15168 réponses à ce sujet

[wright1978]

For me it is not so much about a normal life. Shep is a galactic hero and Miranda is a highly capable genetic super women. They'll never be normal. I would just prefer them to make their own destiny rather than murder and steal her father's fortune. In a way murdering and taking the place of her father be fulfilling his wish for a dynasty not forging her own path.

[Ieldra]

Blarty wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

I'd like Miranda to just throw everything about her father away, and start a fresh life that has nothing to do with her previous life. Instead of trying to be more, I'd like her to try to be less. A normal life.

It's strange, because I like that kind of endpoint as well.... it would be a huge challenge for Miranda to put aside her feelings about her father and her genes and just be like someone else, but I find that it would be the right one because the way she views her own accomplishments and her own thoughts on how others view her, must be really 'unfulfilling' (I don't know if it's the right word, so I hope what I'm thinking comes across there). Irrespective of escaping her father's direct influence, he still holds far too much sway over her in the way she lives her life.

But for me, and as an LI (if you've chosen her as your LI of course), then I think she would settle for a normal life with an extraordinary hero in Shepard beside her.

I have a somewhat opposite viewpoint. She should of course escape her father's mental hold over her, which I've phrased as "exorcising her father's ghost". That's a neccessity for her emotional health. But in any other way I'd like her to make peace with what she is, even embrace it. She's already put her extraordinary gifts to good use, and appreciates them. It is as Shepard said: she can be proud of what she's done with them, and it would be a waste to let all that lie low. Miranda is also ambituous, I can't imagine she'll not seek out challenges on a level with her abilities.

Regarding the romance: Shepard is a larger-than-life hero and needs a larger-than-life woman at his side. Any other kind of woman would completely remain in his shadow. I don't know about you, but my Shepard would not be content with a woman who always stands in his shadow. The ambitious, larger-than-life Miranda who's using her gifts to humanity's benefit, the one Shepard must make an effort to win her regard, that's who I want to see him with. As for the normal life, I can see them taking two decades off to raise a family, but in the end their lives will never be exactly normal. Because of what they are, they will always find themselves where things happen.

Since there are a few new faces around, I'll take this opportunity to suggest reading Elyvern's fanfic "Degrees of Inheritance". It's set after the end of the Reaper war and deals, among other things, the designs of Miranda's fathers and the possible particulars of her genetic legacy, which is why I'm listing it here. Thanks to ME's ridiculously compressed timeline, it's gotten a little AU after the reveals about ME3. Four of seven extremely long (for FFN standards) chapters done, it should be only a few weeks until the next.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 09:17 .

[Jebel Krong]

Yannkee wrote...

My hope is that they don't tweak her at all. I want the Miranda of ME2 back, not someone else.
For her appearance : I would like something similar to what she wears in ME2 (the loyal version) minus the Cerberus logo of course.

i'd like that too, just with the new hair tech (which looks more natural and not like a texture that stretches from head to shoulders).

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 20 mai 2011 - 09:08 .

[Blarty]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Blarty wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

I'd like Miranda to just throw everything about her father away, and start a fresh life that has nothing to do with her previous life. Instead of trying to be more, I'd like her to try to be less. A normal life.

It's strange, because I like that kind of endpoint as well.... it would be a huge challenge for Miranda to put aside her feelings about her father and her genes and just be like someone else, but I find that it would be the right one because the way she views her own accomplishments and her own thoughts on how others view her, must be really 'unfulfilling' (I don't know if it's the right word, so I hope what I'm thinking comes across there). Irrespective of escaping her father's direct influence, he still holds far too much sway over her in the way she lives her life.

But for me, and as an LI (if you've chosen her as your LI of course), then I think she would settle for a normal life with an extraordinary hero in Shepard beside her.

I have a somewhat opposite viewpoint. She should of course escape her father's mental hold over her, which I've phrased as "exorcising her father's ghost". That's a neccessity for her emotional health. But in any other way I'd like her to make peace with what she is, even embrace it. She's already put her extraordinary gifts to good use, and appreciates them. It is as Shepard said: she can be proud of what she's done with them, and it would be a waste to let all that lie low. Miranda is also ambituous, I can't imagine she'll not seek out challenges on a level with her abilities.

