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[Ryzaki]

Miranda is slowly but surely growing on me. Though...I just wish Shepard didn't sound so awkward during her romance. Egads. Tis the only thing stopping me from doing it.



And yes that arguement with Jack always made me sigh. Jack barges in Miranda's office and even when my Paragon/Renegade score is high enough to get them to end it amicably (well semi-amicably) I find my self now siding with Miranda.

[jtav]

Shepard does sound awkward. Though it's perfectly possible to like her and not the romance.



I blame Miranda more, but only because I don't think Jack's responsible for her actions. I pity them both. I'm planning on doing Jack's romance next game. Curious to see if my feelings change.

[Ieldra]

Ryzaki wrote...
Miranda is slowly but surely growing on me.

Very nice to hear

Though...I just wish Shepard didn't sound so awkward during her romance. Egads. Tis the only thing stopping me from doing it.

Too bad indeed. The ME games are the only games where I must bend over backwards mentally to identify with my own player character. The romance is OK, but it could be a lot better if Shepard hadn't mutated into SuperShep between ME1 and ME2.

Do you think, BTW, the other romances are better written? I tried Tali and Jack once to see where it would go, but in their romances I can identify with Shepard even less.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 25 octobre 2010 - 08:57 .

[jtav]

I think Tali's is better constructed and does exactly what it sets out to do. I just don't like that type of romance very much. The best in my opinion is Thane's. I'm having extraordinary difficulty staying faithful to Kaidan and Horizon has nothing to do with it.

[Caihn]

Ieldra2 wrote...


Do you think, BTW, the other romances are better written? I tried Tali and Jack once to see where it would go, but in their romances I can identify with Shepard even less.

I've seen all the romance conversations and scenes on youtube, and Miranda's romance is still my favorite.

If I have to pick my favorites it would be :

1- Miranda
2- Liara (because of LotSB)
3- Thane

[Ryzaki]

jtav wrote...

Shepard does sound awkward. Though it's perfectly possible to like her and not the romance.

I blame Miranda more, but only because I don't think Jack's responsible for her actions. I pity them both. I'm planning on doing Jack's romance next game. Curious to see if my feelings change.

Nah I can't find myself blaming Miranda because Jack must've stormed in her office right after I finished Jack's loyalty mission. Like...seriously Jack? You couldn't have done that the whole time we were there? I might force myself to endure Shep's cringe worthy romance dialogue to see the Miranda romance. Maybe. But since I've started dragging her around everywhere I'm seeing plenty of her good moments. (Though I have to say her crowning moment is telling TIM to screw off). 

Ieldra2 wrote...
Too bad indeed. The ME games are the only games where I must bend over backwards mentally to identify with my own player character. The romance is OK, but it could be a lot better if Shepard hadn't mutated into SuperShep between ME1 and ME2.

Do you think, BTW, the other romances are better written? I tried Tali and Jack once to see where it would go, but in their romances I can identify with Shepard even less.

Aye. There are times where my jaw drops with some of the things Shep says. (LIke Paragon Shep screaming at Mordin that he's a murderer during the loyalty mission only to say at the end of the mission "Mordin...you're not a murder." after stopping him from killing Maelon. Lolwut?   ) At least be consistent!  

Nah. I can't get past Jack's F*** OFF! To bother romancing her and Tali's is just...way too quick. I get that we've known each other but 2-3 conversations in she's already talking about linking suits. 

My poor single Shep. The only people who he can count on is Samara and Thane. (Well...Jacob too but Jacob's so much of a douche at times...). I actually adored the friendships with them. (You're practically Thane's first friend and Samara tells you that whenever you need her she'll be there. It was only 3 lines tops but I squee'd.) 

I don't play FemShep often enough to do the romances. 

I like that through conversations (even though there's not a lot. No where near DA's level of greatness) Shep and Miranda gain a healthy respect for her. (And before he starts romancing her he doesn't seem as patronizing. ...or was it just me that felt that Shep could be increadibly patronizing in the romances?) Well...not Tali's so much (or maybe that's because I feel the whole "we shouldn't do this because you might get sick" to be valid.) 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 25 octobre 2010 - 09:13 .

[Isaidlunch]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Do you think, BTW, the other romances are better written? I tried Tali and Jack once to see where it would go, but in their romances I can identify with Shepard even less.

