436 réponses à ce sujet

[sage_viper]

I decided to make this thread because of the many threads going very much off topic with various concerns about the game. Let this be a more organized "Concerns" thread that hopefully BioWare can look at and take note from their many fans.

RULES OF THE THREAD:
-Constructive Criticism ONLY.
     Please only post things you don't like and WHY. Explain possible changes you would suggest.
-No flaming.
     Please respect the opinions of others. This should go without saying.
-No new information without a link to prove it.
     We don't want people to start mobbing BioWare over a rumor, please back up any surprising claims.
-No bashing on BioWare.
     You may not be happy with some of their decisions, but still respect that they do reserve the right to do whatthey want, it's their game 
-We're here to talk about the game, not how they market it. Stay on topic, please 

RELEVANT INFO

• Dragon Age 2 Announcement - Dragon Age website
  "BioWare has confirmed that Dragon Age 2, the sequel to the 2009 RPG of the Year, is in development. Dragon Age 2 progresses the epic saga, as you take on the role of Hawke, a survivor of the Blight and the hero who will change the world forever."
  http://dragonage.bioware.com/
  
• Minor Plot Details/Screen shots - Dragon Age 2 Website
  http://dragonage.bioware.com/da2/
  
• Press Release details and release date change - Kotaku
  http://kotaku.com/55...-very-different
  (Release now pegged for March 2011)
  
• 5 Facts about Hawke - Game Informer
  http://gameinformer....gon-age-ii.aspx
  
• Regarding PC Strategy gameplay and Dialog Wheel - Kotaku
  http://kotaku.com/55...fects-footsteps

Refer to this thread for all up-to-date info


And one final note:
To those of you who find it necessary to flame those of us who have concerns about a game we care very much for, please understand that the meaning of this thread is to voice concerns about things that are already known. Speculation is welcome, of course, but should only be taken seriously if there is a logical argument to go along with it. But for the most part, I'd like to keep this thread FACT BASED, and as a place where people can safely discuss that which they are disappointed is being left out, changed, or otherwise ignored.

Modifié par sage_viper, 13 juillet 2010 - 06:10 .

[sage_viper]

I guess the big concern is the assumed push towards Mass Effect, and lessening the RPG elements. Even action games like Oblivion give you race selection... and they're taking that away? This has obviously been covered several times, and is obviously not very welcome.

[ThomasAndrew]

Dumbing down the gameplay.

Modifié par ThomasAndrew, 08 juillet 2010 - 07:15 .

[Anathemic]

Massive transition from Origins to 'set character'

[IrishSpectre257]

The game not being as awesome as it sounds.

[Zurei]

A different combat system, a new art style, giving us pre-determined player character sounds all very Fable-ish to me.



Also, im dissapointed they're not carrying on with Origin's Warden's story, but I guess thats more of a pet annoyance than a concern.

[Vicious]

Damn near all the posters already broke the 'rules' outlined in the first thread.



Very sad, cannot even voice concerns properly.



Here's mine:



There's a LOT of silhouettes. I hope they aren't all companions - simply because that many companions means they'll all be less interesting.



HOWEVER, the game takes place over a decade, so naturally some would come and go with the passage of time. Some will live, some will die.



So i'm holding out hope.

[Anathemic]

I wouldn't care if the first character wasn't carried over or not, in fact I'm relieved to have a new story and whatnot, what disappoints me is that there is no 'Origins' to really flesh out and personalize my character.

[TheMufflon]

I think 'Hawke' is an awful name. Other than that I have no concerns, since there really hasn't been any information released to be concerned about.

[Itanius]

Fewer replay possibilities. Probably the best part of DA:O for me was being able to play through each origin with different races, genders, classes, and builds. Now there'll be one hero with one storyline (albeit many choices on where to take him/her). The replay possibilities are much smaller.

Single-player games are heavily dependant, in my opinion, on replay value. DLCs alleviate that a bit, but replayability is still a huge factor.

Modifié par Itanius, 08 juillet 2010 - 07:25 .

[screwoffreg]

I don't get it. Dragon Age sold better than ME 2, so why are they taking elements of ME 2 in DA 2? Hmmmm...at least I can always love Morrowind...

[kyles3]

my concern is that the first bits of info they've put out all point towards turning dragon age into mass effect with swords.

[Valmy]

filaminstrel wrote...

Hm, well I'm concerned with this line: "Rise to power... by any means necessary."

Is this just a shrewd marketing gimmick to appeal to the target audience, or will I have no choice but to play an ambitious, self-serving character, full of bitterness, brooding and angst as a substitute for actual personality traits, and heedless of those trodden underfoot in his quest for ultimate power (or "for the greater good," as such things go,
crossing the moral event horizon in the process)? Or is that too much to speculate on based on one line?

Granted, I doubt Bioware would impose such a personality mandatorily upon your character, because they've always been pretty good regarding dialog options and such. Still, that line of marketing makes me uncomfortable.

