103 réponses à ce sujet

[Lycidas]

Imajasjam wrote...

Baldurs Gate romances good, every other Bioware games romances are bad.

Baldurs Gate did not have any romances for the player
Baldurs Gate 2 on the other side was wow. I remember the kidnapping of your LI it made me so mad and Arie carrying your baby in her inventory in ToB.

[Yana Montana]

Systemlord Baal wrote...

@Dud....Replace Alistair with Morrigan and I can it was the same for me ;-)

Replace Alistair and Morrigan with Leliana and I can tell it's the most amazing experience I've ever get when playing a video game. 

[FRZN]

I want to see some relevance outside of the party camp/ship/whatever. If I go burn down an orphanage with my LI I want them to turn to me and say, "Baby, that's so hot!... But we're never having kids."
Anyway, as a game that takes place over 10 years I'm going to be pretty disappointed if your relationship develops all at once rather than over a decent amount of time.

Modifié par FRZN, 09 juillet 2010 - 09:28 .

[Yana Montana]

FRZN wrote...

 If I go burn down an orphanage with my LI I want them to turn to me and say, "Baby, that's so hot!... But we're never having kids."
 

That made me laugh. 

[joriandrake]

FRZN wrote...

Anyway, as a game that takes place over 10 years I'm going to be pretty disappointed if your relationship develop over several years rather than all at once.

why? is it so hard to imagine that you fall in love with your childhood friend?



anyway, considering that even races got cut back tojust human there will be probably just a single love interest the whole game long too (and I was being optimistic they may include horses or capes into DA2, now I fear they will cut even companion armor use out just as they did in ME2)

Modifié par joriandrake, 09 juillet 2010 - 09:17 .

[Master Shiori]

scyphozoa wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Morrigan's dialogue comes pretty heavy after you sleep with her. 

Absolutely. I would consider this an exception to the formula BW has traditionally used for LIs, as most of DAO breaks the idea of one last night of romance before the endgame sequence. 

I want fewer characters because I don't think BW is going to be able to deliver 4 or 6 new LIs with an unprecedented level of depth. I haven't seen it done with any LIs yet (imo), so lets see what the resources that would go into 4 or 6 characters can do when they are applied to only 2 LIs. I know thats not how resource allocation usually works, but this is what I'm asking for. Greater depth for LIs, by any means necessary. 

While I can agree that there should be more depth for LI's, you also have to keep in mind that not everyone will find the prospect of romancing a certain character appealing.

The reason there's 4 love interests in DA:O is because they are meant to appeal to different kinds of people. Not everyone who romanced Zevran or Leliana found Alistair or Morrigan appealing.

If you only have 2 romance interests they'll either have to be shallow characters in order to appeal to everyone or you'll end up with complex characters who'll be loved by onepart of the playerbase and hated by the other.

Having more then 2 choices allows you to bring diversity and appeal to wide range of interests.

Modifié par Master Shiori, 09 juillet 2010 - 09:17 .

[Demx]

Arttis wrote...

Siradix wrote...

Arttis wrote...

Siradix wrote...

Just slap a japanese light visual novel within the game and blam, you got yourself all the romance you need.

i want a romace where you treat the girl badly.betray her.sleep with her sister and have her crawl back wanting to be with you even more.
Can anyone see a romance like that happening over 10 years?

Sounds like it would fit in perfectly

It would be new and different for Bioware.They just need to make it convincing.

Well I think with the power and money you will gain over the years, her crawling back sounds reasonable.

[Arttis]

Siradix wrote...

Arttis wrote...

Siradix wrote...

Arttis wrote...

Siradix wrote...

Just slap a japanese light visual novel within the game and blam, you got yourself all the romance you need.

i want a romace where you treat the girl badly.betray her.sleep with her sister and have her crawl back wanting to be with you even more.
Can anyone see a romance like that happening over 10 years?

Sounds like it would fit in perfectly

It would be new and different for Bioware.They just need to make it convincing.

Well I think with the power and money you will gain over the years, her crawling back sounds reasonable.

She runs off with a minor lord when your a penniless refugee,
Then comes back when your a legend.I think that may be a bit too realistic for some people.

[FRZN]

joriandrake wrote...

FRZN wrote...

Anyway, as a game that takes place over 10 years I'm going to be pretty disappointed if your relationship develop over several years rather than all at once.

why? is it so hard to imagine that you fall in love with your childhood friend?

>.<  I said the exact opposite of what I meant to say.

[Kalfear]

Dave of Canada wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

Oh pleese. You can ****** Morigan off, but give her gifts and it's "lets have sex!" long as you say you can probe me anytime, ****** her off after then spam gift her and she will sleep with you. Ya that's great, real great <_< Accept it, not everyone jumped on the DAO romance bandwagon. The only good ones where Leli and Morrigan.

