9243 réponses à ce sujet

[MisterDyslexo]

I liked how in New Vegas how a lot of s/s stuff was just put in there to be implied, and not to be made a big deal of. Like I can't remember that girl at the beginning of the game that shows you the ropes, but remind me if I'm wrong, she does sleep in a building with another woman, in a double bed. Theres a lot of that and its just implied and nobody makes a big deal out of it, and its just an accepted thing. Why can't it be like that in the game?

[Fancando]

MisterDyslexo wrote...

I liked how in New Vegas how a lot of s/s stuff was just put in there to be implied, and not to be made a big deal of. Like I can't remember that girl at the beginning of the game that shows you the ropes, but remind me if I'm wrong, she does sleep in a building with another woman, in a double bed. Theres a lot of that and its just implied and nobody makes a big deal out of it, and its just an accepted thing. Why can't it be like that in the game?

The s/s content  was there but Bioware changed the game and removed it by giving all the s/s lines to the Asari (especially in Ilium) , New Vegas simply has the s/s content that ME and ME2  had in their original concept years before it was released. Bioware almost went there first but only kept the Asari parts.

Modifié par Fancando, 23 novembre 2010 - 07:55 .

[Poaches]

And how did the asari turn out? ****ty space elves? not very subtle, to say the least.

[Nashiktal]

I'm sorry, but if you think the Asari are space elves, you have never played Warhammer 40k. While I wish that Bioware would turn up the heat so to speak, will shep really have time in ME3 for overt amounts of love?



The reapers are coming my friend.

[Poaches]

The 40k dark eldar hardly factors into the space elves trope...



As far as anyone knew then, the reapers were coming since ME and the collectors were coming in ME2, did shep really have the time to run little errands for random people off the street or play escort for tali? nah.



Your sense of urgency is overstated.

[Nordic Einar]

Poaches wrote...

The 40k dark eldar hardly factors into the space elves trope...

As far as anyone knew then, the reapers were coming since ME and the collectors were coming in ME2, did shep really have the time to run little errands for random people off the street or play escort for tali? nah.

Your sense of urgency is overstated.

The 40k Eldar are exactly space elves. They're literally WHFB High Elves, in space. I assume you're new to the hobby.

[ElitePinecone]

Nashiktal wrote...

I'm sorry, but if you think the Asari are space elves, you have never played Warhammer 40k. While I wish that Bioware would turn up the heat so to speak, will shep really have time in ME3 for overt amounts of love?

The reapers are coming my friend.

It's going to be difficult to build a squad with all the possible hundreds of combinations of surviving squadmembers from the first and second games. More likely, to avoid this problem, Bioware may introduce 'new' (or familiar) characters as squadmates for the third game. 

More or different squadmates mean more opportunities for romance - the fact that a threat is coming doesn't reduce the characters' emotional involvement (as we saw with Ilos, impending doom can be aphrodisiac). I'm not saying it's guaranteed, but I don't see Bioware changing the fundamentals of their RPG formula simply because this is the third game in a trilogy - expect fetch quests, minor sidequests and so on (even though the Reapers are coming)..

[elearon1]

I expect romance in ME3, though would it really be more difficult to bring the love interests back from the first two games than it would to introduce new options in the 3rd? Either way there will be people who ignore new options or no longer have access to old.



My guess, though, is that love interests from the last two games will be non-active party members, but people established in helpful positions (such as a certain party member from the first game was) who you can visit and have romance related discussions (and experiences) with in their locations. That way BW won't have to provide extensive voice acting for characters who could have died in the first two games, but can give us some nice scenes requiring no more than about half an hour or so of dialog from each returning VAs.

[ElitePinecone]

Mass Effect 3 has been officially announced

[MisterDyslexo]

ElitePinecone wrote...

Mass Effect 3 has been officially announced

Fingers crossed for Mr. Big Ben as LI :innocent:

Modifié par MisterDyslexo, 12 décembre 2010 - 02:43 .

[Blacklash93]

Don't get your hopes up. They won't do it here if they didn't do it in 1 and 2.

[Tarahiro]

I'd be happy with more Asari for my FemShep



I support this thread muchly though.

[ElitePinecone]

MisterDyslexo wrote...

ElitePinecone wrote...

Mass Effect 3 has been officially announced

Fingers crossed for Mr. Big Ben as LI :innocent:

That was my second thought after watching the trailer. Big Ben sounds like a nice name. 

The first thought was something along the lines of "SQUEE!"

