29107 réponses à ce sujet

[BubbleSauce]

Obsydian wrote...

BubbleSauce wrote...

sh*t Obsydian, I never did once think of it like that, I personally don't think that he has a right to hate humans as much as he does, he had absolutely no right to keep Anderson out of the spectres, then again, I don't have much of a right to tell a man guided by grief that what he's doing is completely wrong, I mean he was still guided by some kind of moral compass I suppose.

But in all honesty, to think that saren actually cared for him that much, that he was willing to sacrifice his best friend, and well... lover, so that he'd suffer a lesser fate to what he himself was subjected to, it's just...

Damn it Obsydian now your making me feel like an ass hole...

d'awww..  um, sorry?  i didn't mean to make you feel like an arse. lol.  

i mean, like i said, its just my headcanon... but i've done quite a bit of thinking (and writing, drawing, dreaming)  about this... because i am a dork....  
and i can see it. and it really is just painful to think about, huh.   i really really think that Saren is capable of that depth of emotion, and i think that he's the sort to let his emotions completely rule over his common sense and anything else in that case. 

I think... as far as his hatred for humans...  think about the way that humanity tends to react towards anything new?  we poke it, prod it, dissect it, and then nuke it from orbit.  seriously.  did you see District 9?  I fully believe that is exactly what we would do when faced with an alien race. we would torture it horribly to figure out how it works. 
Then figure out how our species could profit ffrom it.   cause we're horrible like that. *shrug*  but each to their own really.  hell, I hate humans.  LIke I seriously hate 95 percent fo all humanity and live on the belief that at least half of our species is completely useless. 
But i'm a cynic. *shrug*   
and this is why i love the turian race so much. this is why i'm a xenophile. *shrug*   

gods im' a dork. 

Commander Shepard wrote...

You've got a pessimistic view of the universe williams

It really depends, your view is still valid, don't get me wrong, but only in certain situations would humanity dare do things like that, for starters, the only way the events of district 9 could occur is if we discovered the new race ourselves, and even then, they would have to be less technologically advanced than we are, in district 9, we have aliens who are cut off from there homeworld, they're smarter than we are, but that really doesn't matter, it's just as if they are at the same point technologically as we are. In that situation we have the advantage, that particular race is at our mercy, It's portrayed in mass effect that humans have an incredible drive to improve themselves and their race, which is true, but it is also portrayed that the other races do not, which doesn't make sense at all, I can assure you that any other race, from mass effect and beyond, would study another intelligent creature, if they were making first contact, and they would be just as brutal, if not more so. Now there are other situations, say for instance that the race found us, and they were more technologically advanced than we were, now I don't know about you, but I for one, would be accepting of our new alien overlords, for fear that they'd wipe us from the face of the earth. And lastly, if humanity was part of say, some kind of council as they are in mass effect, they simply wouldn't be allowed to carry out the experiments, at least not in public any way. 

But in all seriousness, do you really hate 95 percent of humanity? If I may diverge from mass effect for a moment, It's fairly evident, that if we look at this in a realistic sense, every race (and that includes turians, asari you name it) would react in exactly the same way when faced with a newly discovered race, it's called curiosity, and it comes with being sapient. No matter what their culture is, curiosity is what drives invention, technology, art and culture, and it'll drive us to some all time lows, I can tell you that right now, but to say that humanity is unique in that respect, is simply untrue, there will be turians that want to rip the poo things open, just as there will be humans who wish to do so, and there will be turians who want to give it a hug, just as there are humans who want to do so, like I said, it comes with being sapient, diversity is something that exists in every race, and it’s incredibly presumptuous of you to think that humanity is the only race out there who is willing to go to extremes for the good of their species.  
 

Modifié par BubbleSauce, 07 juillet 2011 - 12:05 .

[k8ee]

AnimaTempli101 wrote...

Guys, I have a question and for many of you it will not be an easy one.

'Not including Shepard, who do you think Garrus should get in a relationship with?'

Someone other than myself?

Xena: Warrior Princess.

[Sialater]

I can't actually imagine Garrus with anyone other than Meghan.







I can't even conceive of another of MY Shepards that would work with him. I'm almost finished with a single Shepard run so I could have a non-cheating Shepard for him, but this Shepard wouldn't work with him. She's too harsh and utterly unromantic and practical.

And Garrus is the hopeless romantic of the Don Quixote sort.

