516 réponses à ce sujet

[Saibh]

crimzontearz wrote...

I wanted to say something about a particular concept I found rather.....interesting about this.

"I did not know you could make a female shepard"

no this is not an attack toward anyone but how could anyone not kbow? it was said a number of times in previews, interviews and reviews both online and on paper magazines. Hell by the time ME1 came out I knew the name of each squaddie and who was romanceable as well as some of the inner workings of the system. By the time Dead space came out I knew mostly everything there was to know about the atmosphere, the new UI (or lack of it) and several other details that surfaced over the months.

So perhaps this is the difference between an hardcore gamer and a casual. The hardcore gamer will do the research, will listen to podcasts, watch previews online and vidocs and such, they will read articles and previews whereas the casual gamer will only skim the surface and perhaps look at the official site .
Same as the difference between someone who likes cars and an actual aficionado who subscribes to 4 wheels monthly and reads lots of publications

just throwing it there

When Dragon Age II was announced, people were freaking out left and right because we thought we couldn't play a female Hawke--it was actually mentioned, briefly, in the preview, but people missed it.

FemShep gets so little exposure that you'd be hard-pressed to find more than one or two official screenshots of her, any video footage or much mention outside the occasional "Oh, yeah, you can pick a girl, too".

Plenty of people picked up the game and were incredibly surprised to see a female customization option. Perhaps you don't realize it because playing as a woman isn't particularly important to you and you don't focus on it--of course you know you can play as a female, but how can you be so sure everyone else is?

Marketing may mention it occasionally, but not everyone reads every interview, every preview, every review. And when so many gloss over or simply don't mention the fact, it's not common knowledge. Think about how many DA2 reviews are saying the same thing over and over and over again, when we know all this.

Marketing doesn't pander to the people suckling on the news drip. Most people (even dedicated fans of the game) don't scour the web looking for information.

Modifié par Saibh, 20 décembre 2010 - 08:13 .

[SarEnyaDor]

Some hardcore gamers also like to not be spoiled, so carefully avoid discussions that might tip them off. For example, I had no idea until I was playing ME2 who Archangel really was, and I was so friggin excited I called my husband up and was jumping up and down. Admittedly this ruined it for him, but you see my point?



With the way story spoilers are thrown around left and right in reviews if you like to not metagame, and like to be surprised by the story you CAN'T do alot more research than a casual glance, and even then sometimes you know details you didn't want to know.



I really don't see how ONE screen shot on the website showing gender selection would detract, take away, destroy, or confuse any marketing plan.

[crimzontearz]

it was kinda staring at you right in the face tho....it is in sooooo many articles.

[SarEnyaDor]

I pre-ordered the Collector's Edition as soon as it was available at Amazon, then pre-ordered a regular copy from Gamestop I think (to get more codes LOL) and then I avoided much of the forums - it was easy to do, had DA to distract me. LOL

[Saibh]

crimzontearz wrote...

it was kinda staring at you right in the face tho....it is in sooooo many articles.

No, it is isn't. Off-hand mentions here or there. Nothing in videos, almost nothing in screenshots. Only occasionally in previews--usually it's mentioned in reviews, though.

Again, FemShep gets almost no mention in marketing. BioWare's marketing. Not what the previewers choose to say or not say. If someone looked on the Mass Effect website to judge whether they want the game, they probably wouldn't realize you could play as a woman.

[HolyJellyfish]

crimzontearz wrote...

it was kinda staring at you right in the face tho....it is in sooooo many articles.

Were you a fan of Mass Effect before you read about it?

Because that could make a difference.

I'm just saying. I didn't know about the franchise. I was really not interested in any of bioware's games at all because of lack of lady-exposure, until I saw that fan trailer.

[HolyJellyfish]

Saibh wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

it was kinda staring at you right in the face tho....it is in sooooo many articles.

No, it is isn't. Off-hand mentions here or there. Nothing in videos, almost nothing in screenshots. Only occasionally in previews--usually it's mentioned in reviews, though.

Again, FemShep gets almost no mention in marketing. BioWare's marketing. Not what the previewers choose to say or not say. If someone looked on the Mass Effect website to judge whether they want the game, they probably wouldn't realize you could play as a woman.

