138 réponses à ce sujet

[Zanderat]

Sopa de Gato wrote...

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...
As has been explained, there was varying degrees of "good", "neutral" and "Evil responses.  Obviously they can't have a bajillion responses covering any possible way the player might want to respond, but they can't have as many ways when they have a dialogue wheel and a voiced protag.

Honestly, you guys are acting like every question had six or seven different responses. They didn't. Most of the time you were stuck on the same three response track (if even that).

DId we even play the same game?

[Zanderat]

Jestina wrote...

I would take a mute heroine over ... linear with no freedom of choice in your character. Now every game has to have a completely scripted character...leaving no room for the player to make any choices, which defeats the whole purpose of playing a game.

Bingo!

[Phazor58]

Tooneyman wrote...

Zanderat wrote...

Careful guys they have started locking the critical threads again.

http://social.biowar...index/3074072/1

Yes, please. Keep it to a debate at the most. I ask all of you. This is good conversation lets keep it from spam.  I'm still going to be indifferent on the decision for the idea that it could work out. Though this does go against what they said in the past. Heres the source on what they said between dragon age and mass effect and how the two were completely different.  
http://xbox360.ign.c...2/982609p1.html

I need to update what I said. HEres a source. I couldn't find the interview fully, but its close to this one. This is a comparison to the two conversations styles.

Interesting.  I remember reading that interview before, but seeing it now makes me cringe.  So basically they talked about how the conversation in Dragon Age made it different from Mass Effect.  So now they're going against all that and making the dialogue systems the same.  So essentially if you take their ideas from before and apply them to what's happening now, Dragon Age 2 is just another Mass Effect.  Either that or they're hypocrites.

[Sirsmirkalot]

Zanderat wrote...
I guess that I am saying that it is a game.  I don't want it to too realistic.  Realism doesn't always equal fun.

With that, I can wholeheartedly agree.

[Paul E Dangerously]

Zanderat wrote...

Sopa de Gato wrote...

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...
As has been explained, there was varying degrees of "good", "neutral" and "Evil responses.  Obviously they can't have a bajillion responses covering any possible way the player might want to respond, but they can't have as many ways when they have a dialogue wheel and a voiced protag.

Honestly, you guys are acting like every question had six or seven different responses. They didn't. Most of the time you were stuck on the same three response track (if even that).

DId we even play the same game?

Four times, going on five. Twice for Awakening.

Next time it might help paying attention, rather than mindlessly praising the first game's system because we've had a few hints of what the second's were like.

Also, a lot of those dialogue choices were questions that simply moved you to other topics. You did not have five or six responses to every question.

[Ekyri]

Atleast you knew exactly what you were going to do when you picked an option in DAO. Not so much with the dialogue wheel.

[LPPrince]

So many dialogue wheel bashers, and none have yet to post something that doesn't scream, "OMG THIS SUCKS TROLLOLOLOLOL"



For goodness sake, both systems were fine.



People are now making stupid blanket statements that make no sense. So here we go with some counter statements-



1. This doesn't make the game any less of an RPG.



2. The character's lines are not linear and totally scripted with a dialogue wheel. If anything, that argument hurts DAO, since its lines were scripted and linear. Literally.



3. You still make choices. You could have up to 6 different choices with the dialogue wheel, which is about the same as DAO's dialogue lines.



So play the games before you spew your hate.

[Anathemic]

LPPrince wrote...

So many dialogue wheel bashers, and none have yet to post something that doesn't scream, "OMG THIS SUCKS TROLLOLOLOLOL"

For goodness sake, both systems were fine.

People are now making stupid blanket statements that make no sense. So here we go with some counter statements-

1. This doesn't make the game any less of an RPG.

2. The character's lines are not linear and totally scripted with a dialogue wheel. If anything, that argument hurts DAO, since its lines were scripted and linear. Literally.

3. You still make choices. You could have up to 6 different choices with the dialogue wheel, which is about the same as DAO's dialogue lines.

So play the games before you spew your hate.

More like 3, right side was Good, Neutral, and Bad, theleft side was 'Investigate' what the hell why would I wana Investigate?

Modifié par Anathemic, 10 juillet 2010 - 03:07 .

[allothernamesweretaken]

The wheel isn't inherently worse. Alpha Protocol and Indigo Prophecy did it well.



Bioware's wheel, though, is far behind a classic system.

