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[MisterJB]

Does that mean ME3 Miranda will be ME1 Liara? God, I hope not.

[jtav]

And now you see why I'm so hypercritical of some of the things they did with Miranda. Tali is a better equivalent to ME1 Liara, but I am scared we'll see a Miranda who is much more subservient to Shepard than she was in ME2.

[Ieldra]

naledgeborn wrote...

Am I the only one that doesn't like this TIW role fans are attaching to Miri? It's almost like we're saying "let's make her Liara 2.0." TIW is too similar to the SB. She needs her own story not a carbon copy of someone else's just because she was introduced in Act II. We're more creative than that, and I can only hope the writers are too.

The TIW scenario was present long before LotSB came out. Miranda is the original.

I refuse to let Liara usurp what Miranda could be. In fact, I resent Liara to hell and back for that possibility. I DO NOT WANT AN ALIEN CANON LI, damn it. If they weaken Miranda's strength of personality and competence because they gave Liara a similar role, I'll explode on this forum I can tell you. I'd feel betrayed by Bioware - first they'd have teased me with Miranda, then they write her down and try to force Liara on me? Won't happen.

And jtav, I would be thankful if you didn't present this possibility as if it were already a fact.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 03 mai 2011 - 08:33 .

[jtav]

I apologize Ieldra, but the endgame and LOTSB make me paranoid. I need something that shows me I'm wrong. Yours and Ely's theories sound plausible. I don't want them to be trrue, but I see how they could be. And there are things about her that remind me of hated tropes. I can still see the character I like, but I also see a shadow version I despise. I'm in desperate need of a counterargument and evidence I was right the first time. Come on, talk the paranoid wreck down.

[PMC65]

jtav wrote...

About Miranda's work for Cerberus: there's something of a disconnect between what must be true because of her background and the lore and how she's presented post-Lazarus. She is presented as almost naïve or deluded. She talks a good game, but the writers are very careful that she keep her hands clean and be horrified at any dodgy Cerberus projects. And yet, she's one of only a half-dozen Cerberus operatives to see TIM in person (per Retribution). People who are naïve and deluded don't rise that high in a terrorist organization. She has almost certainly committed cold-blooded murder, torture, and various other crimes in the pursuit of her duties. But we don't see any of that, because their precious poster girl might be seen as unsympathetic. I wish they had had the courage to follow through with her original characterization in the prologue. I love that Miranda to pieces.. Certainly, I don't want her to be completely ruthless all the time, but I thought I was signing up for a superspy in the vein of Black Widow, not a relative innocent who almost only seems to be with Cerberus because of her self-esteem issues and simply gravitates the most charismatic figure she can find to give her purpose.

The challenge is that the game is being played by so many different types of personalities ... Just look at the "Hate Ash thread" and you can see how people can take just one line and expand on it (good or bad). To have made Miranda that dark creature outright would have put her in the dark TIM slot for some, not that there aren't those who have put her there anyway.

I personally agree with you that she is not a clean hands person but I like darker and more raw characters. So I will join you in the "Black Widow Miranda guild"!  

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
I apologize Ieldra, but the endgame and LOTSB make me paranoid. I need something that shows me I'm wrong. Yours and Ely's theories sound plausible. I don't want them to be trrue, but I see how they could be. And there are things about her that remind me of hated tropes. I can still see the character I like, but I also see a shadow version I despise. I'm in desperate need of a counterargument and evidence I was right the first time. Come on, talk the paranoid wreck down.

