15168 réponses à ce sujet

[aeetos21]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Miranda is jealous of Shepard whether you are a guy or a girl. But do you think she'd be a bit more jealous of a femshep coming in and showing her what's what (sorry, best phrase I can come up with) or a maleshep?
I'm inclined it'd be towards the former and feel that that jealousy would transcend to a relationship of intimacy.

Miranda is likely to be more jealous of anyone she'd see as a rival in a relationship, depending on sexual orientation. Your argument implicitly assumes that femShep and Miranda would be interested in the same gender.

Depending on gender, yes. A person doesn't need to have a certain sexual orientation to feel more threatened from one gender or the other. That is up to the person. It is my opinion that Miranda would take it harder to come to terms with that despite being designed to be the "perfect woman" she still comes up short in comparison to Shepard.

[aeetos21]

Sorry for the triple post but I feel the need to try to bring things back to... I don't know, something. Anyway this is one bit of fanart that was posted on the old forums prelaunch I believe and I've been holding onto it ever since because it - well it just kicks ass. Anyway, now seems like a good time to bring it back so that others can enjoy.

[clennon8]

That is a classic, aeetos. I wonder who snapped the polaroid?

[hooahguy]

Awesome pic, Aeetos...

[Mr Plow]

good lord  

well I certainly won't have roving eyes in ME 3 with Miss Lawson around


assuming she is around 

[ADLegend21]

That pic is amazing. any of my sheps would fight for that anyday.

[Loki330]

aeetos21 wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Miranda is jealous of Shepard whether you are a guy or a girl. But do you think she'd be a bit more jealous of a femshep coming in and showing her what's what (sorry, best phrase I can come up with) or a maleshep?
I'm inclined it'd be towards the former and feel that that jealousy would transcend to a relationship of intimacy.

Miranda is likely to be more jealous of anyone she'd see as a rival in a relationship, depending on sexual orientation. Your argument implicitly assumes that femShep and Miranda would be interested in the same gender.

Depending on gender, yes. A person doesn't need to have a certain sexual orientation to feel more threatened from one gender or the other. That is up to the person. It is my opinion that Miranda would take it harder to come to terms with that despite being designed to be the "perfect woman" she still comes up short in comparison to Shepard.

I dunno. I guess there's three general routes this could go (assuming 'Doesn't actually care' is dismissed) I think:

1. If it's maleshep, the whole Manly Man Doing a Man's thing could make her feel threatened; she can never match up to him because of her gender. I personally think this one's tosh myself.

2. Femshep is interesting; Lawson's (usually, a person's definition of attractive varies of course) going to be more attractive due to her genetics and Shepard being a soldier (hello scars, clearly defined musculatur and broken noses). Despite Lawson supposedly being 'better' she's constantly on-upped by Shepard's ability to get people to follow her and do what she wants, Lawson included. That could really threaten her; Shepard is supposed to be nt-as-attractice yet she seems to be able to get people to like her, and like her more than Lawson. Potential jealously, I suppose.

3. More prozaic this one: just feels threatened\\\\intimidated by all the stuff they've done. I personaly think it's this one.

Modifié par Loki330, 28 décembre 2010 - 10:43 .

[enayasoul]

Found this fascinating article about Alpha Male + Alpha Female combination in relationships. http://www.firstlove...pha-female.html

Modifié par enayasoul, 29 décembre 2010 - 12:06 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

enayasoul wrote...

Found this fascinating article about Alpha Male + Alpha Female combination in relationships. http://www.firstlove...pha-female.html

You know, there is actual academic research surrounding interpersonal relations.  And the current consensus is that the number one thing both men and women seek in relationships isn't charm or sex appeal or even confidence--it's emotional warmth and companionship.  Pretty intuitive when you think about it, but we're so innundated with the "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus" pop psychology.

[aeetos21]

Heh, just gave my computer its first screensaver - i liked my miranda background so much i kept screensaver off. anyway i have like somewhere around a thousand me2 pics - most of which are of miranda with either screenshots or fanart or whatever. i just watched the entire engine room scene screenshot by screenshot over the course of like fifteen minutes.

crazy

edit: that's some pretty damn interesting research and i find myself recognizing examples of both an alpha male and alpha female in my life. my best friend since five (over twenty years) is definitely the leader in my group friends - the glue that holds it altogether - and he hasn't gone one month in this year without having a girlfriend at his side (after he broke up with his fiance he's had like six girlfriends since, though the one he's with now does show promise). anyway the alpha female would have to be my ex-fiance, i mean she fits all of that to a T.

now that doesn't mean they're perfect - hardly. but they do have that magnetic draw that the article was talking about. that doesn't mean i'm saying i'm wrong in my earlier thoughts/touchy feelings but... i definitely want to look into this some more. nothing excites me more than being proved wrong - so enlightening =D

Modifié par aeetos21, 29 décembre 2010 - 01:02 .

