15168 réponses à ce sujet

[Mondo47]

Ieldra2 wrote...

fongiel24 wrote...
I like the krogan as enemies. They're brutal, violent, and singleminded in their determination to roll over everybody else, but at least they're direct and honest about it, as Mondo mentioned. You never have to guess where you stand with them and when they come for you, they do it without deception. I much prefer them to the batarians, who skulk about in the shadows and wage war by proxy with slavers and pirates. There's almost a perverted sense of honour the krogan have that sets them apart from other villains.

Except that the batarians don't have these attributes as racial traits. The canon leaves the possibility open that we might meet decent batarians somewhen, but the krogan would have to evolve as a species. I wonder why nobody has tried to make a genophage-like virus that makes them less aggressive. 

Sorry, somewhat OT here. My Miranda thoughts are all going into my fanfic at the moment. Spy fiction isn't the easiest thing to write.

Veering off topic a little here, but I think we're in danger of judging a different species by our own standards, which doesn't really work from a sociological standpoint. It's akin to going into the depths of the South American jungle and meeting a tribe of cannibals; they kill and eat other jungle tribespeople, something that is morally abhorrent to us, but their society is so far removed from our own we cannot possibly claim to have the moral high ground there, nor the right to alter their way of life. What works for them is a result of the environment they have developed in for perhaps hundreds of years, whereas our own society only in recent historical terms abolished slavery of aboriginal peoples and still can't make its mind up about a plethora of social issues that have no meaning to our jungle cannibals; what they do isn't acceptable to us, but that is only based on our difference to their social systems. It gets even harder when the distance between the cultures in question is not just a few thousand miles into a rainforest but a few thousand lightyears to another planet altogether.

The krogan as a species evolved on a planet so hostile in terms of environment and ecosystem they had to develop masses of biological backup systems and an overcharged breeding cycle to simply avoid dying out. Because of that they grew up confrontational and aggressive; logical if everything on your world was out to kill you. We as a race have not developed in such an environment, so our culture is vastly seperated from theirs. Expecting a krogan to behave in a way that doesn't reflect their society would be like demanding the hypothetical cannibals to stop eating people simply because we say so. Sure, they aren't always the nicest creatures out there, but it is only reflective of their societal development. The real damage was done by the salarian uplift, as Mordin states. If the krogan had been integrated into galactic society slowly, allowed to overcome the drift between their culture and those of the galaxy-at-large, and not been used as living tools of genocide during the rachni war, things might have been very different. It might have taken centuries, but it would doubtlessly have been more successful than giving the intergalactic equivalent of almost-indestructable vikings their own spacecraft and then expecting them to follow the demands of races that based on the krogan's societal rules command little or no respect... once again, it's like telling the cannibals not to eat people anymore - they just will not roll over and accept it.

I'm not trying to make excuses for the krogan's actions, I'm merely saying they make sense within their society. To have expected anything else was a little naive, and makes the use of the genophage especially "ethically ambiguous" as Mordin says, considering it has placed the krogan as a race on a very slippery slope that seems likely to lead to extinction eventually. Besides, Wrex demonstrates that alterations in the structure of krogan society are possible with enough support and time to develop (yes, this involves a lot of bloodshed, but this is the krogan's own business and it is the way they've done things for a long time - it'll have to continue for a while longer before anything can really change), but stronger punative action against them is dangerously judgemental when the problems the krogans have caused lie squarely at other race's doors. Outliers in all species, to quote Mordin one more time... and at least a krogan won't lie to you about its motives. Brutal and barbaric they may be by our standards, but by their own they are very much a product of their homeworld and the times they have been forced to live in.

Besides, think about that krogan that works for Mr Thax - can you cope with the creepiness of a krogan saying "have a pleasant day" to you?

And just to make sure we roll back onto topic in a suitably martial manner, ten-hut!

[Elyvern]

Again, Mordin signed up for the suicide mission,and is fully aware of what that entails. There was never at any point in the story where its stated that Mordin was only recruited for his scientific knowledge. Your desire to save him from a pointless death is a personal motivation that cannot make Miranda's suggestion abhorent. She has a very clear view of what the mission objective is. Saving Mordin or anyone in this case would be a luxury. And when you say things like the countermeasure was already created, there is no need for Mordin, that's meta-gaming. How would you know he doesn't have more tricks up his sleeves?



Anyway, can we just get off this? It's coming down to nitpicking and I very well like the fact that Miranda did make such a suggestion. The weird part is when she advocates blowing up the base. She's perfectly in character until then.