Personally I thought the Jack romance had incredible writing, it perfectly captured that teasing/humorful romance you'd expect for someone like Jack with enough lovey dovey dialogue to show the two really loved each other. I could definitely identify with Shepard more here compared to the others.

[t3HPrO]

Actually, I can see Jack and Miri becoming friends(or at the very least, people who can get along). After 9 rounds of b**chfighting in the boxing ring, of course. And that will be covered sometime soon in my fic. It's just that BW didn't bother much with the after-SM character dev, which leaves us thinking: 'Jack's gonna try to kill Miranda once more...', which I highly doubt. Miranda should soften up enough to apologize to Jack after being romanced. And before those damned thoughts come in again... "Ah yes, intense Miri and Jack hatesex. We have dismissed those claims."

[t3HPrO]

Honestly speaking, I found Tali's romance the shallowest and the most fanservice-y. It's one convo then BOOM! they start talking about sex. I really think it was written that way to appeal to little boys who expect women to throw themselves at their feet. At least you had to get Liara to warm up a bit. Or maybe it's just that I find Tali bland(it was stated somewhere that every single line of hers was run through a synthesizer, a luxury the other VAs did not have), and almost every convo of hers was usually about her whining about everything, or her going into quarian-codex mode. ZZZ. And that is why she'll never be anything more than that little sister I never had.

[jtav]

A writer I respect has done Miranda/Jack, though I haven't read it. It's not my thing. Yes, there are people I don't ship Miranda with. Shocking, I know. I really do like her with Liara though. A lot.

[Ryzaki]

t3HPrO wrote...

Actually, I can see Jack and Miri becoming friends(or at the very least, people who can get along). After 9 rounds of b**chfighting in the boxing ring, of course. And that will be covered sometime soon in my fic. It's just that BW didn't bother much with the after-SM character dev, which leaves us thinking: 'Jack's gonna try to kill Miranda once more...', which I highly doubt. Miranda should soften up enough to apologize to Jack after being romanced. And before those damned thoughts come in again... "Ah yes, intense Miri and Jack hatesex. We have dismissed those claims."

Thing is I don't see Miranda stooping down to Jack's level to fight her unless Miranda was defending herself. And while I think Jack is biotically stronger than Miranda I could easily see Miranda winning. The whole time in Miranda's office she's calmly dodging Jack's attack and just waiting for an opening while Jack is simply attacking wildly. The only way the two of them could be friends would be if Jack would stop verbally attacking Miranda over everything Cerberus did. (Hopefully after the CB the whole "Cerberus Cheerleader" bit would be at an end). 

(Not to mention game wise Miranda's a hell of a lot more useful than Jack is). 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 26 octobre 2010 - 02:04 .

[fongiel24]

t3HPrO wrote...

Actually, I can see Jack and Miri becoming friends(or at the very least, people who can get along). After 9 rounds of b**chfighting in the boxing ring, of course. And that will be covered sometime soon in my fic. It's just that BW didn't bother much with the after-SM character dev, which leaves us thinking: 'Jack's gonna try to kill Miranda once more...', which I highly doubt. Miranda should soften up enough to apologize to Jack after being romanced. And before those damned thoughts come in again... "Ah yes, intense Miri and Jack hatesex. We have dismissed those claims."

I can't see this happening - either the b*tchfighting, the friendship, or Miranda apologizing.

Sparring isn't something you should be doing when you're angry or with people you hate because it decreases the ability of the combatants to think rationally and increases the risk of injury. I imagine with the addition of biotics, this would only get worse.

Jack has been conditioned since her childhood to fear and hate Cerberus and everything that has to do with it. Miranda prances around in a uniform with a Cerberus symbol right on it and is willing to stubbornly defend them. I can't see Jack seeing past that even if she wanted to. Jack seems to be a very impulsive person who lacks much self-restraint or self-control. She just doesn't have the patience for it.

I can't see Miranda apologizing because... well, why should she? She wasn't the one who stormed into Jack's living quarters and started throwing sh*t at her with her biotics. You'd have to be Mother Teresa (or a doormat) to be willing to apologize to someone who attacked you first, particularly if they're the type of person who would be likely to throw your apology back in your face. Miranda might change somewhat, but I doubt she'd change that much.

t3HPrO wrote...

Honestly speaking, I found Tali's romance
the shallowest and the most fanservice-y. It's one convo then BOOM! they
start talking about sex. I really think it was written that way to
appeal to little boys who expect women to throw themselves at their
feet.

