9243 réponses à ce sujet

[Count Viceroy]

Nordic Einar wrote...

They sell as well as they do because they stay loyal to their niche. They do what Bioware USED to, and are extremely successful because of it.

Niche markets exist because they're viable - otherwise they wouldn't be a market.

As gaming becomes more and more socially acceptable and widespread, the potential profit from the mainstream will always outweigh the niche, in fact it already does. Game developers like Bioware are first and foremost out to make money, and mainstream is where the money is. Sad but there it is. While bioware is going more "mainstream" they are still on the forefront of implementing new stuff and trying new things, its just more moderate nowadays. They are not EA with its yearly sport games. 

[Poaches]

This is getting off topic fast? And financial feasibility of of sexuality in ME has already been discussed times over; the market exists and therefore worth the exploitation.

[sickserb]

maybe in a dlc for some people that want it, but i still wouldn't want it in my game because i couldn't stand the fact that garrus might be bisexual/gay (that is the reason im not kidding he is my bro) 

(but to each his own, so if other people want it that's why you should get the DLC) 

Modifié par sickserb, 22 juillet 2010 - 04:18 .

[Poaches]

Every-time someone suggests that it should be DLC only thinking it'll appease everyone. I'll ask: How would you like it if you were singled out that you have to pay 4.99 to have an LI where everyone else does out of the box? And expect no PR scat storm and nerd rage that would've made the liara sex scene look like a news blip?

[Tirigon]

sickserb wrote...

maybe in a dlc for some people that want it, but i still wouldn't want it in my game because i couldn't stand the fact that garrus might be bisexual/gay (that is the reason im not kidding he is my bro) 

(but to each his own, so if other people want it that's why you should get the DLC) 

So what´s wrong if your bro is gay?

He too has rights to f*ck whatever he wants.....

[lewis_1306]

I too support the new character DLC suggestion.



If they were to add a new character that happened to be gay that would be one solution that should be acceptable to both sides.



Making one of the current squad members into a homosexual via DLC is lame. If garrus or Jacob all of the sudden revealed that they were gay that would be.. er.... lets just say it would not sit well with many players.



With a new character DLC you can get the best of both worlds. gay dudes can enjoy thier gay romance and straight guys can ignore the DLC.



Many people will still be uncomforatable seeing videos of default shepard making out with another dude on youtube (some may find it strangely embarassing to see default shepard doing that because he is the media face of the game) but it's a compromise.



By making it DLC it gives the people who would be grossed out or opposed to the idea the opportunity to ignore it and not buy it.

[sickserb]

Tirigon wrote...

sickserb wrote...

maybe in a dlc for some people that want it, but i still wouldn't want it in my game because i couldn't stand the fact that garrus might be bisexual/gay (that is the reason im not kidding he is my bro) 

(but to each his own, so if other people want it that's why you should get the DLC) 

So what´s wrong if your bro is gay?

He too has rights to f*ck whatever he wants.....

I don't know, I took him on almost every mission in both Mass Effect 1 and 2, and in 3 if he tries to make a pass on me I'll be weirded out and probably throw him out the airlock


@ lewis- I agree with you 100%

[alienatedflea]

Poaches wrote...

Every-time someone suggests that it should be DLC only thinking it'll appease everyone. I'll ask: How would you like it if you were singled out that you have to pay 4.99 to have an LI where everyone else does out of the box? And expect no PR scat storm and nerd rage that would've made the liara sex scene look like a news blip?

i see a problem with your rational...it is the gay gamer community that wants there to be bi/gay options in Mass Effect...not the "straight" community...the idea of DLC i believe was a suggestion from the gay gamer community therefore would it be that you guys/girls singled yourselves out...so really i cant help but say that you brought this upon yourself...yet youre going to blame your sexual perferences in a game that could be DLC on the straights that may or may not buy the game...so you really shouldnt just assume that those pesky "straight" gamers wouldnt buy it just for the experience in the game...

[Wittand25]

alienatedflea wrote...

Poaches wrote...

