713 réponses à ce sujet

[Lumikki]

Pacifien wrote...

Your Hold the Line average score is 2.25. Everyone should live.

Okey, but I need one more squad member if the 8 is minimum to get IFF missions?

[Pacifien]

Like the seeker swarms, it would appear the roles each squadmate plays during the final battle follows some sort of ordered list. Even where they stand in cutscenes seems predetermined. Except I'm only basing this on three squad combinations because then I got bored. Squadmates were loyal for the following test runs.

Thane and Grunt - Did it twice, one where I picked Thane first, another where I picked Grunt first.
- Jack gave the update on the defense team.
- Thane held out the omnitool for the Illusive Man's communication.
- Grunt commented on keeping the Collector Base.
- Grunt passed you the bomb needed to blow the base up.
- Shepard catches Grunt.
- Grunt catches Shepard.

Thane and Garrus - Did it twice like I did with Thane and Grunt.
- Jack gave the update on the defense team.
- Garrus held out the omnitool for the Illusive Man's communication.
- Garrus commented on keeping the Collector Base.
- Thane passed you the bomb needed to blow up the base.
- Shepard catches Thane.
- Garrus catches Shepard.

Thane and Jack - Only did one playthrough where I picked Thane first. Suspect it doesn't matter who you pick first.
- Garrus gave the update on the defense team.
- Jack held out the omnitool for the Illusive Man's communication.
- Neither squadmate chimed in with their opinion on the Collector Base.
- Thane passed you the bomb needed to blow the base up.
- Shepard catches Thane.
- Jack catches Shepard.

Modifié par Pacifien, 24 juin 2010 - 06:53 .

[Ecael]

Okay, it took me a while before I realized that this thread was stickied, but I 'm organizing it so Occams Razor 17's work is not lost.

EDIT: Also included Kim Stolz's explanation for why Zaeed is not a good leader.

Modifié par Ecael, 25 juin 2010 - 09:43 .

[Occams Razor 17]

Ecael wrote...

Okay, it took me a while before I realized that this thread was stickied, but I 'm organizing it so Occams Razor 17's work is not lost.

EDIT: Also included Kim Stolz's explanation for why Zaeed is notn a good leader.

Thank you!  Glad to see this got stickied, it's waaay more detailed than my guide :happy:

Any estimate on how many hours were put into making this, by the way? 

[Ecael]

Occams Razor 17 wrote...

Ecael wrote...

Okay, it took me a while before I realized that this thread was stickied, but I 'm organizing it so Occams Razor 17's work is not lost.

EDIT: Also included Kim Stolz's explanation for why Zaeed is notn a good leader.

Thank you!  Glad to see this got stickied, it's waaay more detailed than my guide :happy:

Any estimate on how many hours were put into making this, by the way?

Too many.



Confirming both hold the line lists alone took at least a hundred reloads of one-shotting the final boss with the Cain. Pacifien's playthroughs helped a ton as well.

[Ecael]

Lumikki wrote...

Pacifien wrote...

Your Hold the Line average score is 2.25. Everyone should live.

Okey, but I need one more squad member if the 8 is minimum to get IFF missions?

Correct. That 8th squad member (and 9th, if you're using Legion) can either drag the score down or pull it back up, though.

[Pacifien]

More science. <_<

Everyone is loyal and I always pick blowing up the base. If loyalty actually affects the order, I'm sure it'd be similar to how loyalty affects who dies Holding the Line. I don't think blowing up the base or keeping it would affect things, but I didn't feel like testing to see if that's true.

Thane/Grunt - Shepard catches Grunt. Grunt catches Shepard.
Thane/Garrus - Shepard catches Thane. Garrus catches Shepard.
Thane/Jack - Shepard catches Thane. Jack catches Shepard.
Thane/Jacob - Shepard catches Thane. Jacob catches Shepard.
Thane/Kasumi - Shepard catches Kasumi. Kasumi catches Shepard.
Thane/Legion - Shepard catches Thane. Legion catches Shepard.
Thane/Miranda - Shepard catches Thane. Miranda catches Shepard.
Thane/Mordin - Shepard catches Thane. Mordin catches Shepard.
Thane/Morinth - ?
Thane/Samara - Shepard catches Thane. Samara catches Shepard.
Thane/Tali - Shepard catches Tali. Tali catches Shepard.
Thane/Zaeed - Shepard catches Thane. Zaeed catches Shepard.

