faithful to Liara by siding with Jack and getting Miranda's loyalty back immediately afterward. Most of my games are FemSheps, so Miranda romance isn't an issue there. With one exception, my FemSheps would save Miranda over her actual LI. The other wants her head on a pike. It annoys me that I can't RP that character as hating her. I'm forced to be nice, which makes my games where Shepard does like her feel less meaningful. I'm going to kill her off because that's the only way I feel like I can reflect my character concept.

[Mox Ruuga]

fongiel24 wrote...

Oh god... if the only returning squadmate in ME3 turns out to be the VS and all my favourites end up just making cameos, I think that would be enough to make me check out of the series altogether. Kaidan is growing on me, but unfortunately I always sacrifice him (I actually kill the character I like on Virmire because I feel it's a 'good' death and Bioware's treatment of the VS in ME2 sucked), which would leave me with Ashley. Having to hear Ashley talk for 30-40+ hours with no option to pitch her the way DA gave us an option to ditch party members would drive me insane.

Heh, don't get me wrong! I'd love to have many of the ME2 squaddies back, and would tolerate everyone returning except for two of my unfavorites, but I'm very sceptical. I've seen all the counter arguments, but I still believe my theory is close to what Bioware will end up doing. I believe they will test new ME3 features with these Bridging DLC that LotSB was the first of, and that "temporary squaddie" mechanic with Liara was one of those test runs...

[jtav]

Mox, I think you may be onto something. We'll get a small core squad, with our surviving ME2 joining us on missions where they are plot relevant. Miranda and/or Jacob come back to help you deal with Cerberus. Tali and Legion help you deal with the quarian/geth conflict. And so on. Something like Kingdom Hearts. They'd have plenty of dialogue on their relevant mission. If they're dead, your core squad has very generic dialogue. It's not a perfect solution, but it's better than two-minute cameos.

[AntenDS]

I don't get why Miranda would head Cerberus.



This may seem a little harsh and i don't know if it was brought up. The most likely the reason why Miranda can't get pregnant is her father for seen this as a job hindrance. A pregnant hit woman or seductress isn't that use full.

[Ieldra]

You mean a small core squad of new characters? *shudder* I wouldn't like that one bit, yet another new set forced upon me. I want to start with a core squad of my surviving ME2 team members, if I get that, then I'll eventually use any new ones as well, and I'll be prepared to like them. But if the new ones are forced on me and the old ones mostly gone - again - I'll resent it. Having only one mission with my favorite character, that I would also resent.



My favorite scenario: you start ME3 with your surviving team members of ME2. As the plot progresses, eventually some old characters will remain behind after a mission, and at certain plot-relevant points, new characters will join you, introduced by a mission you do with them. The important thing is that you can choose - within certain limites - when to do the missions where you must leave your old character(s) behind. So Miranda fans can do that Cerberus-related mission late and have her on the team for most of the game, and the fans of the other LIs can do the same. Most interaction will still be on the character-related mission and maybe on the Normandy, but hopefully we'll have some interjections and banter in other places.

[Alessar]

I have a question, apparently I did save before Virmire. If I beat mass effect 1 with this save and leave behind ashley will it count as a separate file or will it not appear at all since I already completed it on this character?

[hooahguy]

Alessar wrote...

Tim has no reason to retaliate just because Shep quits. You're still an asset even if you aren't with Cerberus. Tim isn't so short sighted that he'd let his personal feelings get in the way. If you're an asset, you're still useful.

Yeah Ely, they could use it to get rid of members hadn't thought about that. Good point!

Some thoughts...
Just because Shep said he quit doesnt mean that TIM is gone from his life. Does anyone remember the season 4 opening for Chuck? Basically, Chuck says that he quit, but General Beckman had other plans, and went behind his back to subvert any job applications Chuck was trying to get.
Maybe something similar will happen here. Just because we quit doesnt mean that we have seen the last of TIM as our boss. Just a thought.

[Ieldra]

AntenDS wrote...
I don't get why Miranda would head Cerberus.

The idea is that she'd transform it into something like the STG - still an organization for actions that don't suffer publicity well, but not as ruthless as under TIM. That would be a good use of both her operative and administrative skills.

This may seem a little harsh and i don't know if it was brought up. The most likely the reason why Miranda can't get pregnant is her father for seen this as a job hindrance. A pregnant hit woman or seductress isn't that use full.

(1) The dossier says they don't know if her condition is genetic. I assume it's not.
(2) Miranda's father likely did not intend her to become an operative.
(3) Contraception methods should be reliable in the ME universe - that's absolutely no reason to engineer infertility in.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 octobre 2010 - 09:41 .

