148 réponses à ce sujet

[didymos1120]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...
 I mean the Matriach Benezia/Rachni queen portion (4/4 part: Noveria  = Noveria information center/etc, Drive to the Hot Labs, Restoring Power to the hot labs, plus finally getting into the hotlabs to then encounter benezia) of Mass Effect 1 is like the only major plot hole of the game's story... it's entertaining and fun though to play, in a entertainment perspective... the first half of Noveria was okay, so so... interesting level (like the first Illium, inside a giant Corporate with a snowy scenery for the window view)... 

OK, wait...what!?  What does that have to do with the specific point of Zulu's I was disputing?  I really don't know what you're trying to say here.

[frylock23]

I always let the Rachni Queen live, not for Paragon or Renegade reasons, but for metagaming ones. How much less fun would the universe be without a xenomorph?

[Docbrown777]

In the saved game I plan to play ME3 with first the queen is dead. I don't like bugs. In fact I guess I am racist against them.



The way I see it the Rachni were brutally defeated by the Krogan. Well, in ME2 we find out there might be a cure for the genophage. So, if the galexy needs a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude then we can give the Krogan the cure and they can make a billion babies cause apparently when they aren't genophage restricted they are an extremely fertile species.



If need be. First we have to see what kind of superweapon the Illusive Man comes up with by using the Collector Base which I saved. That's right, I handed the base over to him and didn't think twice. Muhahahahaha!

[Inquisitor Recon]

I figured if somebody really wants to bring them back, they can clone them or something. I just don't want to be blamed for if/when it backfires.

[Auchtane]

You know I am all for a more realistic story, but I still would want an ending with a clear cut paragon and renegade decisions. Actually I would not mind decisions that were not as clearly defined as paragon or renegade.



As Long As I have "that" option to play the super Paragon or Renegade route.



Maybe make the Unreasonably Trite Paragon ending super hard to get? maybe...?

[RiouHotaru]

 Look, they simply CANNOT make saving the Rachni Queen be a strictly negative consequence.  Because that would be entirely unfair.  Perhaps it might require you to have to convince the rest of the galaxy that they're alright, but Bioware, for the sake of game-fairness, make one decision strictly inferior to the other.  So no, the Rachni cannot and likely will not suddenly backstab you.  For one thing, it doesn't benefit them at all.  Simply betraying Shepard for letting them go makes absolutely no sense.  The Rachni are not an Always Chaotic Evil race, so there's no justification besides you wanting Paragons to be "punished".

And in the interest of fairness, if they "punish" Paragons, they have to "punish" Renegades as well.

[Tooneyman]

RiouHotaru wrote...

 Look, they simply CANNOT make saving the Rachni Queen be a strictly negative consequence.  Because that would be entirely unfair.  Perhaps it might require you to have to convince the rest of the galaxy that they're alright, but Bioware, for the sake of game-fairness, make one decision strictly inferior to the other.  So no, the Rachni cannot and likely will not suddenly backstab you.  For one thing, it doesn't benefit them at all.  Simply betraying Shepard for letting them go makes absolutely no sense.  The Rachni are not an Always Chaotic Evil race, so there's no justification besides you wanting Paragons to be "punished".

And in the interest of fairness, if they "punish" Paragons, they have to "punish" Renegades as well.

Of course they would be a consequence for the renegade. Its call the end of ME 2. Just looked out the window. Your going to need a giant army for that so if you killed the lady bug. Your army is kind of small if you think about it. Though what I proposed as a consequence was just a couple of rachni end up fighting you. This way the paragon gets some sort of consequence, but not enough to ruin the next game experience for you and you feel like your decision from two games ago actually matters. Bioware realized small things do matter. Now their budget I have no idea, but we can only hope some thing like this is incorperated. It just gives it an oracle and mystic feeling with consequences. Rather than people putting a label on. Oh this is a good decision/ or "Oh," This is a bad decision. I like the mass effect universe so much for the fact Bioware does try to keep it grey.

[ObserverStatus]

Shandepared wrote...
I have another question for you: what do you suppose that big fancy lab on Noveria was there to do? Why all the security? I don't suppose it was because the rachni are dangerous do you? The rachni queen is a bio-hazard! You don't even know if she's telling the truth and you just set her free! That is not moral, it stupid. Frankly it is immoral because it risks the lives of everyone who lives and works on Noveria.

The security on Noveria was most likely intended to stop their valuable Rachni from escaping.  As for the Rachni getting loose on Noveria, i'm not too worried. If it turns out they aren't on the level, than you shoot a nuke down a bug hole and you've got a lot of dead bugs.