[shinobi602]

Hey guys and gals. Stopping by to say hello to all my fellow Mirimaniacs. Just a small update about the group too. We've just passed 1,300 members!! We're the largest group after of course our good neighbors the Tali fans lol

This is a huge difference to when the group was first created not too long ago, with only a handful of members at the beginning, and it ballooned into a haven full of Miri fans. I'm so happy to see everybody here, still posting and supporting Miranda. A lot of people have preconceptions about her and don't fully delve into her character, but this thread and the members continue to change that.

Keep up the good work guys!

Modifié par shinobi602, 29 décembre 2010 - 01:49 .

[aeetos21]

Well, three cheers for sweet Miranda then as well as Miranda supporters everywhere. Chances of her being in ME3 keep gettin better each day.

[ToshiStation38]

Seems as good a time to chime in as any. I poke my head in here every once in a while, and the amount of discussion and character-delving you guys have done based on only a few hours worth of content is pretty incredible. I'm also in the process of catching on some of your guys' fanfics, and I'm enjoying them.



I'd like to join the discussion, but I feel like I have a little bit of catching up to do first. You guys just understand Miranda a hell of a lot better than I do.

[aeetos21]

Definitely as good as any and feel more than welcome to hop in when you'd like to Toshi, we're more than happy to have you here with us.

[ToshiStation38]

aeetos21 wrote...

The only thing I can come up with in my defense based on any sort of fact is that right now most youth are conditioned culturally to feel a larger threat from those of our same gender thus creating a higher feeling of competition. But that's it and does that qualify  as a justifier for the way I feel? Hell no.

I think that that kind of threat though is born out of sexual competition. I think that a hetero Miranda would probably feel more threatened by a hetero Femshep than a hetero Maleshep. I will point out that this is purely feeling on my part, but I think that it's because Miranda and Femshep would be sexual competitors, because they would both be seeking mates out of the same group of individuals (hetero men).

The only difference when we look at a bi-sex/lesbian Miranda and a bi-sex/lesbian Shepard is that they are part of the group out of which they're seeking mates (bi-sex or lesbian females), but they are still competing for the attention of the same group.

Now, I'm a heterosexual male, so I have no real qualifications to speak on the matter, but the way I see the argument of sexual competition isn't really affected by gender, but just sexual orientation. There are a lot of permutations to consider, but I have no trouble believing that maybe Miranda would be jealous if she saw a bisexual man hitting on a male Shepard instead of Miranda, just as much as she would be if she saw a heterosexual man hitting on a female Shepard.

Honestly, I'm just spitballing, but I think that largely, Miranda would be more likely to be intimidated by Shepard's accomplishments and presence than any kind of sexual competitiveness, which although might be there, is minute in comparison.

Modifié par ToshiStation38, 29 décembre 2010 - 02:23 .

[elmjuniper]

2. Femshep is interesting; Lawson's (usually, a person's definition of attractive varies of course) going to be more attractive due to her genetics and Shepard being a soldier (hello scars, clearly defined musculatur and broken noses). Despite Lawson supposedly being 'better' she's constantly on-upped by Shepard's ability to get people to follow her and do what she wants, Lawson included. That could really threaten her; Shepard is supposed to be nt-as-attractice yet she seems to be able to get people to like her, and like her more than Lawson. Potential jealously, I suppose.



3. More prozaic this one: just feels threatened\\\\\\\\intimidated by all the stuff they've done. I personaly think it's this one.

perhpas it a bit of oth of these? i would think it could be, that it doesn't have to be one or the other.

The only difference when we look at a bi-sex/lesbian Miranda and a bi-sex/lesbian Shepard is that they are part of the group out of which they're seeking mates (bi-sex or lesbian females), but they are still competing for the attention of the same group.

i'm not sure i understood this? aren't hetero-shep and hetero-miranda part of the same group as well? competing within the same group? maybe it's just late and im confused. no critisism, i just didnt understand it.

[ToshiStation38]

elmjuniper wrote...

i'm not sure i understood this? aren't hetero-shep and hetero-miranda part of the same group as well? competing within the same group? maybe it's just late and im confused. no critisism, i just didnt understand it.

