9243 réponses à ce sujet

[staldore13]

eh never cared

my shepard wont be gay thats enough for me

in the end it wont really matter because whoever uses it(or at least most who use it) will take it as a joke

and those that dont will see something meaningfull

everybody wins

[elearon1]

>> BioWare drops all gameplay elements of fighting and plot development, you can only play it on Kentic and the setting is a space High School ... <<



I'm sure you realize what you just described is a Japanese Virtual Novel game and - mock it all you like - these games can be really enjoyable. I wouldn't want ME to go that direction, obviously, but I certainly wouldn't mind seeing a combination between the two game styles, where the interpersonal interactions became an equal part of the game with the action. (note, I've no illusions that this will happen in an ME product or - probably - in any game product ever, but it is a nice dream)



Speaking of which, have people here looked into VNs? There are only a handful translated into English that deal with same sex relationships, but they are out there. (actually there are more which center around m/m relationships that f/f - typically the later only appear as a side story in heterocentric games. This is all about what has been translated, though, in Japan there are plenty of both)

[Garuda One]

elearon1 wrote...

>> BioWare drops all gameplay elements of fighting and plot development, you can only play it on Kentic and the setting is a space High School ...

I'm sure you realize what you just described is a Japanese Virtual Novel game and - mock it all you like - these games can be really enjoyable. I wouldn't want ME to go that direction, obviously, but I certainly wouldn't mind seeing a combination between the two game styles, where the interpersonal interactions became an equal part of the game with the action. (note, I've no illusions that this will happen in an ME product or - probably - in any game product ever, but it is a nice dream)

Speaking of which, have people here looked into VNs? There are only a handful translated into English that deal with same sex relationships, but they are out there. (actually there are more which center around m/m relationships that f/f - typically the later only appear as a side story in heterocentric games. This is all about what has been translated, though, in Japan there are plenty of both)

You're the kind of people that destroy the video game company. All... all of my HATE.

[elearon1]

Excuse me? Because I like stories based around character interaction I'm a bad person? Isn't this entire thread about people wishing there were better types of social interaction in the game? DA comes close to this is many ways, all it lacks is a little more depth and some more significant interaction during missions rather than merely in between them and it we would just about have what I'm suggesting. But like I said, I don't expect it to ever happen.



As for destroying video game companies, the companies that deal in Visual Novels and those that deal in games like Mass Effect are nothing alike - putting bread into the mouth of one is not taking it from the mouth of the other - they each have their audiences already prepared, though there is certainly enough overlap that a combination of the two styles would have a build in customer base.

[Garuda One]

elearon1 wrote...

Excuse me? Because I like stories based around character interaction I'm a bad person? Isn't this entire thread about people wishing there were better types of social interaction in the game? DA comes close to this is many ways, all it lacks is a little more depth and some more significant interaction during missions rather than merely in between them and it we would just about have what I'm suggesting. But like I said, I don't expect it to ever happen.

As for destroying video game companies, the companies that deal in Visual Novels and those that deal in games like Mass Effect are nothing alike - putting bread into the mouth of one is not taking it from the mouth of the other - they each have their audiences already prepared, though there is certainly enough overlap that a combination of the two styles would have a build in customer base.

I refuse to play a game where I have to go on a date with a love interest as part of the main mission. I'm sorry but if it comes down to me buying presents, even more so then in Dragon Age and I have to take them on DATES it's not a TPS/RPG ITS A BLOODY ROMANCE GAME. Oh god I dislike, so very much people who enjoy those disgusting Japanese Dating Sim games. They're terrible for people in the long run.

SOMEONE FROM JAPAN MARRIED HIS HANDHELD DATING SIM GAME for crying outloud. They are nothing but diving into the wrong direction for not only gaming as a whole but it's breaking into the rules of real life.


Do you even go to the fanbase part of these forums? I've done it once, you can see my signature for that proof but it was simply in hopes a character I enjoyed on the fictional bases. There are threads 100 pages long simply discussing how pretty a characters eyes are!

