29107 réponses à ce sujet

[nekhbet]

Xsause wrote...

Welcome to the boards, Evelinessa! Be sure to join Clan Vakarian for some more Garrus-related lulz, discussion and fun.

And make sure to leave your sanity at the door. Might lose it once you're inside otherwise.

[Evelinessa]

Thank you for the warm welcome!  I've joined Clan Vakarian. I'm going to make a second ME1 & 2 playthrough where I will stay with Liara but....I don't know if I could resist Garrus . I romanced him in my first playthrough. What do you guys think the possibility is for him to return as a squadmate?

[TheodoricFriede]

Welcome Evelinessa,

I believe that Garrus and the rest of the ME2 team will return. Or at the very least the Love interests will return.



We've been collecting a team for 2 games, why should we have to do it again when we should be focusing on the reaper threat?

[Geirahod]

I always go with garrus (and tali) to the missions on ME2 (few times I've picked up another crew member, but I always have Garrus with me)....



Well, I guess that's a little bit silly, But I wanted to said this, XD! I'm a super fan of Garrus (and besides, I'm a fan of Kaidan too)

[Sialater]

Ugh. I read another accusation of bestiality today. NO ONE says that about Liara and she's just as alien as Thane and Garrus. I'm going back to the groups.

[nekhbet]

Bestiality claims assume by definition that the aliens in the game aren't really "people", but non-sapient animals. The argument is invalid, because they all have high culture societies, among other stuff that defines them from animals just as humans define ourselves from animals culturally. Paraphilia? Sure (like about every other kink out there, to be correct, including asari), but not zoophilia or bestiality.

Culture is the only thing that really separates us from "animals", so yeah...

Shepard with a varren... now that'd be bestiality!

Modifié par nekhbet, 09 octobre 2010 - 05:08 .

[Evelinessa]

Ragabul the Ontarah wrote...

Evelinessa wrote...

Thank you for the warm welcome!  I've joined Clan Vakarian. I'm going to make a second ME1 & 2 playthrough where I will stay with Liara but....I don't know if I could resist Garrus . I romanced him in my first playthrough. What do you guys think the possibility is for him to return as a squadmate?

I think it's as good as any squddie's chances can possibly be.  He's wildly popular (he consistently wins most of the favorite character polls.)  He's somewhat hard to kill in the suicide mission plus Bioware has said ME3 can afford to have a much more variable path than ME2.  It doesn't have to be as streamlined because it won't have to be imported into another game.  I think that could mean that character death has less of an impact on whether that character will show up or not.  And his dossier introduced genuine new plotlines that would be fun to explore and resolve.  Even if he isn't a squaddie I really believe he will get a pretty awesome role in the story somehow.  Tali as well.

And I'll repeat the welcome as well.  But I will warn you...we're nuts.

Thats good to hear. He needs to have more dialogue though. I also hope we get a good romance ending. That would be nice if we get a sidequest to meet his family so we can find a cure for his mom. I read in another Garrus thread about meeting his father and seeing what he has to say about the romance. I wish characters talk more about shepard being in a relationship like in DA:O.

TheodoricFriede wrote...

Welcome Evelinessa,
I believe that Garrus and the rest of the ME2 team will return. Or at the very least the Love interests will return.

We've been collecting a team for 2 games, why should we have to do it again when we should be focusing on the reaper threat?

BioWare said that there will be consequences for cheating on a ME1 LI so hopefully the ME2 LIs return someway. I wonder how it will work if they get in a fight or something. I think that based on some characters personalitys they would be more inclined to talk it out rather then get violent.

Yes, I agree that we shouldn't build a team again. We spent all ME2 building a team. There should be no more then 3 or 4 new characters. And why would the squadmates leave now? They all seemed ready to finish the fight. Thats if there isn't some really big time gap again. The reapers are getting closer.....

I will try to remain optimistic but I don't want to be disapointed. So I will try my best by supporting my favorite character.

[Evelinessa]

Geirahod wrote...

I always go with garrus (and tali) to the missions on ME2 (few times I've picked up another crew member, but I always have Garrus with me)....

Well, I guess that's a little bit silly, But I wanted to said this, XD! I'm a super fan of Garrus (and besides, I'm a fan of Kaidan too)

I always took Garrus with me since I got him(he was the first one I recruited). I alternate who else I take with me but It's usually Mordin. I play as a soldier. I'm a really big fan too . I keep trying to get my friend to get an Xbox and get the game so he would meet Garrus. He would probably say that Garrus isn't a good character though just to get me mad.