Every-time someone suggests that it should be DLC only thinking it'll appease everyone. I'll ask: How would you like it if you were singled out that you have to pay 4.99 to have an LI where everyone else does out of the box? And expect no PR scat storm and nerd rage that would've made the liara sex scene look like a news blip?

i see a problem with your rational...it is the gay gamer community that wants there to be bi/gay options in Mass Effect...not the "straight" community...the idea of DLC i believe was a suggestion from the gay gamer community therefore would it be that you guys/girls singled yourselves out...so really i cant help but say that you brought this upon yourself...yet youre going to blame your sexual perferences in a game that could be DLC on the straights that may or may not buy the game...so you really shouldnt just assume that those pesky "straight" gamers wouldnt buy it just for the experience in the game...

A DLC with just allows one of the females and on of the males on board of the normandy to be romanced by both sexes would not sell well, worse than the appearance pack definitely (and considering that it has been months since the release of the first and still there is no announcement for a second it is safe to assume that the appearance pack did not sell well).
Not to mention that such a non free DLC would make pretty much everyone angry (pandering to the gays, retconning of characters, charging for something that should have been in the original game would be the most harmless accusations from various parties) and is nearly a guarantied marketing disaster.
The only way the inclusion of s/s romances in ME2 would work right now is either through a free (optional) DLC, or as part of a bigger DLC that provides additional content and has the s/s Romance only as an extra.

Modifié par Wittand25, 22 juillet 2010 - 03:06 .

[sickserb]

I think it should be a free, optional DLC



just what wittand said

[Kikaimegami]

I'd support it being implemented into the base game of ME3, and give us a DLC for ME2.



*resists urge to mention what LI she would like added*

[alienatedflea]

Wittand25 wrote...

alienatedflea wrote...

Poaches wrote...

Every-time someone suggests that it should be DLC only thinking it'll appease everyone. I'll ask: How would you like it if you were singled out that you have to pay 4.99 to have an LI where everyone else does out of the box? And expect no PR scat storm and nerd rage that would've made the liara sex scene look like a news blip?

i see a problem with your rational...it is the gay gamer community that wants there to be bi/gay options in Mass Effect...not the "straight" community...the idea of DLC i believe was a suggestion from the gay gamer community therefore would it be that you guys/girls singled yourselves out...so really i cant help but say that you brought this upon yourself...yet youre going to blame your sexual perferences in a game that could be DLC on the straights that may or may not buy the game...so you really shouldnt just assume that those pesky "straight" gamers wouldnt buy it just for the experience in the game...

A DLC with just allows one of the females and on of the males on board of the normandy to be romanced by both sexes would not sell well, worse than the appearance pack definitely (and considering that it has been months since the release of the first and still there is no announcement for a second it is safe to assume that the appearance pack did not sell well).
Not to mention that such a non free DLC would make pretty much everyone angry (pandering to the gays, retconning of characters, charging for something that should have been in the original game would be the most harmless accusations from various parties) and is nearly a guarantied marketing disaster.
The only way the inclusion of s/s romances in ME2 would work right now is either through a free (optional) DLC, or as part of a bigger DLC that provides additional content and has the s/s Romance only as an extra.

i dont see why it "should" be in the game...but my problem with that is that then shepard with that dlc will be inconstitent i think the reason why ME and ME2 was great was because it was constisent with the storyline...i think that if shep was gay in the beginning then i have no problem with it but in essence the dlc or "option" to make shep open to being homosexual would change him as a character...before you bash me because i dont want the option there period...i ask you...who would you feel better about? a strong will individual who gets the job done his way (paragon or renegade) or a person who appears to be strong willed but behind closed doors he/she is more attached to their feelings than their determination to protect humanity? now i think i might have pissed off a bunch of people in the thread right now but the hero type is not always the masculine type but in this story he/she is...therefore it would break the constisency of a greatly developed rpg game storyline if they all the sudden changed the character of shep to make him gay so the minority of gay gamers could be satsified while the majority would be upset...doesnt sound too profit friendly to me...so i bet in DA2 there will be gay options like in the DA: origins (first one) but to expect that ME and ME2 didnt have those gay options...i would be shocked if they included a gay option in the third one to please all of you guys/girls out there so late in the game...how does that even seem to be reasonable?