[LPPrince]

Anathemic-

You'd want to investigate to learn more about the situation, person, enemy, or whatever the conversation entails.

Otherwise you're going in uninformed. Making a choice without knowing all the details and ramifications.

See, there's actually thought involved.

Modifié par LPPrince, 10 juillet 2010 - 03:15 .

[Phazor58]

LPPrince wrote...

Anathemic-

You'd want to investigate to learn more about the situation, person, enemy, or whatever the conversation entails.

Otherwise you're going in uninformed. Making a choice without knowing all the details and ramifications.

GASP! See, there's actually thought involved.

*Investigates*

Oh so he's kind of bad but also a wimp.  I'll just threaten him.

*Picks bottom option*

*Hawke stabs the guy to death*

"What the heck Hawke!  I just wanted you to threaten him not kill him!"

So yeah.  Still not working for me.

[LPPrince]

Phazor58 wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

Anathemic-

You'd want to investigate to learn more about the situation, person, enemy, or whatever the conversation entails.

Otherwise you're going in uninformed. Making a choice without knowing all the details and ramifications.

GASP! See, there's actually thought involved.

*Investigates*

Oh so he's kind of bad but also a wimp.  I'll just threaten him.

*Picks bottom option*

*Hawke stabs the guy to death*

"What the heck Hawke!  I just wanted you to threaten him not kill him!"

So yeah.  Still not working for me.

So you're making the assumption that all the "renegade" options will involve killing someone.

Way to go. Yeah, just go ahead and not give the system a chance. Sounds like people are now bashing it just because its different.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

LPPrince wrote...

So many dialogue wheel bashers, and none have yet to post something that doesn't scream, "OMG THIS SUCKS TROLLOLOLOLOL"

For goodness sake, both systems were fine.

People are now making stupid blanket statements that make no sense. So here we go with some counter statements-

1. This doesn't make the game any less of an RPG.

2. The character's lines are not linear and totally scripted with a dialogue wheel. If anything, that argument hurts DAO, since its lines were scripted and linear. Literally.

3. You still make choices. You could have up to 6 different choices with the dialogue wheel, which is about the same as DAO's dialogue lines.

So play the games before you spew your hate.

Without a voice and seeing the dialogue spoken I could "read" the dialogue in the proper tone for my character and make sure it was something that they would actually say.

With a wheel and voiced, I can pick the general gist of what my character means, but what they actually say and how they say it is up to Bioware.

There is no longer any room to roleplay with the latter system.

[Phazor58]

LPPrince wrote...

Phazor58 wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

Anathemic-

You'd want to investigate to learn more about the situation, person, enemy, or whatever the conversation entails.

Otherwise you're going in uninformed. Making a choice without knowing all the details and ramifications.

GASP! See, there's actually thought involved.

*Investigates*

Oh so he's kind of bad but also a wimp.  I'll just threaten him.

*Picks bottom option*

*Hawke stabs the guy to death*

"What the heck Hawke!  I just wanted you to threaten him not kill him!"

So yeah.  Still not working for me.

So you're making the assumption that all the "renegade" options will involve killing someone.

Way to go. Yeah, just go ahead and not give the system a chance. Sounds like people are now bashing it just because its different.

No I'm not.  But some renegade choices will involve killing someone.  I don't want to be surprised by what Hawke does.  Again, the example I used is an exact event that happened to me in Mass Effect 2.  So I'm not just making crazy claims.  I'm speaking from actual experience with the dialogue wheel system.

Modifié par Phazor58, 10 juillet 2010 - 03:21 .

[Melness]

Way to go. Yeah, just go ahead and not give the system a chance. Sounds like people are now bashing it just because its different.

I don't know much about the wheel but not knowing exactly what the character (that I'm supposed to be) is going to do is foolish. I hope this part of the system doesn't translate into DA.

[LPPrince]

Then that was misjudgment on your part, not the game's fault.



Some people don't want everything laid out for them. They don't want to know exactly what's going to happen before it happens.



Since the PC's voiced, they pretty much HAVE to use the dialogue wheel.



If they went by the DAO system, we'd be reading and then hearing the same exact lines.



Sorry, but that's a fail in and of itself.



What I've gathered from out exchange is that maybe people don't have a problem so much with the wheel and the implied responses, but that the PC's voiced.

[LPPrince]

Melness wrote...