[Eradyn]

Sialater wrote...

Ugh. I read another accusation of bestiality today. NO ONE says that about Liara and she's just as alien as Thane and Garrus. I'm going back to the groups.

People who make those claims are allowing their ignorance to show.  Xenophilia perhaps, but beastiality? No. 

Beastiality is sex with non-sapient animals.  We, on the other hand, are sapient [animals], capable of wisdom, moral determination, higher reasoning, and all those good things.  So, too, the sapient aliens of the ME universe.  Turians, drell, asari, hanar, elcor, volus, salarians, and so forth, are all sapient beings, and thus to have a relationship with one would not be beastiality.

But we all know this, here, I think. ;p

[nekhbet]

I confess, I'm far more offended by the fact someone gets their insults wrong like this, than that they're trying to insinuate I'm into bestiality because my Shepard dates Garrus. If you wanna insult someone, do it right or don't bother.

Modifié par nekhbet, 09 octobre 2010 - 06:59 .

[General Ashous]

How can it be beastiality if Garrus is sapient? You see I've never had a femshep but as a guy shep, you can't resist Garrus as your bro and for a femshep it's hard to resist Garrus and Thane as LIs. So it can't be beastiality.



Welcome Evelinessa, welcome to the thread and look forward to some great convos.

[Brass_Buckles]

Sialater wrote...

Ugh. I read another accusation of bestiality today. NO ONE says that about Liara and she's just as alien as Thane and Garrus. I'm going back to the groups.

I was posting a response to this when my computer decided to freeze up and then scare me half to death with boot issues.  No virus, no malware detected now that it's finally running again, but I'll still be taking it in for a checkup when the shop's open again.

Here we go, an honest opinion from yours truly:

The Mass Effect aliens, no matter how inhuman, are people, not animals.  They may bear a passing resemblance to animals on Earth--especially in the case of the krogan and the rachni (shrimp anyone?), but human beings bear a resemblance to monkeys, and we're not monkies anymore.  It's not as if Garrus has the head and face of a cat or something.  Because he's a sapient, sentient being and shows self-restraint in various cases despite being an impulsive individual, he's a person, not an animal.  Thus, it's xenophilia, not bestiality.  If Shepard/Garrus is bestiality, then Shepard/Liara and Shepard/Tali must also be bestiality.  Although both of them are more human in appearance than Garrus, they're still very alien.  Liara has a tentacle head.  Tali is dextro-amino and has leg spurs like Garrus (and we don't even know what she's hiding behind her face mask, other than it's vaguely human in the nose/eyes).

And now for the part you guys are probably going to be mad at me for saying (but I hope not because I am not trying to be mean here):

I've run across more than a few fanfics that reduce Garrus to more or less an upright, talking animal.  When people have him "purring" when happy (yes, I've seen it outside of smut) and acting and reacting to just about everything that happens based on "turian instinct," including flying into jealous "alpha male" "WOMAN MINE" rages that I hope none of the authors would tolerate from a real-life boyfriend or significant other, the argument that it isn't bestiality weakens, particularly to those who aren't familiar with the character.  To me these things are kind of frustrating, especially when I'm wading through smutty porn fics to find something with a decent plot (sometimes M-rated stuff has more than smut involved, and it's occasionally awesome when it does).  I have even seen fics where Mordin is made to actually observe that Garrus is participating in some kind of turian mating season/rut/whatever.  To someone who isn't that into the fandom, they could be extremely off-putting.  Some people do pretty much treat him as a "furry"--half-animal, half-human--instead of a "person," who may have a different culture, but who is able and willing to act outside of any extant instincts.  I'm not trying to bash the fanfics here.  I don't like that kind of fic, but I understand that people have fantasies that they like to fulfill through fanfic and that I can close my browser window if I don't like it.  And in some cases I'm sure it's just in fun for the author.  That said, while I think we'd all agree that Garrus is as removed from the dino/bird thing turians evolved from as humans are from the great apes, there are people, especially people unfamiliar with the character, the game, or even just the romance plot, who are never going to see it that way.  And yes, the fanfics involving a purring Garrus or a "turian instinct driven" Garrus are going to fuel the fire, even if the author only intends to show that "turians are alien and therefore different from humans," and expects that only fans will read it.

