18 réponses à ce sujet

[Spinez0rd]

 1. Should i go Sword / Dagger or Dagger/Dagger ? Or even Sword/Sword ? I'm using currently Sword / Dagger and planning on switching to Dagger/Dagger as soon as i get a good knife.

2. I'm currently sitting @ 20 STR and building Dex and Cun in a 2:1 basis, is Assassin / Duelist a good combo for this case ? A friend of mine told me to go Assassin / Bard. I don't plan on using Leliana on my party. 

3. Should i get all DW skills or focus on Rogue skills ? 

And, finally, a little off topic: Why is Shale so strong ? Her biggest hit @ lvl 10 was 220, mine was 60.. wtf. 

Modifié par Spinez0rd, 08 juillet 2010 - 12:48 .

[MindYerBeak]

Swords take longer to swing than a dagger. Dagger/dagger is much faster and delivers more damage. Personally I use a Cunning dagger/dagger rogue. By taking Bard you then have Song of Courage to boost your Cunning stats. My Cunning Rogue was critting for around 580 towards the end game. You need put nothing into lockpicking and only 2 points in coercion with Cunning.

[Cypher0020]

I do dagger/dagger and crank up Dex....I'm still new to playing a rogue...but I noticed I hit fast and rarely get hit myself

[Jestina]

Daggers. I wouldn't mess with weapon talents much as a rogue. I usually go all dex and rogue talents. As long as you make good use of stealth and back stabbing you'll do far more damage than with any talent...plus most of those talents don't give you crits. About the only talents worth getting are the first line of dual wield and maybe sweep on the third line.

[Liliandra Nadiar]

1) Dagger/Dagger will generate the best DPS. And a high backstabbing speed is always good.



2) If you want a Dex based rogue, Assassin/Duelist is the best. High combat survivability baring auto-hit attacks. Cun based Assassin/Bard is more party friendly and has a greater utility outside of Deft Hands/Coercion.



3) Only skills I ended up really using/caring about on my DW rogue was Sweep, Riposte, Flurry and Momentum. Punisher is nice, don't get me wrong, but the cooldown is it's biggest negative.



As far as Shale goes, Str based attackers will out burst damage you pretty much the whole game. You can close the distance after building up Cun with lethality, but as far as single, big numbers go, you'll fall behind. Now look at how many numbers you generated between two of Shale's attacks.

[rayzorium]

Two daggers. No doubt about it. As for abilities, I only use Sweep, Riposte, Dirty Fighting and Momentum. I differ from the above poster in that I don't think Flurry is fast enough to justify using, given how fast my guy already attacks.



Regarding Shale, it sounds like she just got a lucky Slam on something with a matching elemental weakness. She also attacks much, much slower than a rogue does - the rogue might have gotten out three or more attacks in the time it took for Shale to get that crit. When they can backstab freely, rogues are head and shoulders above the crowd.



I guess it should be noted that I play on the 360, so I'm forced to deal with the dex bug. While this means dexterity gives no damage to daggers, it also means cunning gives twice as much. My rogue had to plod through seven levels of crap DPS, but once he got Lethality, he was an unstoppable killing machine.

[jsachun]

Riposte & Flurry do more damage for Dagger wielder, where as if you are wielding sword or axes, sweep & punisher actually does a lot more damage than Riposte & Flurry. So Flurry is actually a good talent to have especially when facing an enemy that can't be backstabed.

Modifié par jsachun, 08 juillet 2010 - 10:40 .

[Yamo425]

My rogue is currently at level 9 and he is an assassin, i'm going to make his second spec duelist. I have been stacking DEX like crazy, with just a few points in STR and and a bit in CUN. I read some pretty in-depth calculations somewhere that a dagger/dagger cunning rogue has the highest dps.. but personally I am having a lot of fun with dagger/dagger DEX, I do a ton of damage for my level and I can solo like 2-4 enemies because they never hit me. I have just been getting the dual-wield talents, along with three ranks of stealth and to be honest I am tempted to put some points into willpower so I can have momentum up without it taking half of my stamina.



Now, I'm pretty new to the class so correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like you do more damager with a sword/dagger vs. dagger/dagger rogue in an upfront fight, but if you factor in the increased attack speed, higher crit chance, and better scaling with fixed damage bonuses and armor penetration dagger/dagger is the winner.

[soteria]

It kinda depends on how high your dex is. Swords don't get damage from it, so the higher your dex goes the worse a sword looks in comparison.

[Spinez0rd]

Well, thanks everyone for the answers

[obliviondoll]

I actually went Axe/Dagger almost the entire way through the game. I levelled Dex mostly, but Str a little as well. I found Sweep rather useful when I got surrounded (which usually meant Alistair and Sten were dead or slacking off).



