9243 réponses à ce sujet

[Jademoon121]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

I'm not trolling, folks. I love how if someone disagrees they are viewed as either trolling or homophobic......

Look, I'm also saying that there is enough fan service, let's just stick with what we got (when it comes to current LIs sexuality).

@Jademoon121 I do not buy either of those.

Brothers-in-arms and teacher-and-student are VERY common themes in a lot of male homoerotic stories and fiction. The Theban Brotherhood, male love in the Samurai ranks between senior veterans and younger pupils, modern day slash...they're old stand buys found in every gay-tolerant society on Earth. If you don't believe me, ask a writer or a historian. I can easily see Garrus and Kaiden falling for Shep.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

@Siansonea II Actually, it doesn't. What I'm saying is

past action =/= new action

[catabuca]

Saeran wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

I'm not trolling, folks. I love how if someone disagrees they are viewed as either trolling or homophobic......

Look, I'm also saying that there is enough fan service, let's just stick with what we got (when it comes to current LIs sexuality).

@Jademoon121 I do not buy either of those.

I don't think anyone has called you homophobic, so don't try using that. The point is what you are saying is a MASSIVE DOUBLE STANDARD. When you give up your Talimancing ways, then you can have a say on what is or isn't deemed worthy fanservice.

Amen.

Ramirez, honey, you've yet to give one real, plausible, realistic reason as to why having an existing LI be available for either gender Shep is any different to allowing Garrus and Tali to be available to a human when they previously showed no inclination, other than "I've had my fan service thanks, no you can't have yours".

[Jademoon121]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

@Siansonea II Actually, it doesn't. What I'm saying is

past action =/= new action

You're beating a dead horse with a chainsaw on jet fuel. A bisexual relationship for Manshep makes much more sense than having him being able to shag Tali. Especially since they're entirely different species that could get allergic reactions from intercourse.

[thatguy212]

Siansonea II wrote...

If anything, people should be pointing to the fail-tacular implementation of the Tali romance as a reason NOT to make Ashley/Kaidan/Miranda/whoever a bisexual love interest. Funny how people aren't doing that. I wonder why.

To be fair there is no way that they'd be able to screw up a bisexual romance to the same level of how god awful tali
's was

[Ramirez Wolfen]

@ Saeran You must not have read my thread.........

I will go back to my old thread and pull up the points I was trying to make there.

[adneate]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...
Look, I'm also saying that there is enough fan service, let's just stick with what we got (when it comes to current LIs sexuality).

As an argument that relies on people accepting an inherently hypocritical premise that we've already done something but let's not do it again because it's actually bad and shouldn't be done ever. If pointless, badly written fan service is so utterly ruinious to the franchise than they already opened Pandora's box in ME2. The unspeakable evil is already out, being worried about implementing some cut content in the third game is like being concerned about a stray match after the uncontrollable 3 county wildfire has already broken out. There are much graver concerns and it would be impossible for something so minor and insignificant to make any noticeable increase in the severity of the situation.

[Siansonea]

To me, there are enough good reasons to outweigh the concerns I have to allow for Kaidan and Miranda to be opened up as bisexual LIs. Notice, I said Kaidan and Miranda, not Ashley. I think Miranda makes the most sense as a bisexual LI, she's very much a self-aware and introspective person, and while Ashley could certainly BE bisexual, what we know of her character makes me think that she would either already be aware of it ME1, or would actually become aware of it later in life than ME3's timeline. That's just my personal opinion, though. Others would feel differently, and have equally valid points about Ashley's possible bisexual leanings.

If BioWare could write them properly, s/s LI options for Kaidan and Miranda could be among the best stories ever told in the games—or they could be as awful as the Tali Shepard-fangirl squeefest. I worry about the writing, but I don't worry about the logic or continuity, because good writing would address those concerns.

[Centauri2002]

I'm still waiting for this spectacular, ground-breaking explanation as to why Garrus/Tali romance implimentation =/= current characters being announced as bisexual.

[ADLegend21]

Siansonea II wrote...

If anything, people should be pointing to the fail-tacular implementation of the Tali romance as a reason NOT to make Ashley/Kaidan/Miranda/whoever a bisexual love interest. Funny how people aren't doing that. I wonder why.

you know I never thought of it. Ash would be all over my femshep, wearing her clothes, using the same toothbrush, styling her hair like her, wearing her armor, using her guns, feeding her fish......wait, they already do that in my headcanon! (not the hair thing though, that was made up)

[Ryzaki]

centauri2002 wrote...

I'm still waiting for this spectacular, ground-breaking explanation as to why Garrus/Tali romance implimentation =/= current characters being announced as bisexual.

You'll be waiting for ages. I suggest getting some popcorn because it's gonna be a loooong wait. 

[Jademoon121]

Ryzaki wrote...

centauri2002 wrote...

I'm still waiting for this spectacular, ground-breaking explanation as to why Garrus/Tali romance implimentation =/= current characters being announced as bisexual.

You'll be waiting for ages. I suggest getting some popcorn because it's gonna be a loooong wait. 

/hands popcorn.

[Siansonea]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

@Siansonea II Actually, it doesn't. What I'm saying is

past action =/= new action

Math: I don't think it means what you think it means.

Past Action = Identical New Action. Me eating breakfast this morning is the same as me eating breakfast right now. It's still breakfast. My stomach doesn't care that it's the afternoon.

[ADLegend21]

centauri2002 wrote...

I'm still waiting for this spectacular, ground-breaking explanation as to why Garrus/Tali romance implimentation =/= current characters being announced as bisexual.

Don't go holding your breath there.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

These are some of the things I said in my earlier thread (Number 5 is removed due to other reasons):

1. It cheapens the romances.
2. The romances lose their uniqueness (kind of like 1, but whatever)
3. It's unrealistic. Not everyone in life is bisexual. (it's a game, sure, but ME should be one of the realistic kind)
4. If it happened, there would be arguments over whether Manshep or Femshep is better with x character.


