168 réponses à ce sujet

[Tirigon]

dan107 wrote...

And they're a HUGE limitation for animations. Having the protagonist be a set height and build allows you to have three times as many animations in DA2 for same price as DA1. I always thought that elves and dwarves were superflous and unnecessary. All the differences and tensions arising between them could just as easily be expressed in terms of skin color and cultural differences among humans. Good riddance to a waste of resources.

Then what about getting rid of HUMANS?!

Honestly, humans in a fantasy game suck. There enough of us dirty humans in Real life, why do I have to be one even in games?

I love Alien vs Predator for the way it lets you treat humans as prey whose only reason of existence is to be killed:devil::devil:

[dan107]

nikki191 wrote...

personally i always found the city elf and human noble both from the female perspective the most complelling, and kudos to bioware for the dwarfs, it was the first time ever ive liked playing a dwarf main character in an rpg.

I just want to point out that playing as an elf or a dwarf really had nothing to do with those origins' being compelling. You could just as easily have created human cultures with all the characteristics of DA's elves and dwarves.

[dan107]

Tirigon wrote...
Then what about getting rid of HUMANS?!

Honestly, humans in a fantasy game suck. There enough of us dirty humans in Real life, why do I have to be one even in games?

Two reasons. One - humans are more relatable. Most people want to play as someone they can identify with.

Two - humans are a necessary reference point. You can't have just dwarves or just elves because they're generally defined through their differences with humans. A game with dwarves but no humans ends up being a game with weird short fat people running around.

Modifié par dan107, 12 juillet 2010 - 04:48 .

[ToJKa1]

dan107 wrote...

Khayness wrote...

Multiple races are limitations for more immerse storytelling, therefore they had to go.

And they're a HUGE limitation for animations. Having the protagonist be a set height and build allows you to have three times as many animations in DA2 for same price as DA1. I always thought that elves and dwarves were superflous and unnecessary. All the differences and tensions arising between them could just as easily be expressed in terms of skin color and cultural differences among humans. Good riddance to a waste of resources.

There are still elves and dwarves in the game, they still need to be animated. And if you take fantasy races away from fantasy it sops being fantasy and becomes history. With magic.

In my humble opinion Dragon Age had too few races to begin with.

[ZaroktheImmortal]

ToJKa1 wrote...

dan107 wrote...

Khayness wrote...

Multiple races are limitations for more immerse storytelling, therefore they had to go.

And they're a HUGE limitation for animations. Having the protagonist be a set height and build allows you to have three times as many animations in DA2 for same price as DA1. I always thought that elves and dwarves were superflous and unnecessary. All the differences and tensions arising between them could just as easily be expressed in terms of skin color and cultural differences among humans. Good riddance to a waste of resources.

There are still elves and dwarves in the game, they still need to be animated. And if you take fantasy races away from fantasy it sops being fantasy and becomes history. With magic.

In my humble opinion Dragon Age had too few races to begin with.

Exactly. So it's obviously not an animation issue. Perhaps voice casting, maybe they just felt like making this one about a human. But I really would prefer to pick my own characters voice.

[Tooneyman]

I'm not going to lie to you. I don't think it really is that hard to say whether or not there maybe or may not be races in future games. i mean it would be cool if DA 2 does really well. Bioware then decides to make a game where you can then start off as a lead with an elf and a dwarf stories, but for some reasons. I'm thinking DA 2 expansions with this.

[dan107]

ToJKa1 wrote...

dan107 wrote...

Khayness wrote...

Multiple races are limitations for more immerse storytelling, therefore they had to go.

And they're a HUGE limitation for animations. Having the protagonist be a set height and build allows you to have three times as many animations in DA2 for same price as DA1. I always thought that elves and dwarves were superflous and unnecessary. All the differences and tensions arising between them could just as easily be expressed in terms of skin color and cultural differences among humans. Good riddance to a waste of resources.

There are still elves and dwarves in the game, they still need to be animated. And if you take fantasy races away from fantasy it sops being fantasy and becomes history. With magic.

In my humble opinion Dragon Age had too few races to begin with.

NPCs don't have nearly as many animations as the PC does. It's the simple things like shaking hands, patting someone on the back, slamming them against the wall, etc. that were missing in DA. Hopefully they can now include them in DA2.

And I don't see how excluding them makes the setting any less "fantasy". Robin Hood and King Arthur are quite firmly in the realm of fantasy even though they don't have imaginary races and hardly any magic. Also, elves and dwarves may've added some color in the beginning, but at this point they are such a staple of the genre that hardly anyone even notices them. Might as well forgo the trouble of modeling and animating them.

Modifié par dan107, 12 juillet 2010 - 09:15 .

[Jedi_blues]

IronVanguard wrote...


And the goddamn Batman!

Don't you mean Hawke Man? 

[Mecha Tengu]

aren't you tired of the same old tolkienn esque fantasy crap?