[Ryzaki]

Elyvern wrote...

Again, Mordin signed up for the suicide mission,and is fully aware of what that entails. There was never at any point in the story where its stated that Mordin was only recruited for his scientific knowledge. Your desire to save him from a pointless death is a personal motivation that cannot make Miranda's suggestion abhorent. She has a very clear view of what the mission objective is. Saving Mordin or anyone in this case would be a luxury. And when you say things like the countermeasure was already created, there is no need for Mordin, that's meta-gaming. How would you know he doesn't have more tricks up his sleeves?

Anyway, can we just get off this? It's coming down to nitpicking and I very well like the fact that Miranda did make such a suggestion. The weird part is when she advocates blowing up the base. She's perfectly in character until then.

Right so him being called "The Scientist" wasn't a dead giveaway? 

Nor the fact that they set him up in a lab first thing?

Nor the fact that TIM specifically asks if Mordin got the countermeasure? 

Because if he had tricks up his sleeves he would've gotten information about the Collectors from EDI and by Proxy Shepard would know about them already. He knows nothing more about the CB than anyone else.

I'll get off it. But metagaming my foot.

Her making such a suggestion was fine if a little sigh worthy but yeah her going to say let's blow it up was her crowning moment for me so I wouldn't change it. I would just make her less of a cold ice queen to start with. And a bit  lot less of a cerberus apologist.

Either that or kept her a "the ends justify the means" all the way to the end. Because it makes no sense as it stands that someone as intelligent as her would be unaware of Cerberus' darker deeds. So either she was falsely horrified at Pragia (because if the ends justify the means then Jack was somewhat of a success Jack just needed a control chip) or the ends don't justify the means and alot of her dialogue earlier is just weird.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 01 novembre 2010 - 09:45 .

[fongiel24]

Ryzaki wrote...
How is knowing the scientist guy is a scientist and not well suited for front line combat metagaming? 
How is knowing anything that needs to be hacked can be done by the Geth far better than Mordin metagaming?
How is realizing that if Mordin needs to create another countermeasure he's probably going to need a lab metagaming? 

Mordin may be a brilliant scientist, but he's also a veteran special forces operator who served for years with the STG. Going into a situation completely blind with no intelligence, I'd want the guy with tons of experience by my side and not handholding my crew back to the Normandy. The fact that Mordin has survived to retire from the STG proves that he either has great instincts or he's incredibly lucky (or both). This guy isn't a lab tech. He's squishier than a character like Grunt, but keep in mind he's also managed to take on a krogan in hand-to-hand combat and kill it with a farming implement. In-universe Mordin is no pushover.

While he obviously wouldn't be able to come up with as effective a countermeasure to unexpected Collector technology outside of his lab, he knows more about them than anyone. He's the most likely to come up with an ad hoc solution that could make the difference.

Even if we're just going to say Mordin's scientific expertise and experience aren't of any use to Shepard, the squad is already badly outnumbered. In that kind of situation, wouldn't you rather have 12 guns on your side instead of 11? Every additional shooter makes a difference. Shepard's primary objective wasn't to rescue the crew - it was to take down the Collectors. If Mordin can take out five Collectors all by himself, that brings Shepard five dead Collectors closer to accomplishing the mission.

Modifié par fongiel24, 02 novembre 2010 - 12:41 .

[Mondo47]

Quick question for the Miranda fans - I'm interested in your interpretations of this for something I'm potentially working on... basically, the relationship between Jacob and Miranda; do you have any thoughts on why "it got real close, then it got real far apart." Can you see potential fractures in any relationship that developed from the beginning? Do you even interpret the relationship as being an intimate one at all?

Seriously, any input would be of use here if I'm going to do the characters any real justice.

[philiposophy]

I don't see anything wrong with Miranda saying you shouldn't send someone to escort the crew. I always do because I want everyone to survive but objectively the mission should come first, and the crew of the SR-2 are expendable in this context.

[Ryzaki]

fongiel24 wrote...
Mordin may be a brilliant scientist, but he's also a veteran special forces operator who served for years with the STG. Going into a situation completely blind with no intelligence, I'd want the guy with tons of experience by my side and not handholding my crew back to the Normandy. The fact that Mordin has survived to retire from the STG proves that he either has great instincts or he's incredibly lucky (or both). This guy isn't a lab tech. He's squishier than a character like Grunt, but keep in mind this is the same guy who managed to take on a krogan in hand-to-hand combat and kill it with a farming implement. In-universe Mordin is no pushover.

