29107 réponses à ce sujet

[Skyline_Stanza]

I've a question to pose to the Garrus board: If Garrus could have control over a squad like Shepard could, which members of the Normandy 2.0 squad would he take and why?

[Sialater]

He probably wouldn't trust Jack farther than he could throw her. Or Zaeed. Or possibly Kasumi. He trusts Tali, respects Thane, seems like Grunt and Mordin amuse him (or he's at least comfortable enough with Mordin to joke with Shepard in front of him -- the hospital dialog). He seems to be indifferent to Miranda and Jacob, though he'd probably get along better with Jacob than Miranda. He might be worried about giving Samara orders, though. Hell, I'm worried about giving an @800 year old being orders.



So, probably Tali (if he didn't insist on Tali being there to cover Shep's six since he can't), Thane and Mordin or Grunt.

[Skyline_Stanza]

Thanks Sialater.



Er....I've another question to ask, but this one's a bit loaded. Now, bear with me and I hope we can all act like mature people when I state this:



I'm writing a fanfic and in this fanfic, one of the main focuses is that Garrus and Thane grow close...as in a romance. Now, I've gone over how these two might form a friendship and maybe have that develop into something more, but I'm stuck on how to get the ball rolling. Thoughts anyone?

[Sialater]

I think it's OOC for both of them. Garrus moreso than Thane.

[Collider]

Kind of difficult for one thing because Garrus is not interested in males in the first place (so far as we know).



If you look at Garrus' romance in ME2, it's based on these things: trust & friendship.



If you like at why Garrus likes Shepard in general, it's partly because Shepard gets things done and because Shepard takes Garrus seriously. Shepard is willing to bend the rules sometimes, and Shepard is willing to hear Garrus out. The latter I could immediately say that Thane would do - Thane would listen to any reasonable person talking to him in general. The former? That's more difficult because Thane is trying to atone and swore off his assassinations.



They would bond over shooting baddies. That's basically the crux of it all, I would think. In this way they would mutually respect each other. They need to trust each other and think they've got each other's backs. You could add in some rivalry for sexual tension.



What I would also do is have Thane be the mentor.

[Skyline_Stanza]

Collider wrote...

Kind of difficult for one thing because Garrus is not interested in males in the first place (so far as we know).

If you look at Garrus' romance in ME2, it's based on these things: trust & friendship.

If you like at why Garrus likes Shepard in general, it's partly because Shepard gets things done and because Shepard takes Garrus seriously. Shepard is willing to bend the rules sometimes, and Shepard is willing to hear Garrus out. The latter I could immediately say that Thane would do - Thane would listen to any reasonable person talking to him in general. The former? That's more difficult because Thane is trying to atone and swore off his assassinations.

They would bond over shooting baddies. That's basically the crux of it all, I would think. In this way they would mutually respect each other. They need to trust each other and think they've got each other's backs. You could add in some rivalry for sexual tension.

What I would also do is have Thane be the mentor.

@Sialater
I realize that it may seem out of character, but it's just one of those things that sort of bites you and won't let go till you write it out. As such, I'm trying to make this as plausible as possible, hence why I'm researching and taking notes on these two.
 
@Collider: Yes, I understand your viewpoint, but I'm not just looking at it from a strictly 'physical attraction.'

 Ok, then. I was off to a good start. I wasn't planning for this pairing to be just SEX SEX SEX, because that's not what I'm about and that's not what I'd like to explore with this. Now, I understand the majority of what your trying to say, but I'm a little lost on what you mean by 'adding in some rivalry for sexual tension.' 

Thank your for the input, Collider.  

Modifié par Skyline_Stanza, 03 novembre 2010 - 07:27 .

[Sialater]

Belive me, I know all about plot bunnies.  The Rescue's one.  But where I could justify Zevran and Alistair sharing the same girl... I just can't seem to get my concept of Garrus to remotely like men of any species. 

[Giggles_Manically]

Garrus dosent like men, because they lack funny bumps, and their wastes are not very supportive.



Damn that line made me laugh.

[Sialater]

I understand, Skyline, what you're trying to show... I just can't help.

[Skyline_Stanza]

Sialater wrote...