I really, really hope you are trolling me and if you are, good damn show. I have to live with people who play those terrible games and they have destroyed any sort of relationship they ever had with people. I could go into detail but I won't because this isn't the thread for it, this is about trying to get BioWare to see that its cool to have a nice assortment of different types of people in a video game.

In some of the threads on this site the lines between fictional characters and real life grow EXTREMELY thin.

New Unreleased Images of Mass Effect for the Nintedo 3DS. Something, I hope never, never happens.

Modifié par Garuda One, 17 juin 2010 - 02:52 .

[elearon1]

The people you are talking about have attachment disorders which may be exacerbated by a medium which allows them to romance an imaginary woman while avoiding real life social contact - however, the internet as a whole is responsible for this same sort of anonymity and social avoidance, so you cannot lay the blame on one product alone. Additionally, if used as a healthy medium, rather than taken to an extreme, these sorts of games can be a healthy way for one to practice at more meaningful forms of social interaction. (I could site psychological studies done concerning the benefit of Virtual Reality to overcome real life obstacles - if I weren't too damned lazy to do such a thing for a discussion on a forum; I do enough of that in my high level psych classes)



Not to mention the fact that most people understand the difference between reality and fantasy, but a healthy fantasy life is a good thing. Sure we see threads in these forums about how 'in love' people are with Alistair or Leliana, but at the end of the day the vast majority of these people realize it is a game and this kind of fantasy is no different from crushing on a character in a movie or book series - mostly harmless.



Fans of this type of game are like any other people, you'll get nuts and obsessive sorts and you'll have clear headed and reasonable specimens. I *am* a member of a forum for a game company which translates this material (JastUSA) and the vast majority of people there are not only healthy in the way they discuss their games, but many of them are intelligent and educated as well. Stating these games are bad merely because some extremists create a bad name for them (such as the fellow above who married his game, and a few more instances of similar behavior in Japan - there are psychosocial reasons why this seems to happen more often there) is the same as saying rpgs are bad because a few disturbed kids used them as an excuse for violence. In the end these people would have found something to obsess upon and fill whatever void they had in their lives - if not Dating Sims and Dungeons&Dragons, then internet sites, sci fi books, movies, music, cults, etc.



Besides which I never suggested having to take the gang out on a date - that is your perception of the genre - there are many games in the style that never deal with that, but instead deal with people living through life stress, dealing with drug addictions, combating evil creatures bent on destroying the earth, etc. The "dating sim" is a stereotype with - admittedly - a base in reality, but is far from being all inclusive.

[SuperMedbh]

Garuda One wrote...
You people really need to set down the Twilight Books. Maybe pick of Enders Game or Ringworld or prehaps watch a good space flick like Bladerunner or Space Oddessy.

Because all romance novels are sparkly vampire YA stories.  Other than...well, a third of the Western Literature canon.

I loved Ringworld, for the record.  And I told Larry Niven that when I danced with him once   True story.  (his response:  "A lot of people tell me that").

[ElitePinecone]

rynluna wrote...
most people who are for S/S romance in the game do not want a dating sim. We are just trying to have options and fairness like the hetero romances.

This. Fight for the Love is not about changing gameplay, pressuring for any sort of 'dating sim' or dumbing down/stereotyping the universe's characters. It's about choice, fairness and consistency. 

[Red by Full Metal Jacket]

elearon1 wrote...

>>The Baldur's Gate and KOTOR games don't have m/m relationships at all.

BG2 had a male character - he was a knight I think. And KotoR 2 had the pilot guy - unfortunately he was toned down, just like the sith woman, so you never got in a truly deep relationship - but you can most definitely tell it was there; quite a few signs remain throughout your interactions with him.