Regarding the romance: Shepard is a larger-than-life hero and needs a larger-than-life woman at his side. Any other kind of woman would completely remain in his shadow. I don't know about you, but my Shepard would not be content with a woman who always stands in his shadow. The ambitious, larger-than-life Miranda who's using her gifts to humanity's benefit, the one Shepard must make an effort to win her regard, that's who I want to see him with. As for the normal life, I can see them taking two decades off to raise a family, but in the end their lives will never be exactly normal. Because of what they are, they will always find themselves where things happen. 

I see what you're saying, but I think we're looking at the same thing just a different set of circumstances... that Miranda accepts herself, and moves on, allowing her to focus her attentions elsewhere without feeling she's got her father two steps behind her.

When I say 'normal', I'm not saying a hum-drum, banal existence, I mean normal from the point of view that she can get on with her life and face whatever challenges or take on any ambitions, without the extra emotional burden that her genetics and her father's dynastic principles appear to put on her currently.

Modifié par Blarty, 20 mai 2011 - 12:01 .

[jtav]

Eldfell as Mr. Lawson is speculation, but not entirely baseless because she looks E-A up in her dossier. The Ashlands are accounted for. And I had to pick something.

A "normal life" for Miranda would be a terrible waste. She is both ambitious and brilliant. Whatever I think of her creation, her gifts are an unalloyed good. Her not using them sends the message that it's far better to be normal. Far better for her to finally own her gifts and use them to do great things, not out of a need to prove herself, but because she wants to.In my head, Shepard is the one who gets the quiet life because he's the soldier. He's not presented in a way that makes me believe he's all that special in peacetime. He'd be horrible at politics and administration. Miranda is a wonderful administration. My particular version of Shepard never wanted this life anyway. So now he gets the one he did.

Suffice to say, Ieldra wasn't consulted on my ending. We disagree violently on Miranda's infertility because I don't want it cured. I do want her to have the children she wants, and I've always had a particular fondness for stable, happy adopted kids in fiction. The marriage may change. The ending is mostly something I'm using to keep things in perspective for the prequel I'm writing. It's depressing, and I need to remind myself it doesn't end there.

[Caihn]

Jebel Krong wrote...

Yannkee wrote...

My hope is that they don't tweak her at all. I want the Miranda of ME2 back, not someone else.
For her appearance : I would like something similar to what she wears in ME2 (the loyal version) minus the Cerberus logo of course.

i'd like that too, just with the new hair tech (which looks more natural and not like a texture that stretches from head to shoulders).

I agree.
I also want better textures quality. JeanLuc did a great job with the ME2 model but I would like the same quality in ME3. Or at least a HQ textures pack for the PC version (like they did with DA2).
They should also make an effort with the bump mapping.

[jtav]

And, Ieldra, they mentioned Garrus had a personal quest in the GI preview. If Miranda is recruitable, she may get something similar.

[jtav]

She went to the trouble of having it checked out. I've been told the tests for infertility are invasive and somewhat painful. So it's reasonable to assume she wanted them at some point. She may still want them or it may be something she's dealt with.

I'm reworking Matt because I'm paranoid. Are there any ME1 Paragon choices you think Miranda couldn't respect?

Modifié par jtav, 20 mai 2011 - 02:37 .

[Ieldra]

A little bit of thread history:

I was searching for my first post in the first Miranda thread (not this one, obviously) and found that aeetos21 is the "oldest" of the regulars still occasionally posting here, with his first post on page 5, followed by Arijharn (10), Prudii Aden (36), Ieldra2 (58) and jtav (70).

The topics discussed back then - when there was discussion - were mostly very familiar:
*The engine room scene
*Miranda's outfits
*Will Miranda have a presence in ME3 that will satisfy her fans (yes, it was a topic that early!)
*Miranda's competence (not much debate there, mostly appreciation)
*The control chip comment

But mostly the early days were dominated by short appreciative posts, pictures of Miranda and Yvonne Strahovski and a few trolls making their presence known. And while I don't like the confluence of Miranda with her VA, Yvonne Strahovski, in people's minds I must admit that some of the pictures posted were distractingly sexy.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 02:49 .

[Ieldra]

ProffesionallNoob wrote...

jtav wrote...

She went to the trouble of having it checked out. I've been told the tests for infertility and somewhat painful. So it's reasonable to assume she wanted them at some point. She may still want them or it may be something she's dealt with.