I understand, Skyline, what you're trying to show... I just can't help.

Ah, no problem then. No problem at all. Collider's advice helped somewhat, and I'm sure I'll brain-storm up something. Ha, plot bunnies. You're wonderful for my writing, (as you pose such an interesting challenge) but sometimes...you're reaaalllly odd.

[Collider]

@Collider: Yes, I understand your viewpoint, but I'm not just looking at it from a strictly 'physical attraction.'

Lol, most of my post had nothing to do with physical attraction. Hence the repeated emphasis on trust, mutual respect, and agreeing on philosophical terms. But yea, good luck.

[Skyline_Stanza]

Collider wrote...

@Collider: Yes, I understand your viewpoint, but I'm not just looking at it from a strictly 'physical attraction.'

Lol, most of my post had nothing to do with physical attraction. Hence the repeated emphasis on trust, mutual respect, and agreeing on philosophical terms. But yea, good luck.

I think what I was trying to say was directed at your comment "Garrus isn't into males (that we're aware of)", but then I sort of see the redundency of my statement with the rest of your advice. I see what you were saying. For all it's worth, it helped me!

Modifié par Skyline_Stanza, 03 novembre 2010 - 08:01 .

[Tasha vas Nar Rayya]

Thane - you just try to take Garrus off me! *red eyes start to burn*



But it is an interesting fanfic. Aliens may have different perspectives on homosexuality than humans do, so you may have to bear that in mind. But they certainly are similar characters, so I see where you are coming from. When femshep romances Thane, she suggests that she should go and talk to the rest of the crew apart from her and that that will distract him from his Keprel's syndrome (Dr. Chakwas also recommends it.) So that might be a good place to start.Thane seems like quite a shy person (apart from around those he trusts.) Garrus does potentially romance a human, with a completely different dextro-something-or other. So that shows he is open minded. Same with Thane. Good luck with it!

[CalJones]

Garrus slash? Do not want!

I see a mutual respect between the two, possibly growing into friendship - maybe a friendly rivalry developed during sniping. I don't mind titillating man on man stuff but I just can't see these two together in that way. At all.

[Evelinessa]

Tasha vas Nar Rayya wrote...

Thanks for the link Evelinessa! I tried it yesterday, hasn't worked yet, but I will have another shot when I haven't got 5 more mins on an internet cafe before going back to work! Do you happen to know if there is one with all the banners on please?
So that is why I have this crazy hyperlink at my signature!

I see you got it to work but what do you mean about "one with all the banners on"? Do you mean a banner with every Garrus one? Or one that supports different characters? Or one of those that flash and show different banners (I don't know how to do those)?

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

From an interview that IGN did with Casey Hudson.  I'm inclined to believe the devs over the forumites on this one   If Hudson and the ME team were like, say, Peter Molyneaux, I might not give them the benefit of the doubt, but generally they're pretty good on delivering on what they say.

Ok, that's good then. I'm just used to getting let down on games. I really like Bioware games. I've only played Dragon Age:Origins and Mass Effect 1 and 2 so far though but I never played other games that hook me like those. And Bioware makes such good characters especially Garrus and I'll just have a hard time playing ME3 if he's not on my team. So I'll try to be more optimistic I just want to be prepared for a worst case scenerio so even if the game sucks(which I'm sure it won't) I'll like it. No matter what though I'm getting really excited(if that's the right word). I want to hear news of another bridging DLC or a trailer for ME3(but they can take as long as they want). I don't know how long it took before the first trailer came out for ME2.

So I guess until we hear news otherwise I'll try to believe that we're going to see alot of consequences in ME3. I'm happy that Bioware usually listens to their fans. I don't think alot of developers do that as much.

[IndelibleJester]

Evelinessa wrote...

Ok, that's good then. I'm just used to getting let down on games. I really like Bioware games. I've only played Dragon Age:Origins and Mass Effect 1 and 2 so far though but I never played other games that hook me like those. And Bioware makes such good characters especially Garrus and I'll just have a hard time playing ME3 if he's not on my team. So I'll try to be more optimistic I just want to be prepared for a worst case scenerio so even if the game sucks(which I'm sure it won't) I'll like it. No matter what though I'm getting really excited(if that's the right word). I want to hear news of another bridging DLC or a trailer for ME3(but they can take as long as they want). I don't know how long it took before the first trailer came out for ME2.