Grunt/Garrus - Shepard catches Grunt. Grunt catches Shepard.
Grunt/Jack - Shepard catches Grunt. Grunt catches Shepard.
Grunt/Jacob - Shepard catches Grunt. Jacob catches Shepard.
Grunt/Kasumi - Shepard catches Kasumi. Kasumi catches Shepard.
Grunt/Tali - Shepard catches Tali. Tali catches Shepard.

Kasumi/Tali - Shepard catches Tali. Kasumi catches Shepard.

First of all, Thane is a dick. He never catches Shepard. Unless he catches Shepard when Morinth is there, but I can't test that. Second of all, it appears whoever hands you the grenade for the reactor is the one that ends up falling. Third of all, if you disagree with the Illusive Man on keeping the base, a squadmate who advocates keeping the base will speak up. If there isn't such a squadmate currently with you, no one says anything. Unless Miranda's there. Fourth of all, if you agree with the Illusive Man on keeping the base, a squadmate who disagrees with keeping the base will speak up. Again, if the squadmates are also in agreement about keeping the base, no one says anything. I've somewhat kept track of which squadmate speaks up so far. As well as which squadmate is holding up the omnitool for communications.

Starting to notice the order in which the squadmates will give you an update on the defense.
Thane - Jack - Garrus - Legion - Grunt - Jacob -- And that's as far as I got.

Going through the combinations with Grunt are next.

Order in which Shepard catches squadmates. Assuming this pattern holds up as I continue...
Tali - Kasumi - Grunt - Thane

Modifié par Pacifien, 25 juin 2010 - 06:36 .

[kennyv217]

This thread is very helpful. Hope we get more tips, so I know what to do during the suicide mission =)!

[Occams Razor 17]

Ecael wrote...

Occams Razor 17 wrote...

Ecael wrote...

Okay, it took me a while before I realized that this thread was stickied, but I 'm organizing it so Occams Razor 17's work is not lost.

EDIT: Also included Kim Stolz's explanation for why Zaeed is notn a good leader.

Thank you!  Glad to see this got stickied, it's waaay more detailed than my guide :happy:

Any estimate on how many hours were put into making this, by the way?

Too many.



Confirming both hold the line lists alone took at least a hundred reloads of one-shotting the final boss with the Cain. Pacifien's playthroughs helped a ton as well.

  Dang!  Well, while it may have taken too many hours, the end result is quite impressive and helpful. :happy:

[CroGamer002]

Pacifien wrote...

More science. <_<

Everyone is loyal and I always pick blowing up the base. If loyalty actually affects the order, I'm sure it'd be similar to how loyalty affects who dies Holding the Line. I don't think blowing up the base or keeping it would affect things, but I didn't feel like testing to see if that's true.

Thane/Grunt - Shepard catches Grunt. Grunt catches Shepard.
Thane/Garrus - Shepard catches Thane. Garrus catches Shepard.
Thane/Jack - Shepard catches Thane. Jack catches Shepard.
Thane/Jacob - Shepard catches Thane. Jacob catches Shepard.
Thane/Kasumi - Shepard catches Kasumi. Kasumi catches Shepard.
Thane/Legion - Shepard catches Thane. Legion catches Shepard.
Thane/Miranda - Shepard catches Thane. Miranda catches Shepard.
Thane/Mordin - Shepard catches Thane. Mordin catches Shepard.
Thane/Morinth - ?
Thane/Samara - Shepard catches Thane. Samara catches Shepard.
Thane/Tali - Shepard catches Tali. Tali catches Shepard.
Thane/Zaeed - Shepard catches Thane. Zaeed catches Shepard.

Grunt/Garrus - Shepard catches Grunt. Grunt catches Shepard.
Grunt/Jack - Shepard catches Grunt. Grunt catches Shepard.
Grunt/Jacob - Shepard catches Grunt. Jacob catches Shepard.
Grunt/Kasumi - Shepard catches Kasumi. Kasumi catches Shepard.
Grunt/Tali - Shepard catches Tali. Tali catches Shepard.

Kasumi/Tali - Shepard catches Tali. Kasumi catches Shepard.

