924 réponses à ce sujet

[mopotter]

the_one_54321 wrote...

mopotter wrote...
Right.  Romance Alistair and have a choice to send him to have sex with Morrigan, die or recruit Loghain and have Alistair take off because of course you don't listen to your love interest, you leave.  

If sex with Morrigan had been one choice I would have been fine with it and I and would have done it to see what happened.  But it was the only choice if you wanted both of  you to live.  Gerrrrrrrrr that makes me very irritated.  He listens to a friend but not his love interest.

1. DA:O was not intended to have a sunshine and rainbows ending. Bad things were supposed to happen no matter what you did.
2. You betray Alistair by not killing Loghain. Look at it from that angle to determine if him leaving makes sense or not. Right now you're seeing it only from character's point of view where she feels betrayed that he abandoned her because of the choice she made.
3. One of you has to die. Alistair would rather die than let Loghain live. If he sleeps with Morrigan he can live. It's a difficult situation, but it is such as it is. That's awesome story telling. They give you something realistic, where there is no "perfect solution." 

Realistic?  your kidding right?  I'm not saying it's not an awesome story telling.  But I am saying that as a love interest you should have more pull with Alistair than you do as a friend.  

# - Alistair would rather die unless he is Marrying Loghain's daughter and you as a friend talked him into agreeing to let Loghain fight the dragon.  He didn't like it, he didn't fight along side you, but he says afterwards that it was a good call.  So in your reality, you would do what your best friend says and not your husband or wife or fiance.  This is my problem with this ending.  And I will continue to have this viewpoint for the next million years.  

[Games4ever]

elearon1 wrote...

mopotter wrote...

Fangirl17 wrote...

Bioware should just be braver,its a rated M game. Gawd this frustrates me. Leave Bioware alone FOX >.<

It always frustrates me too.  I start yelling at the tv - M you people M mature - not K for kids.  

Agreed, it makes me sad to see how many things a Mature game feels obligated to shy - if not outright flee - away from.

In the christian world is nudity and sex some of the worst on earth

there you have the reason

[mopotter]

rolson00 wrote...

i stayed his friend (female dalish warden zev my LI) got loghain after loghains joining i went stright to alistair and talked to him just chose the ones to stay his friend (course i got getting him and anora to marry before hand ) then got loghain to have sex with morrigan

Exactly.  In my opinion, and I know there are a lot who disagree, if someone says they love you, you should have more influence with them than if you are just their friend.  

[the_one_54321]

mopotter wrote...

# - Alistair would rather die unless he is Marrying Loghain's daughter and you as a friend talked him into agreeing to let Loghain fight the dragon.  He didn't like it, he didn't fight along side you, but he says afterwards that it was a good call.  So in your reality, you would do what your best friend says and not your husband or wife or fiance.  This is my problem with this ending.  And I will continue to have this viewpoint for the next million years.

You can do that as a love interest as well. Except he leaves you to marry Anora. The whole point of that route is that you harden him up to make tough, unemotional decisions. He leaves the woman he loves, pardons the man he desperately wants to kill, and marries a woman he doesn't really know, all in the interest of doing what is best for everyone.

[mordy_was_here]

Gemaphrodite wrote...

Bah! I don't care about the good of Ferelden. I want Alistair to make me his wife; his Queen, and then I want to have hot smexy time with Loghain on the side.

And I thought I was the only one...

[phaonica]

Mel213 wrote...

Gemaphrodite wrote...

Bah! I don't care about the good of Ferelden. I want Alistair to make me his wife; his Queen, and then I want to have hot smexy time with Loghain on the side.

And I thought I was the only one...

Did someone say smexy time with Loghain?

[rolson00]

phaonica wrote...

Mel213 wrote...

Gemaphrodite wrote...

Bah! I don't care about the good of Ferelden. I want Alistair to make me his wife; his Queen, and then I want to have hot smexy time with Loghain on the side.

And I thought I was the only one...

Did someone say smexy time with Loghain?

  phaonica how did you get that hair very funky i like

Modifié par rolson00, 14 juillet 2010 - 11:51 .

[mopotter]

the_one_54321 wrote...

mopotter wrote...

# - Alistair would rather die unless he is Marrying Loghain's daughter and you as a friend talked him into agreeing to let Loghain fight the dragon.  He didn't like it, he didn't fight along side you, but he says afterwards that it was a good call.  So in your reality, you would do what your best friend says and not your husband or wife or fiance.  This is my problem with this ending.  And I will continue to have this viewpoint for the next million years.

You can do that as a love interest as well. Except he leaves you to marry Anora. The whole point of that route is that you harden him up to make tough, unemotional decisions. He leaves the woman he loves, pardons the man he desperately wants to kill, and marries a woman he doesn't really know, all in the interest of doing what is best for everyone.

Nope.  Sorry, I will never accept this.