You don't. There's no mention of her. Not even in Mass Effect 2's Q&A

(EDIT)

Hell, they don't even offer a Female Avatar in their media content area. Not even a freaking 100x100 icon.

That's just ridiculous.

Modifié par HolyJellyfish, 20 décembre 2010 - 08:32 .

[crimzontearz]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...
it was kinda staring at you right in the face tho....it is in sooooo many articles.

Were you a fan of Mass Effect before you read about it?
Because that could make a difference.
I'm just saying. I didn't know about the franchise. I was really not interested in any of bioware's games at all because of lack of lady-exposure, until I saw that fan trailer.

It was mentioned in some of the very first videos and announcements. Also aside for sonic and MDK all bioware games allow for gender customization.

I know that because I played some and because I read about games in general not just what I am 100% interested in.
But that is not the point.

As I said before mine was just a consideration.

[Ziggeh]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

And I agree, I'm okay with iconic. It doesn't hurt to have the alternative to that icon on the website with explanation, or to make it very clear that there is an alternative available during interviews, etc.

That's what I'm saying: I think it does hurt. Here's a clumsy example: Imagine if coca cola had two logos, one they used 90% or the time, and one they used the rest. When you go to recall the coca cola logo, it's not longer the simple, clear cut brand identity, but a slightly fuzzier "well it's mostly this one".

Now, I personally wouldn't say that that effect is worth not making it very clear that the protagonist is customisable, I think that's a really important feature of the game, but if I were advising them as to safe marketing practice....well, actually I'd tell them to stick both on the box, but if I worked in marketing I would have probably had my soul removed, and would be merrily steering the advertising boat into the safe and well chartered waters of sticking a macho bloke front and center and shouting "Grrr, be like him. Make blood come out of stuff and get chicks."

[HolyJellyfish]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

And I agree, I'm okay with iconic. It doesn't hurt to have the alternative to that icon on the website with explanation, or to make it very clear that there is an alternative available during interviews, etc.

That's what I'm saying: I think it does hurt. Here's a clumsy example: Imagine if coca cola had two logos, one they used 90% or the time, and one they used the rest. When you go to recall the coca cola logo, it's not longer the simple, clear cut brand identity, but a slightly fuzzier "well it's mostly this one".

Now, I personally wouldn't say that that effect is worth not making it very clear that the protagonist is customisable, I think that's a really important feature of the game, but if I were advising them as to safe marketing practice....well, actually I'd tell them to stick both on the box, but if I worked in marketing I would have probably had my soul removed, and would be merrily steering the advertising boat into the safe and well chartered waters of sticking a macho bloke front and center and shouting "Grrr, be like him. Make blood come out of stuff and get chicks."

How would having information on the website and two screen caps hurt the advertisement campaign? And do you have an alternative idea to reach out to the female audience without disenchanting the men?

I'm really here mostly to hear constructive advice, not be told it can't be done.

[What is this]

filaminstrel wrote...

Hm, Stanley Woo redirected the Oghren thread here? Not sure this is the droid he was looking for...

Lol


Use Oghren to attract the female market!

[Wishpig]

What is this wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

Hm, Stanley Woo redirected the Oghren thread here? Not sure this is the droid he was looking for...

Lol


Use Oghren to attract the female market!

Lol! Yes, thats Oghren's best trait, he appeals to female gamers everywhere. Unlike that dorky Varric. F*** slapping a picture of femhawke on the website, put some images of a shirtless Oghren! Women won't even CARE if there's a female character creation option.

Modifié par Wishpig, 20 décembre 2010 - 09:40 .

[What is this]

Wishpig wrote...

What is this wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

Hm, Stanley Woo redirected the Oghren thread here? Not sure this is the droid he was looking for...

Lol


Use Oghren to attract the female market!

Lol! Yes, thats Oghren's best trait, he appeals to female gamers everywhere. Unlike that dorky Varric.

/thread

[HolyJellyfish]

filaminstrel wrote...

Hm, Stanley Woo redirected the Oghren thread here? Not sure this is the droid he was looking for...

Just message him and tell him he is mistaken.

[Wishpig]

[spam image removed]

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 20 décembre 2010 - 09:58 .

[Ziggeh]

HolyJellyfish wrote...
How would having information on the website and two screen caps hurt the advertisement campaign?