Evidence is hard to come by unless they tell us something about Miranda in ME3. But here are some counterarguments:
(1) If they listen to the fans, they won't do that to her. Even people like Yannkee want her strong and don't want her pragmatism gone, even if they want less of it than we do.
(2) I think with the LotSB comment they may have wanted to bring home to the players who romanced Miranda that she isn't the Cerberus loyalist any more - those who didn't take her to the final boss and those who kept the base would have no indication of that.
(3) To give Miranda a role where her great gifts are left unused would be a waste.
(4) The story needs a human LI who is on Shepard's level. Ashley can't be that.
(5) And lastly, it would be like giving those who were attracted to Miranda in ME2 for more than her appearance a kick in the face. Recall when I first wrote the text which became known as the "Miranda Manifesto"? *Everyone* liked it, and that was the time when there were many more fans on the character threads. That Miranda is on Shepard's level - at least as far as anyone can be - is one of her main points of attraction. I really can't imagine that they go back on that.

I do understand the paranoia. A Miranda who's lost her pragmatism, her moral ambiguity and her drive to use her gifts in the service of a cause she believes in would be a shadow of her former self. What I hope for is that her character development will focus on dealing with those elements that have held her back. Namely, her father's ghost and coming to terms with her origins. She might become a little less detached, and while I wouldnt like that, I could live with it as long as she does't get sentimental and lets that cloud her professional judgment. I think there is hope of that. As I said, I don't think they'll give us a kick in the face with Miranda's character development. Too many people were attracted to her strength and competence to make her a mere satellite now.
 

[naledgeborn]

Ieldra2 wrote...
I refuse to let Liara usurp what Miranda could be. In fact, I resent Liara to hell and back for that possibility. I DO NOT WANT AN ALIEN CANON LI, damn it. If they weaken Miranda's strength of personality and competence because they gave Liara a similar role, I'll explode on this forum I can tell you. I'd feel betrayed by Bioware - first they'd have teased me with Miranda, then they write her down and try to force Liara on me? Won't happen.

We see eye to eye then. I probably resent her more so than you because I dumped her for Miranda in my "canon". Ash died heroically on Virmire and Liara was..... just there with her mystic mind melding. And then Pre Mass Effect 2 EU introduces Miranda and I'm thinking "finally". Then the writers ****** on me with LotSB.....
<_<

[Arijharn]

MisterJB wrote...
Necromancy is magic. What Miranda did was science. Shepard is not an undead, he sleeps, eats, drinks and ****s.

I thought you knew what I meant. Shephard didn't really have free will about the situation (obviously... as he was dead). Shephard was 'dead as dead could be' being nothing more than 'meat and tubes' (my point being is that he was very much beyond the point of CPR).

MisterJB wrote...
I'm going to disagree with you there, Miranda has proven to be willing to sacrifice Cerberus staff in order to achieve the missions goals, not once but twice. However, she would not sent them unknowingly into a trap, she would not lie to them.
She did not lie to Shepard about wanting to put a control chip in his brain.

Maybe, but I think it was more to do with the fact that Shephard was entrusted to handle the situation anyway, and I still think TIM had good reasons not to inform Shephard. I mean, if Shephard was informed but didn't say pass that knowledge to someone like Jack, would Shephard be irresponsible? I'm more than slightly positive that the real world militaries don't actually work like that. Anderson said it best: "Information on a need to know." I think the knowledge that it was a trap was irrelevant to the task at hand. Would it make the situation easier? Doubtful imo, Shephard and co are still going to use their due dilligence and exerise caution.
As for Miranda, I think she's ruthless enough, but she has to be certain of the goal and have no doubts. I mean, she was reckless enough to leave niket by himself because she thought he could move faster on his own, well what if happenstance occuried to which he was surrounded by Eclipse to which Miranda and Shephard could not render assistance? 

MisterJB wrote...
Not ethically debatable, outrigth forbidden by the church, actually. What I mean is that if nowadays we accept tranplants and dissections, why should we disaprove of bringing someone back to life? As far as we know, no one suffered because of it.