I will continue to love BioWare and enjoy their games.  But this was just wrong.  There were 4 backgrounds and in one of the endings he should have listened to his 100% love interest just as much as he would a friend.  He goes off and gets drunk and disappears instead of  if being sensible.  He does not love you (in this situation) no matter what he may say.   If my husband said anything this dumb - "I'm going to die because I hate the man who could die in my place."  I'd hit him in the head with a bucket of slops and tell him to get over it.     My husband agreed.  He would rather send some man he hates to die and live to spend the rest of his nights with me.  (and this was before I told him I'd dump a bucket of slops on his head.)   I'm going to stop because I don't want to get so sidetracked and lectured.  We are supposed to be talking about DA2. So just accept the fact I will never agree with you and I'll accept the fact that you and many others, don't understand my point of view.

[phaonica]

rolson00 wrote...

phaonica wrote...

Mel213 wrote...

Gemaphrodite wrote...

Bah! I don't care about the good of Ferelden. I want Alistair to make me his wife; his Queen, and then I want to have hot smexy time with Loghain on the side.

And I thought I was the only one...

Did someone say smexy time with Loghain?

  phaonica how did you get that hair very funky i like

Oh, TY.  I think it's from the More Hairstyles mod

[rolson00]

darn iv got the ps3 version
 well im going to love and leave you all its bed time for me

Modifié par rolson00, 15 juillet 2010 - 12:04 .

[RPGmom28]

Simfam, if the male romance option looked like your avatar, I'd be damn happy.

[elearon1]

How about an abusive relationship? It starts off nice enough but the person gets more and more abusive until your other companions start commenting on it and you have to try and get away.



Or a Stalker ... well, I hear Leliana was something of a stalker but since I always romanced her I never noticed. (and the few times I tried romancing someone else I felt so bad about it I dumbed them for her)



The point being there are many more complicated relationship dynamics than "lets talk nice til we fall in love"

[errant_knight]

elearon1 wrote...

How about an abusive relationship? It starts off nice enough but the person gets more and more abusive until your other companions start commenting on it and you have to try and get away.

Or a Stalker ... well, I hear Leliana was something of a stalker but since I always romanced her I never noticed. (and the few times I tried romancing someone else I felt so bad about it I dumbed them for her)

The point being there are many more complicated relationship dynamics than "lets talk nice til we fall in love"

Dude. You're creeping me out. First you want Hawke to get it on with his sister, and now this.

[mordy_was_here]

elearon1 wrote...

How about an abusive relationship? It starts off nice enough but the person gets more and more abusive until your other companions start commenting on it and you have to try and get away.

Or a Stalker ... well, I hear Leliana was something of a stalker but since I always romanced her I never noticed. (and the few times I tried romancing someone else I felt so bad about it I dumbed them for her)

The point being there are many more complicated relationship dynamics than "lets talk nice til we fall in love"

You're kidding, right? Sarcasm is hard to detect over the net.

[Tantum Dic Verbo]

I see I'm late to the party, but I'll throw in my preference, anyway. I'd like to see romances without the obligatory sex scene. The sex scenes in these games are almost invariably forced and stilted. I'd also like to see the chance to better develop affirming, platonic relationships with potential love interests.

[errant_knight]

Mel213 wrote...

elearon1 wrote...

How about an abusive relationship? It starts off nice enough but the person gets more and more abusive until your other companions start commenting on it and you have to try and get away.

Or a Stalker ... well, I hear Leliana was something of a stalker but since I always romanced her I never noticed. (and the few times I tried romancing someone else I felt so bad about it I dumbed them for her)

The point being there are many more complicated relationship dynamics than "lets talk nice til we fall in love"

You're kidding, right? Sarcasm is hard to detect over the net.

I really don't think he is....

[kaispan]

mopotter wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

mopotter wrote...

# - Alistair would rather die unless he is Marrying Loghain's daughter and you as a friend talked him into agreeing to let Loghain fight the dragon.  He didn't like it, he didn't fight along side you, but he says afterwards that it was a good call.  So in your reality, you would do what your best friend says and not your husband or wife or fiance.  This is my problem with this ending.  And I will continue to have this viewpoint for the next million years.

You can do that as a love interest as well. Except he leaves you to marry Anora. The whole point of that route is that you harden him up to make tough, unemotional decisions. He leaves the woman he loves, pardons the man he desperately wants to kill, and marries a woman he doesn't really know, all in the interest of doing what is best for everyone.

Nope.  Sorry, I will never accept this.

I will continue to love BioWare and enjoy their games.  But this was just wrong.  There were 4 backgrounds and in one of the endings he should have listened to his 100% love interest just as much as he would a friend.  He goes off and gets drunk and disappears instead of  if being sensible.  He does not love you (in this situation) no matter what he may say.   If my husband said anything this dumb - "I'm going to die because I hate the man who could die in my place."  I'd hit him in the head with a bucket of slops and tell him to get over it.     My husband agreed.  He would rather send some man he hates to die and live to spend the rest of his nights with me.  (and this was before I told him I'd dump a bucket of slops on his head.)   I'm going to stop because I don't want to get so sidetracked and lectured.  We are supposed to be talking about DA2. So just accept the fact I will never agree with you and I'll accept the fact that you and many others, don't understand my point of view.