I've played Baldur's Gate a bunch of times and never got anything like that.  For KOTOR 2: Atton?  I don't remember anything other than him being vaguely flirtatous in a few scenes.  Waaaaay less than what you got with Juhani.  I'd only consider Dragon Age and Jade Empire to be the only two games with actual content.

[KalosCast]

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

elearon1 wrote...

>>The Baldur's Gate and KOTOR games don't have m/m relationships at all.

BG2 had a male character - he was a knight I think. And KotoR 2 had the pilot guy - unfortunately he was toned down, just like the sith woman, so you never got in a truly deep relationship - but you can most definitely tell it was there; quite a few signs remain throughout your interactions with him.

I've played Baldur's Gate a bunch of times and never got anything like that.  For KOTOR 2: Atton?  I don't remember anything other than him being vaguely flirtatous in a few scenes.  Waaaaay less than what you got with Juhani.  I'd only consider Dragon Age and Jade Empire to be the only two games with actual content.

I think the Atton bit was one of the many things that got cut. KotOR 2 was made by Obsidian anyway, who's only notable achievements are having a few employees from the original Fallout Dev team, and making lackluster but financially successful sequels to Bioware RPGs.

[Red by Full Metal Jacket]

KalosCast wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

elearon1 wrote...

>>The Baldur's Gate and KOTOR games don't have m/m relationships at all.

BG2 had a male character - he was a knight I think. And KotoR 2 had the pilot guy - unfortunately he was toned down, just like the sith woman, so you never got in a truly deep relationship - but you can most definitely tell it was there; quite a few signs remain throughout your interactions with him.

I've played Baldur's Gate a bunch of times and never got anything like that.  For KOTOR 2: Atton?  I don't remember anything other than him being vaguely flirtatous in a few scenes.  Waaaaay less than what you got with Juhani.  I'd only consider Dragon Age and Jade Empire to be the only two games with actual content.

I think the Atton bit was one of the many things that got cut. KotOR 2 was made by Obsidian anyway, who's only notable achievements are having a few employees from the original Fallout Dev team, and making lackluster but financially successful sequels to Bioware RPGs.

Has that actually been confirmed or just speculation?  I'm looking through the cut content and don't see anything like that.  I dont believe it unless one of the developers flat out says it.

[KalosCast]

Has that actually been confirmed or just speculation?  I'm looking through the cut content and don't see anything like that.  I dont believe it unless one of the developers flat out says it.

Cold, hard speculation. LucasArts is actually pretty tight-fisted on the sexuality thing. If memory serves, Juhani (who's overt romantic bits were all cut from the game) is the only character in the entire Star Wars mythology to have even implied homosexual leanings.

Modifié par KalosCast, 17 juin 2010 - 07:16 .

[elearon1]

rynluna wrote...

Since when did this topic become about people obsessed with Twilight and being overly crazy about certain squadmates? Sure, there are people such as these out there but most people who are for S/S romance in the game do not want a dating sim. We are just trying to have options and fairness like the hetero romances.

The subject matter is important, because so long as people who enjoy the romance aspect of games are marginalized - as the other poster was doing - arguments for an equal experience in that portion of a game are going to seem unimportant.  Who cares if homosexuals don't get their part of the romance when only freaks and losers care about the love interest stories anyway?  

And for the record *nobody* suggested we turn ME into a dating sim, I suggested that I might like to see a more 50/50 split between the social and combat portions of a game like this, rather than the 80/20 split we have now.  Nowhere, however, did I say I believed it would ever happen.

Modifié par elearon1, 17 juin 2010 - 10:38 .

[Wittand25]

KalosCast wrote...

Has that actually been confirmed or just speculation?  I'm looking through the cut content and don't see anything like that.  I dont believe it unless one of the developers flat out says it.

Cold, hard speculation. LucasArts is actually pretty tight-fisted on the sexuality thing. If memory serves, Juhani (who's overt romantic bits were all cut from the game) is the only character in the entire Star Wars mythology to have even implied homosexual leanings.