Mind you, as far as I'm concerned, it's whatever floats your boat, but just be aware that what you post online will most likely be read by others who are not necessarily fans--even things in this thread.  Something we should all keep in mind, especially as fans of a particular character and his romance plot in particular.  If you're going to be worried and upset about what they think, then be more careful about what you post.  Otherwise, what does it matter what they think or what I think or what John Doe nextdoor thinks?

Modifié par Brass_Buckles, 09 octobre 2010 - 09:36 .

[kglaser]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

If Garrus cant survive ME3 I will return it to the store.

I can't help but agree with this.  I don't think I would be able to resist doing that very thing, as a form of protest.  Hell, it would make it hard to replay ME2 again.

[General Ashous]

Garrus obviously can't be in ME3 if he died in ME2. But who honestly let him die. Therefore, he has to be in ME3. As squad, we have to wait and see but if he isn't squad then it's just unbelievable. I mean, he's been in right from the beginning so why wouldn't he be in at the end. That would boast insanity that's even beyond me! I wouldn't return it but I would be outraged at what Bioware had done and my opinion on the game would drop sharply.

[kglaser]

Brass_Buckles wrote...

Here we go, an honest opinion from yours truly:

<snip>

Now I feel even less secure about the fic I'm writing.

[Brass_Buckles]

General Ashous wrote...

Garrus obviously can't be in ME3 if he died in ME2. But who honestly let him die. Therefore, he has to be in ME3. As squad, we have to wait and see but if he isn't squad then it's just unbelievable. I mean, he's been in right from the beginning so why wouldn't he be in at the end. That would boast insanity that's even beyond me! I wouldn't return it but I would be outraged at what Bioware had done and my opinion on the game would drop sharply.

Some people let him die, according to my poll.  There are also people who freaked out that I made said poll, because they'd heard enough about Garrus and Tali already and darnit he won't be in ME3 at all, and etc.  All in that lovely lack of punctuation and capitalization generally found in the common Internet Troll.

I'm surprised people would kill one and want the other on their squad--except that in some ways I feel the same about Tali.  I don't feel we get to know anything about her, really, until ME2--in ME1 she feels more like an encyclopedia when I talk to her!  I hate that.  I can't even remember her banter.  I feel like she should be my female Shepard's best friend, even beyond Garrus, but in ME2 her first reappearance seems downright cold--not that I blame her.  After all, Shep's wearing a Cerberus outfit.

Garrus, on the other hand, I feel like we've come to know pretty well.  I feel like he's my Shepard's best friend.  He will even stand by Shepard if she's working with Cerberus.  You could argue he's loyal to a fault.  What's surprising to me about him is that he has different dialogue after he's rescued for a male and female Shepard--for a female Shepard, it's like he's kind of flirting before you can even think of starting the romance dialogue.  And yet, he's never had any "impure thoughts" regarding Shepard, according to him.

I can't say whether I know if he'll be in ME3, but it would be a shame if the LIs don't all get some kind of closure.  That may be easier to do if they're in the party than just in a cameo, but the "reward" that Bioware told us about for sticking with Kaidan or Ashley or Liara may be that you get to keep your LI.  Everyone else may lose theirs--though surely not, considering they've been made aware of how very popular Garrus's ending romance scene is.

[General Ashous]

Brass_Buckles wrote...

General Ashous wrote...

Garrus obviously can't be in ME3 if he died in ME2. But who honestly let him die. Therefore, he has to be in ME3. As squad, we have to wait and see but if he isn't squad then it's just unbelievable. I mean, he's been in right from the beginning so why wouldn't he be in at the end. That would boast insanity that's even beyond me! I wouldn't return it but I would be outraged at what Bioware had done and my opinion on the game would drop sharply.

Some people let him die, according to my poll.  There are also people who freaked out that I made said poll, because they'd heard enough about Garrus and Tali already and darnit he won't be in ME3 at all, and etc.  All in that lovely lack of punctuation and capitalization generally found in the common Internet Troll.

I'm surprised people would kill one and want the other on their squad--except that in some ways I feel the same about Tali.  I don't feel we get to know anything about her, really, until ME2--in ME1 she feels more like an encyclopedia when I talk to her!  I hate that.  I can't even remember her banter.  I feel like she should be my female Shepard's best friend, even beyond Garrus, but in ME2 her first reappearance seems downright cold--not that I blame her.  After all, Shep's wearing a Cerberus outfit.

