136 réponses à ce sujet

[Chuvvy]

It's the only way you can play a human warrior/rogue.

[MadCat221]

My decision to execute Lohgain isn't out of vengeance from the HN's perspective, but because he's too risky to keep around. He, like his daughter, thinks they're the only ones who know how to handle things, and will sweep you out of the way if you get in their way. And Lohgain is not above murdering nobles either. Eamon poisoning, anyone? What about all the other nobles in the revolt he gets his hands on that you hear of through gossip?



Barring prior knowledge from existing outside the fourth wall, how do you know that he just won't go around and backstab you again? Whammo, you beat him in a duel and suddenly he's all peachy keen with you? Ain't buying it at all, considering all the atrocities he committed and abetted before that.

[AlexRD]

Would be nice if there was a templar origin.

[Gemini1179]

I just wanted a damn kiss from Anora, was that too much to ask? Even in Awakenings, she didn't even give her Consort a kiss good luck...

[Xandurpein]

Gemini1179 wrote...

I just wanted a damn kiss from Anora, was that too much to ask? Even in Awakenings, she didn't even give her Consort a kiss good luck...

The problem is that a HN can only marry Anora as a political deal, it's business arrangement. That doesn't mean an arranged marriage can't turn into a warm relationship if you're willing to try. The problem is that there is no content in which a consort to Anora can show if he is going to grab as much power as he can or cooperate and be friendly with Anora. This in turn means that any interaction between the PC and Anora must be shallow to cover both possibilities.

Besides, you only get to see Anora in a public situation anyway and Anora is probably a bit prickly about keeping things proper in public. Barring some DLC that let's a consort explore the relationship with Anora more personally I'm afraid you will be limitied to your imagination and fanfiction. (shameless promotion).

[nos_astra]

MadCat221 wrote...
Where is the city of Gwaren?  That's the teyrnir's seat (or at least close to it if it has a similar setup to the arling of Amaranthine with political and economic seats being distinct)  Highever is up north, a bit west of Amaranthine

dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Gwaren
dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Codex_Entry:_Gwaren
dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Ferelden

MadCat221 wrote...
If Gwaren is down south, Loghain would have been Eamon's Teyrn.

He can swear fealty to whomever he sees fit, I think. It's unlikely that he chose Gwaren.

Modifié par klarabella, 06 juillet 2010 - 07:28 .

[Daryn Mercio]

Cypher0020 wrote...

O__O

Wynne snaps to attention? To a HN? Damn I gotta try that now.

Is the family shield/sword good? I got a noble as far as Ostagar and quit....

only in a minor dialogue concerning how you become a grey warden if you tell her you are the last of the Couslands

[Time4Tiddy]

I really enjoyed playing through as HNM rogue, focusing on dual-wielding (the nice extra skill in combat training helps). I didn't find it to be contrary, as you can choose options in the beginning that imply you are a troublemaker anyway, and you don't actually have much in the way of rogue skills when you start (you are level 1 after all) so you can just assume you picked up the abilities as you went along, out of necessity. Perhaps you were training from a dual wielding warrior trainer intending to be a warrior, and you've always been a curious child so you used to pick locks on drawers and the closets and what not.

Human noble definitely gets very interesting once you get to Denerim and start interacting with all the different nobles. Dozens of unique dialogue options. You can also "romance" Anora if you choose the right options. No, you don't get a make out scene, but you can get her to talk about wanting a strong man at her side and being attracted to men with ambition (can't remember the exact lines). It was in the Arl's estate and I remember the conversation going in a direction where she said something along the lines of perhaps it wouldn't have to be a purely political match.

Also, the human noble origin was the only one (of the four I've done) where you can have sex, even to the point of waking up naked next to your hook-up of the night. Another reason I felt that it wasn't out of character to be a rogue. And the sex is equal opportunity, you can seduce the male or female no matter what gender your PC.

The only thing I DIDN'T like about HN is that when I got to Awakenings, my first reaction was to send Nat away and tell him I never wanted to see him again, not realizing that this meant I'd have to do a good chunk of the game with only three people in my party. They should really have had a fourth recruitable available right from the start for those of us that were making choices more in character but don't want to be gimped for the first 20% of the xpac.

Modifié par Time4Tiddy, 06 juillet 2010 - 08:15 .