First of all, Thane is a dick. He never catches Shepard. Unless he catches Shepard when Morinth is there, but I can't test that. Second of all, it appears whoever hands you the grenade for the reactor is the one that ends up falling. Third of all, if you disagree with the Illusive Man on keeping the base, a squadmate who advocates keeping the base will speak up. If there isn't such a squadmate currently with you, no one says anything. Unless Miranda's there. Fourth of all, if you agree with the Illusive Man on keeping the base, a squadmate who disagrees with keeping the base will speak up. Again, if the squadmates are also in agreement about keeping the base, no one says anything. I've somewhat kept track of which squadmate speaks up so far. As well as which squadmate is holding up the omnitool for communications.

Starting to notice the order in which the squadmates will give you an update on the defense.
Thane - Jack - Garrus - Legion - Grunt - Jacob -- And that's as far as I got.

Going through the combinations with Grunt are next.

Order in which Shepard catches squadmates. Assuming this pattern holds up as I continue...
Tali - Kasumi - Grunt - Thane

[squigian]

Hmm. I took Mordin and Thane to the final boss and Shepard caught Mordin. Mordin caught Shepard afterwards. Both were loyal. Is there some other variable involved?

[Pacifien]

When discussing it in another thread, people said they've caught both Garrus and Tali while they were both the squadmates. They seem to believe that whoever is on the right of your selection (which I think is the second person you pick) has a greater chance of being catched. Not necessarily the one you always catch, but with the greater chance. I think there's still a list of who you are most likely to catch, but apparently there's another variable. Garrus and Tali are both on opposite sides of the argument about keeping the base, so I speculated that how you discuss the topic with the Illusive Man might have something to do with it.

Or maybe it simply does have a random element to it. I could get a list that is what you're most likely to get, but people might still be able to get a different outcome.

[Pacifien]

Thane/Mordin
Shepard catches Mordin.
Mordin catches Shepard.

Mordin/Thane
Shepard catches Thane.
Mordin catches Shepard.

Dammit, this means I have to do the Thane testing all over again!

Modifié par Pacifien, 25 juin 2010 - 05:18 .

[SpectreSeven]

Nice work there!

[Pacifien]

Catching Test 2.0
1st Part: The squadmate on the Left / The squadmate on the Right
2nd Part: Shepard catches squadmate / Squadmate catches Shepard

- Thane/Mordin - Mordin/Mordin
- Mordin/Thane - Thane/Mordin
- Garrus/Tali - Tali/Tali
- Tali/Garrus - Garrus/Tali
     - A simple reload from the autosave wouldn't get the two of them to switch places. I had to get the Human Reaper and Collectors to kill me and resume from there. Incidentally, the enemies suck at killing me when playing on Casual difficulty.
- Garrus/Thane - Thane/Garrus
     - Reloaded five times (four of them where I died to get the reload), none of which produced a Thane/Garrus combo.
- Legion/Thane - Thane/Legion
     - Reloaded five times (four of them where I died to get the reload), none of which produced a Thane/Legion combo.

If you're curious, it takes 154 playthroughs of the final battle to test every combo. I'm working on a shortcut.

And Thane is still a dick. Seriously, dude, you can't pick up Shepard just once?

[Pacifien]

Shortcut achieved. From Dusty Everman: In essence it is random. I'm sure it plays out the same way every time in each situation, but I don't think we planned for any order, so what is, is.

[Ecael]

Pacifien wrote...

Shortcut achieved. From Dusty Everman: In essence it is random. I'm sure it plays out the same way every time in each situation, but I don't think we planned for any order, so what is, is.

How does that explain Thane, though?

Hmm...

Modifié par Ecael, 25 juin 2010 - 09:43 .

[Fiery Phoenix]

I suggest you try Thane and Morinth, Pacifien.

[nikki191]

m14567 wrote...

Pacifien wrote...

Shortcut achieved. From Dusty Everman: In essence it is random. I'm sure it plays out the same way every time in each situation, but I don't think we planned for any order, so what is, is.

Huh, first he says (if you are quoting) it is random, then he says it plays out the same way every time in each situation. Those two statements don't seem to jive.

there is no spoon

[Fiery Phoenix]

Also, Pacifien, I have a save right before the suicide mission where I have Morinth instead of Samara and have romanced Thane. I can do this on your behalf if you wish.

[Pacifien]

I think basically he was saying that if there is an order to how things work, it was unintentional. I might still work on it, though. FieryPhoenix, if you'd like to test out Morinth/Thane, Thane/Morinth, that'd be great!