[Ieldra]

Alessar wrote...
I have a question, apparently I did save before Virmire. If I beat mass effect 1 with this save and leave behind ashley will it count as a separate file or will it not appear at all since I already completed it on this character?

Every time you finish an ME1 game, a new endgame file will be created. The name of the game end file contains the date it was finished, so it's possible that it will be overwritten if you finish the game twice on the same day with a Shepard with the same class, origin, background and endgame level. In all other cases - i.e. almost always - a new and different file will be created and you won't lose the old one. Picking the right one for importing, though, that can be a problem.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 octobre 2010 - 09:40 .

[Alessar]

Well picking the right one won't be hard since both will be level 60 except one has kaiden and the other has ash surviving virmire. Thanks!

[enayasoul]

Alessar wrote...

I have a question, apparently I did save before Virmire. If I beat mass effect 1 with this save and leave behind ashley will it count as a separate file or will it not appear at all since I already completed it on this character?

Well you would just have to play through the game from that point you leave her behind until the end. Credits rolling. Then just import the save from the last one.

That's what I did anyways 

[fongiel24]

jtav wrote...

Mox, I think you may be onto something. We'll get a small core squad, with our surviving ME2 joining us on missions where they are plot relevant. Miranda and/or Jacob come back to help you deal with Cerberus. Tali and Legion help you deal with the quarian/geth conflict. And so on. Something like Kingdom Hearts. They'd have plenty of dialogue on their relevant mission. If they're dead, your core squad has very generic dialogue. It's not a perfect solution, but it's better than two-minute cameos.

La-la-la-la-la, not listening! Not listening! *puts his fingers in his ears*

This scenario does sound frighteningly plausible but I'm still holding out hope for more Miranda content than just a mission or two. I want lots of facetime for my favourite characters in ME3 and unfortunately, as others have pointed out, if they're not active squadmates, we're not likely to get that.

While it'd be interesting to see what Bioware could come up with in terms of new characters, I'd rather they work on evolving and refining preexisting ME1/ME2 squadmates. Obviously bringing everyone back into one squad would be a bit much (what is that, a potential squad of 15 if we include the ME2 squad + Wrex, Liara, and VS?) but maybe what Bioware could do is let you pick up to ten out of the full fifteen. The characters you don't pick would still be doing something to help you in your fight against the Reapers, but their stories would take place independently and be told through cameos, cutscenes and exposition.  

This would also solve the problem of ME2 squadmates potentially dying, because Bioware could just remove them as options. Worst case scenario, for an imported save you've have two ME2 squadmates left (you can't survive the suicide mission with less than two survivors other than Shepard) + VS and Liara. Four is a very small squad, but still workable if ME3 continues the two squadmate combat system. Besides, I doubt anybody screwed up in ME2 so badly that they really did just end up with two squadmates. You almost have to be deliberately trying to kill off your crewmates to get that ending.

If Bioware was deadset on creating new squadmates, maybe they could just make four or five so you end up having five new squadmates you're required to take, and leaving another five slots you fill with your choice of old squadmates.

[AntenDS]

Ieldra2 wrote...

AntenDS wrote...
I don't get why Miranda would head Cerberus.

The idea is that she'd transform it into something like the STG - still an organization for actions that don't suffer publicity well, but not as ruthless as under TIM. That would be a good use of both her operative and administrative skills.
.

I just don't think she has the means to take over Cerberus other than having Shep go in and blasting away every Cerberus Base.  The whole notion of her taking it over seems like a reaction to Liara Taking over as Shadow Broker.  Miranda can lead a science team and strike but that doesn't mean she can rule over a company like Cerberus.

[Alessar]

Ieldra2 wrote...

You mean a small core squad of new characters? *shudder* I wouldn't like that one bit, yet another new set forced upon me. I want to start with a core squad of my surviving ME2 team members, if I get that, then I'll eventually use any new ones as well, and I'll be prepared to like them. But if the new ones are forced on me and the old ones mostly gone - again - I'll resent it. Having only one mission with my favorite character, that I would also resent.

My favorite scenario: you start ME3 with your surviving team members of ME2. As the plot progresses, eventually some old characters will remain behind after a mission, and at certain plot-relevant points, new characters will join you, introduced by a mission you do with them. The important thing is that you can choose - within certain limites - when to do the missions where you must leave your old character(s) behind. So Miranda fans can do that Cerberus-related mission late and have her on the team for most of the game, and the fans of the other LIs can do the same. Most interaction will still be on the character-related mission and maybe on the Normandy, but hopefully we'll have some interjections and banter in other places.

