136 réponses à ce sujet

[ObserverStatus]

yummysoap wrote...

Xen's like TIM only about ten times more hilarious.

Also, Morrigan.

Oh dear, does Xen disaprove whenever you do something nice as well?

Modifié par bobobo878, 30 juin 2010 - 10:45 .

[didymos1120]

Shandepared wrote...
As we have no idea how things will play out in the future we can't say for certain whethe or not Xen would want or need Shepard's "help". I'm sure she could find a way to blackmail him if she wanted to.

Just don't pull that crap on an Earthborn Renegade Shep.  They don't respond well to blackmail attempts.

[lovgreno]

Shandepared wrote...

santaclausemoreau wrote...

Would it really be a good idea though to owe someone a favor when you really didn't need help? I'm not saying I wouldn't like her as an ally, I'm just saying it wouldn't make tons of sense on her part to accept an unnecessary partnership that would need something from her in return. Also, if she is truly egotistical, she will take pride in enslaving the Geth with no help from any non-Quarian

As we have no idea how things will play out in the future we can't say for certain whethe or not Xen would want or need Shepard's "help". I'm sure she could find a way to blackmail him if she wanted to.

Xen is probably very proud but to me it feels like she is even more practical. Even if she might not need humans and Shepard right now she might do that in the future. I'm sure she realises that it's much more efficent to make people want to work with you because they can benefit from it than manipulating and threaten people (like a certain illusive person does). Being brutaly honest is more Xens style.

She have good reasons to distrust humans and good reasons to dislike the Council. But I am sure she is mature enough to swallow her pride and work with people she doesn't like to further her own goals. She is a lot like the turian councilour in that way when you think about it. Those two would probably work well together and have a good time throwing snide commets at eachother.

[lovgreno]

Yes that is true. Speculating is fun but realy doesn't say anything about hhe game or it's characters.

[Zaisha_temp]

Shandepared wrote...

lovgreno wrote...

Yes that is true. Speculating is fun but realy doesn't say anything about hhe game or it's characters.

Well it doesn't say anything about Xen. Granted she has plenty of characterization considering how briefly she appears in the game. Her e-mail is a bit illuminating as well.

I'm just saying we shouldn't assume too much other than the sense that she'll probably be an antagonist in at least some capacity.

She has some very interesting and informative things to say if you bring Legion along for the mission, that's for sure.

She generally gives the impression that she thinks of the Geth as the best thing ever, apart from that little "not under my control" detail. 

[Dean_the_Young]

Pretty reasonable attitude for a Quarian to take, all things considered.

[Dark_Caduceus]

To be honest her plan probably has the potential to work, not because it's very realistic but because siding or not siding with her will give us one of those "big decisions" in ME3. Though, for what it's worth she seems kind of overly ambitious with this, not to mention she evidently has some ulterior motive, cool character, but I won't aid her, if given the choice.

[Dark_Caduceus]

I didn't reprogram the geth, and I don't think it will work because based on what we know any previous attempt to hack geth by a third party(meaning not the geth themselves) has been met with swift failure.

[Nightwriter]

Shandepared wrote...

I don't see any reason why her plan wouldn't work. She wanted to do what Legion wants you to do on his loyalty mission. If you think her plan will fail then I hope you didn't reprogram the geth.

This is wrong because:

1) Xen wants to mind control all geth, even peaceful ones, and the heretics were hostile and dangerous
2) It was not their fault they were hostile and they weren't supposed to be, they were brainwashed by Sovereign
3) My intentions were good and hers were bad
4) The true geth themselves participated in what happened to those heretics and acknowledged it was necessary

[Darth Caedus]

all i've got to say is that if Xen goes against Shepard then i'm taking her down.



Also, Claudia Black is an awesome voice actor.

[santaclausemoreau]

So far it seems like reaper tech is the only thing that can effectively control the geth (as in the case of the sovereign developed virus)... So can it be possible that Xen has found reaper tech to help her?

[TheSixthghoul]

Sorry Nightwriter, I have to agree with Shandepared. Good and Evil are an illusion and sense my Shepard is a moral nihilist, that doesn't even factor in.

[Nightwriter]

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

1) Xen wants to mind control all geth, even peaceful ones, and the heretics were hostile and dangerous...