[Wittand25]

alienatedflea wrote...
i dont see why it "should" be in the game...but my problem with that is that then shepard with that dlc will be inconstitent i think the reason why ME and ME2 was great was because it was constisent with the storyline...i think that if shep was gay in the beginning then i have no problem with it but in essence the dlc or "option" to make shep open to being homosexual would change him as a character...before you bash me because i dont want the option there period...i ask you...who would you feel better about? a strong will individual who gets the job done his way (paragon or renegade) or a person who appears to be strong willed but behind closed doors he/she is more attached to their feelings than their determination to protect humanity? now i think i might have pissed off a bunch of people in the thread right now but the hero type is not always the masculine type but in this story he/she is...therefore it would break the constisency of a greatly developed rpg game storyline if they all the sudden changed the character of shep to make him gay so the minority of gay gamers could be satsified while the majority would be upset...doesnt sound too profit friendly to me...so i bet in DA2 there will be gay options like in the DA: origins (first one) but to expect that ME and ME2 didnt have those gay options...i would be shocked if they included a gay option in the third one to please all of you guys/girls out there so late in the game...how does that even seem to be reasonable?

1) There is no reason to assume that Shepard is straight unless the player wants him/her to be so. In neither ME1 or 2 it was mandatory to have sexual contact with someone, and a male Sheppard is forced at no point in both games to express atraction in a females or disintrest in males, so a optional romance with another male would not break canon, it would just mean  Shepard had not found a suiting romance interest until then.
2) Gay man cen be just as masculine as straight men, just like straight men can be efiminate. The sexual orientation of a human does not force them to behave in a special way.
3) NOone not a single poster in this thread or any other thread on this topic ever demanded or even suggested that Shepard should be turned gay. What we want is the option for male/female Shepard to persue a relationship with another male/female additionally to the opposite sex options that will be in the game. That would not make Shepard gay or bisexual it would give the player the option to play a homosexual Shepard (by the way female Shepard can already be exclusivly homosexual and sexually active)

Modifié par Wittand25, 22 juillet 2010 - 04:07 .

[Tirigon]

alienatedflea wrote...

but my problem with that is that then shepard with that dlc will be inconstitent i think the reason why ME and ME2 was great was because it was constisent with the storyline...i think that if shep was gay in the beginning then i have no problem with it but in essence the dlc or "option" to make shep open to being homosexual would change him as a character...

Seriously, cut the bullsh!t please.
Shepard isn´t changed as a character any more than going for Tali instead of Jack changes him, and less than choosing the gender changes him.

[LiquidGrape]

Tirigon, drop the hostility. It's what managed to get the old thread closed down.

As for Shepard's sexual orientation being pivotal to the storyline...that's a bit silly.
Many people, myself included, has roleplayed Shepards with no love interest in either game, due to a lack of romance fitting that particular Shepard.
The reason there is no canonised incarnation of the good Commander is that people are supposed to be given free rein in guiding that character through the game. Shepard is nothing at the start of the game. It's what you make him/her which defines the character.

Modifié par LiquidGrape, 22 juillet 2010 - 04:16 .

[alienatedflea]

Wittand25 wrote...

alienatedflea wrote...
i dont see why it "should" be in the game...but my problem with that is that then shepard with that dlc will be inconstitent i think the reason why ME and ME2 was great was because it was constisent with the storyline...i think that if shep was gay in the beginning then i have no problem with it but in essence the dlc or "option" to make shep open to being homosexual would change him as a character...before you bash me because i dont want the option there period...i ask you...who would you feel better about? a strong will individual who gets the job done his way (paragon or renegade) or a person who appears to be strong willed but behind closed doors he/she is more attached to their feelings than their determination to protect humanity? now i think i might have pissed off a bunch of people in the thread right now but the hero type is not always the masculine type but in this story he/she is...therefore it would break the constisency of a greatly developed rpg game storyline if they all the sudden changed the character of shep to make him gay so the minority of gay gamers could be satsified while the majority would be upset...doesnt sound too profit friendly to me...so i bet in DA2 there will be gay options like in the DA: origins (first one) but to expect that ME and ME2 didnt have those gay options...i would be shocked if they included a gay option in the third one to please all of you guys/girls out there so late in the game...how does that even seem to be reasonable?