Because it would be frowned upon by the religious authorities? Morals and ethics I think are primarily based off these principles (Thou Shalt not steal, Thou shalt not kill, Thou Shalt not Covet Thy Neighbour's Wife etc). Lengthening one's lifespan is pretty safe, but resurrecting someone from the dead is probably going to make the naysayers cry that we're supplanting god etc, etc. You know, alarmist stuff

MisterJB wrote...
You are still not understanding what I mean. Think of it this way:
Let's say that there's a dangerous bear (the Collectors) preying on your hometown. So, you (The Illusive Man) hire an hunter (Shepard) to kill the bear, however, you suspect that this bear is personally interested in the hunter (hey, according toJAWS IV, animals can hold grudges) and so, you grab the son of the hunter (Virmire Survivor) and you take him to a town near your own to see what happens.
And then, you actually wait until the bear has already tore through half of the town's population before warning the hunter about what's going on.
This is more or less what TIM did. What I wanted him to do was to warn Shepard about the trap before it was set in motion, before the Collectors showed up or even before spreading rumors that Shepard was alive and Horizon could be the next colony to get hit.
The way he did it makes me think that it was not a trap at all, TIM wanted to verify if the Collectors were indeed insterested in Shepard and when he was proven rigth, he sent Shepard to Horizon in order to minimize the damage.
This is not setting a trap, this is sacrificing civilians.

Yes and no. This isn't a single town suffering MisterJB, this is a whole county. This massive slavering bear strikes quickly without warning leaving nothing but a ghost town behind. The beast strikes with such speed that no city within your county (other than perhaps the central ones that has the big interstate railway running through it) is safe. It's impossible to predict which town is going to be next so in an effort to hunt and kill this wayward bear, a small town is offered up as bait.

If Shephard was actually able to save the entire colony, I doubt that the Illusive Man would be displeased. As it is, the result was more than satisfactory and the bear was put down (relatively speaking, at least it stopped it's predations upon poor defenseless townships, although the den itself remains a threat). I think if anything it's the best solution that could have occured, simply because everything was ordered as much as possible to beat the bear. I doubt you could just strand the VS and Shephard on some miscellaneous planet with no one else but themselves and still get the Collector's to show up.

MisterJB wrote...
EDI told us that The Illusive Man personally supervises each of Cerberus's projects and we do know that at least once, TIM intervined to stop Miranda from putting a control chip in Shepard's brain.
So, it's really hard to say just how much TIM knew and approved of what happened in the Teltin facility.

That's true, but we also have documented evidence that the staff was keeping something from Illusive Man, and more to the point that the Illusive Man knew that they were, and asked for 'operational logs. Again'

[jtav]

I like Miranda and LOTSB Liara. Strong confident, brilliant women. There's a reason they keep ending up in bed together in my stories: they scratch an itch I don't get scratched often.So if BW wants to make Miranda a power broker in her own way, I'm not going to complain. I couldn't care less which of them is sleeping with Shepard. I'm just happy to have two awesome ladies to fangirl.

And Ieldra, thank you from the bottom of my cynical heart. I'll try to keep my negativity to a minimum.

[Ieldra]

Sorry, double post.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 04 mai 2011 - 05:12 .

[Ieldra]

naledgeborn wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
I refuse to let Liara usurp what Miranda could be. In fact, I resent Liara to hell and back for that possibility. I DO NOT WANT AN ALIEN CANON LI, damn it. If they weaken Miranda's strength of personality and competence because they gave Liara a similar role, I'll explode on this forum I can tell you. I'd feel betrayed by Bioware - first they'd have teased me with Miranda, then they write her down and try to force Liara on me? Won't happen.

We see eye to eye then. I probably resent her more so than you because I dumped her for Miranda in my "canon". Ash died heroically on Virmire and Liara was..... just there with her mystic mind melding. And then Pre Mass Effect 2 EU introduces Miranda and I'm thinking "finally". Then the writers ****** on me with LotSB.....
<_<

Yeah, first they give Liara - who was rather bland in ME1 - a super-critical role and twist her character to be like Miranda, and then that dreadful sentence about Miranda being changed by Shepard and the infertility to boot. It feels like one big insult. The only spark of light is "What are you fighting for? The future of humanity, as evidenced by the perfect Ms.Lawson?" 