So I guess until we hear news otherwise I'll try to believe that we're going to see alot of consequences in ME3. I'm happy that Bioware usually listens to their fans. I don't think alot of developers do that as much.

I should inform you that all characters in the Baldur's Gate series were all carried over besides a few of the lesser liked and least used. The ones that were not were not there for very good reasons (they canonly were murdered or died during the escape of the first game final battle). In another case, you run into two of them in BGII - and they are subsequently murdered before you can recruit them.


Either way, considering the fact that the most popular characters were carried over into BG2 and BG3 (TOB), i seriously doubt they're going to cut out the most popular ones in Mass Effect. One of those characters carried over is directly relatable to Garrus and Tali's core development as characters themselves, and continues to be seen in Mass Effect constantly (the space hamster, "Go for the optics!", etc.)

[Evelinessa]

IndelibleJester wrote...

I should inform you that all characters in the Baldur's Gate series were all carried over besides a few of the lesser liked and least used. The ones that were not were not there for very good reasons (they canonly were murdered or died during the escape of the first game final battle). In another case, you run into two of them in BGII - and they are subsequently murdered before you can recruit them.


Either way, considering the fact that the most popular characters were carried over into BG2 and BG3 (TOB), i seriously doubt they're going to cut out the most popular ones in Mass Effect. One of those characters carried over is directly relatable to Garrus and Tali's core development as characters themselves, and continues to be seen in Mass Effect constantly (the space hamster, "Go for the optics!", etc.)

Garrus can die though. But you mean that those characters died during the story? That it wasn't optional?

Then it's a good thing that Garrus is popular then. I noticed something based on my polls and a couple other polls that had alot of votes. Tali and Garrus are the most popular characters with Tali in the lead by different amounts depending on the poll. But in general Garrus has a very large amount of votes compared to anyone other then Tali. I notice that Garrus wins out on this poll by Collider showing he is one of the more well liked male characters. From my poll that I made the other day it shows that Garrus is the second most popular FemShep LI behind Kaidan but this one from Collider shows different that Garrus is more popular.  Also this poll by enormousmoonboots shows that men playing as FemShep prefer to romance Garrus then the other male LIs. And this poll from guru7892 shows that while Tali is the most popular she is also more hated then Garrus. It shows that Garrus is one of the more least hated characters so alot of people like him and very few hate him. So in a way he is more popular.

So based on what you said I hope Garrus comes back as a squadmate/LI in ME3. I'll be very happy when/if they announce Garrus coming back in ME3.

But I'm starting to wonder about some characters. Jacob is one of the least liked characters but he is a possible LI. They can't have some LIs return like Garrus and Tali, but not have other LIs like Jacob. So I wonder what they'll do.

Sorry if anyone is mad at me for posting their poll. I'll take it down if you want me too.

Modifié par Evelinessa, 04 novembre 2010 - 08:13 .

[Alexine]

I do hope that Garrus does come back into ME3, but popularity won't determined that Garrus will return. Wrex was probably one of the most popular characters from ME1, and when ME2 was announced, many were rooting that Wrex will be back as a squaddie. However, Wrex ended up on Tuchanka in the end for ME2.

I'm not saying that it would apply for Garrus, but we have no clue whatsoever what's going to happen in ME3. If there is a logically reason why Garrus can't join us as a squad member, I can live with that (if the bridging ME2 DLC would explain why, or we get Garrus DLC in ME3). I think Garrus would definitely return to ME3 (if you didn't kill him off during the suicide mission) since he is a potential romance option, along with the fact that ME3 is the last of the Shepard arc, (without need to import anything for future games) and closure is what's needed for the final arc for ME trilogy.

[IndelibleJester]

Evelinessa wrote...

IndelibleJester wrote...

I should inform you that all characters in the Baldur's Gate series were all carried over besides a few of the lesser liked and least used. The ones that were not were not there for very good reasons (they canonly were murdered or died during the escape of the first game final battle). In another case, you run into two of them in BGII - and they are subsequently murdered before you can recruit them.


