203 réponses à ce sujet

[Ecael]

slimgrin wrote...

Ecael wrote...

MarchWaltz wrote...

Why does it seem like if Ecael and Zulu were to fight, the former is the paragon and the latter the renegade?

Zulu is like the Gatatog Uvenk of the forum.

Then what does that make you?

Paragon FemShep?

[BellatrixLugosi]

Ecael wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

Oh, and I just noticed what the last bit of that complaint about the lack of puzzles said: "..and I’m guessing that Mass Effect 2 only has about half the dialogue as Mass Effect."  

Jesus Christ.

This is supposed to an example of a "good" review. 

More like a completely uninformed review.

Mass Effect 2 has nearly twice the amount of dialogue as Mass Effect 1. Anyone can extract all the sound files and figure this out for themselves.

Yup

[Zulu_DFA]

Ecael wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Yes. If the dev team weren't so fixed on the "fluent shooter gameplay", many recruitment, "loyalty" and main plot missions could have played out differently, leaving much less plotholes.

This is an excerpt from some Steven Carter's review of Mass Effect 2, which Smudboy linked up on the previous page:

"The missions in the game are almost exclusively combat-oriented. While in Mass Effect you had to talk to people and solve puzzles and make weighty decisions, in Mass Effect 2 you mostly just kill stuff, and sometimes the missions don’t feel like anything more than extended shooting galleries. In most cases, you enter a large room with lots of objects to take cover behind, you kill about ten guys, you scrounge around for bullets and resources, and then you move on to the next big room and repeat the process. There are some role-playing elements here and there, but BioWare abandoned puzzles completely, and I’m guessing that Mass Effect 2 only has about half the dialogue as Mass Effect. The emphasis is clearly on combat."

Did you just accuse BioWare of rigging reviews and then quote a review on a BioWare game?

1. I have not accused. It's a prerogative of the district attorney. I just stated the fact that everybody does this.

2. Not the reviews. The "scores" and "ratings". They are based on reviews, yes, but there is more to it.

3. I'm sure Mr. Carter's review didn't make into any rating, So it's sort of his humble opinion, just like yours here, or mine. I brought it up to illustrate that there is a third person that thinks the way me and Smuboy think. And Darth Drago, and Skullbonemaster, and others who come up to complain & whine in the "Disappointment with ME2" thread. And if you have for at least a shortes moment thought that we all may be one and the same person, think of it this way: We Are Legion!

4. Finally, I'm not saying that Casey Hudson comes at whoever publishes the "rating" and just asks "How much?" There is more subtle and complex methods, that allow to draw up quite precise figures in the business plan.
Therefore, when having a discussion with another person about something, express your own opinions, borrow from the opinions of others but don't refer to the commercial values. It is (a) bad taste, and ( like telling a friend who is asking for your advice: "Game A actually feels slightly more enjoyable than Game B, but game B is $10 cheaper, and has the same rating as Game A, therefore Game B is overall bettter."

Well, the plot, as I understand it, is a chain of events. Events must, you know, take place. Somewhere. If the universe, the background is not there, the events seem to have no ground to take place at all. Thus, eliminate the universe, and the plot goes down the sewers right behind it.

The universe is decided by the writers. It is not the other way around.
You're confusing plot elements with gameplay elements again.

*Sigh*... In an adventure game, plot is the gameplay. In an RPG, plot is an important part of the gameplay. Even shooters, that aren't supposed to care about the plot at all, since it's not a part of their gameplay, try to feature some sipmle, plain (and therefore coherent, plotholeless) story.

It's not me who is mixing elements. It's the BioWare crew who decided, that it won't hurt if gameplay elements, artistic elements, character design elemnts and all other elements interfere a little with the plot. And with the background behind the plot, aka universe. But it does hurt. It hurts me, Smudboy, that Carter guy. Some more, some less. But I assure you the "crew abduction" PLOTHOLE made my brain cringe on my very first playthrough immediately after it hit the fan, even before I knew there are going to be HUGE CONSEQENCES to my "Yes/Yes" NO-CHOICE CHOICE.

And now this guy pops up and post a thead: "Wussup w/dis here worked up guys about plot hols LOL!"

Well, that's what's up. We don't like plot holes. Simple as that.

And for the rest of those smart advisers who insist on "letting it go" and "getting a life" I have good advice too: buy a dog, and teach it.

[Ecael]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

No, just no.

Modifié par Ecael, 01 juillet 2010 - 03:13 .

[Zulu_DFA]

Ecael wrote...
Zulu is like the Gatatog Uvenk of the forum.

Ecael is still trying to get on my nerves. Knows I don't like krogans.

She does not know I'm open-minded. I liked Patriarch.

[NICKjnp]

I support Ecael... everyone start throwing down money! I put down $10 in favor of Ecael.

[Ecael]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Ecael wrote...
Zulu is like the Gatatog Uvenk of the forum.

Ecael is still trying to get on my nerves. Knows I don't like krogans.

She does not know I'm open-minded. I liked Patriarch.

You've already contradicted yourself several times in the last hour. What's the use in arguing when you're proving yourself wrong?

[BellatrixLugosi]

(facepalm)

Zulu you are just really delusional. 

