4085 réponses à ce sujet

[DJmacpher]

 I saw the screenshots. I saw the 20-30 year old Hawke. What I DIDN'T see was a big ol' sign say "Days Since Lothering was Destroyed: 1"

So really that sign could say "Years Since Lothering was Destroyed: 10" 

Your screen shots prove nothing, and thus do not support your theory. 

Nor do they prove/disprove my theory. 

The screens shots' effect on our theories is null friend.

[Maniac600]

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

This is not the point they were trying to make. The screenshots you posted have no indication of where or when they took place. Just because there are destroyed buildings in the background does not mean he is in Lothering nor does it mean that it is during the same blight in which it was destroyed.

Hawke could have escaped Lothering when he was a child, and the game could start with Hawke returning to Lothering. Or, it could start with him in Kirkwall. Or, it could start with him on the moon taking a space dragon to planet flaglooga.

This is all speculation, buddy. You have no more evidence than anyone else does at this point.

Did I say it wasn't speculation? No, I didn't. My point is that those screenshots likely represent a giant hole in the theory of the GodBaby fanboys who until yesterday were willing to swear that Hawke was the GodBaby (right up until a dev told them they were wrong).

He doesn't have to be a 'Godbaby' to survive a blight. He just has to be a kid who can run fast. I never said that Hawke is Morrigan's child, I'm just trying to shed light on the chance that Hawke could've escaped at a young age.

[Indoctrination]

DJmacpher wrote...

 I saw the screenshots. I saw the 20-30 year old Hawke. What I DIDN'T see was a big ol' sign say "Days Since Lothering was Destroyed: 1"

So really that sign could say "Years Since Lothering was Destroyed: 10" 

Your screen shots prove nothing, and thus do not support your theory. 

Nor do they prove/disprove my theory.

Either you're going out of your way to ignore the core of my argument or you just don't understand it. I'm saying that based on these screenshots it is far more LIKELY that your theory is wrong. Your damage control doesn't even make sense, if I'm understanding it right. Why would there be darkspawn in Ferelden 10 years after a blight ends? When a blight ends, the darkspawn instinctually retreat into the deep roads.


[

The screens shots' effect on our theories is null friend.

See what I'm saying now? you go out of your way to simply dismiss everything I say. It's pure fanboyism and it makes your argument look weak.

[Indoctrination]

Maniac600 wrote...

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

This is not the point they were trying to make. The screenshots you posted have no indication of where or when they took place. Just because there are destroyed buildings in the background does not mean he is in Lothering nor does it mean that it is during the same blight in which it was destroyed.

Hawke could have escaped Lothering when he was a child, and the game could start with Hawke returning to Lothering. Or, it could start with him in Kirkwall. Or, it could start with him on the moon taking a space dragon to planet flaglooga.

This is all speculation, buddy. You have no more evidence than anyone else does at this point.

Did I say it wasn't speculation? No, I didn't. My point is that those screenshots likely represent a giant hole in the theory of the GodBaby fanboys who until yesterday were willing to swear that Hawke was the GodBaby (right up until a dev told them they were wrong).

He doesn't have to be a 'Godbaby' to survive a blight. He just has to be a kid who can run fast. I never said that Hawke is Morrigan's child, I'm just trying to shed light on the chance that Hawke could've escaped at a young age.

This is becoming frustrating. I'm not saying that you are saying that Hawke is the GodBaby. My point was that many of these GodBaby fanboys shamelessly come up with poorly based theories using weak evidence to make them look like a sure thing, and when they get their theory thrown out they either refuse to accept it, or simply move on to a different poorly based theory. It's one thing to theorize. That's cool. Speculation is fun, and I like to speculate too. It's another thing to become a preacher for a poorly based theory, advertise it in your signature, and dismiss anyone who points out that such a theory isn't a rock solid as some of you may believe. Understand what I'm saying now?

[Maniac600]

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

This is not the point they were trying to make. The screenshots you posted have no indication of where or when they took place. Just because there are destroyed buildings in the background does not mean he is in Lothering nor does it mean that it is during the same blight in which it was destroyed.

Hawke could have escaped Lothering when he was a child, and the game could start with Hawke returning to Lothering. Or, it could start with him in Kirkwall. Or, it could start with him on the moon taking a space dragon to planet flaglooga.

This is all speculation, buddy. You have no more evidence than anyone else does at this point.

Did I say it wasn't speculation? No, I didn't. My point is that those screenshots likely represent a giant hole in the theory of the GodBaby fanboys who until yesterday were willing to swear that Hawke was the GodBaby (right up until a dev told them they were wrong).