He tells you the STG is more about stealth and recon. In ME Kairren *spell is off I know* tells you as much. Granted I know Mordin is no pushover his specialty however is lab tech and not holding the line. He took on the Krogan because it was a necessity. Not a horde of Krogan. I didn't say he was completely incapable of fighting but being on the front lines with hordes of Collectors charging? No I wouldn't pick Mordin. And handholding the crew back to the Normandy? Yes let's forget that most of them are completely injured and the other half emotionally scarred. Let's forget that them being bait for the Collectors is part of the reason Joker manages to escape. Nope that doesn't matter at all. He tells you himself he's not one for being on the front lines (which is where you need everyone because you're being constantly swarmed). Hit and run tatics don't do squat when you're surronded and on the enemies turf.

Edit: as for a solution in the base. Let's be serious. If you really needed another countermeasure and you just ran into whatever you needed the CM against your team is going to die. The Collectors weren't sitting on their asses while you were in there.

Edit2: It would've been funny if they CB had been more open and you went into the wrong room and got an instant Game Over.

Even if we're just going to say Mordin's scientific expertise and experience aren't of any use to Shepard, the squad is already badly outnumbered. In that kind of situation, wouldn't you rather have 12 guns
on your side instead of 11? Every additional shooter makes a difference. Shepard's primary objective wasn't to rescue the crew - it was to take down the Collectors. If Mordin can take out five Collectors all by himself, that brings Shepard five dead Collectors closer to accomplishing the mission.

If every additonal shooter makes a difference Shep should've been able to force to crew to go with him. (Sadly you can't D:) Though yes I can see the whole one more person is more collectors dead.

So yeah her reasoning is sound. Fine you win. Doesn't make it any less douchebaggy though.

I wonder though if she will play any important part in ME3? I doubt it seeing as she can die.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 02 novembre 2010 - 12:55 .

[Ryzaki]

Mondo47 wrote...

Quick question for the Miranda fans - I'm interested in your interpretations of this for something I'm potentially working on... basically, the relationship between Jacob and Miranda; do you have any thoughts on why "it got real close, then it got real far apart." Can you see potential fractures in any relationship that developed from the beginning? Do you even interpret the relationship as being an intimate one at all?

Seriously, any input would be of use here if I'm going to do the characters any real justice.

I'm guess Jacob and her were intimate after Galaxy (Ick intimate. I sound like a prude. ) but Miranda and her ridculously high standards starting getting on Jacob's nerves. (Yet another reason I can't romance her.) I'm guess she kept wanting him to be something he couldn't be and they realized that they didn't know each other as well as they hoped. I hope the parting was amicable but its hard to tell.

The fractures I could imagine was Miranda's gung ho Cerberus attitude while Jacob was more iffy on it. And probably what they expected from each other.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 02 novembre 2010 - 12:51 .

[fongiel24]

Ryzaki wrote...

He tells you the STG is more about stealth and recon. In ME Kairren *spell is off I know* tells you as much. Granted I know Mordin is no pushover his specialty however is lab tech and not holding the line. He took on the Krogan because it was a necessity. Not a horde of Krogan. I didn't say he was completely incapable of fighting but being on the front lines with hordes of Collectors charging? No I wouldn't pick Mordin.

The STG are stealth and recon specialists but at the end of the day they are still elite commandos. The STG being stealth and recon-oriented doesn't even make them that unusual amongst special forces units. Most of the world's elite special forces are stealth and recon specialists. The STG prefer to get the job done without excessive shooting. That doesn't mean they can't shoot their way in and out.

Looking at Mordin's skillset, you can't say he's a lab tech first and a soldier second either. He's capable of being both at the same time, as is shown in his SB dossier. When you first go to recruit Mordin it's mentioned several times that he took on Blue Suns and vorcha all by himself. Mordin might not be your first choice for holding a position, but taking him off the firing line definitely makes it weaker.

And handholding the crew back to the Normandy? Yes let's forget that most of them are completely injured and the other half emotionally scarred. Let's forget that them being bait for the Collectors is part of the reason Joker manages to escape. Nope that doesn't matter at all. He tells you himself he's not one for being on the front lines (which is where you need everyone because you're being swarmed).

Cold as it sounds, the survival of the crew is irrelevant, no matter how injured or emotionally scarred they are. They knew the risks when they signed up. Nobody stuck a gun to their heads and forced them to volunteer for the mission. If Mordin gets them to the Normandy but Shepard fails to destroy the CB, the entire mission is a wash and everyone is likely dead anyway.

