81 réponses à ce sujet

[reflir]

And this makes me sad.

There are only so many companies out there making western RPGs, and of those companies there are only so many that don't mindlessly poop out diablo clones. Of those 2 or 3 companies left, only Bioware created Baldurs Gate 2, and only Bioware seemed interested in creating more games like Baldurs Gate 2. When they announced Dragon Age, so long ago, this was a major selling point, and it made me happy. That was in 2003 .

Now here we are, on the other end of the long wait. Dragon Age has come out, and I have to admit that it came close to BG2 in spirit (I especially enjoyed Awakenings), despite This being The New Shit. I would've liked a more varied selection in race and class, and perhaps a slightly tweaked spell system, a larger party and less generic settings, but whatever. It was close enough. Close enough to make me think that maybe, just maybe, Bioware actually WAS interested in creating more games like BG2!

What I don't like is that things seem to be going in the wrong direction. Not much has been revealed so far, of course, but what has been revealed so far indicates that they're moving away from BG2 and towards Mass Effect -- perhaps not in most aspects, but definitely in some. Your name and race and voice are set so that Bioware can tell the story they want to, in the way they want to, with (part of) the character and the voice they want to. This is not insubstantial or irrelevant. These are the characteristics the hellspawn in marketing have chosen as the best way to characterize and introduce their new product. If you like these things, you will want to buy this game! The face they wanted to present for DA2 was 'a mix of mass effect and DA', not 'a mix of BG2 and DA'.

So what'll DA2 be like? I don't know, but it looks like it's moving in the wrong direction. Why doesn't it look like it's moving in the right direction? That could've just as easily been accomplished. Why are they choosing not to? Why are we going through the exact same marketing bullshit we had to endure in the run up to DA? It could very well be a very good game; it just looks like it won't be more like BG2, and that makes me sad, especially thinking back to all those years ago. If you want to make games like BG2, Bioware, why do we get this instead? You're the last hope for the return of the best of the infinity engine games, and that hope is slowly wasting away.

[highcastle]

It's been 4 days! How can we really leap to such conclusions on so little information? It's far, far to early to see what this game is going to be like. As to some of the claims:

In Origins, you also had a set surname. It only really came up if you were a human or dwarf noble, but it was still relevant, and certain NPCs still addressed you as Lord or Lady Cousland. Hawke getting a name is no different.

Yes, you have a voice. However, unlike in ME, you get to pick the intent with which you say lines. This concept is very intriguing to me, and I think could improve the dialogue system a great deal. I loved Origins, but having a voiceless PC does limit you somewhat. Yes you can say the lines in your head with whatever intent you want, but the NPCs are only going to respond one way. I stumbled through a few conversations during my first playthrough because what I said and the way I said it were apparently different, resulting in approval drops I wasn't expecting.

Yes your race is set. You are playing a human. Consider this your single origin for the game. There's no saying you won't be able to pick race in another DA game or that the next sequel won't feature an elf or dwarf main character. But for this game, it's Hawke's story.

I love Baldur's Gate as much as the next girl, but it's too soon to determine how DA2 will hold up in comparison. One thing we must remember is that BG2 is about 10 years old at this point. It faced certain limitations that were a product of technical capabilities at the time. Technology has marched forward quite a bit, and so games have marched forward to. Gone are the days of turn-based combat and limited voice overs, and that's a good thing! Cinematic games can be very engrossing and just as immersive when done right.

All I'm saying is calm down, don't make assumptions based on the roughly 10 pieces of info we have right now.

[Lyssistr]

The path to the Dark Side, fear is.

[Lord_Saulot]

In the Baldur's Gate series your origin/background was a fixed feature of the plot.



Sorry, but having a somewhat fixed origin doesn't make the game less like BG2.

[Gaxhung]

I never played BG games, are those still available, ahem, at a reduced price digitally? Steam doesn't have them. Bypass BG1 go straight for BG2 if I were to get them?



Amazon has them but, the shipping is expensive for me, and what about Planescape Torment (1999 release), costs US$39.99, @_@

[Lyssistr]

Gaxhung wrote...

I never played BG games, are those still available, ahem, at a reduced price digitally? Steam doesn't have them. Bypass BG1 go straight for BG2 if I were to get them?

Amazon has them but, the shipping is expensive for me, and what about Planescape Torment (1999 release), costs US$39.99, @_@

 No digital distribution of BG & PS:T that I'm aware of, you'll need to find a retail copy. Personally, between BG I & BG II, I find BG 2 to be the superior game, it's quite a masterpiece and it stands up for all the hype.

 However, graphics may be an issue to you if you are used to today's HD gfx. Make sure to use the widescreen mod (from gibblerlings three), it allows you to adjust resolution.

[DPB]

Gaxhung wrote...

I never played BG games, are those still available, ahem, at a reduced price digitally? Steam doesn't have them. Bypass BG1 go straight for BG2 if I were to get them?

