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Still no Multiplayer , Co-Op or otherwise?

Débuté par Gel214th , juil. 08 2010 02:37

473 réponses à ce sujet

#226
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 29 août 2010 - 10:23

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AlanC9 wrote...

Do you mean "drivel"?

Some folks here seem to be just plain opposed to MP. I'm in the camp that doesn't care as long as Bio can put it in without any cost or any compromise to the rest of the game, or if adding MP would bring in enough new revenue to pay for itself. Neither of these seems to be true.


Well that's their opinion on the matter, anyway. I think multiplayer has a lot more potential for sales than they're willing to give it credit for. How did they come to that conclusion? Was it analyzing NWN sales? Did they track people's playing methods on gamespy (or whatever it was)? Did they conduct some sort of survey? What if the functionality still made it a more attractive sale, even if people didn't actually use it? (Like a multifunction microwave, which you might prefer over a regular microwave even if you'd only ever use it like a regular microwave.) And if it didn't pay for itself overall, how can they say for sure it was because multiplayer inherently lacks the potential to add to sales, rather than it simply being a matter of them failing to realize said potential?

And I don't mean "realize said potential" by making it like WoW, for those of you who might assume that; I mean by doing what the NWN series did... but better. Co-op was doable, the modding+PW system had a lot of potential, and HotU, NWN2OC, and MotB were respectable singleplayer campaigns in their own right (IMO).

(And I know NWN2 isn't a BioWare game, but it has basically the same functionalities as NWN1 does, so it's comparable.)

(well, maybe it's not comparable, if you want to counter argue that they didn't have to spend dev time hashing out a multiplayer system because it was already built that way, so they merely had to work with it. whatever.)

(and considering that DA2 is based on DA1 which wasn't built around multiplayer, I'm not really saying it should be implemented now, I'm more arguing against the argument they used back when DAO was still in development for why they didn't want to include multiplayer.)

(extra parentheses just to annoy you.)

(not you personally, AlanC9-- "the reader.")

Modifié par filaminstrel, 29 août 2010 - 10:32 .

#227
pasty_buns
Posté 29 août 2010 - 10:39

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this post goes for all of bioware games except SWTOR for obvious reasons. Why in the world does everyone want the next update or next installment of bioware's to have co-op or multiplyer like seriously. I'd rather take a fully fleshed out single player then a good single player and an ok mulit/co-op. Plus, Dragon Age... with co-op is like water and oil they dont mix... same thing goes for Mass Effect. i'm personally tired of people complaining that "such and such" game is a single player game only and that multiplyer rawks hard. Single player FTW. Story is what captures my attention, then gameplay. then graphics. Multiplyer is really the last thing i care about. dont get me wrong i love playing TF2, CSS, CoD, SCII ( i can go on) but really leave the multiplyer out of RPGs and leave that to the MMOs (SWTOR is going to be awesome... just saying).

#228
AlanC9
Posté 29 août 2010 - 10:50

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I don't think Bio has to think MP won't make money "for sure" to avoid doing it. The burden of proof is much more the other way -- you'd have to be fairly confident that something would make money before committing resources to it, with the necessary level of confidence rising as the resources to be committed increase.

I'm not sure the distinction between multiplayer inherently lacking sales potential and Bioware failing to maximize MPs potential is all that meaningful. If Bio didn't know how to maximize that potential then, why would they know better now? I'm not quite clear what NWN1 could have done better in this area anyway. Of course, I'm the wrong person to judge this since I have no personal interest in multiplayer.

My impression of successful MP games is that companies that do them well are strong in areas that Bio hasn't demonstrated any particular strength in. I'm not speaking of MMOs since I don't have any experience of that gamestyle; I'm mostly thinking of shooters and sports games.

As for data, Bio devs have said that for NWN they did analyze use of the authentication server. IIRC this doesn't pick up LAN games, so you need to estimate those some other way. But you'd certainly get the vast bulk of the PW traffic.

Modifié par AlanC9, 29 août 2010 - 10:51 .

#229
rafoquinha
Posté 29 août 2010 - 11:56

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Co-op for future Dragon Age and Mass Effect games?

'We'd consider it', says BioWare.
Dragon Age: Origins screenshot

Canadian developer BioWare "would consider" co-operative multiplayer features for future Dragon Age and Mass Effect games.