Either way, considering the fact that the most popular characters were carried over into BG2 and BG3 (TOB), i seriously doubt they're going to cut out the most popular ones in Mass Effect. One of those characters carried over is directly relatable to Garrus and Tali's core development as characters themselves, and continues to be seen in Mass Effect constantly (the space hamster, "Go for the optics!", etc.)

Garrus can die though. But you mean that those characters died during the story? That it wasn't optional?

They did not exactly have "game import" ability for seperate titles. This is why BG3 (TOB) was treated as an expansion pack rather than a seperate game, because there was no real way to import the game unless it was in within the same game. The second game starts out assuming about the characters you had in your party. There are some mods to correct this and allow you to reignite old romances (canonly, Xan died during the escape in BG1, but someone remade him for the girls who romanced him).

Evelinessa wrote...
Then it's a good thing that Garrus is popular then. I noticed something based on my polls and a couple other polls that had alot of votes. Tali and Garrus are the most popular characters with Tali in the lead by different amounts depending on the poll. But in general Garrus has a very large amount of votes compared to anyone other then Tali. I notice that Garrus wins out on this poll by Collider showing he is one of the more well liked male characters. From my poll that I made the other day it shows that Garrus is the second most popular FemShep LI behind Kaidan but this one from Collider shows different that Garrus is more popular.  Also this poll by enormousmoonboots shows that men playing as FemShep prefer to romance Garrus then the other male LIs. And this poll from guru7892 shows that while Tali is the most popular she is also more hated then Garrus. It shows that Garrus is one of the more least hated characters so alot of people like him and very few hate him. So in a way he is more popular.

So based on what you said I hope Garrus comes back as a squadmate/LI in ME3. I'll be very happy when/if they announce Garrus coming back in ME3.

But I'm starting to wonder about some characters. Jacob is one of the least liked characters but he is a possible LI. They can't have some LIs return like Garrus and Tali, but not have other LIs like Jacob. So I wonder what they'll do.

Sorry if anyone is mad at me for posting their poll. I'll take it down if you want me too.

If I had to make guesses, Jack, Jacob, and Samara are least likely to return as squaddies. Mordin might be given a role on the ship, not necessarily in the squad (which would be unfortunate, his incinerate is invaluable to me.) However, Wrex, Liara, Kaidan and Ashley are not in the second game because because they are protecting the original romances, and because Wrex was a favorite. These characters cannot die on the suicide mission, and thus will be in ME3, and will have major roles most likely. I realize that Wrex can die on Virmire... however, bioware is now aware that pretty much no one let him die. Opposed to that, sometimes people specifically allow Jack to die. I have even seen people calculate how to directly take out Samara.

I myself hope they are able to expand on the Samara romance in ME3, but it is not likely imo.


If I myself had to chose one character to be cut, I would chose Jacob, fyi. I actually really like Jack. When I was playing a guy she hooked me over Tali, who I intended to romance. Who would you all chose?

Modifié par IndelibleJester, 04 novembre 2010 - 11:24 .

[Sialater]

None of them. Not even Jacob. Hell, I even have a Jacob romance save. I have far more Garrus and Kaidan saves, but I have one for Jacob.

[SurelyForth]

If I'm being honest, I could live without Grunt. I hate his recruiting mission, I hate his loyalty mission (you'd think I was a Sole Survivor the way I loathe thresher maws), and even though I find him well-written, I really don't care that much about him. I never take him with me anywhere if I don't have to, that's for certain.



And Liara is the only companion who is guaranteed to survive to the end of ME2. So either we're going to get all new companions, no companions, or BW is going to *have* to include old ones who can die. Obviously, I'm hoping for old ones (especially Garrus) but I have to admit, I love almost all of the ME companions so having any of them back (except for Grunt. And maybe Jacob) would be awesome.

[ciaweth]

BioWare has previously and recently stated that all the LIs are of equal importance. I can't find the original spot where Jesse Houston said it, but I did read his original post at the time. Here's what it said.



I'm not sure why, but this thread periodically forgets that and imagines that somehow BioWare is going to pronounce Garrus DOA in ME3. The only way they could do that is if they pixelmurdered ALL the LIs. Not gonna happen.