As far as understanding points of view go, I would have agreed with you till I read some of what Gaider had to say on the matter (as in, looking at it from Alistair's POV not your character's), and that's aside from "I'm going to die because I hate the man who could die in my place" being something only you as a player are aware of at that point...but yeah, sorry didn't mean to derail this farther; you said you're not really looking for an explanation so much as an agree to disagree kind of thing. ^^;

As far as DA2 goes I would enjoy more complicated tragic horrible endings and emotional confrontations because that really brings the game to life to me, in a punch-you-in-the-gut from the computer screen kind of way.  I had a completely visceral reaction to Alistair's breakup speech (first playthrough I put him on the throne, unhardened ) and right when he started talking I just had this horrible sinking feeling and I could tell what he was going to say-- literally felt like I had just gotten dumped, I was so surprised. And I mean, that sucked... but damn was it cool that it really hit me. I wasn't expecting it at all.

I know that's not to everyone's taste, but I find anything that can affect me that strongly enough to leave me feeling something after (good book/movie/etc) to be infinitely more meaningful than a happily-ever-after.

[stevej713]

Tantum Dic Verbo wrote...

I see I'm late to the party, but I'll throw in my preference, anyway. I'd like to see romances without the obligatory sex scene. The sex scenes in these games are almost invariably forced and stilted. I'd also like to see the chance to better develop affirming, platonic relationships with potential love interests.

I heartily agree with you.  Relationships are very important to human beings, and they don't always have to be sexual.  I, for example, have very good friends, but I would never for a minute consider having a sexual relationship with them.

Modifié par stevej713, 15 juillet 2010 - 12:33 .

[Endurium]

They might as well stick to writing friendships; the romances tend to be friendships + action figures + obligatory night in the sack, and that's about it. David called me out when I mentioned Safiya from NWN2:MotB, yet nothing in DA:O seemed like much of an improvement (unless he was talking about the kiss loop and the one night stand).

I felt closer to Shale than anyone else after most of my games.

My favorite 'romance' companions remain Aerie (especially in ToB), Nathyrra (NWN:HotU; alas her dialog dries up immediately after professing her love halfway through the campaign), and Safiya who thankfully has no kissing or sex scene(s), but she is loyal and we always end up together in my games. (Kissing could work if the animation wasn't cringe-inducing).

Heck sometimes it'd be nice just to see the couple hold each other in silence for a moment. I wonder if Bioware has any experience with love.

Modifié par Endurium, 15 juillet 2010 - 12:40 .

[elearon1]

errant_knight wrote...

Dude. You're creeping me out. First you want Hawke to get it on with his sister, and now this.

I think you missed the following quote: "The point being there are many more complicated relationship dynamics than "lets talk nice til we fall in love" "

The point is that romances could be more complex and involved than they currently are.  Obviously not many people are going to want to play an abusive relationship - but maybe a scenario where you have to save an npc from an abusive relationship and later she becomes a potential LI, but with certain baggage.  

Maybe a situation where you pursue a relationship for awhile and the person continues to turn you down as nicely as possible (unrequited love thing) ... later you learn this was because the two of you are related, or she knows something that would forever stand between you.

Or you fall in love with a married woman/man and have to deal with questions about whether or not to break up their marriage, etc.  

Of you start a relationship with a woman but end up being captured and held as a prisoner of war for a year ... when you return she has moved on and become involved with someone else.  What do you do?

Complications make for great story - that is what I am saying.

[mordy_was_here]

Meh.

Modifié par Mel213, 15 juillet 2010 - 12:42 .

[elearon1]

>>This seems to be a reoccuring theme with you.<<



Because it makes for an interesting story and one you don't see much. I think you are seriously obsessing on the wrong thing here.

[ejoslin]

mopotter wrote...

# - Alistair would rather die unless he is Marrying Loghain's daughter and you as a friend talked him into agreeing to let Loghain fight the dragon.  He didn't like it, he didn't fight along side you, but he says afterwards that it was a good call.  So in your reality, you would do what your best friend says and not your husband or wife or fiance.  This is my problem with this ending.  And I will continue to have this viewpoint for the next million years.

There is no difference in the ending you are talking about no matter what the approval.  If you spared Loghain and got Alistair to marry Anora, there's bad blood between him and the warden.  There is no flag for "relationship cut off" or "still in love" or any approval level of anything in that post coronation ceremony.  

Edit: What he says at the Landsmeet, however, is different if you're in a relationship with him. But the ending?  It's the same.

Modifié par ejoslin, 15 juillet 2010 - 12:50 .