@jtav:
Saying you don't care is sending exactly the wrong message.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 04 mai 2011 - 05:12 .

[xelander]

I believe everyone of the squadmates and more so the LIs are supposed to be influnced by Shepard, to be made more "full" characters.

Liara comes from a place of innocence and indecisiveness/non-confrontation (the Krogan battlemaster line in LotSB is one example that illustrates that Shepard, even being dead for these two years, influenced her thoughts and respectively character development) and becomes the Shadow Broker.

Ash is a skeptic/cynic (no, she is not a racist, nor xenophobe) in ME1, but her being made a Spectre shows that she has at least mitigated these issues, and Shep does have a long conversation with her in ME1 on the very topic.

I never got very far in a Kaidan romance, but Garrus and Tali can be seen clearly changed from ME1 to ME2, because of Shepard.

The thing about Miranda is that she starts in the story from a place of strength - she's very intelligent, cool under pressure, attentive to detail, able to drop moral questions in favor of taking action (and initiative is the first step to victory), in short - efficient. So I believe that she'll learn a little more humility, compassion, kindness, as evidenced by her LM, the SB dossier and her resignation form Cerberus (if you destroy the base). At the end of the day, I think she'll learn to draw lines she won't cross, but they'll still be far beyond the conventional ones (that's a core trait of her character and I don't see the writers changing that, just smoothing the rough edges, as with Ashley) and they won't be non-existent as is in TIM's case.

Besides, as already said, TIW is way too obvious a repetition of the SB plot. I can see Miri dismantling Cerberus, but not overtaking it. (Speculation) Maybe she'll be a (Alliance) clandestine intelligence officer? Would've said Spectre, but the VS is already one.

So, again, I think Shepard is supposed to change her, but not the core of her character.

@Ieldra I'm curious, in what way do you mean, she's on Shepard level? And why Ashley's not? (Don't bother with Jack:whistle:)

[Ieldra]

xelander wrote...
The thing about Miranda is that she starts in the story from a place of strength - she's very intelligent, cool under pressure, attentive to detail, able to drop moral questions in favor of taking action (and initiative is the first step to victory), in short - efficient. So I believe that she'll learn a little more humility, compassion, kindness, as evidenced by her LM, the SB dossier and her resignation form Cerberus (if you destroy the base). At the end of the day, I think she'll learn to draw lines she won't cross, but they'll still be far beyond the conventional ones (that's a core trait of her character and I don't see the writers changing that, just smoothing the rough edges, as with Ashley) and they won't be non-existent as is in TIM's case.

I do not find humility a desirable trait, and I would not want a Miranda more defined by kindness and compassion than by competence and intelligence. Not more than she already shows in her LM anyway, and most definitely not in professional matters. As for ethics, by her reaction to Teltin, she already has lines she won't cross. Since we weren't exactly shown those lines I guess we won't notice much if they move a bit and things will be left to players' interpretation. I could live with that.... But I want her cool and detached, most of the time, and as competent and intelligent as she starts out in ME2. A woman of reason rather than passion, unless matters are personal like with her sister or of course in a romance with Shepard. There are three things that would absolutely ruin her character: becoming too much Shepard's satellite with no independent presence of her own, incompetence or not caring about things being done perfectly, and sentimentalism - letting emotions influence her professional decisions too much.  
I still hope her character development will focus more on her self-esteem problems (i.e. coming to terms with her origins) than the balance of her general personality traits, which I find perfect in ME2 (more at its start but I'm a minority in that). I'd like her to be more at peace with herself and her history, but keep her independence and competence.

And I'm beginning to sound like a prayer wheel.

Besides, as already said, TIW is way too obvious a repetition of the SB plot. I can see Miri dismantling Cerberus, but not overtaking it. (Speculation) Maybe she'll be a (Alliance) clandestine intelligence officer? Would've said Spectre, but the VS is already one.