He doesn't have to be a 'Godbaby' to survive a blight. He just has to be a kid who can run fast. I never said that Hawke is Morrigan's child, I'm just trying to shed light on the chance that Hawke could've escaped at a young age.

This is becoming frustrating. I'm not saying that you are saying that Hawke is the GodBaby. My point was that many of these GodBaby fanboys shamelessly come up with poorly based theories using weak evidence to make them look like a sure thing, and when they get their theory thrown out they either refuse to accept it, or simply move on to a different poorly based theory. It's one thing to theorize. That's cool. Speculation is fun, and I like to speculate too. It's another thing to become a preacher for a poorly based theory, advertise it in your signature, and dismiss anyone who points out that such a theory isn't a rock solid as some of you may believe. Understand what I'm saying now?

It sounds like you just need to relax, man. If they don't get it now, they will when the trailer comes out, or when they've taken the time to read the confirmation from Bioware that Hawke is not Morrigan's child.

Don't let fanboys get under your skin.

[DJmacpher]

Awakenings made it pretty clear that an Arch Demon/The Blight is not necessary for the Darkspawn to operate as a collective enemy force.



As for the screenshots they do not sway the argument to either side. I'm not saying your screenshots are wrong. I'm just saying to can't use them in your argument because you have no basis to show that they support you theory.



That is like saying my screen shot of a puppy disproves you because puppies are adorable.

[Indoctrination]

Maniac600 wrote...

It sounds like you just need to relax, man. If they don't get it now, they will when the trailer comes out, or when they've taken the time to read the confirmation from Bioware that Hawke is not Morrigan's child.

Don't let fanboys get under your skin.

Hey now. Let's not underestimate their resolve. I'm sure that if the trailers right out shoot down the Hawke-GodBaby and white haired girl-GodBaby theories, they'll have a new poorly based theory ready for us within the hour. Let me try!

The GodBaby is the ogre that Hawk is fighting in that screenshot! You see, the ogres face is different from normal which is obviously caused by the god's soul within it. That shows my theory is rock solid and all of you had better agree!

[Maniac600]

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

It sounds like you just need to relax, man. If they don't get it now, they will when the trailer comes out, or when they've taken the time to read the confirmation from Bioware that Hawke is not Morrigan's child.

Don't let fanboys get under your skin.

Hey now. Let's not underestimate their resolve. I'm sure that if the trailers right out shoot down the Hawke-GodBaby and white haired girl-GodBaby theories, they'll have a new poorly based theory ready for us within the hour. Let me try!

The GodBaby is the ogre that Hawk is fighting in that screenshot! You see, the ogres face is different from normal which is obviously caused by the god's soul within it. That shows my theory is rock solid and all of you had better agree!

LOL...come to think of it, this theory would make more sense, considering the 'godbaby' would technically have the soul of an archdemon in it... why couldn't this cause him to morph into an ogre?

Mmm, I think we've broken new ground!

[Indoctrination]

DJmacpher wrote...

Awakenings made it pretty clear that an Arch Demon/The Blight is not necessary for the Darkspawn to operate as a collective enemy force.

So now your theory is that awakened darkspawn are in lothering 10 years later and you have the gaul to call my points baseless? Come now, you're just grasping at this point.

As for the screenshots they do not sway the argument to either side.

Just because you say it doesn't make it true, which is something that GodBaby fanboys seem to have a hard time understanding.

I'm not saying your screenshots are wrong. I'm just saying to can't use them in your argument because you have no basis to show that they support you theory.

Yes I do have a basis. It is confirmed that Hawke is a survivor of the Lothering massacre. It is a fact that Lothering is destroyed by a darkspawn attack. Does that prove my theory? No, but it provides a basis for it and proves that you're just trying to dismiss my argument for the sake of it (again).

That is like saying my screen shot of a puppy disproves you because puppies are adorable.

This is nothing but a pure fallacy that is designed to once again dismiss everything I say that you can't properly address. It's not helping your argument.

[Indoctrination]

Maniac600 wrote...

LOL...come to think of it, this theory would make more sense, considering the 'godbaby' would technically have the soul of an archdemon in it... why couldn't this cause him to morph into an ogre?

Mmm, I think we've broken new ground!

Whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's not confuse things here. GodBaby theories aren't about making sense. They're about how I want to see it happen so badly that I'm willing to grasp at any straw to convince myself that the GodBaby is going to be a major character in DA2.