Possibly, but I still can't imagine her as a mother, having kids. I would like to hear other people's opinions on this topic. Pretty please?

I agree with jtav, we have no way to tell. As opposed to jtav, I'm mostly concerned about her being able to pass on her gifts if she wants that. I want to be able to imagine an after-the-Reapers scenario where she does that. In which way she'll do it, I don't care. I think jtav and I have some middle ground in that we would both accept a scenario where she uses her father's methods to circumvent her infertility. The scenario in jtav's fanfic would not satisfy me in any way for several reasons, some of them unrelated to this topic.

There's also this: Miranda has a life expectancy of about 225 years. If she wants children at all, she wouldn't need to give her whole life to them. Taking 20 years off in order to raise children doesn't seem that implausible.

Personally, yes, I find part of it hard to imagine, others not so much. Miranda would be very demanding, but also very protective, when it comes to her children. Anyway I don't need to imagine it all. I'm only asking for scenarios that don't preclude it. And I definitely don't want to see anything like that appearing within ME3, except as an option (!!) for the epilogue.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 02:52 .

[jtav]

Interesting, Ieldra. I've become much more cynical over time, though I was lying a bit in the first post. I'm glad the Chuck and Strahovski discussion is largely gone.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
I'm reworking Matt because I'm paranoid. Are there any ME1 Paragon choices you think Miranda couldn't respect?

Perhaps the Council decision - saving the DA and the Council. Shepard's taking a huge gamble there. You can rationalize the decision by saying that there wasn't enough space for the whole fleet to attack Sovereign together, but apart from that, it sounds too much like gambling with the lives of the whole galaxy.

Otherwise only in some minor things. I don't quite know if all of these are Paragon, but (consulting my ME1 alignment checklist):

*Offering to buy the permit for the Hanar preacher
*Forcing the Alliance to give Nirali Bhatia's body back
*Being too submissive in conversations with the Council (also: being a jerk in conversation with the Council)
*Not let Chorban continue his research of the Keepers
*Telling the Petrovskys not to have that gene therapy

There are also some Renegade choices she wouldn't respect, I can list them as well if you want. Also there may be some other choices where you don't get points, I don't have these listed. In the big decisions, I don't think she'd have trouble with any. She might be uncomfortable with letting the Rachni queen live, but Shepard wouldn't lose her respect over it. With Feros she'd agree - she's not one who'd feel the mission threatened enough by a handful of armed civilians, especially since they're under mind control. 

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 03:13 .

[jtav]

Go ahead, Ieldra. And it's as I thought: most of those can be accomplished either way. One thing I miss in ME2.

[Ieldra]

OK...I also edited my last post. Here are the Renegade choices I think Miranda wouldn't respect:

*Ritas sister: Telling Chellick he's pathetic
*UNC: ExoGeni Facility: taking a bribe from Dr. Ross
*Feros: Killing Shiala (it *really* wasn't her fault)
*Virmire: Killing Rana Thanoptis (she has insights to offer)
*Noveria: being a jerk to Maeko Matsuo before leaving (seems like petty malice)
*Noveria: betraying Gianna Parasini to Anoleis

Generally everywhere where Renegade means being a jerk without that serving some reasonable purpose. ME1 fortunately hasn't many of these. ME2 is much worse.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 03:34 .

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Go ahead, Ieldra. And it's as I thought: most of those can be accomplished either way. One thing I miss in ME2.

No no, I didn't mean that. It's the result that counts, not the way you do it: for instance, Miranda will not respect a decision where you force the Alliance to give Nirali Bhatia's body back, regardless of whether you used Paragon or Renegade means to get there. The same for the other decisions.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 03:33 .

[Td1984]

Blarty wrote...

As a less 'quaint' scenario, I can see Miranda walking into whatever shell that's left of Cerberus HQ at the end saying 'What a waste! Looks like Cerberus will have to start all over again, Shepard..... but this time, I'm doing it my way', as Anderson and a number of Alliance heads come in and say 'You sure you can make this Cerberus pact work for the Alliance?', 'If there's one thing I know about (looks at Shepard) it's Special Ops... after all, how hard can it be?' 