I didn't really word it that well either, so my apologies. Hetero-MShep is looking for a female mate, while hetero-Miranda is looking for a male mate. Hetero-Femshep and Hetero-Miranda are both looking for male mates, and therefore they are in a way competing, because they are looking for mates from the same group (males). In the former example, they are looking in two different places (one at males, one at females).

[elmjuniper]

Hetero-MShep is looking for a female mate, while hetero-Miranda is looking for a male mate. Hetero-Femshep and Hetero-Miranda are both looking for male mates, and therefore they are in a way competing, because they are looking for mates from the same group (males). In the former example, they are looking in two different places (one at males, one at females).

oh ok! now i get it.

sorry about my blonde moment.

yes, that is true and there could be a point to it.

[ViperVenom117]

Hey all, been lurking on the thread for a while now. You guys have some pretty indepth discussions to say the least. Didn't post till now because I wanted to have something to offer other than my support as a Miri fan. I just got my scanner working so I uploaded a fanart I did of Miranda a while back:



Let me know what you think!

Modifié par ViperVenom117, 29 décembre 2010 - 08:29 .

[clennon8]

I like it. Thanks for sharing!

[ViperVenom117]

clennon8 wrote...

I like it. Thanks for sharing!

Thanks!

Sorry about the poor image quality/size. I would have made it larger but for some reason it didn't look right in larger sizes, but its quite a bit clearer in person (naturally) lol

*Edit: Here's a slightly larger version, still not the greatest quality but oh well. =P

Modifié par ViperVenom117, 29 décembre 2010 - 11:43 .

[Crooty]

She makes me stand to attention

Never been so attracted to a video game character lol

[Elyvern]

ToshiStation38 wrote...

aeetos21 wrote...

The only thing I can come up with in my defense based on any sort of fact is that right now most youth are conditioned culturally to feel a larger threat from those of our same gender thus creating a higher feeling of competition. But that's it and does that qualify  as a justifier for the way I feel? Hell no.

I think that that kind of threat though is born out of sexual competition. I think that a hetero Miranda would probably feel more threatened by a hetero Femshep than a hetero Maleshep. I will point out that this is purely feeling on my part, but I think that it's because Miranda and Femshep would be sexual competitors, because they would both be seeking mates out of the same group of individuals (hetero men).

The only difference when we look at a bi-sex/lesbian Miranda and a bi-sex/lesbian Shepard is that they are part of the group out of which they're seeking mates (bi-sex or lesbian females), but they are still competing for the attention of the same group.

Now, I'm a heterosexual male, so I have no real qualifications to speak on the matter, but the way I see the argument of sexual competition isn't really affected by gender, but just sexual orientation. There are a lot of permutations to consider, but I have no trouble believing that maybe Miranda would be jealous if she saw a bisexual man hitting on a male Shepard instead of Miranda, just as much as she would be if she saw a heterosexual man hitting on a female Shepard.

Honestly, I'm just spitballing, but I think that largely, Miranda would be more likely to be intimidated by Shepard's accomplishments and presence than any kind of sexual competitiveness, which although might be there, is minute in comparison.

There might be some truth in your statement, however I feel alot of our opinions are firmly based on gender dynamics in current society. To imagine that Miranda would feel her lack more acutely when comparing herself to femshep as opposed to maleshep assumes that in the future, males are still subconsciously seen as more competent than females. We don't know that is the case. Granted even in a society where gender equality is far more stressed, that sense of inadequacy may come about because she is a woman and knows exactly what being a woman entails, while men will always have that element of difference which may or may not contribute to a sense of alienation.

As for the sexual jealousy part between heteros, I think both women are professional enough to not make that an issue. Granted, Miranda was engineered to be perfect, but perfection doesn't cater to all tastes. She has to be aware of that and that femshep gets particular attention where she doesn't shouldn't compel her to feel lesser as a woman where it impinges on her idea of how attractive she is. That femshep may get the attention because of her accomplishments and fame, however, is another issue.

[snfonseka]

When I posted those links of unused Fem Shep and Miranda romance, I never thought that will result this kind of in-depth conversation.

[clennon8]

snfonseka wrote...

When I posted those links of unused Fem Shep and Miranda romance, I never thought that will result this kind of in-depth conversation.

I've noticed a lot of these conversations are driven by writers who are interested in knowing everything they can about Miranda, so they can write better stories.  That's kinda why I've started hanging out here.  I never realized what a great source this thread was until a couple weeks ago.

You know, I used to be a Tali guy, but I've been converted.  There's just something about Miri...  Besides that fantastic arse, that is.