1) There is no reason to assume that Shepard is straight unless the player wants him/her to be so. In neither ME1 or 2 it was mandatory to have sexual contact with someone, and a male Sheppard is forced at no point in both games to express atraction in a females or disintrest in males, so a optional romance with another male would not break canon, it would just mean  Shepard had not found a suiting romance interest until then.
2) Gay man cen be just as masculine as straight men, just like straight men can be efiminate. The sexual orientation of a human does not force them to behave in a special way.
3) NOone not a single poster in this thread or any other thread on this topic ever demanded or even suggested that Shepard should be turned gay. What we want is the option for male/female Shepard to persue a relationship with another male/female additionally to the opposite sex options that will be in the game. That would not make Shepard gay or bisexual it would give the player the option to play a homosexual Shepard (by the way female Shepard can already be exclusivly homosexual and sexually active)

see you bring up a great point in 1....bc its an rpg...you think he is gay...i think not...shep is a man...or woman if you made yours a female...rpgs you live through the main character therefore you think he should be gay bc youre gay...if not gay then bi-curious...so obiviously the developers of this game made shep traditional in the sense that the reproduce you need a man and a woman...so they excluded the other kinds of relationships...and i am sorry but i dont want my shep to be a zevran the queer elf from DA...just to please a minority...

[alienatedflea]

Tirigon wrote...

alienatedflea wrote...

but my problem with that is that then shepard with that dlc will be inconstitent i think the reason why ME and ME2 was great was because it was constisent with the storyline...i think that if shep was gay in the beginning then i have no problem with it but in essence the dlc or "option" to make shep open to being homosexual would change him as a character...

Seriously, cut the bullsh!t please.
Shepard isn´t changed as a character any more than going for Tali instead of Jack changes him, and less than choosing the gender changes him.

youre best arguement for same sex relationships is the difference between human and aliens? is not exactly going to change him bc they are both female...but if he went after garrus or kaiden bc of an experience you guys/girls had is wrong to all the other gamers...if i didnt or did feel something for a person in the game i wouldnt be selfish to say put it in there in the last game as in gay relationships

[sickserb]

Wittand25 wrote...

alienatedflea wrote...
i dont see why it "should" be in the game...but my problem with that is that then shepard with that dlc will be inconstitent i think the reason why ME and ME2 was great was because it was constisent with the storyline...i think that if shep was gay in the beginning then i have no problem with it but in essence the dlc or "option" to make shep open to being homosexual would change him as a character...before you bash me because i dont want the option there period...i ask you...who would you feel better about? a strong will individual who gets the job done his way (paragon or renegade) or a person who appears to be strong willed but behind closed doors he/she is more attached to their feelings than their determination to protect humanity? now i think i might have pissed off a bunch of people in the thread right now but the hero type is not always the masculine type but in this story he/she is...therefore it would break the constisency of a greatly developed rpg game storyline if they all the sudden changed the character of shep to make him gay so the minority of gay gamers could be satsified while the majority would be upset...doesnt sound too profit friendly to me...so i bet in DA2 there will be gay options like in the DA: origins (first one) but to expect that ME and ME2 didnt have those gay options...i would be shocked if they included a gay option in the third one to please all of you guys/girls out there so late in the game...how does that even seem to be reasonable?