[DJmacpher]

You're attempting to brand me as a fan-boy fundamentalist. I'm attempting to debate.



The theory in the slideshow made sense to me. I shared it with the forum. You found objections with the theory and posed them to me. I then thought on your comments and posted a return in an attempt to counter your argument. You countered my counter argument with screenshots that neither disproved my theory nor reinforced yours.



I've been attempting to point out that your 'evidence' is null and has no sway over either side of the debate. If you did not wish to continue the debate you should have simply said so, or stopped posting. Instead you've attempted a very underhanded tactic of attempting to brand me as a ignorant crazy.



I see that this debate has become very personal to you, and I apologize for causing you distress. However, I'm afraid I can no longer continue this debate knowing that it is causing another emotion trauma and thus I must retract from our literary salvo.



In ending I say, good luck, and I hope you have a better night.

[Maniac600]

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

LOL...come to think of it, this theory would make more sense, considering the 'godbaby' would technically have the soul of an archdemon in it... why couldn't this cause him to morph into an ogre?

Mmm, I think we've broken new ground!

Whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's not confuse things here. GodBaby theories aren't about making sense. They're about how I want to see it happen so badly that I'm willing to grasp at any straw to convince myself that the GodBaby is going to be a major character in DA2.

Well I'm sure the Godbaby will be a major character in DA 2...just not the main character. Personally, I'm hoping he'll be the antagonist so I have the option to eviscerate him for having such a wench of a mother.

[MoMan313]

ahh... wow...



debating DA2 like faith under fire? I thought I'd never see the day... XD



-Let me get my jab in..-



all of you are forgeting that a "sequal" is also revelvant to the main character.. nice job bioware..



whoode doo..



Nice on scraping the original story...

[MoMan313]

D: wait character AND some of the main story...



-sigh- what the hel happened to good 'ol straight and foward continuations?

[Indoctrination]

DJmacpher wrote...

You're attempting to brand me as a fan-boy fundamentalist. I'm attempting to debate.

I'm not branding you as anything. You're doing that all by yourself by being so ridgid that you can't entertain the though that you are wrong. You're not debating anything. You're dismissing everything I say which is the opposite of debating it.

The theory in the slideshow made sense to me. I shared it with the forum. You found objections with the theory and posed them to me. I then thought on your comments and posted a return in an attempt to counter your argument.

I wish you had done that. That would have been great. Instead you resorted to terrible logical fallacies during your attempts to dismiss everything I said.

You countered my counter argument with screenshots that neither disproved my theory nor reinforced yours.

Gosh, I sure do love repeating myself when my points are right out ignored, so I'll do it again. Those screenshots do not disprove your theory. They open a giant hole in them because they are very likely screenshots of Lothering. Considering that this topic will probably be stickied for a very, very long time, I think it's equally likely you are going to feel very silly when the truth comes out and you're forced to cling to another poorly assembled theory.

I've been attempting to point out that your 'evidence' is null and has no sway over either side of the debate.

Exactly. You simply dismiss everything you don't want to hear. The trademark of unreasonable fanboyism. (And I'm eager for your damage control which argues that declaring someone's argument null and void out right isn't dismissing them, lmao.)

If you did not wish to continue the debate you should have simply said so, or stopped posting. Instead you've attempted a very underhanded tactic of attempting to brand me as a ignorant crazy.

There you go again with the logical fallacies. Please stop trying to rewrite my argument for me. Thanks.

I see that this debate has become very personal to you, and I apologize for causing you distress.

You're the one desperately trying to defend your theories to me, friend. I could care less really, because your theory is so baseless. If anything this is way too important to YOU. GodBaby fanboys are the new Tali fanboys.

 

However, I'm afraid I can no longer continue this debate knowing that it is causing another emotion trauma and thus I must retract from our literary salvo.  In ending I say, good luck, and I hope you have a better night.

By all means use some really over-dramatic rhetoric as an excuse to save face while you leave if you want. It's really unncessary though. I don't care about "e-cred" and if you had just left without posting that drama queen silly stuff you wouldn't have lost face with me. Whatever makes you feel better though, I guess.

Modifié par Indoctrination, 10 juillet 2010 - 06:38 .

[Maniac600]

MoMan313 wrote...

D: wait character AND some of the main story...

-sigh- what the hel happened to good 'ol straight and foward continuations?

Perhaps they're going out of style?

Ugh...