What about that gay couple raising a daughter on Mandalor ?I can not recall their names right now because I am not a StarWars fan and only heard know about them because they came up in the discussion about same-sex LIs in the SW:Tor forums.
Edit: I looked them up their names are Goran Beviin and Medrit Vasur. And I cant believe that the discussion for same sex romance arcs has reached six tousand (mostly positive) pages there, which shows that such a feature would be well recieved in a game with a science fiction setting.

Modifié par Wittand25, 17 juin 2010 - 09:15 .

[Wittand25]

The recent announcement of the Lelianna DLC for DA gave me an idea for how a DLC that opens s/s romance can be added to ME2. I will go through it with Jacob but it would work for many other companions just as well.



After his loyalty mission Sheppard gets another dialog with Jacob about his past. This Dialog leads to a flashback to the time before Jacob joined Cerberus. The player now controls Jacob and during this mission the player has some way to express Jacob´s sexual orientation (like some banter with an npc), the player can choose now that Jacob only shows interest in woman (no change in the romance situation) or also interest in men, which gives MShepard the option to pursue a romance with him after you played the mission.

Such a DLC would be worth its money regardless if you want to have an s/s romance because it would add more back-story to the companions.

[Red by Full Metal Jacket]

Wittand25 wrote...
What about that gay couple raising a daughter on Mandalor ?I can not recall their names right now because I am not a StarWars fan and only heard know about them because they came up in the discussion about same-sex LIs in the SW:Tor forums.
Edit: I looked them up their names are Goran Beviin and Medrit Vasur. And I cant believe that the discussion for same sex romance arcs has reached six tousand (mostly positive) pages there, which shows that such a feature would be well recieved in a game with a science fiction setting.

One of the books, yes?  That's cool.  Sci-Fi has been behind he curve in terms of GLBT representation, likely because of the demographic.

That's great that there are so many positive reviews, but BioWare originally planned to have s/s relationshipsand then removed them...and then left them out in the sequel again.  Sound to me like BioWare made a concious decision not to have them in, and I doubt ME3 will break the trend.

Don't mean to smash anyone's hopes here, but just being realistic.  I assume there was a lot of support for s/s after the first game came out, but Bioware apparently did not listen for whatever reason.

[ElitePinecone]

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...
 Sound to me like BioWare made a concious decision not to have them in, and I doubt ME3 will break the trend.

Don't mean to smash anyone's hopes here, but just being realistic.  I assume there was a lot of support for s/s after the first game came out, but Bioware apparently did not listen for whatever reason.

That's what this thread is for. To get people talking, get debates going and hopefully find a way of implementing s/s romances in some way in the Mass Effect games. Bioware has no obligation to grant any of the requests in this thread, or even read it - but this has a better chance of success if it's in the public sphere and has the opportunity to be discussed in the forums at large. 

[zvbxrpl]

The argument that there is no homosexuality in ME always rings a bit hollow, because even if we take Bioware at their word that the Asari do not think of their relations with women as being somehow gay, there's still the issue of the women who sleep with the Asari. I find it hard to believe that FemShep only sleeps with Liara because she's blue. I mean, when a human woman has sex with an alien that is basically a human woman with a palette swap and funky tentacles on her head, the only reasonable assumption is that that human woman is into girls (albeit not necessarily exclusively).



Incidentally, after Dragon Age, I was sure there was going to be an m/m romance in ME2. What can I say, I avoid spoilers and leaks pretty religiously. I even saw the pictures of Thane in ads and on the box, and thought, "I bet the green guy goes both ways." Needless to say, Hudson's stance of ONLY BLUE DISCOUNT LESBIANS* was something of a disappointment. I mean, Bioware has been making furtive steps toward same-sex romance since Juhani, as far as I know, so this is an unequivocal step backwards



Incidentally, I'm a straight guy, but I'm not particularly averse to one of my PCs having an m/m romance. I mean, every one of my Grey Wardens so far has at least flirted with Zevran. I mean, he's adorable, like a horny puppy dog! Now that I think of it, with my canon playthrough MShep, I think my second choice for romance, had he been available, would in fact have been Thane (Placing before Samara and after Jack, if'n you care).