She is still doing basically the same thing you did though.

Sure.

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

2) It was not their fault they were hostile and they weren't supposed to be, they were brainwashed by Sovereign

They were not brainwashed; they made a choice.

Their choice was influenced by Reaper sabotage.

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

3) My intentions were good and hers were bad

Good and bad are subjective.

Of course. Disagreement and argument come from me trying to say my good and bad are more right than your good and bad.

The intentional enslavement of an entire sentient race - bad.

The rewriting of the heretics, who are killing people - okay.

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

4) The true geth themselves participated in what happened to those heretics and acknowledged it was necessary

This means what, exactly?

Well it's a bit like if this specific group in a species had gone mad and was hurting people. The rest of the species comes to you and says we know they're hurting people and we'll show you where this group is because we understand something must be done about them. We can't decide whether to brainwash them or kill them all, but we'll support you whatever you decide to restore order.

Whereas Xen is saying, let's brainwash the entire race and make them all our slaves.

[Massadonious1]

I'm pretty sure having relaible foot soldiers and another sizeable fleet is a more noble intention for "brainwashing" them than turning them back in to the same manual labor footstools they were before they rebelled in the first place.



The Quarians wont even have a planet to have slaves on if we don't win the war.

[Massadonious1]

With the ultimate intention to turn them back into the way they were.



Besides, I clearly trust Legion more to, "keep them in line" so to speak, more than I trust ANY Quarian to establish similar ties, Xen or otherwise.



As I said earlier in the thread, they don't exactly have the best track record when it comes to controlling Geth.

[Nightwriter]

Shandepared wrote...

I'm glad we agree on something. You "brainwashed" the geth when you reprogramed them and Xen wants to "brainwash" them by reprograming them. 

Yes.

Of course I brainwashed them, durr.

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Their choice was influenced by Reaper sabotage.

No it was not. The nature of their code allowed them to come to a separate judgement. Their reasoning is perfectly logical. There's no flaw, no sabotage, no brainwashing involved. (at least until you force them to think the same was as the "true" geth)

I remember Legion telling me the Reapers introduced this virus into the heretics that made some base number come out .1111112 instead of . 11111111 or something, which resulted in a schism that would not have occurred otherwise.

Shandepared wrote...

The geth kill people too (yes, even the "true" geth) so what is the difference? You're "enslaving" the heretics when you force them to change their way of thinking. What Xen wants to do is no different. She'll force the geth to think in a way that causes them to obey the quarians without question.

Yes, the true geth do kill people, but only those who enter their territory. They are not hostile, they are isolationist.

I rewrote the heretics because they had become dangerous and were helping the Reapers. The true geth are not helping the Reapers - they oppose them. Xen wants to rewrite all the geth because she wants slaves.

I did not rewrite the geth for personal gain, like Xen wants to do, and I returned them to the race to which they belong. If you can't see the difference I'm thinking you're wearing moral sideblinders. Which of course you are, you doll you.

Shandepared wrote...

What you did is no different from what Xen did except instead of being under the command of the quarians the heretics are under the command of the "true" geth.

Which is better. They're going back to their own race.

Shandepared wrote...

Your position is a hypocritical one. If you oppose Admiral Xen on moral grounds then you must also oppose rewriting the geth for the same reason. If you want to protect people from heretics then just blow them up.

First off, I didn't say rewriting the geth isn't morally ambiguous. It's just that I'm willing to do morally ambiguous things if I think it's what's best for the galaxy.

What I am saying is that what Xen wants to do is WAY worse and DEFINITELY morally wrong.

I'm aware that I'm killing the geth no matter what I do. I'm either killing them or rewriting who they are, which is just another form of death. So I figure I'll take a gamble and try to make their deaths mean something by strengthening a possible ally for the defense of the galaxy, as well as hoping the rest of the geth learn something from this.

I am trying to restore balance, Xen is trying to upset it.

You realize there's no way we'll be able to have this argument if you don't see the geth as a sentient race deserving of life and I do. I think my way is better because it ends with the geth getting treated like an equal species and Xen's way doesn't. But of course that makes no difference to you, so you see no difference. Typical.