As I explained with the coke example, think of male hawke as a logo, introducing other logo's serves to weaken the brand indentity of the intial logo. It's a bit more complex than that, and I'm not convinced or indeed saying that "harm" is important enough to warrant the current usage, just that the effect exists and is part of the consideration.

HolyJellyfish wrote...
And do you have an alternative idea to reach out to the female audience without disenchanting the men?

I'm really here mostly to hear constructive advice, not be told it can't be done.

Can't say that I do, or at least one that is as easy or effective, I just felt it was important to understand the problems such an approach would face.

[HolyJellyfish]

@Wishpig, @What is this

I'm all fine and dandy about humor, but when it insults the integrity of what a lot of people find to be a serious issue and belittles our opinions, it comes across as irritating. If you want your giggles at our expense, go PM battle one another or find another thread.



If you have something of merit to say that is on topic, feel free to offer.



Otherwise, don't mock it. If you dislike this thread, you can leave.

[What is this]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

@Wishpig, @What is this
I'm all fine and dandy about humor, but when it insults the integrity of what a lot of people find to be a serious issue and belittles our opinions, it comes across as irritating. If you want your giggles at our expense, go PM battle one another or find another thread.

If you have something of merit to say that is on topic, feel free to offer.

Otherwise, don't mock it. If you dislike this thread, you can leave.

Marketing is SRS  buisness

[Wishpig]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

@Wishpig, @What is this
I'm all fine and dandy about humor, but when it insults the integrity of what a lot of people find to be a serious issue and belittles our opinions, it comes across as irritating. If you want your giggles at our expense, go PM battle one another or find another thread.

If you have something of merit to say that is on topic, feel free to offer.

Otherwise, don't mock it. If you dislike this thread, you can leave.

Shirtless Oghren is SRS business also. Don't belittle the sex god.

[HolyJellyfish]

[quote]ziggehunderslash wrote...

[quote]HolyJellyfish wrote...
How would having information on the website and two screen caps hurt the advertisement campaign? [/quote]
As I explained with the coke example, think of male hawke as a logo, introducing other logo's serves to weaken the brand indentity of the intial logo. It's a bit more complex than that, and I'm not convinced or indeed saying that "harm" is important enough to warrant the current usage, just that the effect exists and is part of the consideration.
[/quote]

But that's not true in the case of Dragon Age, at least, not imo. You already have the DA logo. Its a blood splattered dragon. I don't know why there needs to be a male character on their at all, but I imagine it is because the marketing strategies are similar to Mass Effect 2 considering that game's wild success. However, it isn't necessary for the integrity of the game, if you look at Portal, Half Life (a cover that features a male & female), Fable, etc.

Regardless, it seems to be a staple, and so now the question is 'Okay. You are choosing to market to that demograph. That is fine. Just DON'T neglect us'

[quote]HolyJellyfish wrote...
And do you have an alternative idea to reach out to the female audience without disenchanting the men?

I'm really here mostly to hear constructive advice, not be told it can't be done.[/quote]
Can't say that I do, or at least one that is as easy or effective, I just felt it was important to understand the problems such an approach would face.

[/quote]

I understand the problems. And I don't think better information on the website with a screen cap of female hawke in the media area would hurt the advertisement at all. Just to test the female demograph reaction, and if sales seem to be spiking in that area, then it gives Bioware more stats and information if they want to dip into that arena more.

Just trying doesn't hurt. By not trying, who knows how many potential customers they could be losing. Its hypothetical, but its just a few screen grabs and information on a website.

[Ziggeh]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

You already have the DA logo. Its a blood splattered dragon.

..........................

I'm not saying he's literally the logo, I'm saying he works in the same way re the brand identity.

[Wishpig]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

You already have the DA logo. Its a blood splattered dragon.

..........................

I'm not saying he's literally the logo, I'm saying he works in the same way re the brand identity.

Yeah like Gears of War. It has a Logo, but it also has a face (marcus).

[What is this]

Wishpig wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

You already have the DA logo. Its a blood splattered dragon.

..........................

I'm not saying he's literally the logo, I'm saying he works in the same way re the brand identity.

Yeah like Gears of War. It has a Logo, but it also has a face (marcus).

And halo has master chief.