[maegi46]

Yes the queen is a giant bug and while I am not into bugs in real life, i tend to kill them. This is a game. These bugs were intelligent and a life form, not some pest that eats crops. At least I don't think they eat crops? Who knows? Point is, I think we have their undying gratitude, pun intended. How good of an ally will they be? Pretty fierce according to the stories. Altho my team had no trouble squishing the lil bastards on Noveria that were foolish enough to spit acid at us.



I think those of us that spared the queen will be rewarded. If you killed her, I'm sure you will come to regret it. You played God and decimited ie committed genocide. That can't have a happy ending. Bioware said several times in the transition scenes of ME2 that all your decision wil have "dire" consequences in ME3. Aren't you glad we have saved games for different outcome possibilities?

[kidbd15]

I think BioWare will somehow make the rachni the key to stopping indoctrination. The rachni see sound as color, to which they described the reapers and indoctrination as "oily shadows" i believe (correct me if I'm wrong). So because of this ability to see sound, the rachni may now be able to avoid it, filter it out in a way.

[Tooneyman]

kidbd15 wrote...

I think BioWare will somehow make the rachni the key to stopping indoctrination. The rachni see sound as color, to which they described the reapers and indoctrination as "oily shadows" i believe (correct me if I'm wrong). So because of this ability to see sound, the rachni may now be able to avoid it, filter it out in a way.

Couldn't happen because they are a short decision and if you kill the queen it wouldn't happen.

[didymos1120]

maegi46 wrote...
. Altho my team had no trouble squishing the lil bastards on Noveria that were foolish enough to spit acid at us.

Yeah, but those things were completely batsh!t and had zero sense of self-preservation, much less tactics.  Imagine them with kinetic barriers and weapons designed for their use, and able to actually reason during a fight.   

[didymos1120]

kidbd15 wrote...

I think BioWare will somehow make the rachni the key to stopping indoctrination. The rachni see sound as color, to which they described the reapers and indoctrination as "oily shadows" i believe (correct me if I'm wrong). So because of this ability to see sound, the rachni may now be able to avoid it, filter it out in a way.

Here's the relevant dialogue:

About the dying Asari she's speaking through:  "She is weak to urging."  (all of the Asari there were full-on indoctrinated, though the queen may just mean that the woman is barely conscious. Or a bit of both.)

What the war sounded like in her egg: "We heard only discordance, songs the color of oily shadows" (so, yeah: you had it right).

What she remembers before that: "We were only an egg, hearing mother cry in our dreams.  A tone from space hushed one voice after another.  It forced the singers to resonate with its own sour, yellow note."

Compare to what you can hear Eden Prime:

Cole: "It was emitting some kind of signal as it descended.  Sounded like the shriek of the damned.  Only...it was coming from inside your own head. Whatever it was, felt like it was tearing through my skull.  Almost made it impossible to think."

Powell: "And it was making this noise, this -- this sound that bored right into your brain."

Modifié par didymos1120, 06 juillet 2010 - 10:21 .

[didymos1120]

Tooneyman wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

I think BioWare will somehow make the rachni the key to stopping indoctrination. The rachni see sound as color, to which they described the reapers and indoctrination as "oily shadows" i believe (correct me if I'm wrong). So because of this ability to see sound, the rachni may now be able to avoid it, filter it out in a way.

Couldn't happen because they are a short decision and if you kill the queen it wouldn't happen.

A Rachni squaddie isn't out of the question though.  God, I want that just for the bizarre conversations you could have.  Not to mention carting it around to population centers.  Then again, there is Rule 34 to consider....no: Rachni teammate would just be too awesome.  Must...have...now...

[wizardryforever]

I believe that Bioware will make saving the Rachni a positive thing, but only in that it will make things a bit easier.  Not the whole game, of course, but maybe a specific mission in which the Rachni could help immensely.  Maybe something bad will be avoided by having their help against the Reapers, kind of like upgrading the ship in ME2.  Doing so prevents people from dying on the ship, but you needed to spend resources on it in order for it to happen.  Maybe the Rachni make a certain step in stopping the Reapers that much easier, or remove that step entirely.  Maybe it will be something as simple as having Rachni backup on a dangerous mission.  But it will be very difficult to convince the other races that they can be trusted, particularly the Krogan and Turians.

I don't think they need to "punish" either Paragons or Renegades (or those indecisives who play Paragade/Renegon).  Every decision needs to have good and bad consequences.

Modifié par wizardryforever, 06 juillet 2010 - 10:38 .

[didymos1120]

Shandepared wrote...

God, what a... misguided idea. Sure it would be LOL RANDUMB ECKS DEE but I don't think it would fit the theme very well.

