9243 réponses à ce sujet

[catabuca]

Cool story, bro.

[catabuca]

Anyone who starts a sentence with, "I have nothing against gays, but ..." gets an automatic ignore.

Just like anyone who starts a sentence with, "I'm not racist, but ...".

[Collider]

Maybe Male Shepard just hasn't met someone he's felt attracted to yet. Or maybe none of the male characters were attracted to Male Shepard and Male Shepard hasn't bothered to flirt yet.



I think Joker could work well as an M/M option in ME3.

[catabuca]

My manShep met Kaidan. And they were attracted to each other. I'm totally fine with the idea that other people's manSheps weren't attracted to Kaidan. I'm also totally fine with the idea that some people's femSheps were attracted to Garrus, even though mine totally and completely wasn't nor will ever be.

[alienatedflea]

catabuca wrote...

Anyone who starts a sentence with, "I have nothing against gays, but ..." gets an automatic ignore.
Just like anyone who starts a sentence with, "I'm not racist, but ...".

well im sorry that im not pushing my sexual perferences on a game there pal...the game is good the way it is...it is constitsent and through...yet thats not good enough for you guys/girls...so if ME3 caters to your needs then good for you but you will be screwing up a perfectly made-up story to cater to a "minority" of people...so GG

[Collider]

I see we may be treading upon conversations we've already had. For the record, I've changed my stance and although I don't think it's optimal, I don't care if sexual orientations are "changed" or "opened up" to other genders. I still prefer that they either use existing characters who have not a romance before or new characters altogether, though. As for Kaidan and M!Shepard being attracted to each other, you have the power to believe so.

[Collider]

Oh no, if M!Shepard can be gay or bisexual in ME3, it's gunna ruin the whole story!!1111

[catabuca]

Collider wrote...

I see we may be treading upon conversations we've already had. For the record, I've changed my stance and although I don't think it's optimal, I don't care if sexual orientations are "changed" or "opened up" to other genders. I still prefer that they either use existing characters who have not a romance before or new characters altogether, though. As for Kaidan and M!Shepard being attracted to each other, you have the power to believe so.

You were always my favourite 'dissenter', Collider. I always had a soft spot for you. I'm over the moon you changed your mind

[catabuca]

alienatedflea wrote...

catabuca wrote...

Anyone who starts a sentence with, "I have nothing against gays, but ..." gets an automatic ignore.
Just like anyone who starts a sentence with, "I'm not racist, but ...".

well im sorry that im not pushing my sexual perferences on a game there pal...the game is good the way it is...it is constitsent and through...yet thats not good enough for you guys/girls...so if ME3 caters to your needs then good for you but you will be screwing up a perfectly made-up story to cater to a "minority" of people...so GG

Hey kid, guess what? femShep could be gay in ME1 AND in ME2. Oh noes! Teh galaxies, they imploded!

[ElitePinecone]

alienatedflea wrote...

i personally dont understand...now games should please everyone of all sexual perferences? i mean the goal of cerberus is the advancement of humanity? and alliance is to protect...yet some would think that making the option of gay relationships would enhance the game? how so? does it really build the game that much? you say character development but really? to develop shep fully he needs to be gay or bi-curious? i think not...and sweets i think made the compairson of DA: origins and Mass Effect's sells to say that the gay inclusion in DA: origins didnt hurt the game but the first week i am sure there was no indication that there would be a fruity elf (even to gay standards according to some of the fellow posters) so to say that me3 needs to have a shep thats bi curious could in fact ruin the series because the option wasnt there before in the first 2 games and now in the last game he is becoming gay? no...the hard fact is this...if you want a great last game in me3 then there has be the same throughout with no major changes ( and yes having that change would be major)...i think i could support the option of a bi curious shep if he was bi curious throughout the trilogy...but he/she wasnt therefore i must decline my support in this (note: i have nothing against gays but the storyline needs to be constisent and not fall apart)

I'm not sure I understand you completely here. Shepard isn't a defined character. Shepard isn't even a 'he'. Shepard - as a female - can already be 'bi-curious' or (shock) homosexual with Liara (in Mass Effect) or Kelly (in ME2). 

Imagine, for the sake of the argument, that the roles were reversed and there were only same-sex love interests in Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2 that Shepard could pursue (and no, I'm not arguing there should be). Would your Shepard be any less heterosexual, in your mind, because he/she couldn't actually pursue a relationship? Would you accept the absence of heterosexual romances in Mass Effect 3 because Shepard wasn't heterosexual throughout our hypothetical Mass Effect and ME2? I'm guessing not. You would argue - against all superficial evidence - that your Shepard was heterosexual and deserved to have a heterosexual love interest in ME3. 

