81 réponses à ce sujet

[Bahlgan]

 Specifically for two handed warriors, I imagine anyway. Personally, it is my second highest stat, with Constitution being the third highest stat in my attributes bar. Being a two handed warrior, I hope not to tell you that I placed strength as my most powerful feature, but some (from the two handed stinks thread) believe that I place dexterity as the number one attribute. For that I apologize if I made myself as an ignorant no-good bad person 

What do you all think about the willpower attribute? Consider these questions:

1. Could all classes make great use of willpower?
2. Wouldn't it be cool if willpower had another function, like say resistance to mental control?
3. Should willpower be a form of coercion for all classes, and not just mages? Perhaps against fade spirits?

[nestorprado]

Never pushed willpower. Only go with the points from the fade and equipment. If you choose the right equipment you'll have enough Stamina for most fights (Warden commander boots +50STA, Spellward +5Wil, Chasind Great Maul +75STA...).

And yes, Willpower does increase mental resistance.

[Elhanan]

My 2H was based on 2:1 placed on STR: Will; worked well for me. I even stopped placing pts on Will when I reached ca.30, and placed some on DEX for ranged combat.

But no pts other than Fade and item bonuses went into CON; better choices elsewhere.

[Bahlgan]

Hmm, my two hander has over a couple hundred points of stamina right now, (cannot figure out the exact number) and this is counting the Warden Commander's set. I believe I have 33 points into Willpower plus 4 from bonuses. What do you think? (I am not preparing for Nightmare so I am not planning on going pro, I play for RP purposes).

Modifié par Bahlgan, 28 juin 2010 - 11:21 .

[beancounter501]

Not a fan of Willpower. Deathblow is better for every single Warrior build in the game. Solves any and all stamina issues. Ten points of Will gives you 50 stamina - which you can easily get back from Deathblow for each guy you kill.

[soteria]

1. Not from level-ups, no. From gear, sure. It's much easier to get stamina from gear than any other stat except con.

2. It does provide mental resistance, but yes, it would be cool if it did something better.

3. Eh?

[yasuraka.hakkyou]

FYI: I play on hard, and while I do powergame to an extent, I also RP a bit.



1. to an extent. rogues to 15 or 20, warriors to 20, and mages +2 magic +1 will every level for me.

2. yes. and to add on to soteria's post, either have more effects be mental resistance checks or just have it do something else / a greater effect.

3. eh, not so much. all that says to me is that "so and so" is a stubborn person (or something similar). Stubborn-ness doesn't exactly work like coercion in DA methinks.

[Nooneyouknow13]

I like willpower on Templars and Spirit warriors. Other than that, it's pretty easy to pass on. Well, I use it on mages too, while suboptimal for a lot of builds, I just don't care for potion chugging.

[Bahlgan]

My apologies to you all. I assumed that you all knew my two hander also happens to be a Templar AND Spirit Warrior (Champion being third spec). You know what happens when you assume eh? Lol



I knew Willpower also (I forgot to mention before) augments your powers with both classes, improving effects and damage done with spec skills; I just don't know to what end.



I personally would like to say that Willpower is more important than all of you are giving credit for in terms of your general warrior, but perhaps maybe the majority stands right this time. Two handed warriors CAN run out of stamina really quickly, particularly if they spam skills, so I thought in general to raise the stamina pool. I am glad to hear my general notion is correct, but it seems I may have placed a few too many points into Willpower,



PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE keep in mind I play casual, I am by no means intentionally a hardcore player, but I DO RP (I choose who dies by whose hand; not as difficult but much more annoying). With this in mind, opinions vary greatly.



Anyway, I appreciate the opinions and support given about my viewpoint on Willpower. Anyway, keep up the flow, as long as whatever criticism comes out is at least somewhat constructive.

[Bahlgan]

Awwww no one has got anything else to add?

[Yrkoon]

Bahlgan wrote...

Awwww no one has got anything else to add?

Meh, there's  not much more to be said.    Most people already  understand  what willpower  does for  warriors, so repeatedly restating  what we already know is  a waste of time.     But for two handers, I just don't see the point.  When the best 2-handed weapons  in the game happen to bestow massive stamina boosts (+75  stamina  AND .5 stamina regeneration for Chasind Great Maul... are you kidding me?) and when  the best armor in the game bestows both willpower bonusses  and stamina regneration, and when  the Deathblow passive gives you back huge chunks of stamina with every kill,  One begins to  question the wisdom of sacrificing your warriors' Damage dealing ability  (strength) in order to raise your willpower even further.
 