DWARVES, ELVES, ORCS (WHOOPS SORRY DARKSPAWN) OH MY



Tolkien did his well, but the entire fantasy community just can't help plagiarisng his ideas.



I would be looking forward to a new race. The Qunari was a good start.

[joriandrake]

Mecha Tengu wrote...

aren't you tired of the same old tolkienn esque fantasy crap?

DWARVES, ELVES, ORCS (WHOOPS SORRY DARKSPAWN) OH MY

Tolkien did his well, but the entire fantasy community just can't help plagiarisng his ideas.

I would be looking forward to a new race. The Qunari was a good start.

I would already be very happy with getting dwarves and elves back

[Tirigon]

joriandrake wrote...

Mecha Tengu wrote...

aren't you tired of the same old tolkienn esque fantasy crap?

DWARVES, ELVES, ORCS (WHOOPS SORRY DARKSPAWN) OH MY

Tolkien did his well, but the entire fantasy community just can't help plagiarisng his ideas.

I would be looking forward to a new race. The Qunari was a good start.

I would already be very happy with getting dwarves and elves back

I agree with both of this.

I would also suggest that a game based on Markus Heitz´s "The Dwarfes" is made. It has the most awesome dwarfes and Dark elves EVER!!!!!!!   And lots of freaking ugly basts to kill, too.

[Sidney]

Mecha Tengu wrote...

aren't you tired of the same old tolkienn esque fantasy crap?

DWARVES, ELVES, ORCS (WHOOPS SORRY DARKSPAWN) OH MY

Tolkien did his well, but the entire fantasy community just can't help plagiarisng his ideas.

I would be looking forward to a new race. The Qunari was a good start.

Yes but then again I'm sort of over the whole swords and sorcery thing and wish we'd see more settings used.

Still, I at least give Bioware credit for trying to make the Elves not just the usual mystical forest dwellers and the giving the dwarves castes and some ugly poltical divisions gave them more texture. I can do with or without all the races but I can really do without ever seeing them used the way the were in Tolkein's books.

[Mecha Tengu]

true, Im tired of the metaphysical leet elves with the forest and bows



but elves are still elves cmon.....



What we lack today is historical fantasy RPGs

[zahra]

I don't mind that much not being able to play an elf. (Would be more exciting if there was a "drow" option).

[Jestina]

I don't know why people say Tolkien when he himself didn't even come up with that stuff. Apparently some people just know zero about mythology.

[Chuvvy]

Jestina wrote...

I don't know why people say Tolkien when he himself didn't even come up with that stuff. Apparently some people just know zero about mythology.

He popularised it. You cannot deny that. And people will believe anything. People think Halo invented the FPS.

Also as long as there's some elf companions I'm fine.

Modifié par Slidell505, 12 juillet 2010 - 10:49 .

[joriandrake]

Jestina wrote...

I don't know why people say Tolkien when he himself didn't even come up with that stuff. Apparently some people just know zero about mythology.

orcs... I mean darkspawn is mostly why people mention LOTR

[Maverick827]

Zerthus wrote...

...The idea of playing a game as a Broodmother...is just amusing to me. Could you imagine that? Sit around all day inputting button commands to spit out new darkspawn. Then when an adventurer shows up...start spitting and tentacle whipping. xD

runscript appearance 10

Good times.

[ZaroktheImmortal]

Jestina wrote...

I don't know why people say Tolkien when he himself didn't even come up with that stuff. Apparently some people just know zero about mythology.

Well he did bring a lot of popularity to the whole fantasy world with elves and dwarves concept.

[dan107]

Jestina wrote...

I don't know why people say Tolkien when he himself didn't even come up with that stuff. Apparently some people just know zero about mythology.

You answered your own question. The reason that people think of Tolkien when they think fantasy is that most people know very little mythology, but almost everyone knows Tolkien.

[joriandrake]

mythology always existed, but Tolkien made the first step towards the creation of RPG

[Maverick827]

joriandrake wrote...

mythology always existed, but Tolkien made the first step towards the creation of RPG

Erm.  Tolkein popularized (created, even) modern fantasy, but as far as I know, he created no such games.

[joriandrake]

I wrote "first step towards"

[AllThatJazz]

Indeed. The most popular roleplaying game (D&D, or is there one played more?) isn't based on the ancient myths and legends from where the concepts of elves and dwarves were created, but on Tolkien's versions of those races specifically. Okay, so there are similarities, but most people, when thinking of those races, think of Legolas and Gimli.



Personally, I like Terry Pratchett's elves. I would love a game where the elves weren't a playable race, but were actually the main villains.

[Tirigon]

AllThatJazz wrote...

Personally, I like Terry Pratchett's elves. I would love a game where the elves weren't a playable race, but were actually the main villains.

I would love a game where the elves are the main villains AND playable, and it is your goal to conquer the lands of the inferior races.




To the tolkien topic:
Tolkien´s world is indeed based on mythology, but the dwarves / elves he created are still very much different from the ones in northern mythology, and other stuff like the giants don´t exist at all in Tolkien´s world.