Would you accept a response like yours above - that if Shepard was heterosexual throughout ME/ME2 a heterosexual romance in ME3 would make sense, but because he/she wasn't it shouldn't be done? No, I don't think you would. 

[Wittand25]

alienatedflea wrote...

catabuca wrote...

Anyone who starts a sentence with, "I have nothing against gays, but ..." gets an automatic ignore.
Just like anyone who starts a sentence with, "I'm not racist, but ...".

well im sorry that im not pushing my sexual perferences on a game there pal...the game is good the way it is...it is constitsent and through...yet thats not good enough for you guys/girls...so if ME3 caters to your needs then good for you but you will be screwing up a perfectly made-up story to cater to a "minority" of people...so GG

First: I dont know if it was an honest mistake or not  but to explain catabuca´s reaction:
The sentences "I have nothing against ..., but " and "some of my best friends are ... , but" are the trademark of an bigot and are likely to attract hostile responses.
Second: Not only can female Shepards be attracted to female and/or female looking companions in both games, at no point in the games a male Shepard is forced to show interest in a female/female-looking individual, so allowing a male Shepard a m/m romance in ME3 or earlier would not break canon or character ( heck even if there was a forced m/f romance for male Shepards there is nothing keeping him from being bisexual).

[alienatedflea]

Collider wrote...

Oh no, if M!Shepard can be gay or bisexual in ME3, it's gunna ruin the whole story!!1111

im just saying it will not be consistent with the previous mass effects...so it will in a way will ruin the story to have shep be something he was not in the first 2 games...shep was not gay or bi-friendly in the first 2 games so when they make another sci-fi rpg game then request that throughout the story there is the OPTION of being gay...so i dont understand why its so hard to get through the fact that youre trying to queer up an individual that was not like that to begin with...it does not fit with the story...im talking about the storyline not my experience with the game...

[catabuca]

alienatedflea wrote...

Collider wrote...

Oh no, if M!Shepard can be gay or bisexual in ME3, it's gunna ruin the whole story!!1111

im just saying it will not be consistent with the previous mass effects...so it will in a way will ruin the story to have shep be something he was not in the first 2 games...shep was not gay or bi-friendly in the first 2 games so when they make another sci-fi rpg game then request that throughout the story there is the OPTION of being gay...so i dont understand why its so hard to get through the fact that youre trying to queer up an individual that was not like that to begin with...it does not fit with the story...im talking about the storyline not my experience with the game...

1) femShep was written specifically to be able to have a lesbian relationship with Liara in the first game, and with Kelly in the second.

2) You are, in fact, talking about your experience of the game. Just because manShep was not able to act on his feelings towards any of his male crew mates does not mean he did not have those feelings. There is no line of dialogue that has manShep saying "I only like to **** girls". You may interpret it to be that way, and you are entitled to do so, but we are just as entitled to interpret our Shep as gay or bi.

3) Have you ever seen the videos of the dialogue and animations that were originally made for m/m and f/f relationships? They were cut before the game went gold. I just think it might be useful for you to know they existed.

[Poaches]

alienatedflea wrote...

Collider wrote...

Oh no, if M!Shepard can be gay or bisexual in ME3, it's gunna ruin the whole story!!1111

im just saying it will not be consistent with the previous mass effects...so it will in a way will ruin the story to have shep be something he was not in the first 2 games...shep was not gay or bi-friendly in the first 2 games so when they make another sci-fi rpg game then request that throughout the story there is the OPTION of being gay...so i dont understand why its so hard to get through the fact that youre trying to queer up an individual that was not like that to begin with...it does not fit with the story...im talking about the storyline not my experience with the game...

Please offer evidence to support your claim then. Cause arguments like that has been thrown around like dimes a dozen and most of which can be affectionately categorized as colon refuse.

Modifié par Poaches, 19 juillet 2010 - 04:15 .

[catabuca]

As has been said in the past, my biggest problem with the lack of m/m relationship options is the presence of f/f options.



femShep is able to romance and sleep with Liara in the first game, with Kelly in the second, and she is able to come onto both Samara and [the person who is not Samara]. Why on earth does anybody think it is fair or representational to have that choice for femShep and not for manShep?



My second biggest problem comes with the knowledge that such content was planned in both games (with extra options for both genders), but cut, for various still unclear reasons. The argument that such content was cut because of budgetary and time concerns might hold more water had that content a) been cut completely for femShep; and had the 'surplus' Garrus and Tali romance options not been added in purely at the behest of the Garrus and Tali fanbase.

[catabuca]

Poaches wrote...

Please offer evidence to support your claim then. Cause arguments like that has been thrown around like dimes a dozen and most of which can be affectionately categorized as colon refuse.