[MisterDyslexo]

ElitePinecone wrote...

MisterDyslexo wrote...

ElitePinecone wrote...

Mass Effect 3 has been officially announced

Fingers crossed for Mr. Big Ben as LI :innocent:

That was my second thought after watching the trailer. Big Ben sounds like a nice name. 

The first thought was something along the lines of "SQUEE!"

Of course this would be as nice a time as ever to include some s/s content, Bioware. You know, end the series off on the right -foot <_<

Most of the counter-arguments are invalidated when its a new LI. The only real argument I can think of is for not having him as a LI in general, seeing as we may not have much time with him in the game. Seeing that a lot of people in the forums want him however.

Modifié par MisterDyslexo, 13 décembre 2010 - 02:59 .

[Wittand25]

Well I am not to optimistic but right now is the important time to show that we want this content.

I am not sure on the man from the trailer though because we do not know when in game the trailer takes place. If the battle on earth is the finale of the game there would not be time enough for a romance. If the battle is the start he seems like a good canditate. Because I really want the same sex option if it is added to be a undeniably so with another human or as humanlike as Asari and not with a Turian, like Gavorn or another not humanlike alian.

[BowlerBen]

It's only gay if....you know what I am saying there lol.



No use trying to force shepard in a gay relationship, but it's optional, then again, you could say the ME1-ME2 romances never existed and just started and end in ME3 if you wanted. I managed to get Liara of course in ME1 anyway. I guess Shepard kinda like some Jacob and Mordin....oh god, no. kidding. Just keep the same sex lesbian romances anyway.

[only1sgop]

This thread is awesome! Bioware supports all kinda of love interests. Great suggestions!

[ScotOfClanDonald]

I'm a fan of same sex relationships in games where the resources exist to give them. Bioware has the resources to be much more inclusive than it has been in previous ME games.



I was pretty disappointed in the ME 2 romance options; they felt incomplete somehow. The character I liked for the romance most, Kelly, was definitely short-shifted... we didn't even see the dinner date!



I read that one of the studio guys claiming that the FemShep/Liara romance wasn't lesbian because asari are monogendered. This, of course, is technically true, but that does NOT change the aesthetics or the interpersonal chemestry between the characters. Asari are blue skinned space babes. Women who like blue skinned space babes are lesbians (or at least bisexual).

[Ryzaki]

Oh yes Big Ben would be very much appreciated Yummy.

[MisterDyslexo]

Ryzaki wrote...

Oh yes Big Ben would be very much appreciated Yummy.

Yummy indeed

I'd make a banner for m/m Big Ben, but the last time I tried something involving creating a digital picture I got suspended from high school for three days and slapped in the face by a weird 3-foot tall lady. Anybody else think one would be good?

Modifié par MisterDyslexo, 16 décembre 2010 - 05:46 .

[ElitePinecone]

MisterDyslexo wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Oh yes Big Ben would be very much appreciated Yummy.

Yummy indeed

I'd make a banner for m/m Big Ben, but the last time I tried something involving creating a digital picture I got suspended from high school for three days and slapped in the face by a weird 3-foot tall lady. Anybody else think one would be good?

Given the reaction last time, your banner-making abilities can only improve By all means go ahead, I'd like one to replace the current Big Ben banner - our slightly-strange fixation on an unnamed trailer character must continue!  

ScotOfClanDonald wrote...

I'm a fan of same sex relationships in games where the resources exist to give them. Bioware has the resources to be much more inclusive than it has been in previous ME games. 

We can only hope so. The reunion with Liara in Lair of the Shadow Broker was exceptional, if that standard is continued with any possible romances in ME3 then I think they'll be outstanding. Obviously this would be better with s/s romances, even galaxy-saving Shepard gets cold and lonely sometimes. 

[BiancoAngelo7]

This is just not gonna happen. The devs have already stated quite clearly that they have different narrative structure in place when comparing Dragon Age and ME. In ME Shepard has a more structured character archetype, and that's not going to change. Sure they let you make choices and affect the outcome of the story and how it progresses, but that doesn't mean that they will let you change who the main character IS.



Asking for gay romance options for shepard is essentially asking the devs to allow us to let Shep have a mid life crisis and abandon his life of combat and adventure to take up horticulture with Liara on a remote world.



Its just not going to happen.



Imagine if instead of ME, Bioware had made the next bond game, with the same gameplay mechanics and personalized story that ME has.