Cerberus is unique in that it combines science, intelligence and covert operations work. It is exactly that kind of work Miranda is uniquely suited for. LotSB Liara is very similar in her qualifications, that's why I said Liara has usurped Miranda's role since LotSB, but she's left the science part mostly behind. I would prefer her to be independent from the Alliance and the Council, but if she's to be Alliance, then directing a secret intelligence and research department with limited oversight might be acceptable. What I can also imagine is that she's leading the team studying Reaper technology in order to unravel their secrets. After the war has ended, there should be enough wreckage flying around to keep the scientists busy for decades.

So, again, I think Shepard is supposed to change her, but not the core of her character.

Maybe, but there may be some disagreements between the fans and the writers about what exactly constitutes the core of her character. Intelligence and reason, competence independent from Shepard and moral ambiguity are what I count as core traits.

@Ieldra I'm curious, in what way do you mean, she's on Shepard level? And why Ashley's not? (Don't bother with Jack:whistle:)

Ashley has a strength of personality to match Shepard, but she's not the brightest, especially compared to Miranda. Not saying she's stupid, but she's too passionate about things, too fiery. And she'll have difficulties dealing with Shepard's coming back from the dead and his cybernetic upgrades. Miranda wouldn't have these and can second-guess Shepard on any level, I can see them having discussions about strategic matters, among other things. With everything she has, being supremely gifted in many areas, Miranda is larger than life in her own way, as Shepard is. Ashley is not - though there may be Shepards out there who are more suited to her than to Miranda.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 04 mai 2011 - 09:57 .

[MsSihaKatieKrios]

How many of you think that Miranda is socially awkward like Dr. Temperance Brennan, better known as Bones? I mean, both women had little to no interaction with others during their childhood and adolescent years, had almost no friends, are both extremely intelligent, cool, professional and are totally awesome at what they do. Oh, and they are both INSANELY overqualified at their jobs.

I started to realise the similarity when I replayed ME2 after watching an episode of Bones and talked to Miranda and she listed her qualifications matter-of-factly just like Bones did. In fact, I kinda like visualising Miranda as being the futuristic, more well-rounded for want of a better word, Bones.

[MsSihaKatieKrios]

MisterJB wrote...

Does that mean ME3 Miranda will be ME1 Liara? God, I hope not.

Oh God NO. HELL F**KING NO!!!

[jtav]

Ieldra2 wrote...
@jtav:
Saying you don't care is sending exactly the wrong message.

How so? I don't care which of them is the LI. Both of them have moments that make me want to throw things. And both of them have moments that make me really want to romance them. I do care very much that they remain strong and capable. But romance? Eh, well, I'm trying to make a decision and it's not going so well.

[xelander]

Ieldra2 wrote...

... and I would not want a Miranda more defined by kindness and compassion than by competence and intelligence...

Again, I meant it as a smoothing of the rough edges, I neither wish nor expect her to become a whole new gooey person.ugh.
A small bit more empathy wouldn't hurt, and a bit too much would ruin her character.

Ieldra2 wrote...
Maybe, but there may be some disagreements between the fans and the writers about what exactly constitutes the core of her character. Intelligence and reason, competence independent from Shepard and moral ambiguity are what I count as core traits.

Me too. I guess we only differ in our opnion whether her character would benefit from a bit more moral rigidity (again, not much).

Ieldra2 wrote..
Ashley has a strength of personality to match Shepard, but she's not the brightest, especially compared to Miranda. Not saying she's stupid, but she's too passionate about things, too fiery. And she'll have difficulties dealing with Shepard's coming back from the dead and his cybernetic upgrades. Miranda wouldn't have these and can second-guess Shepard on any level, I can see them having discussions about strategic matters, among other things. With everything she has, being supremely gifted in many areas, Miranda is larger than life in her own way, as Shepard is. Ashley is not - though there may be Shepards out there who are more suited to her than to Miranda.