To be fair, Tali is recruited fairly late. If they forced you into having three or four convos before Shepard can even begin flirting, a lot of people might run out of time before the SM to conclude the romance arc.  

[Ieldra]

Ryzaki wrote...
I like that through conversations (even though there's not a lot. No where near DA's level of greatness) Shep and Miranda gain a healthy respect for her. (And before he starts romancing her he doesn't seem as patronizing. ...or was it just me that felt that Shep could be increadibly patronizing in the romances?)

No, you're not the only one. Shepard is patronizing in the romances. In Miranda's case it's more jarring than in the others because she's more on his level than Tali or Jack.

[Ieldra]

fongiel24 wrote...
To be fair, Tali is recruited fairly late. If they forced you into having three or four convos before Shepard can even begin flirting, a lot of people might run out of time before the SM to conclude the romance arc.  

I don't think so. If you like Tali, you'll recruit her early, and there are enough missions and N7 assignments for two dozen conversations after Horizon. Besides, I think Tali's loyalty mission has more dialogue than anyone else's loyalty mission to make up for it.
Having said that, one reason why Miranda's romance is so much more convincing is that you know her from the start of the game, and come to know her better much more gradually, especially if you don't always trigger the conversations at the earliest possibe time.

[Ryzaki]

Ieldra2 wrote...
No, you're not the only one. Shepard is patronizing in the romances. In Miranda's case it's more jarring than in the others because she's more on his level than Tali or Jack.

Oh. Good. I was concerned I might've been overly sensitive. At least in ME1 I actually felt that It was more balanced...granted it was ninja-y but still... 

...And good grief. I was watching a youtube vid of the Jack romance...is it wrong I wanted to smack Dude Shep? 

[GodWood]

Ryzaki wrote...
...And good grief. I was watching a youtube vid of the Jack romance...is it wrong I wanted to smack Dude Shep? 

Its best to avoid most of the upper right dialogue options in Jack's romance otherwise Shep comes off as a bit of a douche.

[Elyvern]

To be fair too, Garrus and Tali also got shafted on friendship dialogue because they are established characters. All the new ME2 characters do get more "get to know them" dialogue whereas Garrus really reverts to "calibrations" fast if you're maleshep.

I'm running an adept maleshep on my latest runthrough and wondering if I should try and romance Jack, (not the first time I'm trying) but the only way I can even begin to do that is not talk to Miranda at all. It's so hard...

[Elyvern]

Ryzaki wrote...

Nah I can't find myself blaming Miranda because Jack must've stormed in her office right after I finished Jack's loyalty mission. Like...seriously Jack? You couldn't have done that the whole time we were there? I might force myself to endure Shep's cringe worthy romance dialogue to see the Miranda romance. Maybe. But since I've started dragging her around everywhere I'm seeing plenty of her good moments. (Though I have to say her crowning moment is telling TIM to screw off). 

There is a way to avoid the cringe-worthy shep lines, not to mention the classic sheploo's rape face which takes place during the "admire your body" dialogue. Ugh. Just choose the renegade romance path. We were discussing that renegade Shepard has some of the most natural interactions with Miranda in the game, and the renegade romance is the best example. The reward is you get a spontaneous and tense confrontation between them that ends up with a passionate kiss. It continues to boggle me how the paragon and renegade path end up with such vast differences in quality and execution. 

[Ieldra]

Elyvern wrote...
To be fair too, Garrus and Tali also got shafted on friendship dialogue because they are established characters. All the new ME2 characters do get more "get to know them" dialogue whereas Garrus really reverts to "calibrations" fast if you're maleshep.

Very fast, indeed. In my latest playthrough, I made a point of trying to speak to Garrus every chance I had, because I thought I'd missed something. But no, the point where he retreats behind his calibrations does come early.

I'm running an adept maleshep on my latest runthrough and wondering if I should try and romance Jack, (not the first time I'm trying) but the only way I can even begin to do that is not talk to Miranda at all. It's so hard...

I've given up on that. Miranda monopolizes the maleShep LI slot like no character in any game with romances ever.