Modifié par Yrkoon, 01 juillet 2010 - 03:44 .

[Elhanan]

Yrkoon wrote...

Bahlgan wrote...

Awwww no one has got anything else to add?

Meh, there's  not much more to be said.    Most people already  understand  what willpower  does for  warriors, so repeatedly restating  what we already know is  a waste of time.     But for two handers, I just don't see the point.  When the best 2-handed weapons  in the game happen to bestow massive stamina boosts (+75  stamina  AND .5 stamina regeneration for Chasind Great Maul... are you kidding me?) and when  the best armor in the game bestows both willpower bonusses  and stamina regneration, and when  the Deathblow passive gives you back huge chunks of stamina with every kill,  One begins to  question the wisdom of sacrificing your warriors' Damage dealing ability  (strength) in order to raise your willpower even further.
 

For me, it is based a little playing all those years on RPG's when items are confiscated, stolen, or ruined. I prefer to have my abilities within me; not on me.

And I purchased the maul, but never used it; plan to wait until Awakenings.

Modifié par Elhanan, 01 juillet 2010 - 06:16 .

[Bahlgan]

Yrkoon wrote...

Bahlgan wrote...

Awwww no one has got anything else to add?

Meh, there's  not much more to be said.    Most people already  understand  what willpower  does for  warriors, so repeatedly restating  what we already know is  a waste of time.     But for two handers, I just don't see the point.  When the best 2-handed weapons  in the game happen to bestow massive stamina boosts (+75  stamina  AND .5 stamina regeneration for Chasind Great Maul... are you kidding me?) and when  the best armor in the game bestows both willpower bonusses  and stamina regneration, and when  the Deathblow passive gives you back huge chunks of stamina with every kill,  One begins to  question the wisdom of sacrificing your warriors' Damage dealing ability  (strength) in order to raise your willpower even further.
 

You obviously missed the part about the Spirit Warriors and the Templars. Otherwise, I indeed wouldn't have put so many points into willpower. 

Also, 0.5 is a laughable amount of stamina regen, if it were 2, on the other hand, I might be interested 

Modifié par Bahlgan, 01 juillet 2010 - 06:33 .

[beancounter501]

Willpower is not a big boost to either Templar or Spirit Warrior. Unless, you do not have the stamina to run the sustains.  For instance you have to spend a ton a points in Willpower to make Holy Smite do any real damage. Why gimp your melee damage to get a few extra points of dmg out of attacks that have big cooldowns?

Look, it is your game play as you want. But willpower does not equal Awesome. Willpower is by far the weakest stat in the game. Especially if you are playing a warrior.  Willpower does not boost either your damage or your attack rating.  That is what matters to a warrior. 

Modifié par beancounter501, 01 juillet 2010 - 07:06 .

[soteria]

^^ I'd "QFT" but I'm too lazy.

Bahlgan, even if I agreed that 0.5 stamina regen was laughable (and I don't, at all), it still comes on an item with the equivalent of five whole levels' investment in willpower on it.  If you're paying attention, that's almost 1/4 of the game.

Modifié par soteria, 01 juillet 2010 - 07:16 .

[Elhanan]

For my 2H, the invested Willpower allowed me to run Indomitable and Rally modes full time with Berserker on the side, and have full use of my 2H talents for each 'round' of melee with Starfang. Since I lose it for Awakenings, I have the maul until I gain a new blade, as I generally dislike the maul appearance; both in combat and while bouncing off my lower armor pieces while running.

Now I do so with the full knowledge that I cannot reach the final dmg numbers seen in STR only builds, but I am fine with that as I compete only with my own designs. But where my ego does take a hit is in the knowledge that my Rogue archers have much higher dmg scores (ie; 500+).

Modifié par Elhanan, 01 juillet 2010 - 08:49 .

[Yrkoon]

beancounter501 wrote...
 Willpower is by far the weakest stat in the game. Especially if you are playing a warrior. 

You know, I was tempted to make an absolute statement like this but  I feared the 'backlash"  so I refrained.

It's true though.  It IS the  most useless stat for a warrior.    More   useless than Constitution, in fact.  The other day I was running my character through Awakening and noticed the most amazing thing.  Once your Physical resistance    reaches about 120 or so  (easily done in Awakening  with  some constitution) , you will no longer get knocked down, stunned, pinned or  pulled in melee.  You will, literally, resist  every melee physical effect .     For a two hander,  that means you don't need Indomitable anymore.  So chalk one up to Con. 