[Time4Tiddy]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Considering that Loghain Mac Tir and Bryce Cousland were both Teyrns, and Eamon Guerrin was an Arl, I don't know how Eamon was more important. To Loghain, the Couslands and Eamon might be of equal importance, since Loghain himself would be out of that equation, however.

Loghain was of common birth, but raised to Teryn. 

Eamon was Cailan's uncle, and had been trusted by the former king with the raising of his bastard son.  He is of noble birth and believes strongly in the continuation of the true bloodline on the throne.  They also note in codex that Redcliffe is large and influential to the point that he is seen as nearly a Teyrn by most of Ferelden.  If anything he's a bigger threat to Loghain than the Couslands were, hence the Jowan/poisoning attempt.

[Xandurpein]

Time4Tiddy wrote...

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Considering that Loghain Mac Tir and Bryce Cousland were both Teyrns, and Eamon Guerrin was an Arl, I don't know how Eamon was more important. To Loghain, the Couslands and Eamon might be of equal importance, since Loghain himself would be out of that equation, however.

Loghain was of common birth, but raised to Teryn. 

Eamon was Cailan's uncle, and had been trusted by the former king with the raising of his bastard son.  He is of noble birth and believes strongly in the continuation of the true bloodline on the throne.  They also note in codex that Redcliffe is large and influential to the point that he is seen as nearly a Teyrn by most of Ferelden.  If anything he's a bigger threat to Loghain than the Couslands were, hence the Jowan/poisoning attempt.

Exactly. There is no real evidence that Bryce Cousland would have had strong feelings for either Alistair, Anora or Loghain as ruler. We are told that the Couslands supposedly are royalists, but it's only a matter of conjecture what that really means. There is also evidence to suggest that the story the Couslands tell about their own history isn't always the truth. My guess is that Bryce Cousland, if he had lived, would have tried to stay out of the civil war, seek a peaceful solution and in the end side with the victor.

Arl Eamon is the prime mover for putting Alistair on the throne and Eamon believes that if Alistair becomes king he will turn to him for support and knowledge. So Eamon stands very much to gain from putting Alistair on the throne, while if Loghain becomes regent or Anora is crowned his influence will shrink drastically. Eamon is fighting as much to preserve his family's influence as the Theirin blood line.

Modifié par Xandurpein, 06 juillet 2010 - 01:00 .

[MKDAWUSS]

Xandurpein wrote...

Time4Tiddy wrote...

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Considering that Loghain Mac Tir and Bryce Cousland were both Teyrns, and Eamon Guerrin was an Arl, I don't know how Eamon was more important. To Loghain, the Couslands and Eamon might be of equal importance, since Loghain himself would be out of that equation, however.

Loghain was of common birth, but raised to Teryn. 

Eamon was Cailan's uncle, and had been trusted by the former king with the raising of his bastard son.  He is of noble birth and believes strongly in the continuation of the true bloodline on the throne.  They also note in codex that Redcliffe is large and influential to the point that he is seen as nearly a Teyrn by most of Ferelden.  If anything he's a bigger threat to Loghain than the Couslands were, hence the Jowan/poisoning attempt.

Exactly. There is no real evidence that Bryce Cousland would have had strong feelings for either Alistair, Anora or Loghain as ruler. We are told that the Couslands supposedly are royalists, but it's only a matter of conjecture what that really means. There is also evidence to suggest that the story the Couslands tell about their own history isn't always the truth. My guess is that Bryce Cousland, if he had lived, would have tried to stay out of the civil war, seek a peaceful solution and in the end side with the victor.

Arl Eamon is the prime mover for putting Alistair on the throne and Eamon believes that if Alistair becomes king he will turn to him for support and knowledge. So Eamon stands very much to gain from putting Alistair on the throne, while if Loghain becomes regent or Anora is crowned his influence will shrink drastically. Eamon is fighting as much to preserve his family's influence as the Theirin blood line.

So why wipe out the Couslands as well? Just so Howe could get a few extra goodies alongside some revenge for some unnamed reason?

I will say that they're the unknown factor in the equation because there's little that we know of as to where their stance would be at the Landsmeet. There are those comments Bryce makes at Howe when Howe remarks about Cailan, Aldous mentions that the Couslands are "ardent royalists," but what we don't know is the Cousland-Loghain relationship and the Cousland-Eamon relationship. Neither Loghain or Eamon really talk about that, despite recognizing the younger Cousland.

[pprrff]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Xandurpein wrote...

Time4Tiddy wrote...