6. It's a bit late to make them bi in ME3. ME1 was released in 2007 or something. If they were going to be bi, it should have been then.

7. Wouldn't it be awkward if the LIs were just suddenly bi? It would seem like it was done just to appease people (which is LAME)

[Temper_Graniteskul]

Siansonea II wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

@Siansonea II Actually, it doesn't. What I'm saying is

past action =/= new action

Math: I don't think it means what you think it means.

Past Action = Identical New Action. Me eating breakfast this morning is the same as me eating breakfast right now. It's still breakfast. My stomach doesn't care that it's the afternoon.

Shut up. You eating your new breakfast is going to ruin all breakfast FOREVER.

I know you feel this.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

This thread seems to be not Ramirez-friendly *wonders when ARWA will show up*

[NICKjnp]

@Siansonea: You already know how I feel. I don't think the old characters should bs made bisexual. I think the new characters should be gay/lesbian.

[Ryzaki]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

These are some of the things I said in my earlier thread (Number 5 is removed due to other reasons):

1. It cheapens the romances.
2. The romances lose their uniqueness (kind of like 1, but whatever)
3. It's unrealistic. Not everyone in life is bisexual. (it's a game, sure, but ME should be one of the realistic kind)
4. If it happened, there would be arguments over whether Manshep or Femshep is better with x character.


6. It's a bit late to make them bi in ME3. ME1 was released in 2007 or something. If they were going to be bi, it should have been then.

7. Wouldn't it be awkward if the LIs were just suddenly bi? It would seem like it was done just to appease people (which is LAME)

1. Why? 
2. Why? 
3. Again asking for 2 or even 4 characters out of 9 isn't everyone by any stretch of the imagination. 
6. If Tali was goin to be a romance option she should've been one in ME1 it's too late in ME2...oh wait.
7. Wouldn't it be awkward if Tali suddenly was interested in Shepard? It would seem like it was done just to appease people (which is LAME)

[Jademoon121]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

These are some of the things I said in my earlier thread (Number 5 is removed due to other reasons):

1. It cheapens the romances.
2. The romances lose their uniqueness (kind of like 1, but whatever)
3. It's unrealistic. Not everyone in life is bisexual. (it's a game, sure, but ME should be one of the realistic kind)
4. If it happened, there would be arguments over whether Manshep or Femshep is better with x character.


6. It's a bit late to make them bi in ME3. ME1 was released in 2007 or something. If they were going to be bi, it should have been then.

7. Wouldn't it be awkward if the LIs were just suddenly bi? It would seem like it was done just to appease people (which is LAME)

1. And making two alien races that could die from intercourse doesn't?
2. There'd only be ONE male romance in the ENTIRE series.
3. We've got new blood in Shepherd's party, and like I said, it's easy to make jumping borders pluasible and romantic with the right writing.
4. Whut? Bisexuals can romance both men and women...I should know. Besides that's been happing since ME1.

6. Again, proper writing makes ANYTHING possible. Besides, people have been asking for a male homosexual romance since ME1.

7. No, not really. The ME team is going their own route, not same one as DA did. There'd only, as I said earlier, ONE bisexual LI.

[earthbornFemShep]

I haven't checked this forum in a few days and I was surprised at the growth. We've got a few new trolls to shoo back under a bridge and we've also circled back to the Ash and Kaidan argument. And now we're back at Tali. That means that Garrus will be soon on deck once more... then, we'll cycle again through Jack and Thane.

I'm getting tired of the same arguments used against this idea. Many people aren't reading the first post or much of the thread. So, here's a brief list of what 'logic' has been used to argue against this thread:
-"Shepard isn't gay" because he's 'too predefined' or 'too badass' etc, etc.
-"All the squaddies are straight" ("Kelli doesn't count")
-"Gay characters would make me uncomfortable"
-"Gays are" 'icky' 'immoral' etc
-"Don't pander to the fans"
-"The developers should do something else with their time/money"
-"A majority of people don't want it"
-"Only gay people want it"
-"I don't want it in my game"
-"It will ruin the franchise"
-"It is not realistic"
etc. etc.

These notions have been refuted time and time again. If those reasons above are your reasons for not wanting s/s content, please take some time to peruse this rather lengthy forum. If, after reading through some of this thread, you are unconvinced, please feel free to post. Otherwise, you are most likely beating a dead horse.

Also, please note that the main point of this thread is to find a solution to implement s/s options that will please both sides. If you have a suggestion to add (other than '/thread', 'qft', 'don't do it'), please make it known.

The first page of this thread has some notable ideas on how to address adding s/s content to the ME franchise. You can find my personal thoughts about adding s/s content to ME3 on the top of this page: http://social.biowar...dex/2883314/162

I certainly hope we can get back around to the topic of HOW to implement a workable solution... instead of just arguing about it in general.

Modifié par earthbornFemShep, 24 avril 2011 - 07:05 .

[adneate]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...
These are some of the reasons why Tali and Garrus shouldn't be romanceable.

1. It cheapens the characters.

2. The characters lose their uniqueness (kind of like 1, but whatever)

3. It's unrealistic. Not everyone in life is pansexual and attracted to different species. (it's a game, sure, but ME should be one of the realistic kind)

4. If it happened, there would be arguments over whether Shepard and that character could have kids or the unplesant mechanics of sexual intercourse with an alien creature.

6. It's a bit late to make them romances in ME2. ME1 was released in 2007 or something. If they were going to be romanceable, it  should have been then.

7. Wouldn't it be awkward if  NPCs were just suddenly interested in humans? It would seem like it was done just to appease people (which is LAME)