Ah, so you mean that Miranda is more likely to co-exist with Shepard on the same intellectual level, in a manner of speaking. That depends on the lore of your own Shepard though, not to mention that I can easily see Ashley and Shepard discussing Sun Tzu. Lucky for me, I got two Sheps for my two favorite romances:whistle:

@MsSihaKatieKrios
No, Miri is not socially awkward the way Bones is. She just chooses to keep most people at arm's length, probably because she believes it gives her more power/authority to resolve situations quickly and effciently. Actually that's a minor gripe I have with her characterization - Miranda was marketed in part as femme fatale type, yet in the game itself there is little to no evidence of that (no, skin-tight suit and the camera angles do not count). I would've prefered for this to be touched upon in a conversation or in a small sidequest, perhaps not even by her, maybe Jacob, but still.

Anyway, she's adept at reading social situations, she just prefers not to become too attached.

OT:  Is it possible to quote multiple posts? I.e. queue them up and hit quote on the last one, not manually copy/paste?

[Ieldra]

About Ashley and Miranda:
It's that from Miranda I get that larger-than-life vibe I don't get from Ashley. She's a larger-than-life companion for a larger-than-life hero. Ashley seems like more like your regular girl, even though she's very competent in her own way and has a strength of personality as well. Of course who fits better depends on how you imagine your Shepard, but that feeling that she's in a league of her own together with Shepard, that I only get from Miranda. Liara comes close, but she doesn't count because she's not human.

As for quoting, I've never found another method for multiple quotes except copying and pasting. I usually quote each of the relevant posts in a separate browser tab as if I wanted to answer and then copy the stuff out.

[mathieu_p85]

Hey everyone, I'm new here.

Trying to follow the debate on Miranda's personality and Liara seemingly copying it, though it seems I'm not quite as familiar with Miranda's personality as some here seem to be. Or maybe I just have a different view on her.

Anyway, I don't think Miranda will change all that much, though I hope when it comes to personal interactions with Shepard she'll be more passionate. I think her independence and pragmatism should remain intact. I liked how she was in ME2, professional when she needed to be yet also more passionate and likeable when talking to Shepard or during her loyalty mission. I don't see her personality changing much in ME3, I think if they did the characters might start to become too similar. Furthermore I don't see Liara becoming like Miranda, with LotSB Liara's motivation to me seemed to be purely personal. As a result I don't think Liara could make the same decisions Miranda would be able to, Miranda seems the more rational type compared to Liara.

[aeetos21]

mathieu_p85 wrote...

Hey everyone, I'm new here.

Trying to follow the debate on Miranda's personality and Liara seemingly copying it, though it seems I'm not quite as familiar with Miranda's personality as some here seem to be. Or maybe I just have a different view on her.

Anyway, I don't think Miranda will change all that much, though I hope when it comes to personal interactions with Shepard she'll be more passionate. I think her independence and pragmatism should remain intact. I liked how she was in ME2, professional when she needed to be yet also more passionate and likeable when talking to Shepard or during her loyalty mission. I don't see her personality changing much in ME3, I think if they did the characters might start to become too similar. Furthermore I don't see Liara becoming like Miranda, with LotSB Liara's motivation to me seemed to be purely personal. As a result I don't think Liara could make the same decisions Miranda would be able to, Miranda seems the more rational type compared to Liara.

Well most important things first.

Welcome to the club Mathieu! We're always happy to have another fan.

I like your description of her professionalism versus her passion but I'm thinking the same professionalism, pragmatism, and maybe a little less independence where Shepard is concerned. Let me clarify that before everybody picks up a torch! I'm saying she opens herself more to Shepard and shows a bit mroe vulnerability than what we had in ME2 - but only in private settings, the one on one moments. Anytime else and she's the same tough and capable woman we all know and love.

