194 réponses à ce sujet

[cerberus1701]

And I thought choosing Morinth was distasteful?

No where near the level of "ick" in Overlord.

[Bhatair]

What, me evil? All I did was doom an innocent victim to a life of torture in order to perfect ways to control an entire race of sentient machines.

[Dave of Canada]

Renegade on Overlord is actually not pure-evilness, while it's cruel to let David there the entire dialogue still shows that Shepard disapproves of what's happened and will happen to the poor guy.

[DOYOURLABS]

I dislike doing Renegade playthroughs because renegade options don't make you a bad ass they make you a jerk.

[SSV Enterprise]

Renegade interrupts are badass. Renegade choices are, for the most part, downright sinister.

[Malsumis]

Something good had to come out of that mess. Killing him, means all that death was for nothing.

[Yakko77]

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Renegade interrupts are badass. Renegade choices are, for the most part, downright sinister.

This.

I did the renegade choice with my one renegade play through (1 out of 5) and I felt pretty dirty for it.  Heck, I even destroyed the Collector base as a renegade but this renegade choice was just..... nasty.

The renegade interupt with the damaged mech was humorous though!

[primero holodon]

Malsumis wrote...

Something good had to come out of that mess. Killing him, means all that death was for nothing.

the Paragon option doesn't have you killing him. also leaving him with Cerberus probably won't bring any good seeing as how Cerberus "Reaserch" has a rather alarming tendency to result in everyone in the reserch base dying.

[incinerator950]

Apparently none of you have seen "low" yet.

[NoUserNameHere]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Renegade on Overlord is actually not pure-evilness, while it's cruel to let David there the entire dialogue still shows that Shepard disapproves of what's happened and will happen to the poor guy.

So admitting that what you are doing is wrong makes it better... how?

[Aggie Punbot]

Malsumis wrote...

Something good had to come out of that mess. Killing him, means all that death was for nothing.

I've seen people use that reason for a number of different choices (such as keeping the collector base, keeping the work on the genophage Maleon was working on) and I just cannot agree with it. It's not just what you learn but what you had to do to gain that knowledge. Successfully using technology that is gained from torture and murder will only inspire other people to do the exact same thing in the future with the excuse that:

"Hey, X killed so many people just so you could have [technology]. How can you disapprove of torture and yet still reap the benefits of its use without being a hypocrite?"

The answer? You can't. If you allow someone to continue torturing an innocent person (or people) simply because you might be able to benefit from the results, you are no better than the person doing the torturing. You become like The Illusve Man: someone that is willing to torture and murder (or tacitly approve of) the very people you're claiming to try to save in order to benefit yourself.

Modifié par TS2Aggie, 19 juin 2010 - 08:13 .

[DOYOURLABS]

TS2Aggie wrote...

Malsumis wrote...

Something good had to come out of that mess. Killing him, means all that death was for nothing.

I've seen people use that reason for a number of different choices (such as keeping the collector base, keeping the work on the genophage Maleon was working on) and I just cannot agree with it. It's not just what you learn but what you had to do to gain that knowledge. Successfully using technology that is gained from torture and murder will only inspire other people to do the exact same thing in the future with the excuse that:

"Hey, X killed so many people just so you could have [technology]. How can you disapprove of torture and yet still reap the benefits of its use without being a hypocrite?"

The answer? You can't. If you allow someone to continue torturing an innocent person (or people) simply because you might be able to benefit from the results, you are no better than the person doing the torturing. You become like The Illusve Man: someone that is willing to torture and murder (or tacitly approve of) the very people you're claiming to try to save in order to benefit yourself.

I disagree, if torturing ONE person brings technology that will save millions of lives, I'm okay with that. Archer was trying to save his job, save millions of lives if war with the geth ever happens, and he gave David the opportunity to use the probably only skill he has. In regards to keeping the collector base, blowing it up will not bring the dead back and blowing it up wastes all the lives the technology will save. With the genophage data, those tests were performed on volunteers to try and cure a gentle genocide. You can't cure diseases without testing. Do you not want a cure to AIDs because they tested on monkeys? 

[didymos1120]

DOYOURLABS wrote...
I disagree, if torturing ONE person brings technology that will save millions of lives, I'm okay with that.

OK, groovy.  You can be that  person.

[SpiderFan1217]

Bhatair wrote...

What, me evil? All I did was doom an innocent victim to a life of torture in order to perfect ways to control an entire race of sentient machines.

Oh... well, if that's all. Ok, your free to go.

[Zaisha_temp]

DOYOURLABS wrote...
 I disagree, if torturing ONE person brings technology that will save millions of lives, I'm okay with that. Archer was trying to save his job, save millions of lives if war with the geth ever happens, and he gave David the opportunity to use the probably only skill he has. In regards to keeping the collector base, blowing it up will not bring the dead back and blowing it up wastes all the lives the technology will save. With the genophage data, those tests were performed on volunteers to try and cure a gentle genocide. You can't cure diseases without testing. Do you not want a cure to AIDs because they tested on monkeys? 

DOYOURLABS +2 Renegade.
"The ends justify the means" is the credo of the Renegade. They may very well be correct, depending on the circumstances, but allowing evil in order to benefit from it is still Renegade and Evil. Immoral actions being beneficial for the majority does not make them any less immoral. [/lecture]

[Dave of Canada]

NoUserNameHere wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Renegade on Overlord is actually not pure-evilness, while it's cruel to let David there the entire dialogue still shows that Shepard disapproves of what's happened and will happen to the poor guy.

So admitting that what you are doing is wrong makes it better... how?

He knows what he's doing is wrong, he admits it and he admits the -only- reason he's keeping David in Cerberus is because of the lives it could save. While it's cruel and unethical, the Renegade only does it because in the long term it could save more lives instead of doing it because he's a jerk and doesn't care.

Most Renegade choices doesn't have Shepard show remorse or awknowledging what he's doing is unethical, this is one of those times where he does.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 19 juin 2010 - 09:06 .

[cachx]

I just finished playing with my renegade and left David after the care of his brother (after I punched him ) didn't seem particulary evil, not for my Shep anyway.

[spacehamsterZH]

I still think the low point is the execution on Feros. That made me physically queasy. Like Dave says, at least here Shepard seems disgusted by what's going on.

[arek_celera]

I call renegade runs "douche runs".

[archurban]

renegade action for this? never happen. even I got email from Illusive man who told me that it's not intentional work to give human pain by extremely unusual experiment. but I don't believe anything what he says since he has tried to disguise me, and persuade me from getting collector technology to take advantage of reusing. all what he tries to attempt is that making me sick. so I deny him whatever he says.

[snfonseka]

Looking at the big picture...

Choosing between saving one life vs. saving thousands.

[DOYOURLABS]

I've managed to get up to 75% renegade without being a douche to everyone. I prefer being paragon though. I hate to see people die, which completely contradicts my previous speech about the ends justifying the means.

[archurban]

I think that many scientists got, who work for Cerberus, brainwashed from itself. it's very dangerous that you don't even know you were really captured without knowing consciously. so they think that all experiment no matter how it is horrible or unspeakable, it is all about human being. but that's all bull****.