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Considering that Loghain Mac Tir and Bryce Cousland were both Teyrns, and Eamon Guerrin was an Arl, I don't know how Eamon was more important. To Loghain, the Couslands and Eamon might be of equal importance, since Loghain himself would be out of that equation, however.

Loghain was of common birth, but raised to Teryn. 

Eamon was Cailan's uncle, and had been trusted by the former king with the raising of his bastard son.  He is of noble birth and believes strongly in the continuation of the true bloodline on the throne.  They also note in codex that Redcliffe is large and influential to the point that he is seen as nearly a Teyrn by most of Ferelden.  If anything he's a bigger threat to Loghain than the Couslands were, hence the Jowan/poisoning attempt.

Exactly. There is no real evidence that Bryce Cousland would have had strong feelings for either Alistair, Anora or Loghain as ruler. We are told that the Couslands supposedly are royalists, but it's only a matter of conjecture what that really means. There is also evidence to suggest that the story the Couslands tell about their own history isn't always the truth. My guess is that Bryce Cousland, if he had lived, would have tried to stay out of the civil war, seek a peaceful solution and in the end side with the victor.

Arl Eamon is the prime mover for putting Alistair on the throne and Eamon believes that if Alistair becomes king he will turn to him for support and knowledge. So Eamon stands very much to gain from putting Alistair on the throne, while if Loghain becomes regent or Anora is crowned his influence will shrink drastically. Eamon is fighting as much to preserve his family's influence as the Theirin blood line.

So why wipe out the Couslands as well? Just so Howe could get a few extra goodies alongside some revenge for some unnamed reason?

I will say that they're the unknown factor in the equation because there's little that we know of as to where their stance would be at the Landsmeet. There are those comments Bryce makes at Howe when Howe remarks about Cailan, Aldous mentions that the Couslands are "ardent royalists," but what we don't know is the Cousland-Loghain relationship and the Cousland-Eamon relationship. Neither Loghain or Eamon really talk about that, despite recognizing the younger Cousland.

That depends, I too think that the Couslands wouldn't necessarily backed Alistair unless they had real proof that Loghain was responsible for Cailan's death. I thought Howe's attack was personal, he didn't do it under the order of Loghain, he merely took advantage of the situaton. So yeah, I do think Howe's attack was just too get a few extra goodies (well alot of goodies).

And also back to poltical power of Couslands, i think even tho they are teyrns and probly have large weath, land and army, their influence is less than Eamon and Loghain. Highever seems to be almost semi-automous, and so the Couslands are off doing their own things. Where as Loghain and Eamon are personal friends of Maric, plus they are part of the royal family, so their influence in the court must be stronger.

Its like comparing who is more powerful? the chief of staff of the President or an governor of a state? you can't base everything on rank and stature.

[Time4Tiddy]

pprrff wrote...

That depends, I too think that the Couslands wouldn't necessarily backed Alistair unless they had real proof that Loghain was responsible for Cailan's death. I thought Howe's attack was personal, he didn't do it under the order of Loghain, he merely took advantage of the situaton. So yeah, I do think Howe's attack was just too get a few extra goodies (well alot of goodies).

And also back to poltical power of Couslands, i think even tho they are teyrns and probly have large weath, land and army, their influence is less than Eamon and Loghain. Highever seems to be almost semi-automous, and so the Couslands are off doing their own things. Where as Loghain and Eamon are personal friends of Maric, plus they are part of the royal family, so their influence in the court must be stronger.

Its like comparing who is more powerful? the chief of staff of the President or an governor of a state? you can't base everything on rank and stature.

I agree with this.  Howe's vendetta against the Couslands was completely personal.  He had swapped sides repeatedly during the war and the Couslands had never let him forget it.  They may or may not have been royalists, but they were definitely patriots, and they put Howe in his place as a fairwether Ferelden.  He held that grudge for decades until he could get his revenge.  He just took advantage of Loghain's power play to make his move.

Modifié par Time4Tiddy, 06 juillet 2010 - 10:31 .

[Sarah1281]

Howe didn't switch sides. His father-or-grandfather was an Orlesian supporter but when he was publicly executed Rendon was with the rebellion.

[JergenKajaton]

I almost never play as a non-human. I'm not sure why. I don't mind having them in my party, I just don't want to be one. They don't hold my interest for long enough to actually finish a playthrough. This goes for every fantasy RPG I've ever played, not just DAO.