Edit: as for a solution in the base. Let's be serious. If you really needed another countermeasure and you just ran into whatever you needed the CM against your team is going to die. The Collectors weren't sitting on their asses while you were in there.

Mordin doesn't have the facilities or the time to come up with technological countermeasures, but his experience allows him to offer insights on changing tactics to deal with any surprises. His scientific expertise isn't what's invaluable here - it's his years of experience. He's deal with the unexpected before and managed to prevail. He can be counted on not to lose his cool and panic. That is why his place is on the line.

If I absolutely had to pick anyone to send back with the crew, it'd be Kasumi. Even then, the only reason I ever send someone back with the crew is for metagaming purposes.

Edit:

If every additonal shooter makes a difference Shep should've been able
to force to crew to go with him. (Sadly you can't D:) Though yes I can
see the whole one more person is more collectors dead.

So yeah her reasoning is sound. Fine you win. ../../../images/forum/emoticons/pinched.png Doesn't make it any less douchebaggy though.

Yeah, it's a coldhearted decision to be making but someone had to present it. Who else could we really conceive advising Shepard to leave the crew to fend for themselves? Miranda might soften up a bit over the course of ME2, but at the end of the day she's still ruthlessly pragmatic when it comes to getting the job done.

Modifié par fongiel24, 02 novembre 2010 - 01:05 .

[Ryzaki]

fongiel24 wrote...

Yes you're right. I bow to your almighty logic.

It's still a douchebaggy thing to do though.

She is a ruthless pragmatist isn't she? Hm...I might've liked *who* I thought she was rather than who she actually is. As it is I'm getting the superiority complex I'm not fond of.

Which makes her latter behavior...the one I can actually say I like her even more confusing. WTF BW? Why not have her attempt to betray a Paragon Shep and then get shot? Honestly it would've been an awesome cutscene. And it shouldn't have mattered loyal or not she shouldn't have been pro-destroying the base. And the only way to stop her should've been death because I doubt she would've backed down. Sure she's grateful Shep helped her with Oriana (which I could probably picture her probably being gracious enough to give Shep a chance to back down before shooting him).

...But that wouldn't have worked because you're forced to have 2 people in your party for the fight against RB even though the game itself will glitch and sometimes your companions "vanish". Gah. Game mechanics ruining storyline. Bah.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 02 novembre 2010 - 01:40 .

[Elyvern]

Mondo47 wrote...

Quick question for the Miranda fans - I'm interested in your interpretations of this for something I'm potentially working on... basically, the relationship between Jacob and Miranda; do you have any thoughts on why "it got real close, then it got real far apart." Can you see potential fractures in any relationship that developed from the beginning? Do you even interpret the relationship as being an intimate one at all?

Seriously, any input would be of use here if I'm going to do the characters any real justice.

I didn't go through the other 2 older threads but check here:

http://social.biowar...dex/2857694/294

read to page 296 or so for some input. If you feel it isn't enough, you can PM me or something.

[enayasoul]

Do you see Miranda as having an apartment or loft on Illium like Liara does in LOTSB? I am thinking yes, or at least something rich in taste and elegance... not that she spends a lot of time at her place. Would be more interesting than her and my maleshep being on the ship all the time.



(Basically for my romance story fic with maleshep)

[Ryzaki]

enayasoul wrote...

Do you see Miranda as having an apartment or loft on Illium like Liara does in LOTSB? I am thinking yes, or at least something rich in taste and elegance... not that she spends a lot of time at her place. Would be more interesting than her and my maleshep being on the ship all the time.

(Basically for my romance story fic with maleshep)

Maybe not on Illium but I could picture her having a elegant and secluded apartment.

[jtav]

I always imagined her having a collection of safehouses with never a place she calls home and living out of a suitcase.

[Ieldra]

enayasoul wrote...
Do you see Miranda as having an apartment or loft on Illium like Liara does in LOTSB? I am thinking yes, or at least something rich in taste and elegance... not that she spends a lot of time at her place. Would be more interesting than her and my maleshep being on the ship all the time.

(Basically for my romance story fic with maleshep)

I agree with jtav here - she has a collection of safehouses on various worlds. If she needs a place for a tryst, she'll rent a room - a really nice one - in a hotel or suchlike. She's spent two years on Lazarus station and she's a practical woman, so I doubt she kept a home somewhere.

[Jebel Krong]

mordin is cool and a badass. that is all.

[fongiel24]

enayasoul wrote...