[Obsydian]

BubbleSauce wrote...

Commander Shepard wrote...

You've got a pessimistic view of the universe williams

It really depends, your view is still valid, don't get me wrong, but only in certain situations would humanity dare do things like that, for starters, the only way the events of district 9 could occur is if we discovered the new race ourselves, and even then, they would have to be less technologically advanced than we are, in district 9, we have aliens who are cut off from there homeworld, they're smarter than we are, but that really doesn't matter, it's just as if they are at the same point technologically as we are. In that situation we have the advantage, that particular race is at our mercy, It's portrayed in mass effect that humans have an incredible drive to improve themselves and their race, which is true, but it is also portrayed that the other races do not, which doesn't make sense at all, I can assure you that any other race, from mass effect and beyond, would study another intelligent creature, if they were making first contact, and they would be just as brutal, if not more so. Now there are other situations, say for instance that the race found us, and they were more technologically advanced than we were, now I don't know about you, but I for one, would be accepting of our new alien overlords, for fear that they'd wipe us from the face of the earth. And lastly, if humanity was part of say, some kind of council as they are in mass effect, they simply wouldn't be allowed to carry out the experiments, at least not in public any way. 

But in all seriousness, do you really hate 95 percent of humanity? If I may diverge from mass effect for a moment, It's fairly evident, that if we look at this in a realistic sense, every race (and that includes turians, asari you name it) would react in exactly the same way when faced with a newly discovered race, it's called curiosity, and it comes with being sapient. No matter what their culture is, curiosity is what drives invention, technology, art and culture, and it'll drive us to some all time lows, I can tell you that right now, but to say that humanity is unique in that respect, is simply untrue, there will be turians that want to rip the poo things open, just as there will be humans who wish to do so, and there will be turians who want to give it a hug, just as there are humans who want to do so, like I said, it comes with being sapient, diversity is something that exists in every race, and it’s incredibly presumptuous of you to think that humanity is the only race out there who is willing to go to extremes for the good of their species.  
 

I have a very pessamistic view of the universe. I know this.  I've worked in retail or foodservice or somesuch for 10 years now.  I've dealt with people who throw coffee at me because i don't have the kind of ****ing donut that they want. People who yell at my employees cause they are charging 15 cents for a cup because thats what we're supposed to do. 
Yes. yes i do hate 95 percent of humanity. Humans are lazy, selfish f*cks who really don't give a sh*t about anyone but themselves. As a race we've extincted more species than most natural disasters. We've destroyed our planet without even a thought.  And now, even during this "green revolution"  so few actually care.  And are STILL doing it for selfish reasons. 
Now, keep in mind... that we have 6billion people on the planet. so me liking 5% is still quite a few people. And that, in itself, is still sad. 
*shrug* 

Now, back to ME. 
You are completely right.. I actually believe that the game was pretty spot on in its portrayal of what would probably happen to humanity if we were to go out there and meet with a new (and fairly agressive) alien race. A war would definitly break out. And its true, there would be things stopping us from doing experiments and whatnot. Publickly. 
Now, obviously the races in ME are all human created. They are all facets of the human paradigm. We really have NO idea what an alien species would be like.  You're probably right. they probably would experiment on us. However...  i cannot believe that they would be as brutal.  i just cant.  i can barely believe that humans could be so brutal, and yet i know for a fact that we can.  Hell, we're that brutal to our OWN species let alone another. 

i am with you though... i'd welcome our alien masters.  If only cause they can't do a worse job then OUR world leaders. 

[AnimaTempli101]

Not to detract from that very eloquent speech of yours Obsy, but is extincted a word?

[Obsydian]

well, no... since its not a verb it actually can't be conjugated in any manner. technically the proper sentence would be "humans have made extinct" but... yeah.
i don't necessarily use proper grammar. its not that i dont know the proper way of speaking, i just don't.

[BubbleSauce]

Not that I'm making light of the fact that people were utter bastards to you, but the people who have thrown coffee at you probably make up less than 1% of the worlds population. And even still, do you think other races would be any better? Sure, maybe if they were like the hanar, but a space faring race like the turians? I'm sure they'd strip mine a habitable planet for resources without second thought, and I'm sure they wouldn't be to considerate about using resources natural to palaven as well.

God I really must sound like an arse here but still, don't you think it's a little presumptuous of you to think that the grass is always greener on the other side? There are good people out there, just because the ones who are partial to throwing coffee at you sometimes overshadow them, doesn't mean that they aren't there.