Same goes for mages, for pretty much the same reason: Playing as a mage just doesn't interest me.

I've played all six origin stories, mostly for the sake of completeness, but all three of my three complete playthroughs (one male warrior and two rogues, one of each sex) have been as human nobles. When you're not interested in playing non-humans or mages, it's the only origin you have left.

I'd prefer a human commoner origin for rogue characters, but the game didn't give me that option.

[PatchWorks]

Human Noble is the only origin that makes sense for Awakening.



In Awakening, the monarch (whether Alistair or Anora) makes the Commander of the Grey the new Arl of Amaranthine. Despite being a Grey Warden, there is no way in hell any Fereldan ruler would make a Mage, Dwarf, or Elf the lord over any human Fereldan subjects. Mages as nobles would bring to mind Tevinters for any Fereldan (or Andrastian for that matter), and there is no way they would tolerate that. I don't really imagine I have to explain as to way Dwarves or Elves would be unacceptable to the human populace of Amaranthine as Arl do I?



That pretty much leaves the only acceptable candidate as Arl of Amaranthine to the human noble. Human commoner would probably be acceptable too, but they don't have that as an origin.

[Bahlgan]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Considering that Loghain Mac Tir and Bryce Cousland were both Teyrns, and Eamon Guerrin was an Arl, I don't know how Eamon was more important. To Loghain, the Couslands and Eamon might be of equal importance, since Loghain himself would be out of that equation, however.

If you people are talking about titles, then that means Loghain and Bryce are equally important, they're both Teryns, and hold more power than any Arl, leaving Howe below the two. Now I assume Loghain may have more respect for Howe, but it doesn't change the importance of titles.

[Jacks Smirking Revenge]

Reason to be a HMN you can marry Anora! I bet she has some pent up urges from Cailan always being off playing at war, and her all alone at the palace to rule!



On a serious note I feel HN fits the best into the story next to the Dwarf Origins. The mage and elf stories don't fit very well for me. If there were Dwarf romances I would say Dwarf would be a tie with HN for my favorite character to play on.

[Cypher0020]

I agree. I tried all the origins, and I think the ones that really impact the story for me are the DC and HN....they can totally influence dwarven-fereldan politics and gain an incredible ammount of power....



with that being said... if a HN marries Anora/Alistair....which blood line is stronger?



what about the heir problem? Is Conner the next heir?

[Aurelet]

Connor can't be the heir for anything...He's a mage

[Cypher0020]

Aw crap. Well shoot that idea down.



but who would be the next heir? Calin's dead....Conner's a mage...Fergus has to rebuild Highever....Loghain either dead/warden....



Fereldan....will be pretty screwed in 30 yrs....

[Sarah1281]

Well, any child of Fergus or Teagan (in many endings he becomes Arl of Redcliffe himself) might become eligible, particularly if a HN is on the throne. And it is POSSIBLE that there will be an heir born to Alistair and/or Anora but if it's with a HNF non-natural means will be required.

[MadCat221]

Jacks Smirking Revenge wrote...

Reason to be a HMN you can marry Anora! I bet she has some pent up urges from Cailan always being off playing at war, and her all alone at the palace to rule!

I doubt it.  I get some major Electra Complex vibes from her.

[Jacks Smirking Revenge]

Maybe I'm having a brain cramp been working 14 hour days past 4 days, but....

How would Teagan and Eamon have an actual claim they aren't related to Alistair, Anora or a HN. Because Alistair is from Maric+Fiona or a random maid. Anora is Mac Tir. Rowan is what makes Teagan and Eamon have a claim through marriage. You basically erase any claim Rowan or her family would have you can only preserve the Therin bloodline or start a new one.

I see only a child between Queen and King, or Fergus and his children having a claim. Since Anora has no family we know of other than Loghain left who is either dead or in Orlais.

As for the electra complex vibes that crossed my mind on my first play through, but the more I've played and talked to her the less I feel that, but she is still very much "her father's daughter", but she isn't batpoo crazy.

Modifié par Jacks Smirking Revenge, 08 juillet 2010 - 03:56 .

[Sarah1281]

No one had a claim once Cailan died and Alistair/Anora have to be confirmed with the Landsmeet. If they die with no heir then no one has a claim to the throne and if Fergus or his children want it then they could make a bid for it as could Teagan/Eamon or their children. If there isn't an heir then it's just politics and the nobles ruling Redcliffe and Highever are some of the big players.