Do you see Miranda as having an apartment or loft on Illium like Liara does in LOTSB? I am thinking yes, or at least something rich in taste and elegance... not that she spends a lot of time at her place. Would be more interesting than her and my maleshep being on the ship all the time.

(Basically for my romance story fic with maleshep)

If Miranda did have some sort of more permanent home that she retreated to in her rare periods of downtime, I imagine it would be a luxury space yaht of some type. Easier to hide than a luxury apartment and if her cover was blown and someone came for her, she could just move it. It could also act as useful cover for her work, allowing her to masquerade as a spoiled heiress or a successful business executive, like Grayson did in Ascension.

[t3HPrO]

Wow come on guys, you're like a bunch of fans who don't want their favorite band to go famous and well liked just because you want them to 'remain yours because you discovered them.' Or another example would be how military aviation fans are pissed that the AC130 is now in pop culture. Miri should lose most of the ice if her character dev were to be truly successful, otherwise she'd be a b**chier version of Tali, who was a whiny girl with a Russian(?) accent in the first game and is a whiny girl with a Russian(?) accent in the second. If Bioware were to conform to your wishes to keep Miranda very icy in the 3rd game, what character dev is there? Of course, I'm not expecting Miri to pull a Yeoman Chambers on us(I still want her to be aloof when working), but I'd like her to be very open with her emotions with Shepard at the very least.

[t3HPrO]

fongiel24 wrote...

If Miranda did have some sort of more permanent home that she retreated to in her rare periods of downtime, I imagine it would be a luxury space yaht of some type. Easier to hide than a luxury apartment and if her cover was blown and someone came for her, she could just move it. It could also act as useful cover for her work, allowing her to masquerade as a spoiled heiress or a successful business executive, like Grayson did in Ascension.

I like this idea. It fits her covert lifestyle very well, and I thought of James Bond and his yacht in Casino Royale. However, I suspect she may have a permanent piece of property somewhere.

@Ieldra2

200 years in the future and people are still checking into hotel rooms for one nights stands huh? Heh, SSDD indeed.

[Elyvern]

t3HPrO wrote...

Wow come on guys, you're like a bunch of fans who don't want their favorite band to go famous and well liked just because you want them to 'remain yours because you discovered them.' Or another example would be how military aviation fans are pissed that the AC130 is now in pop culture. Miri should lose most of the ice if her character dev were to be truly successful, otherwise she'd be a b**chier version of Tali, who was a whiny girl with a Russian(?) accent in the first game and is a whiny girl with a Russian(?) accent in the second. If Bioware were to conform to your wishes to keep Miranda very icy in the 3rd game, what character dev is there? Of course, I'm not expecting Miri to pull a Yeoman Chambers on us(I still want her to be aloof when working), but I'd like her to be very open with her emotions with Shepard at the very least.

Really? So you're willing to change her character concept solely for the sake of making her more acceptable to a bigger crowd? I'm sorry, it has never crossed my mind when I like Miranda to think that my choice needs to be eventually vindicated by some popular notion of what a "successful" character is. I couldn't care less about crap like that. Whereas you come across as someone who needs peer approval to grant value to your opinion. Maybe that's why you get so worked up over filmsy one-liners from trolls. Liking a character that the rest of the community eventually comes around to warming up is nice but that's all it is - a bonus. But attempting to justify character assassination as reason to make my favourite character more delectable to general tastes means I may as well save myself the heartache and go find some other more "pleasant" character to like in the first place.

[Ieldra]

fongiel24 wrote...

enayasoul wrote...

Do you see Miranda as having an apartment or loft on Illium like Liara does in LOTSB? I am thinking yes, or at least something rich in taste and elegance... not that she spends a lot of time at her place. Would be more interesting than her and my maleshep being on the ship all the time.

(Basically for my romance story fic with maleshep)

If Miranda did have some sort of more permanent home that she retreated to in her rare periods of downtime, I imagine it would be a luxury space yaht of some type. Easier to hide than a luxury apartment and if her cover was blown and someone came for her, she could just move it. It could also act as useful cover for her work, allowing her to masquerade as a spoiled heiress or a successful business executive, like Grayson did in Ascension.

Heh...I had actually planned on using exactly that in my latest fanfic. In the end it didn't add anything significant to the story and I never realized it.

[Mondo47]

Elyvern wrote...