Alistair's romance was charming, silly and cute. Many women I know who played the game felt a lot closer to Alistair than Jacob / Thane or Garrus. Why? Because you explore with them, you talk and get to know them and you're there with them all the way. The entire thing about the Mass Effect romance is that the dialogue is hollow, you can't flirt with them - they flirt with you, you pick to accept it or not.

The romances in Dragon Age aren't as easy, you need to please your significant other and entertain them. Some of them are different people and have different habits, Morrigan for example will sleep with you early in the relationship because she doesn't see 'sex' as 'love' but just a tool. Having sex with her doesn't end the romance, it continues and it's part of it.

Mass Effect romances build up with one or two conversations before the sex scene and then that's it, no more and no less. Somebody who slept with Tali will only get a small extra bit of dialogue saying she's sick, there's no conversations that follow deeper into the person you've just 'romanced'. If anything, Mass Effect romances feel like nothing but a fling considering how Shepard only smiles and nods through the entire romance

Bang on the money Dave,

ME2 romances were a joke. Oh sure you had to wait till just before end of game to actually have the romance but the conversations ended long time before that!

I liked DA:O way of doing things, I slept with Leli, I slept with Morrigan, and I made my choice when they confronted me and forced me to!

But the difference between DA:O and ME2 was I got to know the characters in DA:O before and after they slept with me! It wasnt just "can we talk later, we already spoke this 4 hour session" like ME2.

Dont know how this got on ME anyways? All I said was ME1 love scene which was awsome compared to DA:O or ME2 love scenes.

MORE romances
MORE DEPTH

And if your choice is to avoid them, then go ahead and do that but I want more romances and more depth to them! ME2 was a joke and ill be severly pissed off if inter party interaction limited the way it was in ME2.

[Arttis]

We need to see our character naked rubbing each other otherwise it feels like all they did was cuddle.

Wheres the depth.

[joriandrake]

Arttis wrote...

We need to see our character naked rubbing each other otherwise it feels like all they did was cuddle.
Wheres the depth.

heh, even Sims2 had better sex action animation than what was in DA that we have to admit

[Dudzilla]

Kalfear wrote...


Bang on the money Dave,

ME2 romances were a joke. Oh sure you had to wait till just before end of game to actually have the romance but the conversations ended long time before that!

I liked DA:O way of doing things, I slept with Leli, I slept with Morrigan, and I made my choice when they confronted me and forced me to!

Agreed. I'm also interested to see if DA2 implements Awakenings-style dialogue triggers (Anders with the statue, etc), to allow your NPCs to open up to you.

Even though part of me was annoyed that i couldn't control or manipulate the event like I could if I was in camp (saving the game and trying different options), it somehow feels a little more authentic and properly paced when they spring it on you & you're prevented from interrogating your NPCs, forcing them to divulge their deepest feelings using a laundry list of questions. 

[Tooneyman]

I'm sorry 2 to 3 love interest per game makes the game kind of fun. If I'm stuck with some crappy love interests its not worth going for.

[highcastle]

Dudzilla wrote...

Kalfear wrote...


Bang on the money Dave,

ME2 romances were a joke. Oh sure you had to wait till just before end of game to actually have the romance but the conversations ended long time before that!

I liked DA:O way of doing things, I slept with Leli, I slept with Morrigan, and I made my choice when they confronted me and forced me to!

Agreed. I'm also interested to see if DA2 implements Awakenings-style dialogue triggers (Anders with the statue, etc), to allow your NPCs to open up to you.

Even though part of me was annoyed that i couldn't control or manipulate the event like I could if I was in camp (saving the game and trying different options), it somehow feels a little more authentic and properly paced when they spring it on you & you're prevented from interrogating your NPCs, forcing them to divulge their deepest feelings using a laundry list of questions. 

I think the Awakening method had potential. My real problem was that it replaced campfire dialogues completely. I'd have liked to see environment triggers mixed with home-base conversations. That would have been the most realistic, I think.

On topic: I don't think we need to see fewer love interests (especially since that would likely mean that same-sex LIs get cut, and that would just be terrible after ME2). But I'd definitely agree that more depth would be nice. As others have pointed out, DA:O did a far better job than ME2 in developing your romance. It doesn't end or even culminate with physical intimacy. Rather, the romance deepens afterward. With Zevran's romance, for instance, all the best character development comes after the actual sex. This was far better and more moving than ME2's system, IMO.

One of the chief problems I had with ME2 was the characters never wanting to speak with Shepard. And that includes your LI. Until you did their loyalty mission, they were out of bounds. Even companions like Garrus, who really should've been loyal from the start. I hope DA2 will avoid this particular misstep. The best parts of the game were interacting with companions and learning more about them. The characterization in Origins was really strong, and I'd love to see that continued with new characters in DA2, both love interests and standard companions.

