15168 réponses à ce sujet

[Ieldra]

ShadowJ20 wrote...
I see Miranda as a good parent.  She obviously loves her sister to death and I believe she'll have the same love for her child.  I dont' see her being strict or anything since her Father was like that.

Not strict in the way of forbidding her kids to have fun or friends, or being narrow-minded in matters of lifestyle, tastes etc.., but she will push her children to the limits of their abilities, and will demand a measure of discipline to that end. I think she appreciates that her father gave her a good education, and only resents that he made impossible demands and she didn't have time for friends or fun. Even that wouldn't have pushed her to run away in the end. Something much more serious happened.

She'll probably will be the parent that would send her kid to a private school.  But nothing crazy strict.

Given that she's the type who's away for work often, I think there's a high chance of that.

[Ieldra]

While we're at it: should there be a question like "What exactly did Miranda's father do to her?" in the FAQ? This hasn't come up lately, but there has been some interesting speculation about it in the past, based on what Miranda says in Shepard's conversations with her.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 25 juin 2010 - 07:47 .

[Prudii Aden]

I reckon Miranda would make a good Mum - she'd probably be strict, she'd also realise that any kid of hers (and Shepard) would have ridiculous amounts of pressure on them. There's no doubt she'd push them to excel, but I could actually see her settling down, or at least the kid(s) were old enough to go to boarding school. I can also see her teaching her kids self defense/martial arts as they grow up.



As to the FAQ, I think it's a valid question - we should put something in there, with what we know for certain first, followed by some of the speculation, clearly labelled as such..

[Ieldra]

Prudii Aden wrote...
As to the FAQ, I think it's a valid question - we should put something in there, with what we know for certain first, followed by some of the speculation, clearly labelled as such..

OK. Let's see what we know:

Miranda says: "I was brought up with no friends, pushed to meet impossible demands"
Miranda says: "[Oriana] was meant to replace me. I couldn't let my father do to her what he did to me"
Miranda says: "Shots were fired" and that some of her father's security guards were injured when she ran away (can't find the reference now)
Miranda says: "My father invested a great deal in his dynasty. It wasn't a matter of just leaving... I knew he would continue to pursue his... investments."
Miranda says: "I was not the first one he made. Only the first one he kept."
Miranda says: "He's a very influential man, and extremely controlling"

So, what we know is Miranda's father was very demanding and controlling, didn't want Miranda to have friends, and was prepared to use his security guards to prevent her from leaving. We also know he disposed of earlier daughters who supposedly weren't perfect enough, and that the same fate was intended for Miranda for an unknown reason. We don't know if he killed his other daughters or did something else with them, but since Miranda doesn't mention other sisters except that her father didn't keep them we can safely assume they weren't around any more.

From Miranda's side, we know she considered her situation so unbearable that she not only ran away using force of arms against those who'd prevent her, but also took away Oriana. And that in spite of the material wealth and good education her father provided.

Speculation has resulted, among other things, in this:
(1) Miranda's father either killed his other daughters, or - being extremely controlling - let them live out their lives imprisoned in some remote asylum. A more beneficial variant would be that he gave them away for adoption.
(2) Miranda's father set her up for some kind of emotional or physical trauma in order to trigger her biotics, similar to what Cerberus did with Jack, only not as prolonged.
Assuming the less beneficial variant of (1), both would have been enough motivation for Miranda to run away and take Oriana.
(3) No speculation so far about why Miranda was to be replaced.

So much for now. Any additional facts? More specuation? Comments?

Modifié par Ieldra2, 25 juin 2010 - 11:30 .

[Jebel Krong]

Miranda says: "I was not the first one he made. Only the first one he kept."

is conveyed by yvonne with a lot of finality that leaves little room for interpretation beyond mortality.

regarding oriana: self-preservation also played a part? assuming she was a direct replacement rather than a back-up, it's possible that what triggered Miranda's escape was impending "removal" and replacement by her "sister" as much as her spoken motives.

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 25 juin 2010 - 11:36 .

[TheSixthghoul]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Sixth Goul wrote...

Yeah, I think it does the same thing with what It's face picture, regardless of which new romance. Personally, I prefer saying the relationship is over by throwing the picture out the airlock.

Why that? That shows a kind of resentment I don't think the old LI deserves. Well, maybe your Shepard thinks she does, but mine certainly doesn't. It was good as long as it lasted, only....well....Miranda came along.

One thing to note, did anyone notice the second picture frame beside the bed?

There is one, really? Must check in on that....eh...two days until I get to play. If the curiosity doesn't kill me first, that is.

Not out of malice, its more of a cultural thing. I suppose you've never seen the 2002 hit movie Chicago is a good example. To get to the point the protagonist cheat's on her husband, but while she's cheating, she turns the picture of her husband flat down. So, the person shes cheating with won't get distracted, this is an alternate view point, I wish to avoid. Turning the picture down can be perceived too broadly for my taste.

As for throwing it away as resentment, your giving them way too much power over Shepard,contempt is better. Anyways, throwing it away is a better indicator that the relationship is over or dead, it leaves little room for interpretation.

[jtav]

don't like having to say that, but I don't think she'd hesitate long before doing exactly that.

I know, but since it's not something that will ever come up in game or anything I'll ever write, I prefer to ignore that so I can keep some sympathy for her.