Modifié par BellatrixLugosi, 01 juillet 2010 - 03:18 .

[Zulu_DFA]

didymos1120 wrote...
Where were all these alleged ME1 puzzles?  The Towers of Hanoi thingie on Noveria?  Ok, that's one.

Noveria was awesome. Particularly Peak 15. You could do that single mission alone by at least three different paths. One of them was avoiding a shooting gallery. Is there a way to avoid a shooting gallery in any mission of ME2?

[didymos1120]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

1. I have not accused. It's a prerogative of the district attorney. I just stated the fact that everybody does this.

That's the problem: it's not a fact.  You actually need to supply evidence that everybody does this.  Instead, you just spewed a bunch of quasi-conspiratorial double-talk about "business plans" and whatnot.

[NICKjnp]

Ecael wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Ecael wrote...

MarchWaltz wrote...

Why does it seem like if Ecael and Zulu were to fight, the former is the paragon and the latter the renegade?

Zulu is like the Gatatog Uvenk of the forum.

Then what does that make you?

Paragon FemShep?

We all know how that turned out... link

[Zulu_DFA]

Ecael wrote...

You've already contradicted yourself several times in the last hour.

Like?

[Ecael]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...
Where were all these alleged ME1 puzzles?  The Towers of Hanoi thingie on Noveria?  Ok, that's one.

Noveria was awesome. Particularly Peak 15. You could do that single mission alone by at least three different paths. One of them was avoiding a shooting gallery. Is there a way to avoid a shooting gallery in any mission of ME2?

You're forgetting the geth in the Noveria garage.

Citadel Presidium
Elevator near Conduit (Race Against Time: Final Battle)
Citadel Tower (Race Against Time: Final Battle)

Citadel Wards
Med Clinic (Garrus Recruit)
Wards Access (Tali Recruit)
Chora's Den (Citadel: Expose Saren)
Lower Markets (Citadel: Scan the Keepers, Citadel: Rita's Sister)

Noveria
Noveria, Synthetic Insights (Noveria: Lorik Qui'in)
Noveria Dock (Noveria: Smuggling)
Noveria Garage (Noveria: Leave Port Hanshan)

Feros
Feros Colony (Feros: The Thorian)
Feros Underground (All Feros side quests)

Practically every place in Mass Effect is a shooting gallery. What's your point?

[Ecael]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Ecael wrote...

You've already contradicted yourself several times in the last hour.

Like?

You just said you care about the plot, and then you mention shooting galleries.

You also said that BioWare nudges other companies to giving them good reviews, and then quote a review on a BioWare game from a person who didn't appear to play half of the game.

And then you say they spent less time and effort on the gameplay and used that time to spend less time on the plot, and then go ahead to combine the two anyway.

Modifié par Ecael, 01 juillet 2010 - 03:25 .

[pprrff]

wait, is this about plot holes or ME1 vs ME2?

[BellatrixLugosi]

[Ecael]

slimgrin wrote...

Ecael, you were leader of your high school debate team. Admit it.

People tell me I should have aimed for law school instead.

[NICKjnp]

slimgrin wrote...

NICKjnp wrote...

Ecael wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Ecael wrote...

MarchWaltz wrote...

Why does it seem like if Ecael and Zulu were to fight, the former is the paragon and the latter the renegade?

Zulu is like the Gatatog Uvenk of the forum.

Then what does that make you?

Paragon FemShep?

We all know how that turned out... link

So would that be considered an easter egg of sorts? Damn, if I'd only known. Now I wanna headbutt with femshep.  

I killed Harbinger the other day with it... it was great.

[BellatrixLugosi]

I just want to know whats the point of the complaining the way zulu does. Its not going to change the mind of us who don't ridiculously high standards for a GAME. And its certainly not going to change the course of the development if you can't point out how it is a bad game. You are nitpicking small elements of storyline and small game issues to say this is a paralyzing problem when pretty much a large portion of the gaming world disagree's with your BS

[lazuli]

Ecael wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

Oh, and I just noticed what the last bit of that complaint about the lack of puzzles said: "..and I’m guessing that Mass Effect 2 only has about half the dialogue as Mass Effect."  

Jesus Christ.

This is supposed to an example of a "good" review. 

More like a completely uninformed review.

Mass Effect 2 has nearly twice the amount of dialogue as Mass Effect 1. Anyone can extract all the sound files and figure this out for themselves.

Does this include the Codex voice-overs?

[Tesla17]

Where did this topic go so wrong?



Not that it's not obvious, I just thought I would like to indicate just how off-topic the damn topic is in its current state.

[Ecael]

slimgrin wrote...

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

I just want to know whats the point of the complaining the way zulu does. Its not going to change the mind of us who don't ridiculously high standards for a GAME. And its certainly not going to change the course of the development if you can't point out how it is a bad game. You are nitpicking small elements of storyline and small game issues to say this is a paralyzing problem when pretty much a large portion of the gaming world disagree's with your BS

Perhaps he is just analyzing and being critical. I'm sure the team working on ME3 is doing that very thing.

Because it's not like they play video games too, right?

...Not to mention the structure of the main plot has already been set, so regardless of what happens to the Reapers in Mass Effect 3, it was decided before people started complaining about Mass Effect 2.