I can live with the favorite scenario, but having squad members moved around so much would annoy me to no end, this being in reference to the first situation.

Modifié par Alessar, 18 octobre 2010 - 10:08 .

[hooahguy]

Ieldra2 wrote...

My favorite scenario: you start ME3 with your surviving team members of ME2. As the plot progresses, eventually some old characters will remain behind after a mission, and at certain plot-relevant points, new characters will join you, introduced by a mission you do with them. The important thing is that you can choose - within certain limites - when to do the missions where you must leave your old character(s) behind. So Miranda fans can do that Cerberus-related mission late and have her on the team for most of the game, and the fans of the other LIs can do the same. Most interaction will still be on the character-related mission and maybe on the Normandy, but hopefully we'll have some interjections and banter in other places.

Im curious, why would this be your favorite scenario? I would not like this at all. Ive already gotten a connection with the ME2 squaddies, why replace them?

[Ieldra]

AntenDS wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

AntenDS wrote...
I don't get why Miranda would head Cerberus.

The idea is that she'd transform it into something like the STG - still an organization for actions that don't suffer publicity well, but not as ruthless as under TIM. That would be a good use of both her operative and administrative skills.
.

I just don't think she has the means to take over Cerberus other than having Shep go in and blasting away every Cerberus Base.  The whole notion of her taking it over seems like a reaction to Liara Taking over as Shadow Broker.  Miranda can lead a science team and strike but that doesn't mean she can rule over a company like Cerberus.

That idea is older than LotSB by quite a few months - when LotSB appeared, it was almost as if the Bioware had stolen our idea and adapted it to Liara. Also, it's plausible that Miranda has training in management, being the daughter of a wealthy businessman who underwent a rigorous education programme at her father's hands  *and* leader of a Cerberus cell (which is more than just a science team). She also has the operative skillset.

[Alessar]

hooahguy wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

My favorite scenario: you start ME3 with your surviving team members of ME2. As the plot progresses, eventually some old characters will remain behind after a mission, and at certain plot-relevant points, new characters will join you, introduced by a mission you do with them. The important thing is that you can choose - within certain limites - when to do the missions where you must leave your old character(s) behind. So Miranda fans can do that Cerberus-related mission late and have her on the team for most of the game, and the fans of the other LIs can do the same. Most interaction will still be on the character-related mission and maybe on the Normandy, but hopefully we'll have some interjections and banter in other places.

Im curious, why would this be your favorite scenario? I would not like this at all. Ive already gotten a connection with the ME2 squaddies, why replace them?

I think Iedra means that if we were to get new members to replace older ones, the scenario listed would be the best.

[hooahguy]

You mean, if BW made us get new squaddies, then that would be the best scenario?
In that case, I agree with Iedra.

Modifié par hooahguy, 18 octobre 2010 - 10:31 .

[Ieldra]

hooahguy wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
My favorite scenario: you start ME3 with your surviving team members of ME2. As the plot progresses, eventually some old characters will remain behind after a mission, and at certain plot-relevant points, new characters will join you, introduced by a mission you do with them. The important thing is that you can choose - within certain limites - when to do the missions where you must leave your old character(s) behind. So Miranda fans can do that Cerberus-related mission late and have her on the team for most of the game, and the fans of the other LIs can do the same. Most interaction will still be on the character-related mission and maybe on the Normandy, but hopefully we'll have some interjections and banter in other places.

Im curious, why would this be your favorite scenario? I would not like this at all. Ive already gotten a connection with the ME2 squaddies, why replace them?

It is a scenario that would give us Miranda as a team member for most of the game if we wanted, *AND* make her take a plot-relevant role at the same time. The best of both worlds. It needn't apply to all old characters - there are some more suited to their old roles, Garrus for instance. Perhaps you could also make the assumption of that plot-critical role beneficial for the mission but optional.
Lastly, a game completely without new characters wouldn't be desirable, though I'd limit it to two or three.

Edit:
About your reply above: We will get new characters, that's for sure. The point is that (a) I don't want to be forced to start with them, ( I'd like to give my favorite woman in the galaxy a plot-relevant role at some time in the game - which being Shepard's XO is not. I am willing to sacrifice time on the team for that.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 octobre 2010 - 10:40 .

[jtav]

I know what I want. I just consider it unlikely and am wasting my limited panicking energy on the thought that Miranda will lose her competence and pragmatism, which would severely impact my enjoyment of the game. Not having Miranda on the team would also impact my enjoyment, but not to the same degree.