Would you expect to be able to make Bond have a gay relationship? No. Because that's not who the character is, regardless of what you would like for him to be, he is Bond. Just like Shepard is Shepard.



Also, personally I kinda mentally blocked out the gay sexual advances I got in Dragon Age, not having to deal with that in ME is a big relief. Especially because for some reason in Dragon Age it kinda broke the game immersion element for me somehow, kind of like "why did I get hit on by a gay elf? Oh yeah, they did that to leave options open to all types of characters"



Im not saying thats how it would be for everyone, thats just how I experienced it. But regardless of that, my previous point is the real reason Shep will never go gay in ME.



And he shouldn't, cuz if he did, then Bioware will essentially be making the same mistake it did with its love scenes, reduce the quality (read: not nudity) of the scene because of external hissy fits that people and the media throws.



Like I said, it would be like making Bond gay out of the blue.

[LiquidGrape]

Sorry, Bianco, but that doesn't add up.

BiancoAngelo7 wrote...
This is just not gonna happen. The devs have already stated quite clearly that they have different narrative structure in place when comparing Dragon Age and ME. In ME Shepard has a more structured character archetype, and that's not going to change. Sure they let you make choices and affect the outcome of the story and how it progresses, but that doesn't mean that they will let you change who the main character IS.

The developers claim that Shepard is predefined as a character, but it doesn't stop the female incarnation from engaging in bisexual relationships. How do you explain that?
Of course, we all know why female characters are allowed to pursue that orientation (if unsatisfyingly so) whereas the male counterpart is not. But it doesn't excuse BioWare. It's a rather disgraceful omission.

Asking for gay romance options for shepard is essentially asking the devs to allow us to let Shep have a mid life crisis and abandon his life of combat and adventure to take up horticulture with Liara on a remote world.

Say what now?

Imagine if instead of ME, Bioware had made the next bond game, with the same gameplay mechanics and personalized story that ME has.

Would you expect to be able to make Bond have a gay relationship? No. Because that's not who the character is, regardless of what you would like for him to be, he is Bond. Just like Shepard is Shepard.

That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Bond, as often portraid in the films, is a static, whereas Shepard evidently is not. We are always being told that we are shaping "our Shepard's story". There is no canon. There is no "true" version. But I've already covered that what BioWare says is very different from what BioWare does. Apparently.
And for that matter, why couldn't Bond be rendered a bisexual/gay character? Artistic license grants us that freedom. It would make for more interesting films, that's for sure.

Also, personally I kinda mentally blocked out the gay sexual advances I got in Dragon Age, not having to deal with that in ME is a big relief. Especially because for some reason in Dragon Age it kinda broke the game immersion element for me somehow, kind of like "why did I get hit on by a gay elf? Oh yeah, they did that to leave options open to all types of characters"

Your issue, not anyone elses.

And he shouldn't, cuz if he did, then Bioware will essentially be making the same mistake it did with its love scenes, reduce the quality (read: not nudity) of the scene because of external hissy fits that people and the media throws.

Actually, the only hissy fit was that of Fox'. And their alleged "expert" later apologised for not even having seen the scene they were discussing.
The point being, nobody expects anything more of Fox. It's a bigoted, ignorant network which values hyperbole over facts. No sane person takes them seriously, and I doubt BioWare even flinched at that particular episode.
You're allowed to romance non-humans in Mass Effect 2. Don't you think everyone would concede that something like that is a fair bit stranger than homosexuality?

Like I said, it would be like making Bond gay out of the blue.

No. No it wouldn't. Shepard's sexuality has at no point been set in stone. There is no evidence that you can claim otherwise.

Modifié par LiquidGrape, 16 décembre 2010 - 11:49 .

[Wittand25]

The thing with the differnet narrative sturcture and how Sheppard is oh so predefined (apart from sex/looks/class/history and behavior )has been discussed and dismissed as a hasty explanation why the games lack this content when other Bioware titles don´t.
I really don´t see how some change in dialog would be equal to turn the game into Farmville or what else you are suggesting in your second paragraph.
Bond is predefined, Sheppard is not.
Regarding your feelings of Zevran I feel the same way about Liara, Mirandan and Tali when playing a male Sheppard so my sympathy for you is not that big. Also the elf is bisexual and even prefares women.
A m/m sexscene can be done like they are done in ME1 or did I miss any negativ backslash for the MWarden/Zevran scene that was about as graphical as the scenes in ME1.