I've done this to see all romance conversations:
(1) Do all loyalty missions and all loyalty mission debrief conversations with Miranda, Jack and Tali.
(2) Leave one N7 short assignment open (good choice: the one where you need to reactivate radiation shields for a colony), then do the Reaper IFF mission and Legion's loyalty mission
(3) Save your game.
(4) From this saved game, you can do any romance in about 15-20 minutes. The sequence: romance conversation 1 - N7 mission - romance conversation 2 - crew abduction - romance conversation 3 (only Jack, she has one more) - enter the Omega-4 relay and see the love scene.
(5) Once you're finished you can reload any earlier save and continue your regular game from there.
I did this because seeing the romance scenes on youtube isn't the same as seeing them in your game. My first impression didn't change, though: Tali's romance is somewhat OK if you like the type, which I don't, and Jack's is completely implausible. Miranda's has flaws (most of them are Shepard's), but it's still the best of the male romances.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 26 octobre 2010 - 08:39 .

[Jebel Krong]

Elyvern wrote...

To be fair too, Garrus and Tali also got shafted on friendship dialogue because they are established characters. All the new ME2 characters do get more "get to know them" dialogue whereas Garrus really reverts to "calibrations" fast if you're maleshep.
I'm running an adept maleshep on my latest runthrough and wondering if I should try and romance Jack, (not the first time I'm trying) but the only way I can even begin to do that is not talk to Miranda at all. It's so hard...

yeah all the cool character development garrus has is nearly undone by the limited conversation options you get with him. tali i always recruit last, although she has great missions, as i have no interest in her (either game, she was just so boring in me1) i don't really notice the lack of convos there, plus i'm usually chomping at the bit to get legion.

[Elyvern]

Ieldra2 wrote...

I've given up on that. Miranda monopolizes the maleShep LI slot like no character in any game with romances ever.

(snip)

I did this because seeing the romance scenes on youtube isn't the same as seeing them in your game. My first impression didn't change, though: Tali's romance is somewhat OK if you like the type, which I don't, and Jack's is completely implausible. Miranda's has flaws (most of them are Shepard's), but it's still the best of the male romances.

Thanks, Ieldra. Setting Miranda aside, the most important reason for me not being able to romance any other squadmate is my inability to divorce my personal opinions from the character of Shepard being a spectre/war-hero/N7 elite/savior of the citadel. I never had a problem with Shepard patronising all LIs because I don't think it would be out of character for him, consciously or unconsciously. This is a man who can charm eskimos into buying fridges, who gets his own way on almost everything. It's why I I find it so difficult to steer my Shepard into a relationship with Tali or Liara, and Ashley or Jack (to a lesser extent) because he would invariably end up the dominant partner, reducing all 4 women into subordinate roles. His decisions will always seem like the best, his power to change and influence them will override their personalities as a result.

[MindyG]

I’ve been reading and following this thread for months
unofficially and Miri is the sole reason I bought Mass Effect 2. Having not
been a PC gamer before and strictly a Final Fantasy die-hard, it’s a big step
for me, but so great is the pull of this polygon perfect woman that I had to
know everything about her.

I find myself just zooming in and panning around her
(she’s ALWAYS in my squad) just to admire her.

:?P.S- I’m not sure if this is the right place to ask this,
but after seeing the 3d renders people have made of Miranda I have also become
obsessed to learn how to do this myself.

Could a Miranda fan who has successfully created a 3d model
of her possibly help me out? I am a very quick study with computer programs, so
despite being a novice, I promise not to waste your time.

Also, fantastic screenshots (thank you Jebel Krong), my HD is already filling up
with them and every bit of Miri fanart I can find in this thread.

Thank you all
so much for feeding my girl-crush!<3

Modifié par MindyG, 26 octobre 2010 - 11:55 .

[Caihn]

 Welcome MindyG.

You can also join the Miranda support group here : http://social.bioware.com/group/1284/

I also take Miranda in my squad every time. She's my favorite character & romance, but she's also my favorite squadmate in combat.


I can't help you for the 3d model.

[Jebel Krong]

oh thanks, MindyG - glad you enjoyed them.



i know people have extracted the 3d models from the game, but i don't know anything about posing/rigging etc. myself. an old poster here: jeanluc761 may be able to help if he's still around.

[jtav]

I'm the only one here unmoved by the kiss, aren't I? *continues being thread contrarian* The Paragon lines about how she can be proud of what she's done with her gifts are among my favorite.



I think I know why Miranda makes such a good romantic lead for me. We see the depth of her familial love for Oriana. If she ever found someone she loved romantically at that level, she'd show the same care and devotion. Being really, genuinely loved by Miranda is heady stuff.