[alickar]

they cut off alot of stuff so NO. dnt make it worse.

[Loc'n'lol]

I thought the number of romances available in DAO was ideal, really.

[Sidney]

highcastle wrote...


I think the Awakening method had potential. My real problem was that it replaced campfire dialogues completely. I'd have liked to see environment triggers mixed with home-base conversations. That would have been the most realistic, I think.

On topic: I don't think we need to see fewer love interests (especially since that would likely mean that same-sex LIs get cut, and that would just be terrible after ME2).

Awakenings was good but the pure "encounter" dialogs didn't make it. As you said the blend is the right answer.

I'll take fewer with more depth. I didn't like that  you could "progress" the LI with Morrigan in camp right after Lothering very easily to the full on romance state.

Maybe the triggers are needed to push things forward and can stop the head-long rush. The pacing of the LI's in ME and ME2 were both better than DAO even if the LI characters were not as compelling.

[andar91]

I'd be happy with more AND with better quality. I'd like a good variety too.

[WingsandRings]

I just want all of the romances to be able to last till the end of the game. While ones like Zevran's worked well for that, Alistair's could max out pretty fast and then have basically nothing new to say to you for over half the game.



I also agree that Awakening's dialogue could be useful as an EXTRA way to learn about your companions, but as an exclusive way to do it, it was too limiting. In a way, it should be kind of like an enhanced version of the way some of Sten's dialogue worked....a character reacts to something within the environment, and you can talk about it some then, but then it can also open up more dialogue options later at the campfire. (or whatever home base is)

[Teredan]

i agree with this thread but i also applies for companions not only for romance, find the balance bioware we know you can do it

[Sneelonz]

DEPPTTHH!!!!!!

[highcastle]

Sidney wrote...

highcastle wrote...


I think the Awakening method had potential. My real problem was that it replaced campfire dialogues completely. I'd have liked to see environment triggers mixed with home-base conversations. That would have been the most realistic, I think.

On topic: I don't think we need to see fewer love interests (especially since that would likely mean that same-sex LIs get cut, and that would just be terrible after ME2).

Awakenings was good but the pure "encounter" dialogs didn't make it. As you said the blend is the right answer.

I'll take fewer with more depth. I didn't like that  you could "progress" the LI with Morrigan in camp right after Lothering very easily to the full on romance state.

Maybe the triggers are needed to push things forward and can stop the head-long rush. The pacing of the LI's in ME and ME2 were both better than DAO even if the LI characters were not as compelling.

I think the pacing on ME was still a bit off. In both ME and ME2, you have minimal interactions with your LI before the final mission, at which point the characters finally sleep together. Since DA and now DA2 take place over much longer time periods, its natural to have the relationships reach a physical stage earlier, then continue to develop afterward.

But yes, some of the companions could be romanced quite early. However, this is also in some of their natures. Morrigan for instance wasn't truly looking for love, not at first. And with her characterization, it makes sense that she'd be willing to sleep with a PC much earlier into the game. Zevran had a similar bit of characterization. And both Morrigan and Zev eventually developed feelings that surprised them, making their romance arcs two of the most compelling in the game.

The one thing I didn't like about DA was how you could breeze through most of the conversations in the first camp visit, leaving you with very little to talk about for the rest of the game. Sure there were extra conversations available at certain approval bumps or after story events, but not nearly enough. LIs in particular should've had more conversations. With my human noble character, for instance, I wanted to talk to my LI about killing Howe. This would've been a logical and natural conversation. Alas, I couldn't do it. LIs should definitely react more to the PC's actions and more conversations should be available with romanced characters than non-romanced characters (since this is who your PC will likely be turning to for support and guidance).

[SithLordExarKun]

Kalfear wrote...



this is where Mass Effect 2 failed, the romance arcs were a joke!

This is where i would agree with you, although i got to admit ME1's romance were even more of a joke than ME2's considering you can't even end a romance path and you get into one by just talking to the LI.

I hope they keep DA2's romance as deep or deeper than DAO's, which was already very good.

[Jimmy Fury]

mmmm stopped reading at xkcd because of tea snorting laughter.

So here's my take on it. ME2 and DAO romances had their own pros and cons. ME2 had more partners while DAO had better conversations.

But why?

ME2 and DAO had different writing teams which is likely why the styles of romances were so different.

There are also limited resources. ME2 was probably able to have more partners because Shepard had less variables in terms of animation. DAO the devs had to make sure the animations could fit 3 different skeletal structures (which apparently is a major pain in the butt according to modders).



So... Since DA2 is going to have DAO's writing team *and* fewer animation variables... I see no problem in having more romance options. The story, unlike either ME or DAO, also takes place over a longer span of time and isn't as "OMG DOOM! LET'S MAKE OUT!" so more can be fleshed out (no pun) as the story progresses.