My point is this, I'm sure that if you went to palaven and set up a small food chain in a street corner, there would be turians who would throw coffee at you as well, just as there are humans that would do so, that doesn't mean that the vast majority of turians are bastards, I'm sure there are many turians who would help you clean it up, just as there are many humans who would do so. (and just because none of said humans were present at your work place does not mean that they don't exist, so don't pull that one on me) 

Edit: and yes the the turians would be just as brutal, it's not that the humans are trying to torture the creature, that's just the technology that they have at their disposal, same applys for the turians...

Modifié par BubbleSauce, 07 juillet 2011 - 06:48 .

[Obsydian]

you don't sound like an ass at all. Philisophical discussion is something that I've always enjoyed and if you shared the same opinions as me, then it would be a pretty boring discussion, now wouldn't it?
I didn't say that there weren't any good people out there. In fact, there are tons. I'm merely saying that in the society that I see in my day to day life, most of the people that I come in contact with in one way or another are selfish, self-centered bastards who really don't give a lick for anyone but themselves. I myself am not saying that I'm a peach either. I live in this world too. I try my damnedest to be polite and to be respectful and nice to people, but *shrug* i guess life is what we make of it.
I understand that it happens in all races. Of course it does. In fact, I'd be MORE nervous about a race of beings that DIDN'T have ****s in it. Without the bad people it would be hard to see the good. Without dark, there is no light and all that. There is a balance...

I would never ever say that there are not good people in this world. But again, there are 6.5 billion people on the planet. and I truely believe that a small fraction of them make up the "good people". *shrug*
but again, opinions are like ****s, everyone has them. and none of them are necessarily wrong. I'm outspoken and opinionated, and really not quiet about ever sharing them. I hope I'm not outta line here...

Now, back to that whole setting up a food chain on Palaven. I want to do that. I wanna be surrounded by sexy turians all the time.
And yup, I realize I just made one hell of a generalization. And that a large number of those turians, sexy or no, would be ****s ... especially because I'm human. But thats how it is.

[BubbleSauce]

Obsydian wrote...

Now, back to that whole setting up a food chain on Palaven. I want to do that. I wanna be surrounded by sexy turians all the time.
And yup, I realize I just made one hell of a generalization. And that a large number of those turians, sexy or no, would be ****s ... especially because I'm human. But thats how it is.

Eh, I'm hoping we get to fix that in mass effect 3, the hierarchy are allying themselve with the alliance whether they like it or not! 

Sorry, I seem to be getting everything your saying a little mixed up, I was under the impression that you were speaking of the entire human race as opposed to simply those you meet in your day-to-day life. Well in that case your right, in condensed areas people can be ass holes.

I think the thing that got me a little riled up about your comments, was not that you were saying that there are not nice people in the world, but the fact that you seem to think that there are so few, I mean really? Only five percent of the human race is tolerable to be around? I think theres more than that, I fear for the state of our race if there isn't, I think the irritating ones, simply draw our attention, which is why it seems that there are so many, I don't know, I live in northern ireland and it's a colony of the united kingdom, so we don't have much of a choice to be anything other than pleasant here, especially after the events of the 1980's and 90's, people are too scared that it will revert back to that. Maybe it's just the people around your area?

*looks at profile*

Hm, odd, I thought people would have been more pleasant in the tardis.

Obsydian wrote...

 opinions are like ****s, everyone has them. and none of them are necessarily wrong.

I'm sorry, but what was the word that bsn censored out? I'm laughing my head off trying to figure out what it could be, lets see... "everyone has them, and none of them are necessarily wrong..."

sh*ts maybe? no doesn't really apply... hmmm, I can think of a word begining with c, but it's to dirty to utter here... eh, I guess it kind of fits the description, in an awfully weird way though.... Come on! Tell me! 

Modifié par BubbleSauce, 07 juillet 2011 - 07:48 .

[Sialater]

"Opinions are like ****holes, everyone has one and they all stink."

That's what I think Obsydian was paraphrasing.

[Obsydian]

i'm sorry if i got you riled up. i just fully and completely do not believe that humans are a good race. i don't. now, I've met a lot of people that i like, don't get me wrong... and im generally a friendly person... but i don't like people. i'm a misanthrope and a cynic and agoraphobe.

i mean... do you find me unpleasant? i may have opinions that you're not fond of.. but i'd like to think that on these boards i've been rather polite and friendly. i apologize if you've seen different.