Do not trust Bioware marketing.  It is designed to sell games not accurately portray the game being sold.  I refer you to most of the marketing stuff about DA.

[mordy_was_here]

Vicious wrote...

Damn near all the posters already broke the 'rules' outlined in the first thread.

Very sad, cannot even voice concerns properly.

Here's mine:

There's a LOT of silhouettes. I hope they aren't all companions - simply because that many companions means they'll all be less interesting.

HOWEVER, the game takes place over a decade, so naturally some would come and go with the passage of time. Some will live, some will die.

So i'm holding out hope.

Sorry, where are you seeing the silhouettes? Maybe I just haven't perused the website enough.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Valmy wrote...
Do not trust Bioware marketing.  It is designed to sell games not accurately portray the game being sold.  I refer you to most of the marketing stuff about DA.

I think that's more of EA's doing given the drastic Heel Face Turn of the marketing for DA after EA signed on, but essentially, I agree.  If the marketing was to be believed, DA was Marilyn Manson + Dragons + Sex.  Which it very much was not XD

And while I don't MIND having a fully voiced protagonist, it will upset me just a wee bit.  One of the nice things about not having a set voice for the character is the role-playing flexibility.  The writers can come up with more dialogue options for the PC, and you can imagine your PC's voice, intonation, inflection, verbal tics, etc. in any way you please.  Jennifer Hale (and Mark Meer to a lesser extent) did a good job of keeping a reasonably neutral inflection in the ME2 voice work so you could read whatever you wanted into it, but there were still moments where I went, "OK, my Shepard would not sound like that."  Mostly when accidentally hitting on Jacob.  

[Gerudan]

So the character generation is now more like in ME2, if I understand this right?



I could live with that, but they better not discard the tactical fightsystem.



But my biggest concern is, that my decisions from DA1 will have no meaning in DA2. I like my DA1 character and his group mates, but instead of giving us more time with them in the addon, they already made them disappear and there seems to be little hope, that anyone of them will be in DA2 (except perhaps for Morrigan, who could be the mother of the hero, although that would be way to obvious).

[sage_viper]

Another thing I'm worried about is mage characters. Well, not really worried because I'm not a mage, but just confused about.



Their own lore says that the Chantry takes all mages at a young age to the Circle and train them to use their magic. Hawke obviously doesn't sound like a mage character, because he likely lives in a town, probably in the Bannorn (I'm speculating). The Chantry and Templars should almost definitely have a presence wherever Hawke is from, and it isn't likely that a family of commoners could hide a mage for such a long time.



Yes, Morrigan was able to get away with it, but she was basically the Witch of the Wilds and they could easily evade. Conor only got away with it for the short amount of time he did because his family had money to keep it a secret. But even then, he didn't get away with it for long.



So how are they going to handle a mage character without drilling a large hole through their own lore?

[Kinthalis ThornBlade]

I'll repost my reply from elsewhere.



The marketing right now is vague (as is all marketing) and it's hard to draw any conclusions based on what has been released so far. The only real thing we know in any concrete way is that we won't have options for race. We are not playing "our" character. We are playing Hawke the human. Just as we did Shepherd the space marine.



And that sucks. Truly sucks.



DA was harped as the "spiritual successor" to Baldur's Gate. That means certain things to me that DA:O (mostly) delivered on. Mainly: a tactical combat system, detailed stats and loot, a complex storyline that I can shape and mold by my actions and a lot of freedom in choosing who my character is what characteristics define him/her, etc. So far the marketing has chopped off that last bit significantly since (and specially in the DA universe) race colors so much of how the player interacts with and is affected by the world.



Hell, before today one of the things I had assumed to be a safe bet was that we'd get MORE race choices to choose from (Q'nari anyone?) in a sequel of this game, not less. Not just one!



The other aspects of a Baldur's Gate "spiritual successor" have not been touched (yet), only time will tell as to how those aspects fare, but I'm not as hopeful as I once was.



So although change can often times be good, and fear of all change is a silly attitude to have, change that does not bring with it something interesting to play (change for the sake of change), or change the game so much that it's not what the fans signed up for in the first place, is not something I would be terribly happy about.



Undoubtedly the number 1 complain of console gamers for DA played a role in this decision: No voice over for the main character.



So I'm guessing we will be seeing a fully voiced over character coming in DA2, and I'm sure that will make a lot of people happy. Not me though. Compare the length of BG2 to Dragon Age. Now compare the length of Dragon Age to Mass Effect. Expect a 15-30 hour game tops, and not the epic game that DA:O is.

[Khayness]

sage_viper wrote...

So how are they going to handle a mage character without drilling a large hole through their own lore?

Thermal Clips

My only concern that it won't be a Dragon Age game. More like Jade Empire set in Thedas (which isn't neccesarily a bad thing). Or Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance

Modifié par Khayness, 08 juillet 2010 - 07:42 .

[sage_viper]

To all the people talking about Marketing, that is NOT what we're discussing. We're discussing design elements of Dragon Age 2. Thanks.