Besides, does it really make any more sense that we can haul a freaking geth around with barely any reaction from folks on, say, oh, I don't know...the goddamn Citadel?  Or the Quarian fleet, for chrissakes.  Fun, but completely bizarre and implausible.  But you know what: I'm OK with that.  I just don't do either on a "serious" playthrough.  

Modifié par didymos1120, 06 juillet 2010 - 11:14 .

[AdamNW]

They won't help you.  They've sworn to be peaceful and any action taken by them would cause a ****storm among the surviving races, particularly the Krogan.

[CkLynx]

Will be interesting to see what Bioware do with the Rachni.

[didymos1120]

Shandepared wrote...
I never endorsed a geth party member, didymos1120. In fact I was against the idea of making the geth good guys from the very beginning. It is cliche and stupid.

Umm, OK?  Not really my point in bringing up Legion, but whatever.

They were great villains, most especially as servants of the Reapers.

Look, I like 'em. They were used well, have a few interesting quirks in their otherwise fairly standard  backstory, but "great villains"?  They literally have zero personality (and no, that's not somehow more innovative than the alternative, just in case you were thinking of going that route).  Their role is basically to provide you with stuff to shoot for the majority of the first game.  Yeah, their design really is just overall fantastic, but c'mon: evil AI robots out to KILL ALL HUMANS ORGANICS!

And the fact that they work for (what appeared at the time to be) another race of evil AI robots out to KILL ALL HUMANS ORGANICS is somehow supposed to elevate them to greatness?  They are indeed cool, and fulfill their role quite admirably, but anything more than that...just isn't really in them.  At least not in ME1 (I won't get into their presence/lack thereof in ME2, and whether or not they're now ruined forever, or ruined-but-salvageable, or not ruined at all because, well, I just don't feel like it at the moment. Legion excepted obviously).

Face it: you just prefer the other evil robot cliche, which is that they're really just evil. Or may as well be since all they want for Christmas is our complete and utter destruction.  Well and good, but don't try and pretend like it's somehow not as battered and shopworn as the misunderstood, not-so-evil evil robots. 

Oh yeah: IN SPACE!  Musn't forget that bit, for either of those cliches. 

  A rachni squadmate is just dumb, so is a volus, hanar, or elcor squadmate. So is EDI in a mech body. Stupid ideas by stupid fans.

 
OK, so I see you still haven't figured out that I wasn't actually serious about this (or maybe you have and just felt like debating these points anyway).  Don't get me wrong: I wouldn't mind a Rachni squadmate, provided it were handled reasonably well, but I'm not particularly invested in the idea (currently have no opinion on the others, beyond thinking an Elcor might be the easiest of the bunch to pull off).  It's both amusing and intriguing to me precisely because it is sort of nuts.  Or, fine, stupid. "Misguided".  Whatever.

Anyway, that doesn't mean it couldn't be awesome and/or fun (as you seemingly, if grudgingly and condescendingly, acknowledged earlier). It could even be good.  If it's handled in a manner similar to Legion, where it's rather obvious he's only "officially" supposed to be around for the Heretic Station and Omega-4, and he has a very specific purpose in the larger story, and all the rest is just there for our amusement, what's the harm?  That people might get a laugh out of a few absurd situations involvng this notional character? And also potentially get an interesting new, non-joke character because they also have a legitimate and serious (if limited) purpose that really "counts" in the gameworld?  That...that's just so horrible! 

And yes, if attempted, it could fail. Horrifically, even.  So can anything, if properly screwed up.  Would it be easier to screw up a Rachni/Volus/Elcor/Arcturan Mega-donkey squadmate?  Probably.  I can't really work up much beyond a shrug for that, though.  All sorts of story ideas have the odds against them, are maybe even universally believed to just be "stupidmisguided", but that's not sufficient reason to dismiss them out of hand and not give them at least a shot by sticking 'em into some early drafts, or even whipping up some rough concept art. 

Excuse me, that was rude. Replace stupid with "misguided" again.

Thanks, but pardon me if I doubt the sincerity, since you seem to keep having this problem.  Don't get me wrong:  I'm not mad.  Merely...skeptical?  Yeah, let's go with that.

Modifié par didymos1120, 07 juillet 2010 - 01:50 .

[Merlin 47]

Soverign 666 wrote...

Does anyone else think it might be cool if the rachni instead of helping you in ME3 if you saved them became enemys (possibly through indoctrination). Making the renegade choice actually be the right choice instead of just the evil one. Thoughts?

No...it wouldn't be cool.  In fact, I think it'd be really stupid if this was the case.

I wouldn't see making the Renegade choice as the right one.  If you think by doing that, it IS the right choice, then that's your opinion. 

[didymos1120]

Shandepared wrote...
Thanks for your opinion on the matter.

Oh, you're quite welcome.