I like the theory that Lawson institutionalized his rejects. Someone is going to notice if his daughters keep dying, but he might be able to milk sympathy if he passes off his daughters as mentally ill.

Modifié par jtav, 25 juin 2010 - 12:40 .

[Ieldra]

I'll have to announce my absence from this thread for two days minus a few hours, beginning now. Maybe I'll be able to post some time in-between, but don't count on it. Keep up the discussion - and the picture spam...



...or else!

(I love this Miranda picture and I like having a cheap excuse for posting it)

[jtav]

I won't be around much either. Remodeling...

[Melra]

Well she runs a tight ship, she needs to make sure everyone knows their place. Who do you think is in charge of that vessel, Shepard? Hah! Not on my playthroughs! *coughs*

[TheSixthghoul]

I know, I used this picture before,but it goes great with this song. This is, Das Kabinette The Evil of his Kiss www.youtube.com/watch

[jtav]

I finished my single MaleShep game. Not perfect (Wrex is dead) but it will do. We shall see if my opinion of the romance improves or if I'm doomed to remain the thread oddball.

[Andaius20]

Hey mirimancers! how's the thread progressing? Anything new and exciting happening?

[Ieldra]

Rather not exciting, it seems. I'll post another question for you to ponder:



Miranda said Oriana was made to replace her. But why would Miranda's father do that? It seems he had everything he wanted in Miranda - she's very competent, she's a strong biotic, she's physically perfect, and a few things more. So...why? Or was Oriana grown after Miranda ran away?



@Andaius20:

I'd rather ignore that scene - Miranda saying such a thing has always seemed out of character to me.

[TheSixthghoul]

Here's a song that will go with my next post Afi This time Imperfect

[TheSixthghoul]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Rather not exciting, it seems. I'll post another question for you to ponder:

Miranda said Oriana was made to replace her. But why would Miranda's father do that? It seems he had everything he wanted in Miranda - she's very competent, she's a strong biotic, she's physically perfect, and a few things more. So...why? Or was Oriana grown after Miranda ran away?

I assume, she reached her creative potential,which to him is not good enough. He was trying to create the ultimate human one with limitations. Sure she's strong, but not the strongest possible, not as perfect as perfect could get. As for why he'd get rid of her, he can't have attachments to his creations, he can only have perfection.

[jtav]

I think Miranda was too rebellious and strong-willed for him to control and didn't want to play the role he had in mind for her. If she is an artificial biotic, she may have been planning her escape as far back as the initial surgery. I think Oriana may have been created after Miranda left, but it's most;y a gut feeling.

[Ieldra]

Sixth Goul wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
Miranda said Oriana was made to replace her. But why would Miranda's father do that? It seems he had everything he wanted in Miranda - she's very competent, she's a strong biotic, she's physically perfect, and a few things more. So...why? Or was Oriana grown after Miranda ran away?

I assume, she reached her creative potential,which to him is not good enough. He was trying to create the ultimate human one with limitations. Sure she's strong, but not the strongest possible, not as perfect as perfect could get. As for why he'd get rid of her, he can't have attachments to his creations, he can only have perfection.

The problem is that there is no measure for perfection. You can always be stronger, for instance, but at some point you're going to look inhuman. 
And, if the limits you can reach with the utmost effort are defined by your genes, then replacing Miranda with the genetically identical Oriana makes no sense. It would have be because of something that could reasonably be corrected by a different upbringing. The more I think about it, the more likely the following scenario seems: Miranda finds out what happened to her sisters, and runs away because she doesn't want the same thing happening to her. After she's run away, her father grows Oriana. Miranda, having spy programs in her fathers' systems, finds out about it and takes Oriana away. Any further setup of Miranda by her father, as described in my post further up on this page, might have served as a trigger or an added incentive.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 26 juin 2010 - 05:08 .

[jtav]

We all know Miranda is significantly more durable than any other squadmate. I think she actually can't die if she's loyal. I have tried and failed on several occasions to kill her. So wh is she so hard to kill? If they are planning something with her for ME3, what might it be? I still thing something about the nature of Shep's resurrection will be revealed and influence the fight against the Reapers and Miranda, as Lazarus Project director, will be instrumental in dealing with it.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
We all know Miranda is significantly more durable than any other squadmate. I think she actually can't die if she's loyal. I have tried and failed on several occasions to kill her. So wh is she so hard to kill? If they are planning something with her for ME3, what might it be? I still thing something about the nature of Shep's resurrection will be revealed and influence the fight against the Reapers and Miranda, as Lazarus Project director, will be instrumental in dealing with it.

I certainly hope it's plot-related. Your hypothesis seems plausible. But it may have been a technical reason: Miranda may have a line to deliver after the biotic bubble sequence, and that's why she stays alive until then no matter what. I don't recall if she says anything before the final battle. Does she?

As for killing her, Ecael's finally cracked the numbers for the hold-the-line sequence, so we can now calculate if it's possible to get a loyal Miranda killed. Not that I'd ever want to do such a thing...

[jtav]

I think it might be technical. But where's the fun in that? And they didn't have to give her lines there, after all.

[Ieldra]

Just checked the numbers. At a quick glance, it seems that indeed, loyal Miranda can't die. Anyone who's interested may want to look into this thread.