[Evelinessa]

Alexine wrote...

I do hope that Garrus does come back into ME3, but popularity won't determined that Garrus will return. Wrex was probably one of the most popular characters from ME1, and when ME2 was announced, many were rooting that Wrex will be back as a squaddie. However, Wrex ended up on Tuchanka in the end for ME2.

I'm not saying that it would apply for Garrus, but we have no clue whatsoever what's going to happen in ME3. If there is a logically reason why Garrus can't join us as a squad member, I can live with that (if the bridging ME2 DLC would explain why, or we get Garrus DLC in ME3). I think Garrus would definitely return to ME3 (if you didn't kill him off during the suicide mission) since he is a potential romance option, along with the fact that ME3 is the last of the Shepard arc, (without need to import anything for future games) and closure is what's needed for the final arc for ME trilogy.

What you're saying worrys me...

Was Garrus and Tali more popular then Wrex back then? At least Garrus has an advantage from being a squadmate in both games. I'm sure Bioware knows that people really like these two and want them back but.... I don't know if they will.

They would have to come up with a really good reason for Garrus not to be there since he is one of the only if not the only squadmate that has nowhere else to go.

Another thing that got me worried is I read on another thread that Retribution(I own the book but haven't read it yet don't post any spoilers.) and the new comic take place one year after ME2. So that means If ME3 takes place a long time after ME2 It's very possible that we could lose all our squad within that time.

IndelibleJester wrote...

They did not exactly have "game import" ability for seperate titles. This is why BG3 (TOB) was treated as an expansion pack rather than a seperate game, because there was no real way to import the game unless it was in within the same game. The second game starts out assuming about the characters you had in your party. There are some mods to correct this and allow you to reignite old romances (canonly, Xan died during the escape in BG1, but someone remade him for the girls who romanced him).

Oh, I see. And Bioware had romances in their games even back then?

IndelibleJester wrote...

If I had to make guesses, Jack, Jacob, and Samara are least likely to return as squaddies. Mordin might be given a role on the ship, not necessarily in the squad (which would be unfortunate, his incinerate is invaluable to me.) However, Wrex, Liara, Kaidan and Ashley are not in the second game because because they are protecting the original romances, and because Wrex was a favorite. These characters cannot die on the suicide mission, and thus will be in ME3, and will have major roles most likely. I realize that Wrex can die on Virmire... however, bioware is now aware that pretty much no one let him die. Opposed to that, sometimes people specifically allow Jack to die. I have even seen people calculate how to directly take out Samara.

I myself hope they are able to expand on the Samara romance in ME3, but it is not likely imo.


If I myself had to chose one character to be cut, I would chose Jacob, fyi. I actually really like Jack. When I was playing a guy she hooked me over Tali, who I intended to romance. Who would you all chose?

Yeah I was thinking that Mordin is going to stay on the ship instead of being a squadmate. I think Wrex is going to stay on Tuchanka though. He will probably help Shepard unite the Krogan or something. And I don't think people were complaining as much about Wrex's cameo as they were for Kaidan/Ashley. But I think that might be just how it was handled.  I don't think Liara will be in the squad now that she's the Shadow Broker. I can see Kaidan/Ashley being on the squad though.

Do you know if Bioware has a way of finding out what characters players usually killed off in the suicide mission? I'm pretty sure alot of people kept Garrus alive.

Also does anyone know if Bioware was working on ME3 while they were working on ME2? I hope they have a plan about making characters into squadmates when they could be dead. But since this is the last game in the trilogy and they don't have to worry about continuing it I hope most of the squadmates can come back.. or at least Garrus. My ideal squad for ME3 is everyone I have left alive from ME1 and ME2 and maybe two new ones. But I rather have old people then new people. I know my ideal squad won't happen though.

I don't know who I would cut. I like all the characters to a certain extent. In one of my polls I've shown my dislike for Tali but I don't think she is that bad. It's just the extreme parts of her fanbase annoy me and I think she is overated but I wouldn't neccesarily cut her from it. There is no one I dislike enough that I wouldn't want to see them in ME3. I want at least all the LIs to return as squadmates because I probably will end up romancing them at some point but the only character I need is Garrus. I will probably have to finish the game multiple times and do all the romances before I can give a definite answer. I noticed I'm appreciating Kaidan, Tali, and Liara alot more on this playthrough I'm doing of ME1. It's my second playthrough. I'll keep thinking about my answer though.