She had a great deal of passion in ME2, but depending on your views of Cerberus it may not be the sort you are hoping for. To borrow Jack's expression whether you like it or not Miranda is/was the "Cerberus Cheerleader" in ME2 and had more passion for Cerberus than anybody. In fact whenever I talked to her about Cerberus I kept feeling like I was talking to some sort of HR Recruitment Officer versus something more along the lines of a liason. But that was when I was asking her things about Cerberus. BW is very compartamental about some of their characters and Miranda is perhaps one of the most. She's very organized and doesn't let personal issues spill over to her duties, something I would like to see a little bit less of in ME3.

If I were to do an analogy Jack was very much the opposite of Miranda in that practically everything that was personal spilled over into her duties on Shepard's team. On the other hand like Miranda there were very few moments in ME2 were she truly allowed herself to be vulnerable, making them all that more important.

And just to continue the whole human LI for the male Shep we then have Ashley who unlike Jack and Miranda is a LOT less scarred emotionally given her loving family. Her passion is much more obvious and I feel aimed in the right direction, or at least in the direction Shepard's was aimed in.

Anyway, more one on one moments to show some more passion and vulnerability in ME3. I guess that's what all that nonsense above says.

Edit: As for the whole Liara treading on Miranda's territory thing... I don't see it happening, at least to the extent some of you guys are worrying about. I'm a HUGE TOR fan and am eagerly waiting for its eventual release and if one thing BW has shown day in and day out it's that it knows how to listen to the fans. There was this one TOR fansite commentator who got a job at BW and just recently did an interview in a podcast focusing on knowing what it's like to be on both the outside looking in and now on the inside looking out and the thing that he really emphasized on was just how much BW loves the fan feedback (which is sort of a duh) but that BW also really goes out of its way to read all the threads and the comments and listens to the fanbase and then tries to deliver in that direction - or as much as they can without sacrificing story. Of course these two games are in entirely differnt situations as how one hasn't even began yet officially and the other is nearing its final chapter but still the rule applies. Even if Liara does tread a bit on Miranda's turf I'm 100% positive that it won't be at the displeasure of the fans.

Modifié par aeetos21, 04 mai 2011 - 04:54 .

[Sigyn2011]

I am complete agreement with everything you wrote.  Liara made that comment in LOTSB because she was jealous of Shepard's and Miranda's relationship.  She realized that she could not be his equal, especially if he had romanced her in ME1.  So she thought that by making him feel slightly guilty by saying that Miranda was perfect.  Perhaps it did, perhaps it didn't.  I had one Shepard say that he was fighting for everyone, and I had another one say that yes, he was doing it for her.  

And I know that the later release date is probably getting on everyone's nerves, but that means that the game will be all the better!  It means that someone's definitely been reading and doing research throughout the forums.    

Miranda is not like Dr. Brennan in Bones--she could manipulate someone into doing probably whatever she wanted.  That could be a possibility as to why she and Jacob suddenly broke up.  Naturally, this is all pure conjecture because when Shepard asks Jacob about Miranda, he kind of shuts down.  Like that Robert Frost poem that Ieldra posted, Miranda's got both some fire and ice in her.  We saw a ton of ice in the beginning but were able to gently chip it away as we got to know her.  Here's hoping that the writers keep her just as interesting.

Modifié par Sigyn2011, 04 mai 2011 - 06:53 .

[Vertigo_1]

ME3 is pushed back till 2012!

[Sigyn2011]

Yes, indeed, it has been pushed back. But I am hopeful in spite of this cloudy forecast. Bioware not only wants to please us, they'd also like to make good returns to their investors. They are wise; since this is the last installment of the Shepard trilogy, it's better to not rush a good thing.

[naledgeborn]

@ Sigyn. Yeah Shepard's "sour grapes" comment towards Jacob was really dickish. I enjoyed it cause it was in character for my canon Shepard.

He acts like "yeah, she's totally outta your league dude." And you get a hint of jealousy(?) from Jacob. Despite bromancing Jacob I always lol at that part.

[themark443]

I'm not surprised that they delayed it. The original 'end of 2011' date was just to boost pre-order sales.