I was Assassin/Duelist, and Dueling was pretty much always switched on.

[Last Darkness]

Try them all and see what you like best. Assassin/Duelest is a pretty solid build. You may wanna try Asassin/Bard (If you have high Cun cause both classes abilitys use Cun score) Assassin/Ranger is something im looking at right now and allows for some intresting setups. My last was a Duelest/Ranger and that was pretty good. Anyways really try what some have already suggested and see what works for you.

[Kalcalan]

All you really need for a backstabber is Momentum. You could also skip Dual Wielding entirely and focus on Rogue talents instead. Stealth works great to lower threat and insure backstabs.

[Last Darkness]

Kalcalan wrote...

All you really need for a backstabber is Momentum. You could also skip Dual Wielding entirely and focus on Rogue talents instead. Stealth works great to lower threat and insure backstabs.

Even with Momentum you do more damage backstabbing with a single weapon then duel weapons since each backstab attack despite its animation switches weapons it uses for damage and the second you put a weapon your offhand you take a serius damage hit due how it calculate damage.

I find it a bit easier to use a sword and shield/two hander on my rogues anymore since it does considerably more damage (I was backstabing for almost 90+ damage a hit at lvl 10) and focus more on the rogue class feats instead of weapon styles. Veshialle axe+Shield and 60 or more Str puts out insane damage numbers.

[Last Darkness]

bamaboy24z wrote...

dual wield expert, momentum and riposte then the rest in rogue tree. with momentum going you will do less damage if you use a talent like flurry etc.. momentum does not speed up those talents and there animation is slow compared to auto attack with momentum. only get riposte for the stun. put some paralyze runes in each dagger and with coup de grace it will be an automatic back stab no matter where you stand.

'

Punisher is great too.


You really also have to synergise up your class for how you play.  Do you do more Backstabs or just brawl?
Duelest is great for rogues not focused on backstabbing while Assassin is the opposite. Bard is bard with teh buff but Bard isnt very good unless your a heavy Cun build, like Cun at least 60+
Currently I am greatly enjoying Ranger/Duelest and Ranger/Assassin.  It can put out some great damage and is pretty fun.
The Spider pet Web allows for some instant backstabs remember
Wolf is pretty good as it puts out the best DPS and the Bear can be useful.

[rayzorium]

Last Darkness wrote...

Even with Momentum you do more damage backstabbing with a single weapon then duel weapons since each backstab attack despite its animation switches weapons it uses for damage and the second you put a weapon your offhand you take a serius damage hit due how it calculate damage.

It might do more per hit, but saying it does more damage period would be quite outrageous. Two daggers hit almost twice as fast as a longsword alone, and are surprisingly not far behind in damage if you pick the right skills, because... well, because of how the game calculates damage. The only aspect of your damage that's affected by the dual wield/offhand penalty is attribute contribution, which is not insignificant, but amounts to much less of your total than you might think. Runes, poison, talents like The Tainted Blade and Exploit Weakness... literally everything else in the game scales with attack speed and only attack speed.

[MindYerBeak]

If you have a Mage in the party cast Haste and watch your Rogue take off like a bat out of hell. Better still if you have 2 Mages in the party caste Haste twice and watch your Rogue behave like a chainsaw.

[Last Darkness]

rayzorium wrote...

Last Darkness wrote...

Even with Momentum you do more damage backstabbing with a single weapon then duel weapons since each backstab attack despite its animation switches weapons it uses for damage and the second you put a weapon your offhand you take a serius damage hit due how it calculate damage.

It might do more per hit, but saying it does more damage period would be quite outrageous. Two daggers hit almost twice as fast as a longsword alone, and are surprisingly not far behind in damage if you pick the right skills, because... well, because of how the game calculates damage. The only aspect of your damage that's affected by the dual wield/offhand penalty is attribute contribution, which is not insignificant, but amounts to much less of your total than you might think. Runes, poison, talents like The Tainted Blade and Exploit Weakness... literally everything else in the game scales with attack speed and only attack speed.

Well if your going to compare optimum setups you need to have the optimum for both sides factored into your equation.
Daggers unfortunetly do pathetic damage compared to a sword or axe and duel wielding is even worse(Your offhand does something close to 50% less damage). Its really how the game mechanics calculate is the problem. 

You can use runes(Which dont work for ofhand on daggers), poison, tainted blade, exploit weakness ETC with a sword and shield while backstabbing too. You will do more damage per hit and attack at a decent speed. Also using Haste or Double Haste (Which you cant do with momentum) makes this even better.   You can even do this with a meaty two hand weapon like Chasind Great Maul or Starfang.   Sadly unless your stacking +crit damage gear and hit the cap of +350% preferably(Can be done in Awakening) Daggers are not the weapon of choice for backstabing.