I also decided that when I finish all the romances at least once I'm going to post here and tell you guys what I think of them. This will probably take me a few months because so far I only have one finished playthrough of both games and I'm working on my second. I have romanced Kaidan then cheated on him with Garrus and this playthrough I'm romancing Liara and plan to stay faithful. It's going to be really hard once I get to the "reach and flexibility" conversation.

SurelyForth wrote...

If I'm being honest, I could live without Grunt. I hate his recruiting mission, I hate his loyalty mission (you'd think I was a Sole Survivor the way I loathe thresher maws), and even though I find him well-written, I really don't care that much about him. I never take him with me anywhere if I don't have to, that's for certain.

I know. I think he's the only character that I hate both their recruiting and loyalty missions. Actually I don't like Legion's either but I like Legion alot more then Grunt.

Garrus-I loved his recruiting and loyalty mission. I really liked going undercover for his recruitment.
Mordin-I liked his recruiting but not his loyalty...I guess I just don't like Tuchanka.
Jack- I liked both.
Miranda- I thought her loyalty mission was alright.
Jacob- I thought his loyalty mission was pretty good. I didn't like his father at all but I thought the area looked nice.
Samara- I didn't like her recruitment mission but I really liked her loyalty mission.
Tali- I didn't like her recruiting mission and I thought her loyalty mission was alright but only the parts where we were at the trial. I guess I just don't like fighting Geth.
Thane- His recruitment mission was alright and I really liked his loyalty mission. I failed it the first time and had to restart.
Zaeed- I didn't like his loyalty mission.
Kasumi- I loved her loyalty mission. I like it when games make you go undercover...as long as they arn't like those parts in Beyond Good and Evil and Ocarina of Time where you get caught and you get a gameover or have to start at the beginning. Kasumi's loyalty mission did it just right. I couldn't stand moving in that dress though. The animation just didn't look right for it.

From what you can see from my answers is that I prefer unique quests over combat heavy ones.

[Evelinessa]

ciaweth wrote...

BioWare has previously and recently stated that all the LIs are of equal importance. I can't find the original spot where Jesse Houston said it, but I did read his original post at the time. Here's what it said.

I'm not sure why, but this thread periodically forgets that and imagines that somehow BioWare is going to pronounce Garrus DOA in ME3. The only way they could do that is if they pixelmurdered ALL the LIs. Not gonna happen.

I said earlier that they have to treat all LIs equally so I didn't forget it. Or I said it in another thread. I think it was this one though.


Edit:
Maybe Bioware is going to have all LIs be squadmates......or none of them.

Modifié par Evelinessa, 04 novembre 2010 - 03:46 .

[IndelibleJester]

Evelinessa wrote...

Oh, I see. And Bioware had romances in their games even back then?

They did. I'm not completely sure how many were in BG, but in BG2 there were three for males and one for females. There were also a few times you could sleep with an NPC kind of like Kelly Chambers. These romances were all carried over into TOB. You even had a child with one of the male romance girls (the character that is inspiration of our Tali, they even have similar lines let alone similar personality).

Evelinessa wrote...

Do you know if Bioware has a way of finding out what characters players usually killed off in the suicide mission? I'm pretty sure alot of people kept Garrus alive.

I'm pretty sure EA implimented a way for Bioware to see which characters got killed. Garrus is pretty easy to accidently kill at some points if he is not loyal. Even if he is loyal, I've seen him accidently get killed from another character not being loyal/a bad biotic specialist choice.

Evelinessa wrote...

Also does anyone know if Bioware was working on ME3 while they were working on ME2?

I'm pretty sure Bioware was well aware this would be a trilogy when they working on Mass Effect 1, and thus had a plan for all three games. They have stated before that they want the third game to go wildly in vastly different directions depending on tons of different decisions you've made in ME1 and ME2, something they could not yet do in ME2, making it a very unique play through for each individual person. I am sure they have put all their resources into making sure this is a good end for the game.