Bahlgan wrote...

You obviously missed the part about the Spirit Warriors and the Templars. Otherwise, I indeed wouldn't have put so many points into willpower. 

No, I didn't miss it.  I ignored it.     And you wasted those points.


What's a Spirit warrior need Willpower for?  So his Fade Burst talent does more damage?   Big deal.  My warriors  will just use Massacre instead.  It does about  10  times more damage. 

Ditto with Templars.     Are you actually going to argue that you should subtract, say,  20  points of strength and put those points into Willpower instead,  just so  your 1-time-per-battle Holy Smite does 40 points of damage to surrounding mobs  instead of 20?  Really?    Alright.  To each his own.    Me, I'll just  put those points in strength then let my 2h-sweep nail those mobs for about 90 points of damage.  Then I'll do it again 20 seconds later.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 01 juillet 2010 - 09:30 .

[Arttis]

Awakenings you need to weaken yourself for the sake of a average difficulty playthrough.

[Elhanan]

Yes; will have to test my high Magic/Cunning 2H to see if Willpower was such a poor choice....

Modifié par Elhanan, 01 juillet 2010 - 11:20 .

[Kalcalan]

Not a big fan of either Constitution or Willpower. To be honest I prefer Constitution but I'd rather focus on attributes that make the build work, mainly Strength for a Warrior (with some Dexterity for Sword and Shield, Archer and Dual Wielding types). Death Blow makes it easier to deal with Stamina.



The same goes for a Rogue. Feast of the Fallen works well with backstabs and replenishes stamina (Assassin only, but since I like backstabbers, Assassin is most certainly the best specialization).



As far as Mages are concerned more Magic may be a lot better since it increases Spellpower and since Lyrium potions give you back more mana with more Spellpower. So unless you don't want to use Lyrium potions, you don't really need that much Willpower.



It's my understanding that the Fade bonus is there just to allow the player to focus on the attributes that really matter and make the other attributes work no matter what.



Not to mention that Clarity in Awakening makes Willpower less interesting as a long term investment (unless you rationalize by saying that your character doesn't need more Strength, more Magic or more Cunning).



I'm not such a big fan of Constitution but it has the advantage of making characters more resilient (which is never a bad thing). Still I'd rather dish out a little more damage than being able to take a little more damage.

[Yrkoon]

Elhanan wrote...

Yes; will have to test my high Magic/Cunning 2H to see if Willpower was such a poor choice....

Your tests will confirm it..

Cunning is a lot more useful than willpower. Cunning helps your coersion skills. It also increases your armor penetration, making you do more damage with each swing. Can't say the same for Willpower now, can we. Cunning also increases your Mental resistance, just like Will does. There's no two-handed talent that can be used in place of cunning.

Magic makes all your poultices, salves, grenades and and coatings super-powered when you use them -- which again, directly contributes to the damage you can do. Also interesting to note, for you Stamina-centric people, . A high magic score makes the stamina pots in Awakening more effective.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 01 juillet 2010 - 12:28 .

[Elhanan]

I have only used a few grenades; sell them mostly. Never touched Coating posions at all. However, my next Rogue was going to give greandes more of a try, as they are plentiful.

Coersion on a Warrior does not seem to need help other than pacing it with Combat Training. The base 16 has been enough for both Mages and Warriors.

And I have no real desire to make my Poultices super-powered, as I do attempt to avoid needing them. This is where my choice to use some extra pts on DEX comes in to help, but that is for another thread....

[soteria]

Yes; will have to test my high Magic/Cunning 2H to see if Willpower was such a poor choice....

Willpower is the weakest stat in the game because every class in the game can and should completely ignore it. It's not needed for any talents and the 5 stamina you get per point is outclassed from the base levelup bonus of 10. Cunning and magic are at least useful to someone.

[Elhanan]

Let me see; go all Magic w/mages and all STR with 2H.

Not a bad design; simple enough, I reckon. But it does seem rather bland for my taste in play. Think I will continue on happily in my ignorance and use this ignored gem for both buildfs, with a pinch of DEX for seasoning.

[soteria]

There's nothing wrong with doing that if that's what you enjoy, but if we're having a discussion about how valuable willpower is compared to other stats.... well. To be honest, I don't build pure-magic mages or whatever myself, but if someone asks where to put their stats, I'm not going to advise them to do something I only do for flavor.