Really? So you're willing to change her character concept solely for the sake of making her more acceptable to a bigger crowd? I'm sorry, it has never crossed my mind when I like Miranda to think that my choice needs to be eventually vindicated by some popular notion of what a "successful" character is. I couldn't care less about crap like that. Whereas you come across as someone who needs peer approval to grant value to your opinion. Maybe that's why you get so worked up over filmsy one-liners from trolls. Liking a character that the rest of the community eventually comes around to warming up is nice but that's all it is - a bonus. But attempting to justify character assassination as reason to make my favourite character more delectable to general tastes means I may as well save myself the heartache and go find some other more "pleasant" character to like in the first place.

Welcome to the world of Jack fans

Thanks for that link to the past posts re. Jacob and Miranda. I'm just working on a more action-packed story involving Zaeed before I drop things down a notch and handle something more emotional and thoughtful. All your insights will be very useful in making this as real as possible without it turning into an episode of Desperate Housewives - cheers

Actually, on the subject of a home for Miranda, I occasionally pen these (very) silly, just-for-laughs stories about little Miranda Shepard: Jack and Shep's nine year old daughter -  these are set long after the end of the trilogy, and yes, it was actually Jack's idea to name her kid after her nemesis Silliness aside, I pictured Miranda having a series of homes in various locations, based on where her work takes her. Keeping apartments here and there wouldn't be too difficult, and it would mean you would always have somewhere secure to go to without the risks of being tracked to public locations like hotels... a friend of mine has multiple holiday homes in his family, and they regularly swan off around the globe for a couple of weeks here and there, the rest of the time the places sit empty, just wating for them to come back. I can see the same thing fitting for Miranda.

Modifié par Mondo47, 02 novembre 2010 - 01:47 .

[t3HPrO]

Elyvern wrote...

Really? So you're willing to change her character concept solely for the sake of making her more acceptable to a bigger crowd? I'm sorry, it has never crossed my mind when I like Miranda to think that my choice needs to be eventually vindicated by some popular notion of what a "successful" character is. I couldn't care less about crap like that. Whereas you come across as someone who needs peer approval to grant value to your opinion. Maybe that's why you get so worked up over filmsy one-liners from trolls. Liking a character that the rest of the community eventually comes around to warming up is nice but that's all it is - a bonus. But attempting to justify character assassination as reason to make my favourite character more delectable to general tastes means I may as well save myself the heartache and go find some other more "pleasant" character to like in the first place.

*Facepalm*
Is Miranda thawing out somewhat defined as a 'character change' and 'character assasination'? Honestly, IDC if she's more popular or not, but you people seem to be positively terrified at the idea that Miranda'll become more popular. Get over yourselves; she's not an exclusive club, she has the right to be popular(one way or the other)...or not. Besides, her thawing up is an intergral part of her character development, so to stop that would be to derail her excellent character development.

[Ieldra]

t3HPrO wrote...
200 years in the future and people are still checking into hotel rooms for one nights stands huh? Heh, SSDD indeed.

What is "SSDD?"

As for the hotel room, if you have no home it is a reasonable alternative, don't you think? It's also a reasonable alternative if you don't want to let your acquaintance into your home because that requires more trust than a one-night stand. And third, nobody said it has to be second-class: it might just be that the hotel room you pay 500 credits per night for is nicer than your home could ever be, and drinks and food can be ordered.

[Nightwriter]

t3HPrO wrote...

Wow come on guys, you're like a bunch of fans who don't want their favorite band to go famous and well liked just because you want them to 'remain yours because you discovered them.' Or another example would be how military aviation fans are pissed that the AC130 is now in pop culture. Miri should lose most of the ice if her character dev were to be truly successful, otherwise she'd be a b**chier version of Tali, who was a whiny girl with a Russian(?) accent in the first game and is a whiny girl with a Russian(?) accent in the second. If Bioware were to conform to your wishes to keep Miranda very icy in the 3rd game, what character dev is there? Of course, I'm not expecting Miri to pull a Yeoman Chambers on us(I still want her to be aloof when working), but I'd like her to be very open with her emotions with Shepard at the very least.

Her character should appeal to more fans. But not by gutting something intrinsic to her character, like her coldness.

Try taking out the ass shots and the ridiculous outfits. Try giving us more of a visible change in Miranda after her loyalty mission and focusing more on her growing doubts about Cerberus. Try showing us she's smart instead of just having her tell us she's smart, which is irritating to a lot of people. Try showing us her past instead of having her go "oh I'm perfect and it tormented me", which is irritating to a lot of people. Try showing us her mistakes and how she struggles with them instead of just having her tell us she makes mistakes. Try having her demonstrate her femme fatale capabilities instead of just using it as a weak excuse to squeeze her into a gratuitous outfit.