*Discount lesbians is a trope on TV tropes, and while I'm not going to link, seeing as it's a weekday and at least some of you actually want to do anything today, the essence is that it concerns a f/f relationship being discounted as not actually gay because of some technobabble justification. I'd say Hudson's official stance on the Asari is a textbook example.

[Bookman230]

Red's comment got me thinking. If they release ME3 without S/S romances, what would you do? Refuse to buy the game? Protest? Keep fighting for DLC? I would fight for more DLC, but I wouldn't refuse to buy the game unless the majority of the group do so, and I won't protest unless it's nearby(I doubt I can convince my parents to drive me to protest about a video game).

[BigC-VI]

I support it completely. But, Say the overly friendly shep comes around, complimenting Garrus on his amazing fighting skills, and when he is only trying to be friendly, it starts the love interest side story. I think, if this were to go through, they would have to make you select your sexuality, and because of that, very well may not happen.

[Garuda One]

elearon1 wrote...

rynluna wrote...

Since when did this topic become about people obsessed with Twilight and being overly crazy about certain squadmates? Sure, there are people such as these out there but most people who are for S/S romance in the game do not want a dating sim. We are just trying to have options and fairness like the hetero romances.

The subject matter is important, because so long as people who enjoy the romance aspect of games are marginalized - as the other poster was doing - arguments for an equal experience in that portion of a game are going to seem unimportant.  Who cares if homosexuals don't get their part of the romance when only freaks and losers care about the love interest stories anyway?  

And for the record *nobody* suggested we turn ME into a dating sim, I suggested that I might like to see a more 50/50 split between the social and combat portions of a game like this, rather than the 80/20 split we have now.  Nowhere, however, did I say I believed it would ever happen.

I apologize for my typing outburst last night. At the end of my first post and going into my last was drinking a little too much and again I apologize and I agree with you on all of your post against mine. I just have an annoying time because I have to live with a few people who are of the extreme sort of playing those sort of games. I thought it over when I was busy today and I think this wouldn't bother me in the least, solve the people like me with issues about it turning into a dating SIM and solve the people who want a dating SIM of sorts and also saving the gay community as well. Hear out my idea.

BioWare introduces a DLC that only you and your love interest can do. The mission itself could pertain to a lot of things and it would come down to BioWare if they were to ever do this. One example would to help your love interest with something thats part of their story. In no means does this imply going to a dinner date or going shopping but simply having a mission only you and your interest can do. This not only helps all of the sides of the argument but also gives a challenge to players because your two people fighting against the odds. If your love interest dies after using up all of the first aid items then it's game over. This makes it so you have to protect your interest through out the DLC story. The text and plot for this story doesn't have to be mushy ether. 

For the actual said plot for the mission, like I've said you could do a few things. Have the mission pertain to your interest. For instance trying to find a cure for Thane and you have to go to some planet and get some sort of item, through the level you are met with resistence from some sort of rogue Hanar group that use Drell to fight against you, think the mission where you meet an actual Reaper from Mass Effect. Other missions for other characters could simply be added, there's enough room to add something. The other possibility is to make the mission pertain to Shepard. Your interest is worried about you I guess? From whatever history you chose in ME1 or 2 will pretain to that mission.

TL;DR people: Think Loyalist Mission but with a romantic ending and could possibly more personal. Have a mission only you and your interest can do. It's both challenging and in a sense "brings you closer to your interest" There doesn't have to be a huge sex scene and could simply be implied like they did the love scenes in ME2. I personally would like it to be even less, I personally don't have any interest seeing a 3D model naked, personal prefrence.

Again this could solve everyones issues and would make my cousin shut-up and my friends satisfied as well when I chat with them. The date is the mission with you and your interest breaking skulls and warping people off the side of ****.