*shrug* this probably isn't the place for a philisophical/moral discussion on the state of the human race. i'm sorry for derailing the entire thread... and if anyone is offended by what i've said, i'm also sorry, but i'm not going to change what i think or who i am to please someone.

i live on the east coast of the US. its a beautiful place full of people who are completely unappreciative.
but again. my opinions. maybe things are different in Ireland.

either way. i'm sorry for derailing the thread. and i'm sorry, bubble, for riling you up and getting you angry. not my intention.

also, yes, Sia is correct ... that is the saying i was going for. 

Modifié par Obsydian, 07 juillet 2011 - 08:11 .

[BubbleSauce]

Oh for gods sake Obsydian, now you sound like me when I first joined this thread and "offended" lady Olivia, I would never have anyone change their opinion just to please me, I'm not going to go into politics, but as a libertarian, that goes against everything I believe in and I'd be vastly disappointed in myself if that's what I seem to be doing.

And that was a fault on my part actually, "riled up" was most certainly a very poor choice of words, you did not once irritate me, in fact I actually quite enjoyed the discussion. I do not at all find you unpleasant and although I haven't been here very long, I'd still rate you as one of the nicest people on this thread. Oh dear god now it sounds I'm pandering... Well get the point, your not in the wrong, I am, and the fact that you felt you should apologise in such a manner probably says more about my form of discussion than it does about your belief system.

But come on, you shouldn't apologise to me for having a different opinion than I do, like I said I'm a libertarian, I am most certainly not trying to shout down your opinion. Speak freely, it's what the internet is about after all

[AnimaTempli101]

This is a brilliant dicussion, shame it isn't allowed here but before we all get told off by some moderator or another (what ever hapened to devs moderating anyway? Used to happen a lot over on the DA forums on the lead up to DA2) I will put in my twenty billion Zimbabwean dollars (two cents) :

I find it a logical fallacy to just divide human beings into black and white categories of "Nice" and "An ****". Human nature is so diverse that such definitions should be impossible to make. For example, I give you none other than myself. I am a friend of the utmost loyalty and devotion, I am known as the joker of the pack and I also am known to be a decent guy to be around. However, if I am confronted either by an -ism of any kind (sexism, racism, homophobia-ism or ignorantism (not a word but I'm running with it) or a large quantity of alcohol I can become superior, aggressive, cold, harsh and basically become a bit of a ****. It all depends on situation, however I will admit that being 'a customer' and thus infallible makes the negative aspects of humanity come out. However at that point I usually spin that person around and either rip the hell into them with words (nicely, not swear at them) or kindly inform them that whilst the person behind the counter may not be able to do anything, I will gladly make sure they leave the establishment with more than their pride bruised.

Now I bid you goodnight, possibly. Someone do me a favor while I'm not on and post some good artwork.

P.S I am also known to be quite Holmes-ish when I'm trying to figure something out. 

Modifié par AnimaTempli101, 07 juillet 2011 - 09:29 .

[Sialater]

Arcian wrote...

Man, I asked one of the most important questions of all time on twitter, and they haven't replied yet.

Go here.

I doubt they'll answer that.

[CroGamer002]

^Ain't you a guy?

[BubbleSauce]

AnimaTempli101 wrote...

I find it a logical fallacy to just divide human beings into black and white categories of "Nice" and "An ****". Human nature is so diverse that such definitions should be impossible to make.

Exactly, my point is that other races would be exactly the same, and to think that all humans are all terrible people is on par with thinking that the entirety of another race would be any better.

AnimaTempli101 wrote...

However, if I am confronted either by an -ism of any kind (sexism, racism, homophobia-ism or ignorantism (not a word but I'm running with it) or a large quantity of alcohol I can become superior, aggressive, cold, harsh and basically become a bit of a ****.

Hell I don't blame you, I get very defensive when faced with prejudice, sectarianism and homophobia, I've been called a f*g many times before and been slated for coming from a catholic background more times than I can count, and I'm not even catholic anymore, but even still that's beside the point, I'll live my life how I want to live it and I'll be damned if anyone wants to tell me otherwise!

It's okay to act like an ass hole if your speaking out against something that's evidently wrong.

Modifié par BubbleSauce, 07 juillet 2011 - 10:06 .