Garrus, on the other hand, I feel like we've come to know pretty well.  I feel like he's my Shepard's best friend.  He will even stand by Shepard if she's working with Cerberus.  You could argue he's loyal to a fault.  What's surprising to me about him is that he has different dialogue after he's rescued for a male and female Shepard--for a female Shepard, it's like he's kind of flirting before you can even think of starting the romance dialogue.  And yet, he's never had any "impure thoughts" regarding Shepard, according to him.

I can't say whether I know if he'll be in ME3, but it would be a shame if the LIs don't all get some kind of closure.  That may be easier to do if they're in the party than just in a cameo, but the "reward" that Bioware told us about for sticking with Kaidan or Ashley or Liara may be that you get to keep your LI.  Everyone else may lose theirs--though surely not, considering they've been made aware of how very popular Garrus's ending romance scene is.

Brass Buckles, you summed that up lovely. I've found a new friend. I too can't say for sure, but I made sure everyone survived because I think they all deserve a chance to end what's been started and Garrus would be on the front lines with Shep, Thane, Legion and Tali as they are also great characters. But, I can't see how people can have had enough of great characters such as Tali and Garrus. They were there at the very start, they should be there to see the very end if they wish to, it only seems fair.

[Alexine]

I've (shamefully) killed Garrus once... for science. By seeker swarms. I don't want to do it again. It makes me feel pathetic, but I want to see the various endings of ME3, depending on what happens on the suicide mission. If anyone wants to make a Shepard who kills Garrus, be prepared (or steal someone's save who did so when ME3 is just around the corner)

I think BW should have closure to everything in general (even the romance/LI). But I have a feeling it won't close everything, since they want to make more Mass Effect games. I'm more looking forward to what happens if you decide to pure paragon/pure renegade/paragade Garrus by ME3.

[kglaser]

General Ashous wrote...

But, I can't see how people can have had enough of great characters such as Tali and Garrus. They were there at the very start, they should be there to see the very end if they wish to, it only seems fair.

It would be damn silly if they just ditched them now, after all that character development.  In my opinion, it just wouldn't make any sense.

[Brass_Buckles]

kglaser wrote...

Brass_Buckles wrote...

Here we go, an honest opinion from yours truly:

Now I feel even less secure about the fic I'm writing.

Don't.  I seem to have a different opinion about Garrus's behavior in general than other people do, but I have noticed that he's anything but possessive in-game.  I've seen the love triangle on Youtube.  He's not clinging to Shepard, but he's very glad when she chooses him, and interestingly--contrary to what I've seen on most fics and believed, myself--he seems to want everyone to hear that they're together in the rumor mill.  He's not going to fly into a jealous rage if Shepard is with someone else; he's more likely to step aside.  But he still wants everyone to know they're together, so he can improve his chances of not being pushed aside.

As for the instinct thing, it's not my style, but Harbinger does call turians "primitive," so I can kind of see where people are coming from even if I don't agree with it.  I think he's more of a "person," not human, and likely to have different ideas on culture and music and religion and just about everything including money, drug use, and collateral damage, and won't act on instinct unless it's to avoid getting killed or to keep one of the team or crew from getting killed.  The primitive aspect of a turian is more likely a reference to their warlike, imperialist culture.

I'm also one of the apparently very rare people who don't think Garrus, after sharing a very tender moment with Shepard, proceeded to indulge in very rough, violent sex with her, especially not because "turian instinct" demanded he "take her then."  He was stroking her arm very delicately, cautiously--the first time he'd touched her socially or intimately that we've seen in either game.  Considering his caution, it's possible nothing at all happened until after the Omega-4 Relay Mission, though that would depend on the Shepard in question.  After all, maybe one or both of them would fail to return after that.  My impression is that his time with Shepard was very different from that wild night with the recon scout, in no small part because they were sharing a very vulnerable moment just beforehand rather than an argument or sparring match, and the fact that the situation at that point is also pretty somber (your crew's out there, you know...).  As Garrus himself said, "More than one way to blow off steam, I guess."  A post-Omega 4 "private celebration" might be wilder, however, assuming Garrus is still interested at that point, but still not driven by "mating instinct."  Again, my opinion--we don't see anything of it so it really is up to each of us to take the clues as we may.