To be honest, I don't particularly care for this idea of Cerberus working for/with the Alliance, as I don't trust the Alliance much more than I trust Cerberus (and I don't trust Cerberus). That's why I'd much prefer to freelance in ME3 if you can. Plus I figure that if you're freelancing, it may be easier to recruit the other races as they may be more willing to trust you that way. After all is said and done, I'd be okay with Miranda & Shepard taking over Cerberus and running it to foster Human-Alien relations (yes, I realize that idea is far from popular, as I'm not the only one who feels this way and it's been mentioned and panned before).

[jtav]

You got me backwards. In ME1, it's how you get Rebekah to accept the treatment that matters. The same decision could grant you either Paragon or Renegade. In ME2, it's the decision that grants you P/R. The asari with the krogan boyfriend being the best example.

ME1 fortunately hasn't many of these. ME2 is much worse.

Really? I found most of the Renegade "big decisions" more reasonable and the regular dialogue dropped the racism.

Modifié par jtav, 20 mai 2011 - 03:42 .

[Blarty]

My thinking is that at the end of ME3, when Cerberus goes after Shepard, the aftermath isn't going to be pretty.... My view is a ruined bombed out HQ or an abandoned space station perviously used by the Illusive Man, perhaps,... scars of battle, explosion marks on walls, electricity cables hanging from the ceiling still crackling, the lights flickering on and off and Miranda stepping over a large Cerberus logo that once hung above the desks in front of her, but now it's all bent with bullet fire peppered through it. She cleans it for a second then sighs and drops it back on the floor, and maybe walks away back to the Normandy?

[wolfennights]

I just popped in, and I gotta say, that this is an interesting discussion. Not the same old fanwankery and bad fan art at other threads.

Carry on.

[Caihn]

Td1984 wrote...

Blarty wrote...

As a less 'quaint' scenario, I can see Miranda walking into whatever shell that's left of Cerberus HQ at the end saying 'What a waste! Looks like Cerberus will have to start all over again, Shepard..... but this time, I'm doing it my way', as Anderson and a number of Alliance heads come in and say 'You sure you can make this Cerberus pact work for the Alliance?', 'If there's one thing I know about (looks at Shepard) it's Special Ops... after all, how hard can it be?' 

To be honest, I don't particularly care for this idea of Cerberus working for/with the Alliance, as I don't trust the Alliance much more than I trust Cerberus (and I don't trust Cerberus). That's why I'd much prefer to freelance in ME3 if you can. Plus I figure that if you're freelancing, it may be easier to recruit the other races as they may be more willing to trust you that way. After all is said and done, I'd be okay with Miranda & Shepard taking over Cerberus and running it to foster Human-Alien relations (yes, I realize that idea is far from popular, as I'm not the only one who feels this way and it's been mentioned and panned before).

I agree. I would like to be freelance too.
But I don't want that Miranda replaces TIM. The running of Cerberus should be revised, and I don't want a single person as the leader of the new Cerberus. I wouldn't mind Miranda to have an important role in the new organisation, but I also want her at my side during ME3.

New fanart :



http://yatenkou.devi...randa-209546396

Modifié par Yannkee, 20 mai 2011 - 04:03 .

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
You got me backwards. In ME1, it's how you get Rebekah to accept the treatment that matters. The same decision could grant you either Paragon or Renegade. In ME2, it's the decision that grants you P/R. The asari with the krogan boyfriend being the best example.

Ah yes. I miss that about ME1 as well.

ME1 fortunately hasn't many of these. ME2 is much worse.

Really? I found most of the Renegade "big decisions" more reasonable and the regular dialogue dropped the racism.

In ME1 I only have a problem with Feros, where I just can't be the Renegade. But you're right, the big decisions are mostly OK. I was more thinking of some of ME2's Renegade conversation options and interrupts, where he's a real jerk. For instance, Renegade Shepard is an authoritarian assh*le in the Tali/Legion conflict and not much better in the Miranda/Jack conflict ("my opinion is the one that matters", yeah).

But we're getting OT.... 

Modifié par Ieldra2, 20 mai 2011 - 04:15 .

[jtav]

I may get in trouble for this, but I don't think Miranda belongs on the Normandy anymore. She was only there as TIM's agent. She's capable in a firefight, but she's even better at logistics, tactics and seeing the big picture. Being Shepard's grunt is almost slumming it. Note that the same is true of Liara and she's on the squad.