[Obsydian]

AnimaTempli101 wrote...

This is a brilliant dicussion, shame it isn't allowed here but before we all get told off by some moderator or another (what ever hapened to devs moderating anyway? Used to happen a lot over on the DA forums on the lead up to DA2) I will put in my twenty billion Zimbabwean dollars (two cents) :

I find it a logical fallacy to just divide human beings into black and white categories of "Nice" and "An ****". Human nature is so diverse that such definitions should be impossible to make. For example, I give you none other than myself. I am a friend of the utmost loyalty and devotion, I am known as the joker of the pack and I also am known to be a decent guy to be around. However, if I am confronted either by an -ism of any kind (sexism, racism, homophobia-ism or ignorantism (not a word but I'm running with it) or a large quantity of alcohol I can become superior, aggressive, cold, harsh and basically become a bit of a ****. It all depends on situation, however I will admit that being 'a customer' and thus infallible makes the negative aspects of humanity come out. However at that point I usually spin that person around and either rip the hell into them with words (nicely, not swear at them) or kindly inform them that whilst the person behind the counter may not be able to do anything, I will gladly make sure they leave the establishment with more than their pride bruised.

Now I bid you goodnight, possibly. Someone do me a favor while I'm not on and post some good artwork.

P.S I am also known to be quite Holmes-ish when I'm trying to figure something out. 

.... i don't understand grey, to be honest and to quote our wonderful Mr. Vakarian.  I really find it hard to think in terms of grey.  I'm very an all or nothing sort of girl in all respects. 

i also have been told that i am very very callous at times.  i will defend myself, my friends, and my rights as hard as i can. 


your wish is my command. 

Modifié par Obsydian, 07 juillet 2011 - 10:10 .

[BubbleSauce]

 Mass effect movie details at comic-con

So tell, me would you prefer to see a live action garrus or a cgi one? *mindless promt for conversation*

For me it depends, if the costume is as good as ridely scot's alien, then I'd say live action, but if the cgi is as good as district 9's "prawns," then I'd have to go with cgi. Which do you guys prefer?

[DragonRacer]

@ Obsydian and Bubblesauce

Heck of a well-done conversation there. I think a lot of perception about your fellow human depends on where you are... Obsydian being on the East Coast of the U.S. (as am I), is definitely going to encounter a lot of jerk-ish people because a) population is so dense, so you're definitely bound to see more jerks when the amount of people you see is so great and anyone working in retail or fast food is in a place to meet more jerk-ish people than the norm. I'm not sure why that is, although I suspect it's because both environments see people who are a) in a hurry and, thus, become easily short-tempered and people who are customers, unfortunately, seem to adopt a master-talking-to-slave attitude when dealing with retail or fast food employees. I see it happen around me in line all the time (Obsydian - I am one of those few folks who will be kind and patient, and shakes my head and gives my sympathies to the employee after a nasty customer has left... I don't have to work with the general public, thankfully, but I deal with enough jerks in my job to feel that we really should just slow down and be nice to each other... why is that so hard for others?).

Whereas, Bubbles, you mention being in Ireland? I may not have had a proper sampling of the locals during my summer abroad college semester in the UK... spent the month of May 2005 in northwestern England and took a day trip to Dublin... but people over there, in general, are MUCH nicer, friendlier, and patient than people over here in the U.S. I think it has to do with population density, honestly. When I lived in a much larger city here in the U.S., people were colder and more stand-offish. I now live in a much smaller city/large town, and while there are always going to be jerks, people do not act quite as much as toddlers here as they did in a city of over one million folks.

Now, to get back on the topic of Garrus -- I would probably prefer a CG one myself. Even though it's years old now, I still watch "Jurassic Park" and "Dragonheart" and am impressed with how good and realistic the CG effects look. They've come even farther now, to the point that it actually breaks my immersion more to see a suited character (no matter how well done) instead of a CG character.

And hi, everyone! *waves* Probably a strange first post to the Garrus thread, but I've been lurking for a few weeks. Just got ME2 on my PS3 the end of May and completed first playthrough, but finally got off my bum and registered so I could post. Garrus and Legion were, by far, the most interesting squadmates, in my opinion.

[k8ee]

Arcian wrote...

Man, I asked one of the most important questions of all time on twitter, and they haven't replied yet.

Go here.

Wooooo!

That is all.

[kglaser]

I couldn't see that because I'm not on Twitter. :/