BioWare co-founder and CEO Dr. Ray Muzyka told VideoGamer.com in a wide-ranging interview that such features "could make a great gameplay experience".

He said: "Sure, we would consider it. We haven't announced anything on that front yet, but those are interesting ideas. They could make a great gameplay experience. Whether we'll do them or not remains to be decided."

But before you get your role-playing knickers in a twist, Muzyka revealed that implementing co-op would not be as simple as inserting the feature into the single-player driven gameplay Dragon Age and Mass Effect are known for.

"It could [detract from the experience]," Muzyka said. "It might depend on how you do it.

"It's hard to weave a great single-player storyline into a multiplayer experience. It's not impossible. We've done it, and we're doing it again now in Star Wars: The Old Republic. But it is challenging."


#230
Lord_Valandil
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:04

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Are people still complaining about the lack of multiplayer?

#231
Chim3ra
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:05

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The way it should be. No multiplayer.

#232
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:10

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@AlanC9

That's true enough, they don't have to prove anything. They could just say, "We didn't want to include it," and leave it at that, and for those of us who do want it, the burden of proof is on us for why it would be a good investment. Do I have any proof? No, not really... I can't think of any comparable games except the NWN games. I'd just like to think it would add to sales, and it makes logical sense to me that it would, but my perspective may be biased by my desire to see it implemented.

But I understand that they have sought to prove why it wasn't a good investment anyway, by pointing to NWN as their model, and I am just questioning the conclusions they drew based on that. If they are going to use it as evidence, they should be expected to prove that it actually supports their claim.

How could they improve on a NWN-style multiplayer? Well, assuming it needs to be improved to be a worthwhile investment... there were some complaints people had. I don't remember exactly. Stuff about auto-downloading from servers, etc. They could work to address those. They could make the toolset more accessible and work more with modders like Ossian to add incentive to the modding community. I had some ideas about how they could incentivize Persistent World creation and upkeep and play to their strength as a sort of user-generated mini-MMO, but those are ideas without any sort of expertly knowledge backing them up, so I hold no illusions about them panning out well, realistically. I'm not even sure how the current PW system works. (who pays for the servers/bandwidth, the PW owners?)

I'd like to think NWN-style multiplayer wouldn't necessarily have to be improved upon to be workable and pay for itself, though, or at least partially pay for itself. I personally think it would be worth some loss in profits, but again, biased.

Modifié par filaminstrel, 30 août 2010 - 12:12 .

#233
Dynamomark
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:10

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Bioware is already making a multiplayer game--Star Wars. Ergo, it's not going to bother with a multiplayer for Dragon Age.

#234
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Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:37

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Why doesn't a moderator put a link and/or a quote of Priestly's post in the OP? That way, anyone new who comes to this thread has a clear, bolded answer in the first post.

#235
Nyaore
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:48

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Lord_Valandil wrote...

Are people still complaining about the lack of multiplayer?

It's the one inherent rule about the gaming community. For every single player game there is a portion of players that will **** and moan in an attempt to get the game to make the jump into a multiplayer experience. Conversely, for every multiplayer game there is always a faction of people who strongly believe that said game would have been a hundred times better without a 'tacked on' co-op mode. Both sides doomed to forever continue their struggles until the end of time.
Better get some popcorn. I'm afraid this debate won't end until someone does the wise thing and forcibly silences both sides under penalty of death.

#236
Lord_Valandil
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:50

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Nyaore wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...

Are people still complaining about the lack of multiplayer?

It's the one inherent rule about the gaming community. For every single player game there is a portion of players that will **** and moan in an attempt to get the game to make the jump into a multiplayer experience. Conversely, for every multiplayer game there is always a faction of people who strongly believe that said game would have been a hundred times better without a 'tacked on' co-op mode. Both sides doomed to forever continue their struggles until the end of time.
Better get some popcorn. I'm afraid this debate won't end until someone does the wise thing and forcibly silences both sides under penalty of death.


Image IPB

Yes, I agree with you. Good thing there is plenty of popcorn, and enough to share.
You can't make everyone happy, I guess.

#237
Maverick827
Posté 30 août 2010 - 12:56

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Nyaore wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...