And now in regard to turian vs. human culture:

Shepard> Seriously, Garrus, music from Flux?
Garrus> Hey, it's good stuff.  Gets you moving.
Shepard> It's not a human's idea of good date music, though, Garrus.  You might as well have played something from a porn flick.  We human women like slow, romantic music.  It soothes the nerves, and doesn't cause... distractions.
Garrus> Really?  But I saw so many humans dancing to it on the dance floor at Flux, and I remembered you danced, too, so...  Isn't that romantic?
Shepard> Do turians usually play dance music on a date?
Garrus> Yeah, it makes it more exciting.  I don't know why you don't think it's romantic enough.  I know!  Maybe I could turn it on again, and we could dance to it and then--
Shepard> (decides abruptly to change the subject, guessing where that was going) And about that money we earned back on the first Normandy... Didn't you get a huge chunk of that?  So why are you broke now?  That should've lasted you years.
Garrus> I, uh, donated it to charity.  I didn't need it at the time.  I was working for C-Sec, and...
Shepard> Well I can't say I disapprove, but maybe next time you should set up a savings account and put some of the money there.  You know, just in case.

Etc...

Modifié par Brass_Buckles, 09 octobre 2010 - 10:26 .

[Jackalope]

Somehow, I could see Garrus spending all his ME1 money on an AWESOME SCOPE. One that probably didn't survive Omega.



Also, I'm replaying ME1 and a thought came to me. I know we've mentioned Garrus and his Omega team would be awesome DLC...but I think I rediscovered a better idea. How about his early C-Sec days, when he found that elcor that was hacking people to pieces.



Because...really...an elcor hacking murderer...there's something about that that just sounds like a good idea.

[kglaser]

I'm mostly interested in the logistics of how an elcor could hack anything to pieces. LOL

[Brass_Buckles]

Okay, somehow I got inspired to build on that "different cultures" sketch from my last post.  Garrus and Shepard discuss their romance, and other things.

Shepard> Garrus, you know, I appreciate that you dressed up in a suit for me...
Garrus> I sense a "but" coming, Shepard.  I wanted it to be special.  I wanted it to be the best date you've ever had.   I didn't want to make it feel rushed, or--
Shepard> Garrus, that's not the problem.  Blue and green can go well together, but, those were kind of... Well, they weren't the best shades to go together.  It wasn't a flattering outfit.
Garrus> (Sounding hurt) Really?  I thought I looked great.   I thought you liked those colors.  They go well with your eyes, and--
Shepard> (uses a paragon interrupt) That's sweet, Garrus, but you have to think about what looks good on you, too.
Garrus> I guess you're right.  Did I, uh, at least get the compliments right?  You didn't seem very... convincing, when you answered.
Shepard> Er... about that.  You didn't sound very, er, sure about my hair.  And the waist thing... Let's just say that most human women aren't exactly flattered to hear that their waistlines are "supportive."
Garrus> Really?  But that's a very appealing feature on a woman.  If she has a supportive waist, she--
Shepard> (paragon interrupt--no, I really don't want to hear the details!) I'm just glad to know I'm not entirely unattractive to you.
Garrus> If that were a problem, then blowing off steam together would've been a lot harder.  But the suit must not have bothered you much.  You didn't even drink any of the wine.  I thought you'd--
Shepard> (paragon interrupt) Garrus, if I had to get drunk to be interested in you, I wouldn't have asked in the first place.
Garrus> (flattered) I guess I'm just universally attractive, then.
Shepard> The best you could afford on a vigilante's salary, huh?  So where did the money you earned on the SR-1 go, anyway?
Garrus> I donated it to charity.
Shepard> Really?
Garrus> I had a job at C-Sec, a steady income. Other people needed those credits more than I did.  So, yeah, why not?
Shepard> Maybe because you don't have a real job, or a steady income now, and you spent most of your money on wine for me?  Next time, you should set up a savings account so you don't go broke.
Garrus> Yeah, I guess you're right.  I still don't regret it, though.  So, you turned off the music.  You didn't like that song?  You danced to it in the Flux.  I remember.
Shepard> About that... Dance music isn't the most romantic for a date, especially if you're planning to blow off steam together.  It's almost as bad as porn music.
Garrus> (sounds bewildered) It is?  But I thought it would get you moving, raise your heartrate, make it all more exciting.  Turian women like it...
Shepard> Human women like slow, quiet music on a date.  It's more romantic, sets the mood.  Of course, if you ever want to dance, then the Flux music is fine.
Garrus> Really?  But that's so boring. Ha!  And, no offense, Shepard, but no thanks.  I've seen how you dance.  Unless... We could go back to your cabin, I could turn the dance mix back on, and we could dance our clothes off, and--
Shepard> (paragon interrupt) That's tempting, Garrus, but we're on duty.

I'm sure you guys can think of more potential culture clashes.