[Sable Rhapsody]

OK, stepping back from the flame war:



Not sure if this counts as official, but it's paraphrased from the latest Game Informer. Apologies if it's been posted already--I'm sleepy and not thinking terribly clearly.



http://www.gamingeve..._age_ii_details

[mosaiclobster]

I understand where both sides of the debate are coming from, but even a cursory look at those screenshots makes it pretty clear that they look nothing like Lothering. I see a dry, almost desert-like landscape, dead trees, mountains.. no grass, no real shrubbery of any kind. Just red dirt and rocks. As for the darkspawn themselves... well, they don't look very similar to the ones in DA:O judging from what they're wearing, and the face on the one in the second screenshot. That doesn't look like any Hurlock I ever saw in DA:O.

edit: if that is in fact legit (the quotes supposedly from game informer) that definitely disproves most if not all of the theories in regards to the white-haired woman. She couldn't even be Flemeth in that case, not unless she didn't appear until a few years into the game.


But I still don't see how those screenshots are of Lothering, given the atmosphere and the strange look of the enemies. If our Warden didn't fight those enemies in Lothering, why would Hawke?

Modifié par mosaiclobster, 10 juillet 2010 - 06:48 .

[Indoctrination]

Maniac600 wrote...

Well I'm sure the Godbaby will be a major character in DA 2...just not the main character. Personally, I'm hoping he'll be the antagonist so I have the option to eviscerate him for having such a wench of a mother.

How DARE you suggest that the GodBaby won't be the main character!! It's a GOD. I'm willing to argue that the GodBaby is a pantheistic god and as a result, the GodBaby will be EVERY character. Don't even try to argue this! I am willing to debate that any argument against this is void because I say so! So there!

[Indoctrination]

mosaiclobster wrote...

I understand where both sides of the debate are coming from, but even a cursory look at those screenshots makes it pretty clear that they look nothing like Lothering. I see a dry, almost desert-like landscape, dead trees, mountains.. no grass, no real shrubbery of any kind. Just red dirt and rocks. As for the darkspawn themselves... well, they don't look very similar to the ones in DA:O judging from what they're wearing, and the face on the one in the second screenshot. That doesn't look like any Hurlock I ever saw in DA:O.

That is a very well written, well thought out, and good point which addresses the argument without dismissing it. This is how responses are supposed to be and you should feel good about yourself. You could very well be right.

[Maniac600]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

OK, stepping back from the flame war:

Not sure if this counts as official, but it's paraphrased from the latest Game Informer. Apologies if it's been posted already--I'm sleepy and not thinking terribly clearly.

http://www.gamingeve..._age_ii_details

I haven't seen this info yet, thanks for posting.

Interesting, symbols which indicate the tone of the response...that's not a terrible idea.

It looks like they're basically using the ME 2 dialogue format and then evolving it.

[mosaiclobster]

Thanks

But it looks like you're correct about all the GodBaby theories, if that link is correct about what the article says.

[Indoctrination]

Maniac600 wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

OK, stepping back from the flame war:

Not sure if this counts as official, but it's paraphrased from the latest Game Informer. Apologies if it's been posted already--I'm sleepy and not thinking terribly clearly.

http://www.gamingeve..._age_ii_details

I haven't seen this info yet, thanks for posting.

Interesting, symbols which indicate the tone of the response...that's not a terrible idea.

It looks like they're basically using the ME 2 dialogue format and then evolving it.

A lot of people complain about how you pick a dialogue choice in ME and ME2 but end up saying something you didn't intend to say. Revealing the tone of each dialogue choice via symbol could a way of trying to remedy that. It sounds pretty cool actually.

[Maniac600]

Indoctrination wrote...

Maniac600 wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

OK, stepping back from the flame war:

Not sure if this counts as official, but it's paraphrased from the latest Game Informer. Apologies if it's been posted already--I'm sleepy and not thinking terribly clearly.

http://www.gamingeve..._age_ii_details

I haven't seen this info yet, thanks for posting.

Interesting, symbols which indicate the tone of the response...that's not a terrible idea.

It looks like they're basically using the ME 2 dialogue format and then evolving it.

A lot of people complain about how you pick a dialogue choice in ME and ME2 but end up saying something you didn't intend to say. Revealing the tone of each dialogue choice via symbol could a way of trying to remedy that. It sounds pretty cool actually.

Indeed. These are the kinds of changes that excite me. They add depth, clarity and simply more possibilites. This is the Bioware I remember from the KOTOR days.

[DJmacpher]

 This makes me happy.

It's like a long fight with your significant other, where it turn out they were right. 

Ya sure you're wrong, 
but you're glad the fights over.

High-Five Indoctrination!