[DrBobcat]

While I won't outright agree with you and say that it isn't going to happen, I still believe that there are many options available to Bioware at this point to implement same-sex relationship without compromising Shepard as a character. It would be difficult and possibly unwise to construct purely homosexual (non-bisexual) characters at this point given how few players would likely pursue them as love interests. Statistics have estimated that only 5-10% of the human race prefers same-sex partners and these figures become further complicated when we look at the demographics playing this game.

Not to over-generalize, but I think many here would agree that most serious RPG players are more concerned with plot/character development over gameplay mechanics, while the shooter crowd tends to worry about things on the opposite end of the spectrum. Try to think realistically here. When you think of FPS/TPS fans the world over, do you often consider them to be the most open-minded and tolerant individuals around? I do not. When I play fire up a session of Black Ops, Killzone, or even Team Fortress, I'm regularly exposed to a lot of hate and animosity aimed towards gays and lesbians. Hell, look back through the history of this debate on this very forum and you'll immediately aware of how intolerant and hateful people can be.

What is my point? The sad truth is that implementing content like this comes at a huge risk. There will undoubtedly be a lot of backlash from not only the community here, but the conservative media. With the stinging criticism Bioware received from major "news" conglomerates in the past, I am certain they are trying their best to play their cards close to their chest in attempt to appease the bumbling, paranoid majority. Should it be this way? In my opinion, it should not.

Long past are the days of Pacman, Tetris, and Mario. Video games have dramatically evolved as a medium and I believe will be soon recognized as legitimate form of art. However, I also hold the opinion that pandering to the deluded, ignorant, and close-minded masses will limit advancement in this area significantly. As I've said before, Bioware is in a position to push the medium to new heights and really make a name for themselves as true innovators in the industry of interactive entertainment.

Idealistic rant aside, there also are the more pragmatic concerns that have already mentioned numerous times in this thread. What harm would result from introducing love interests with bisexual tendencies? How would conversations with these characters differ from those who are straight? If a squad mate were to approach you with their feelings and express some sort of interest, what would stop you from turning them down if it makes you uncomfortable? The answer is quite obvious: nothing.

Now, if you simply don't want to even be exposed to these advances because they make you uncomfortable, I can only advise that you take a moment to think and consider why these feelings of discomfort came about in the first place. I think you'll find that the problem lies more with you, not the game.

No one here is saying that you must play as a homosexual character, nor that you must accept all the advances that come your way. That's a completely ridiculous assumption. We simply want to have the option to pursue these kinds of relationships as it suits our personal tastes. Just like anything in life, there will be things that you don't necessarily agree with or even understand, but that does not mean that they aren't important for others. This is where tolerance comes into play.

Finally, I want to apologize if it seems like anything above was aimed at any one person in particular or that I was labeling anyone a homophobe or bigot. I wasn't. However, anyone who has been following this debate for the past few months is undoubtedly aware of the numerous instances of prejudice and hate that have sprung up every now and then. Hearing the same arguments again and again is mentally exhausting and certainly leaves a bad taste in the mouths of those who are simply wanting to feel more a part of a universe we all know and love.

P.S.
Comparing Mass Effect to a James Bond film is quite a leap, in my opinion. Bond's character and story is predefined from the outset. His personality thoughout every film remains concrete and consistent. Mass Effect, on the other hand, is far less predefined. Choices are made on a regular basis that dramatically change how each individual character develops, especially Shepard. These decisions range from whether or not to kill a man holding hostages all the way to Shepard's choice in romantic partners.

At no point throughout Shepard's story (whether male or female) does he/she explicitly state his/her sexual orientation. There is nothing stopping him/her from "coming out of the closet," so to speak, and pursuing relationships with those of the same sex. The exact same could be said for any of the current squadmates he/she has already met. What's to stop Thane in ME3 from coming to (a male) Shepard and confessing profound feelings for him? Perhaps he has been worried about what Shepard's reaction might be and, until now, has kept his true feelings under wraps. Perhaps due to a lack of understanding of human social standards, he is apprehensive in bringing the idea to light. The possibiltiies are endless and, in my opinion, make for great story-telling and character development. Maybe we learn more about same-sex relationships from another perspective and, therefore, will be better able to reflect on our own modern day prejudices (a poignant case of the "the outside looking in").

What harm is there in any of this? Really, I'd like to know. Because, from what I can tell, a lot of the opposition on this topic seems firmly rooted in a blatant discomfort with same-sex interactions and relationships. Again, that isn't the game's problem, that is yours.

Modifié par DrBobcat, 17 décembre 2010 - 01:08 .