Which claim? That there are videos showing the cut material that was originally planned to be in the game. Okay, here's some of the evidence:

manShep/Kaidan love scene: (note how Kaidan turns into a woman when they undress - they obviously hadn't finished animating that part. However, they did for the femShep/Ashley love scene - which you can find by searching on youtube.)

manShep/Kaidan reunited on Horizon:

manShep/Kaidan just before Ilos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fsMiHGov3w&feature=related

There are plenty more videos on youtube chronicalling the lead-up to all those romances, for manShep/Kaidan, for femShep/Ashley and, I believe, for some s/s options in ME2.


EDIT: I'm sorry, you hadn't included the quote to which you were replying when I wrote this, I thought you were replying to me. Still, these links are useful to others I hope

Modifié par catabuca, 19 juillet 2010 - 04:23 .

[catabuca]

Watching back some of those videos of the ME1 romances reminds me of why I preferred ME1 to ME2: I never got 'lump-in-my-throat' moments in ME2. And in the lead up to the final missions (Ilos, and on to the Citadel) they managed to ramp up the emotional tension so much that I had knots in my stomach. In ME2 all I felt was, "Oh, well I upgraded my ship so hopefully no one will die. Time for the big fight."

[Collider]

We differ there, catabuca. I felt ME2's romances with the exception of Jacob were much more emotional. Of course this all comes down to opinion.

[Wittand25]

You know thinking about problems ME2 creates for ME3 (mostly the party size) an expansion that gives many if not most squad members a farewell would be a good idea.

Right now Bioware has the problem that either ME3 will start with big squad that leaves no place for newcomers ( and would alienate new players) or letting a big portion of the squad leave the normandy in the time between the games (this would ****** off the established fan-base).

An expansion that contains missions that are special for a companion after which the companion says goodbye to Shepard and leaves the crew would be a way to deal with that. For example you get a mission on an planet colonised by Asari after that mission if Samara is still alive she will tell Shepard that her duties as Justicar require her to stay and that she hopes that one day they will meet again (something similar can be done for several other companions).

Because of the nature of the suicide mission this would of course require the expansion to have at least two new squad mates that only join the crew after the suicide mission.Those two could be new LIs that are open to the same (or to both) sex(es).

This way Bioware can kill several birds with one stone, they can slim down the cast for ME3, still give all the characters a proper goodbye and allow us to have a same sex romance that even would carry over to ME3.

[catabuca]

Collider wrote...

We differ there, catabuca. I felt ME2's romances with the exception of Jacob were much more emotional. Of course this all comes down to opinion.

Of course

I extend it to the whole of the game too, not just the romances. For example, that music you hear in the scene with Kaidan and manShep just before Ilos - that music was there throughout the buildup to that mission, and it set the tone amazingly. I loved getting to the later stages of the game, from Virmire onwards*, because the mise-en-scene came together in such a way as to create a fantastic feeling of tension and anticipation. I was still reeling from having to make such a decision on Virmire, and the feeling that you were always so close to Saren, but he was just out of reach, and you had the reveal about the Protheans with Vigil, and the Citadel ... wow! I just never had that same feeling of either urgency or emotional attachement, or of feeling drained by the decisions, in ME2.

People are argue over and over about the shooter mechanics, the inventory, and the like, but for me it's the way that story had me sitting on the edge of my seat in ME1, and not in ME2, that marked the biggest disappointment

*With the exception of perhaps 2 playthroughs, I always played Virmire last so it'd be the last mission before Ilos. It felt more emotional that way.

[Siansonea]

alienatedflea wrote...

...the hard fact is this...if you want a great last game in me3 then there has be the same throughout with no major changes ( and yes having that change would be major)...i think i could support the option of a bi curious shep if he was bi curious throughout the trilogy...but he/she wasnt therefore i must decline my support in this (note: i have nothing against gays but the storyline needs to be constisent and not fall apart)

So, the Lazarus Project doesn't qualify as a 'major change' in the character?

You could always rationalize it that Shepard's sudden interest in boys is a side effect of the Lazarus Project, maybe The Illusive Man wanted to make sure that he himsef was a romanceable character for ManShep in ME3, so he had Miranda tweak Shepard's IFF (Identify Friend or F***buddy) whilst he was cookin'.

[Gorn Kregore]

gays are spawns of satan! dur dur dur durr

[Cowculator]

Gorn Kregore wrote...

gays are spawns of satan! dur dur dur durr

And pedophiles are spawns of GOD. I'd prefer to be a spawn of Satan over a spawn of God(like you) anytime.

[Siansonea]

Now now, let's not resort to name-calling. I have a feeling Gorn was being sarcastic, poking fun at people who actually think like that.

[Tirigon]

derLoko wrote...

I'm a mormon and I've got 8 wives. I think that In the future everybody will be more open-minded about that, so all characters in ME should be into polygamy now.

I hate mormons (or rather, not mormons specifically but every group whose society is based on religion), but know what? I actually support this.