[Phazor58]

My criticism is probably the same as many others.  I don't like that they're moving in the direction of Mass Effect.  I loved ME1 and ME2, and I also loved DA:O and Awakening.  But I liked them for different reasons, and I don't want to just be playing ME in a fantasy setting.  DA:O became my favorite game (of all time) after I completed it, primarily because it used so many RPG elements that I truly enjoyed - the biggest of those elements being customization and choice.  I enjoyed being able to choose my character's race, his background, his appearance, and his personality (which changed as both he and I learned from experiences in the game and adapted).  I felt much more connected to the Warden than I did to my Commander Shepard because I took such a deep role in creating him and fleshing him out as a character.

So now with being limited to playing as Hawke, I can only hope that what I did with my Warden will actually have some effect on the story of DA2.  That's where most of my concern lies.  Playing as my Warden, I felt a sense of power from being able to shape the landscape of the world around me through my decisions.  If those decisions have no effect on what occurs in DA2...if Bioware takes up a canon story and disregards what I did with my character in DA:O and Awakening to create this new gameplay style, then I will be sorely dissapointed in the Dragon Age team for essentially making the gamer feel like their playthroughs of DA:O and Awakening were worthless.

So please Bioware, make sure that our Wardens actually have an effect on the world of DA2.  That would allay my concerns.

[Dave of Canada]

Assumption of main character having voice acting.

[sage_viper]

Phazor58 wrote...

My criticism is probably the same as many others.  I don't like that they're moving in the direction of Mass Effect.  I loved ME1 and ME2, and I also loved DA:O and Awakening.  But I liked them for different reasons, and I don't want to just be playing ME in a fantasy setting.  DA:O became my favorite game (of all time) after I completed it, primarily because it used so many RPG elements that I truly enjoyed - the biggest of those elements being customization and choice.  I enjoyed being able to choose my character's race, his background, his appearance, and his personality (which changed as both he and I learned from experiences in the game and adapted).  I felt much more connected to the Warden than I did to my Commander Shepard because I took such a deep role in creating him and fleshing him out as a character.

So now with being limited to playing as Hawke, I can only hope that what I did with my Warden will actually have some effect on the story of DA2.  That's where most of my concern lies.  Playing as my Warden, I felt a sense of power from being able to shape the landscape of the world around me through my decisions.  If those decisions have no effect on what occurs in DA2...if Bioware takes up a canon story and disregards what I did with my character in DA:O and Awakening to create this new gameplay style, then I will be sorely dissapointed in the Dragon Age team for essentially making the gamer feel like their playthroughs of DA:O and Awakening were worthless.

So please Bioware, make sure that our Wardens actually have an effect on the world of DA2.  That would allay my concerns.

Yeah, if they could make it possible to upload your save game from DA:O/Awakening, just to put in your decisions, that would make me very happy. Otherwise we'll just be stuck in a standard Thedas where some Wardens came and did generic stuff, rather than our own personal worlds. That's what I like about Origins, for the first time I feel that my game is different from your game, or anyone else's game.

And I'm worried that this aspect of the series is just going to go down the drain... Tough moral decisions? Who cares, the game is probably going to end up the same anyway.

[Anathemic]

Kinthalis ThornBlade wrote...

I'll repost my reply from elsewhere.

The marketing right now is vague (as is all marketing) and it's hard to draw any conclusions based on what has been released so far. The only real thing we know in any concrete way is that we won't have options for race. We are not playing "our" character. We are playing Hawke the human. Just as we did Shepherd the space marine.

And that sucks. Truly sucks.

DA was harped as the "spiritual successor" to Baldur's Gate. That means certain things to me that DA:O (mostly) delivered on. Mainly: a tactical combat system, detailed stats and loot, a complex storyline that I can shape and mold by my actions and a lot of freedom in choosing who my character is what characteristics define him/her, etc. So far the marketing has chopped off that last bit significantly since (and specially in the DA universe) race colors so much of how the player interacts with and is affected by the world.

Hell, before today one of the things I had assumed to be a safe bet was that we'd get MORE race choices to choose from (Q'nari anyone?) in a sequel of this game, not less. Not just one!

The other aspects of a Baldur's Gate "spiritual successor" have not been touched (yet), only time will tell as to how those aspects fare, but I'm not as hopeful as I once was.

So although change can often times be good, and fear of all change is a silly attitude to have, change that does not bring with it something interesting to play (change for the sake of change), or change the game so much that it's not what the fans signed up for in the first place, is not something I would be terribly happy about.

Undoubtedly the number 1 complain of console gamers for DA played a role in this decision: No voice over for the main character.

So I'm guessing we will be seeing a fully voiced over character coming in DA2, and I'm sure that will make a lot of people happy. Not me though. Compare the length of BG2 to Dragon Age. Now compare the length of Dragon Age to Mass Effect. Expect a 15-30 hour game tops, and not the epic game that DA:O is.

While this is unfortunantly true, I am a console gamer and I prefer no voices for my chracters <_<