[mattahraw]

Bookman230 wrote...

Red's comment got me thinking. If they release ME3 without S/S romances, what would you do? Refuse to buy the game? Protest? Keep fighting for DLC? I would fight for more DLC, but I wouldn't refuse to buy the game unless the majority of the group do so, and I won't protest unless it's nearby(I doubt I can convince my parents to drive me to protest about a video game).

No way i'd refuse to buy it. We've already asked for it to be included, either as DLC or not. Only thing you can do is wait and see. If it doesn't happen, that's the dev's call. It'd be nice but is not essential.

[sw33ts]

Garuda One wrote...

elearon1 wrote...

rynluna wrote...

Since when did this topic become about people obsessed with Twilight and being overly crazy about certain squadmates? Sure, there are people such as these out there but most people who are for S/S romance in the game do not want a dating sim. We are just trying to have options and fairness like the hetero romances.

The subject matter is important, because so long as people who enjoy the romance aspect of games are marginalized - as the other poster was doing - arguments for an equal experience in that portion of a game are going to seem unimportant.  Who cares if homosexuals don't get their part of the romance when only freaks and losers care about the love interest stories anyway?  

And for the record *nobody* suggested we turn ME into a dating sim, I suggested that I might like to see a more 50/50 split between the social and combat portions of a game like this, rather than the 80/20 split we have now.  Nowhere, however, did I say I believed it would ever happen.

I apologize for my typing outburst last night. At the end of my first post and going into my last was drinking a little too much and again I apologize and I agree with you on all of your post against mine. I just have an annoying time because I have to live with a few people who are of the extreme sort of playing those sort of games. I thought it over when I was busy today and I think this wouldn't bother me in the least, solve the people like me with issues about it turning into a dating SIM and solve the people who want a dating SIM of sorts and also saving the gay community as well. Hear out my idea.

BioWare introduces a DLC that only you and your love interest can do. The mission itself could pertain to a lot of things and it would come down to BioWare if they were to ever do this. One example would to help your love interest with something thats part of their story. In no means does this imply going to a dinner date or going shopping but simply having a mission only you and your interest can do. This not only helps all of the sides of the argument but also gives a challenge to players because your two people fighting against the odds. If your love interest dies after using up all of the first aid items then it's game over. This makes it so you have to protect your interest through out the DLC story. The text and plot for this story doesn't have to be mushy ether. 

For the actual said plot for the mission, like I've said you could do a few things. Have the mission pertain to your interest. For instance trying to find a cure for Thane and you have to go to some planet and get some sort of item, through the level you are met with resistence from some sort of rogue Hanar group that use Drell to fight against you, think the mission where you meet an actual Reaper from Mass Effect. Other missions for other characters could simply be added, there's enough room to add something. The other possibility is to make the mission pertain to Shepard. Your interest is worried about you I guess? From whatever history you chose in ME1 or 2 will pretain to that mission.

TL;DR people: Think Loyalist Mission but with a romantic ending and could possibly more personal. Have a mission only you and your interest can do. It's both challenging and in a sense "brings you closer to your interest" There doesn't have to be a huge sex scene and could simply be implied like they did the love scenes in ME2. I personally would like it to be even less, I personally don't have any interest seeing a 3D model naked, personal prefrence.

Again this could solve everyones issues and would make my cousin shut-up and my friends satisfied as well when I chat with them. The date is the mission with you and your interest breaking skulls and warping people off the side of ****.

Someone suggested that a long time ago.  I can't remember if it was in a former topic of the same thing or in a different topic or even in the group board.  I think it was about liara.   If someone wants to claim it go right a head, but if you don't mind I'd like to add your suggesitoin to to the FAQ if you can explain to me how exactly this helps us out?  Because as I've read it it only helps your love interest out but for males who play the game or rather people who play as a gayShepard well they have no love interest as of right now.