Are people still complaining about the lack of multiplayer?

It's the one inherent rule about the gaming community. For every single player game there is a portion of players that will **** and moan in an attempt to get the game to make the jump into a multiplayer experience. Conversely, for every multiplayer game there is always a faction of people who strongly believe that said game would have been a hundred times better without a 'tacked on' co-op mode. Both sides doomed to forever continue their struggles until the end of time.
Better get some popcorn. I'm afraid this debate won't end until someone does the wise thing and forcibly silences both sides under penalty of death.

Actually, the wise thing to do would be to add multiplayer intelligently and without detriment to the single player experience.  

That way the "multiplayer moaners," as the clearly more rational group, would be appeased, and the "single-player whiners," who can never be appeased as evidenced by making uneducated assumptions and acting on them rashly, are hilariously tormented.

I'm still waiting on that huge list of contemporary co-op RPGs, by the way.

#238
Guest_JoePinasi1989_*
Posté 30 août 2010 - 01:02

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Lord_Valandil wrote...

Nyaore wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...

Are people still complaining about the lack of multiplayer?

It's the one inherent rule about the gaming community. For every single player game there is a portion of players that will **** and moan in an attempt to get the game to make the jump into a multiplayer experience. Conversely, for every multiplayer game there is always a faction of people who strongly believe that said game would have been a hundred times better without a 'tacked on' co-op mode. Both sides doomed to forever continue their struggles until the end of time.
Better get some popcorn. I'm afraid this debate won't end until someone does the wise thing and forcibly silences both sides under penalty of death.


Image IPB

Yes, I agree with you. Good thing there is plenty of popcorn, and enough to share.
You can't make everyone happy, I guess.


Sweet Jeebus, that made my mouth water sooo badly!

#239
MofineBovine
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 01:44

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I cant believe That people are actualy opposed to the idea of multiplayer co op.

There is a game you may have heard of, its called Baulder's Gate 2. It is a single player game. Its single player campain was excellent. Playing its single player game with a freind in multiplayer co op made the game even more exciting. It didnt change the story, it didnt affect how the game played what so ever. The difference was, that there were times when you knew what was comming up ahead and you had a plan to tackle a certain enemy a certain way. Then as you were explaining what you wanted to do with your freinds, one of them would wander foward and set off the npcs. Absoulte bedlam would ensue and alot of screaming "what are you doing YOU IDIOT!!??!!!" would break out. But, it was all good fun. It actualy adds a level of unexpected excitement to what would be an otherwise clockwork, routine encounter. Overall, adding mutliplayer to an excellent party based single player game increased the level of enjoyment tenfold.

Anyone who is afraid that playing a game online with someone else would ruin their experience is obviosly mentaly deficient. Because, you could always just not do it. Co op play isnt somthing you do with randoms, its somthing you do with freinds. If your freinds are annoying douche bags, then dont play with them.

I just wish DA:O did have multiplayer co op. It would have increased my level of enjoyment of the game immeasurably. Instead of hearing my girlfriend complain every 20 minutes that i was on the computer and not spending time with her, i could have spent time with her by playing the damn thing.

Modifié par MofineBovine, 30 septembre 2010 - 01:48 .

#240
Phoenixblight
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 02:41

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MofineBovine wrote...

I cant believe That people are actualy opposed to the idea of multiplayer co op.

There is a game you may have heard of, its called Baulder's Gate 2. It is a single player game. Its single player campain was excellent. Playing its single player game with a freind in multiplayer co op made the game even more exciting. It didnt change the story, it didnt affect how the game played what so ever. The difference was, that there were times when you knew what was comming up ahead and you had a plan to tackle a certain enemy a certain way. Then as you were explaining what you wanted to do with your freinds, one of them would wander foward and set off the npcs. Absoulte bedlam would ensue and alot of screaming "what are you doing YOU IDIOT!!??!!!" would break out. But, it was all good fun. It actualy adds a level of unexpected excitement to what would be an otherwise clockwork, routine encounter. Overall, adding mutliplayer to an excellent party based single player game increased the level of enjoyment tenfold.