1) There is no reason to assume that Shepard is straight unless the player wants him/her to be so. In neither ME1 or 2 it was mandatory to have sexual contact with someone, and a male Sheppard is forced at no point in both games to express atraction in a females or disintrest in males, so a optional romance with another male would not break canon, it would just mean  Shepard had not found a suiting romance interest until then.
2) Gay man cen be just as masculine as straight men, just like straight men can be efiminate. The sexual orientation of a human does not force them to behave in a special way.
3) NOone not a single poster in this thread or any other thread on this topic ever demanded or even suggested that Shepard should be turned gay. What we want is the option for male/female Shepard to persue a relationship with another male/female additionally to the opposite sex options that will be in the game. That would not make Shepard gay or bisexual it would give the player the option to play a homosexual Shepard (by the way female Shepard can already be exclusivly homosexual and sexually active)

i can smell the contradiction

[LiquidGrape]

alienatedflea, you're not making any sense.
Are we to believe that BioWare carved Shepard's sexuality in stone because, as you so astutely observed; "the reproduce you need a man and a woman..." ?
Not to mention that you contradict yourself in the space of one sentence.

The simple fact is that while there might be no ****** or bisexual alternatives for a Shepard of that inclination to pursue, make no mistake that Shepard can be homosexual.
Half of mine are. Erasmus Shepard, for example. He likes long walks at the beach, shoegaze and has wistful dreams about Wrex during those lonely hours in the night.
Why do I know all this? Because Shepard is up to the individual to mold. I haven't pursued any female love interest with this character, and I do not intend to do so either.
Because he's gay. And no preconceived notion you might have of the abstract Shepard is going to change that.

Modifié par LiquidGrape, 22 juillet 2010 - 05:19 .

[Tirigon]

alienatedflea wrote...

youre best arguement for same sex relationships is the difference between human and aliens? is not exactly going to change him bc they are both female...but if he went after garrus or kaiden bc of an experience you guys/girls had is wrong to all the other gamers...if i didnt or did feel something for a person in the game i wouldnt be selfish to say put it in there in the last game as in gay relationships

You didn´t understand anything.

My point is: If Shepard has multiple romance options, as is the case now, and can even be female or male depending on your choice, he can´t be set in stone. If he can´t be set in stone he can be gay in our game, while still be hetero and homophobe in yours. Got it?

[Poaches]

Any time someone goes out to claim Shepard can only be straight, then can't offer any concrete proof, clearly is blinded by their own wish fulfillment of what they think to claim as their own character as canon.



If one were to use reproduction as an argument; one only need to point out in such an example any relationship with Liara, Tali, Garrus, and Thane would all be voided as abominations under that because clearly you can't reproduce "naturally" in any of those cases.

[catabuca]

To clarify, it is not only gay players who want to see same sex options open up for their Shepards; I'm straight, and I've been supporting this since the beginning, and I always will. There are plenty of straight people on this thread and out in the world who don't belong to this forum who support it.
I, too, have various Sheps who are gay, but who have had to remain celibate because the option never arose for them to pursue their interests.
It's a damning indictment of some people's selfishness that they would rather this content not be an option for those who want to play it, even when they would never have to use it themselves. You have your opposite sex relationship content, I would never begrudge you that, even if I never wanted to play it myself. Why not the other way around? So incredibly selfish, and actually really quite sad.

Modifié par catabuca, 22 juillet 2010 - 06:24 .

[Wittand25]

sickserb wrote...

[That would not make Shepard gay or bisexual it would give the player the option to play a homosexual Shepard (by the way female Shepard can already be exclusivly homosexual and sexually active)

i can smell the contradiction

OK that was not clear, by making Shepard gay or bisexual I mean having an mandatory m/m flirt in ME3 (kind of like the FShep dialog with Jacob right now), by playing a homosexual Shepard I mean it is up to the player if Shepard flirts with male or female NPCs.

Modifié par Wittand25, 22 juillet 2010 - 07:31 .

[SorenTrigg]

Just remember, if Shepard were a set character, all we would be able to play is the default character and there would be no dialogue choices.

There would be no female Shepard, there would be no choosing what to say to people. John Shepard would just say whatever they specifically wrote. There would be no paragon or renegade choices.



As it stands, the game is about choice. Shepard is not straight, or gay, or bisexual. Shepard is not male or female. Shepard is not named John.



Sure, any of these *could* be true. And they are true for some people. But everyone chooses their own thing.

So, please, do not use the argument that Shepard is a straight, white male who cannot possibly diverge from the story and character that Bioware has set out for him. Because for every person, Shepard already has.