Way to go. Yeah, just go ahead and not give the system a chance. Sounds like people are now bashing it just because its different.

I don't know much about the wheel but not knowing exactly what the character (that I'm supposed to be) is going to do is foolish. I hope this part of the system doesn't translate into DA.

Then we need to divide where the problem is.

Is it what is SAID, or what is DONE, that is the problem with the dialogue wheel?

[LPPrince]

Anathemic wrote...
why would I wana Investigate?

I'd like to go back to this, because I hope that's not a stab to the dialogue wheel.

If you don't like investigating, you had to have ended every conversation in DAO as fast as possible with no thought put into it whatsoever.

Now THAT is foolish.

[AlanC9]

LPPrince wrote...
Some people don't want everything laid out for them. They don't want to know exactly what's going to happen before it happens.

They don't want to know what their own character is going to do?

You're serious?

[LPPrince]

AlanC9 wrote...

LPPrince wrote...
Some people don't want everything laid out for them. They don't want to know exactly what's going to happen before it happens.

They don't want to know what their own character is going to do?

You're serious?

Yes! Can you believe it, there's actually people that aren't carbon copies of you!

*Not trying to sound mean or anything, but I'm getting frustrated reading all these hateful posts from people that are hating just for the sake of hating*

Modifié par LPPrince, 10 juillet 2010 - 03:40 .

[Anathemic]

LPPrince wrote...

Anathemic wrote...
why would I wana Investigate?

I'd like to go back to this, because I hope that's not a stab to the dialogue wheel.

If you don't like investigating, you had to have ended every conversation in DAO as fast as possible with no thought put into it whatsoever.

Now THAT is foolish.

Now think of it this way I have to 'Investigate' the conversation whereas I can't speak in a smooth flow and yet at the same time retain the basic knowledge of what influences my choice?
DA:O struck gold with this there was no 'Investigating' involved but a thought process in looking at the dialogue choices and seeing which one will influence the decision.

[Phazor58]

LPPrince wrote...

Then that was misjudgment on your part, not the game's fault.

Some people don't want everything laid out for them. They don't want to know exactly what's going to happen before it happens.

Since the PC's voiced, they pretty much HAVE to use the dialogue wheel.

If they went by the DAO system, we'd be reading and then hearing the same exact lines.

Sorry, but that's a fail in and of itself.

What I've gathered from out exchange is that maybe people don't have a problem so much with the wheel and the implied responses, but that the PC's voiced.

I can live with the VA if we don't have a dialogue wheel.

The solution is fairly simple.  Have paraphrased choices.  This is what they used in Leliana's Song apparently (I haven't played it myself, but this is what I've heard from others).  That way we still know what we're going to say, but the VA won't just be repeating what we read.  We can only hope this is what Bioware decides to do.

[LPPrince]

You do realize that the investigate options are options that lead to learning more about the situation, which is what some lines did in DAO?



With the dialogue wheel, its CLEARER.

[AlanC9]

LPPrince wrote...

Yes! Can you believe it, there's actually people that aren't carbon copies of you!

*Not trying to sound mean or anything, but I'm getting frustrated reading all these hateful posts from people that are hating just for the sake of hating*

I'm not hating. I  think you're insane, but I'm not hating.

[LPPrince]

Phazor58 wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

Then that was misjudgment on your part, not the game's fault.

Some people don't want everything laid out for them. They don't want to know exactly what's going to happen before it happens.

Since the PC's voiced, they pretty much HAVE to use the dialogue wheel.

If they went by the DAO system, we'd be reading and then hearing the same exact lines.

Sorry, but that's a fail in and of itself.

What I've gathered from out exchange is that maybe people don't have a problem so much with the wheel and the implied responses, but that the PC's voiced.

I can live with the VA if we don't have a dialogue wheel.

The solution is fairly simple.  Have paraphrased choices.  This is what they used in Leliana's Song apparently (I haven't played it myself, but this is what I've heard from others).  That way we still know what we're going to say, but the VA won't just be repeating what we read.  We can only hope this is what Bioware decides to do.

I played Leliana's Song. Its just like ME's system, except there's no wheel and its still the DAO lines. Its like if you combined the two.

The reason they can't use that for DA2 is because there'd be way too much dialogue and the game would be forced into multiple disks, which is definitely a pain for console gamers such as myself(I don't have a problem with it, but some do).