Anyone who is afraid that playing a game online with someone else would ruin their experience is obviosly mentaly deficient. Because, you could always just not do it. Co op play isnt somthing you do with randoms, its somthing you do with freinds. If your freinds are annoying douche bags, then dont play with them.

I just wish DA:O did have multiplayer co op. It would have increased my level of enjoyment of the game immeasurably. Instead of hearing my girlfriend complain every 20 minutes that i was on the computer and not spending time with her, i could have spent time with her by playing the damn thing.


Sorry Fix your priorities or get a new Gf. 

#241
AlanC9
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 04:40

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MofineBovine wrote...
There is a game you may have heard of, its called Baulder's Gate 2.


Can someone explain to me why so many BG2 fans can't spell the name right?

#242
Kajros
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 05:28

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I feel a Lockdown is imminent.

#243
Guest_Jynthor_*
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 05:31

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Phoenixblight wrote...

MofineBovine wrote...

I cant believe That people are actualy opposed to the idea of multiplayer co op.

There is a game you may have heard of, its called Baulder's Gate 2. It is a single player game. Its single player campain was excellent. Playing its single player game with a freind in multiplayer co op made the game even more exciting. It didnt change the story, it didnt affect how the game played what so ever. The difference was, that there were times when you knew what was comming up ahead and you had a plan to tackle a certain enemy a certain way. Then as you were explaining what you wanted to do with your freinds, one of them would wander foward and set off the npcs. Absoulte bedlam would ensue and alot of screaming "what are you doing YOU IDIOT!!??!!!" would break out. But, it was all good fun. It actualy adds a level of unexpected excitement to what would be an otherwise clockwork, routine encounter. Overall, adding mutliplayer to an excellent party based single player game increased the level of enjoyment tenfold.

Anyone who is afraid that playing a game online with someone else would ruin their experience is obviosly mentaly deficient. Because, you could always just not do it. Co op play isnt somthing you do with randoms, its somthing you do with freinds. If your freinds are annoying douche bags, then dont play with them.

I just wish DA:O did have multiplayer co op. It would have increased my level of enjoyment of the game immeasurably. Instead of hearing my girlfriend complain every 20 minutes that i was on the computer and not spending time with her, i could have spent time with her by playing the damn thing.


Sorry Fix your priorities or get a new Gf. 


This. Image IPB

#244
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 05:34

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AlanC9 wrote...

MofineBovine wrote...
There is a game you may have heard of, its called Baulder's Gate 2.


Can someone explain to me why so many BG2 fans can't spell the name right?


Probably get it confused with the word "boulder."

#245
Vaeliorin
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 06:28

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AlanC9 wrote...

MofineBovine wrote...
There is a game you may have heard of, its called Baulder's Gate 2.

Can someone explain to me why so many BG2 fans can't spell the name right?

I think they're trying to prove that being a BG2 fan doesn't automatically make you smarter than the average person.  :devil:

#246
Behindyounow
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 07:46

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Maverick827 wrote...

Actually, the wise thing to do would be to add multiplayer intelligently and without detriment to the single player experience.  


Impossible, unless EA gives Bioware a limitless budget to make a game.

#247
Lintanis
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 08:13

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 Had to be done lol

Image IPB

#248
Behindyounow
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 08:20

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This one always keeps coming back. Fire, acid, cutting it into millions of pieces and scattering them to the four winds in their own seperate mirror lined boxes...



It always comes back. Always.

#249
Marcus8958
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 08:44

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Behindyounow wrote...

Maverick827 wrote...

Actually, the wise thing to do would be to add multiplayer intelligently and without detriment to the single player experience.  


Impossible, unless EA gives Bioware a limitless budget to make a game.

Its not impossible. Just look at DAO, They spent money on making a achievements system that caters to the typical Modern Warfare player on Xbox or the World of Warcraft player.

Modifié par Marcus8958, 30 septembre 2010 - 08:44 .

#250
Behindyounow
Posté 30 septembre 2010 - 09:06

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Marcus8958 wrote...

Its not impossible. Just look at DAO, They spent money on making a achievements system that caters to the typical Modern Warfare player on Xbox or the World of Warcraft player.


I would think adding achievements would cost a lot less time and money than adding a multiplayer component.

Although yes, the achievements are a waste of money and development time that could've bettered singleplayer too. But not by much, I'd wager.
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