I suggest buying the 4 in 1 compilation, it contains both games plus the expansions, and it isn't very expensive. I don't think there are any digital versions available anywhere, Hasbro are in a dispute with Atari over the rights to publishing D&D games, and until it's resolved there won't be any new D&D games or re-releases.

[CalJones]

There's a box with BG, BGII and ToB - go for that. You can get it pretty cheaply from Amazon but you may be able to find another online retailer who is Malaysia based or ships there cheaper.

BG1 is definitely worth playing but I like BG2 a bit better - it has a lot of very good mods (and a lot of bad ones too, heh) and thanks to those I must have played through it in excess of 30 times now.

[BomimoDK]

Lord_Saulot wrote...

In the Baldur's Gate series your origin/background was a fixed feature of the plot.

Sorry, but having a somewhat fixed origin doesn't make the game less like BG2.

actually more i'd say. the plot being spread over 10 years also sounds like they're planning some epic adventure.

[Wyndham711]

DA2 is going to be its own thing. And I think it's going to be something refreshingly new and different, moreso than a mere origins 2.0 would ever be. Origins as a game wont be going anywhere, and eventhough the sequel changes certain things (some of which I hold very dear, such as the voiceless PC), as far as I know many of the core features that made Origins a great game will still be intact. Needless to say I'm _very_ excited!

[Gaxhung]

Thanks Lyssistr and dbankier.

[stylepoints]

You know that raises an interesting point. The BG series had you locked into a certain past and it certainly didn't hurt that game.

[BomimoDK]

All you BG2 fans NEED to play BG1. otherwise, i can safely say. you have no clue about the story... about the sarevoks past/childhood, about you, Imoen and Gorion. about the Political intrigue during the Iron Crisis. about how the hell you somehow managed to survive insane mages and later lycantropes and a demon with laughably weak casters and some sticks as weapons.



BG1 i just as fun and doubly challenging compared to BG2.

[BomimoDK]

Acharnae wrote...

Exactly... The BG trilogy was the most compact and thrilling story ever to grace the PC screen IMO.
Everything made sense.
Characters were unique, plot was as tight as it could get, the battles were real tactical gems.
DA2 sure isn't going to be BGII (could it be better? I hope...)
But also DAO wasn't BG either.
Edit: although to be fair, DAO propelled the genre in a much more realistic environment. I guess to replicate BG in DAO environment you would need... 10 DVDs...

no, what they're actually doing is convert the original video and sound from BG to Dragon Age... so you would need to own the old games.

Gamers Nexus Modders - BGR Mod Team

[AlanC9]

Acharnae wrote...

Characters were unique, plot was as tight as it could get, the battles were real tactical gems.

Actually, the BG games had an awful lot of trash fights. One or two boss battles were interesting, but the vast bulk of the combat was so brain-dead I wouldn't have needed to touch the controls if my characters had tactis the way DA characters do.

[WilliamShatner]

BG + Tutu + NPC pack is better than BG2. Dungeons were far to big in BG2, too easy to get stuck in and too many cheap deaths.

[AlanC9]

Absolutely, Acharnae. Tactics would have just made it obvious to everybody how brain-dead most of the BG combat was. As long as you have to push the buttons yourself a lot of people can fool themselves into thinking they're accomplishing something. It's the same principle that made Diablo a hit.

Modifié par AlanC9, 11 juillet 2010 - 05:06 .

[In Exile]

I couldn't stand BG2. Finally played through the whole series a few years ago, but it was just dated and, well, lacking in a lot of ways compared to modern games. I get that people really, really loved that game, but the fact that every Bioware game isn't a BG2 clone isn't a bad thing.



And, honestly, I find BG unplayable. Even with the BG2 graphics update.

[marko2te]

highcastle wrote...

I love Baldur's Gate as much as the next girl, but it's too soon to determine how DA2 will hold up in comparison. One thing we must remember is that BG2 is about 10 years old at this point. It faced certain limitations that were a product of technical capabilities at the time. Technology has marched forward quite a bit, and so games have marched forward to. Gone are the days of turn-based combat and limited voice overs, and that's a good thing! Cinematic games can be very engrossing and just as immersive when done right.

Good thing that technology advanced now instead of dialog trees we have dialog wheels with emoticons. Its always funny how some people think that dumbing down games is evolution. Also turn based combat is not related to techical capabilities of computers. BG was a real time game and Temple of Elemetal Evil while turn based still has the best combat system ever created for any RPG.

[hexaligned]

Well I don't think anyone was comparing BG2 to winning a Civ4 tournament against human players.
It was still more complex than DAO though. Especially if you were a young goober (like me when I first played it) or had no prievious expierience with DnD. For instance running into a mind flayer for the first time and getting one shotted while it locked down the rest of your team with CC and chewed them apart. You had to stop and develop different strategies for each fight. Once you know the game and have every encounter and enemy mechanics memorized, you can tear through it yes. Compare that to DAO where you can auto attack your way through with 0 threat of death from anything from the get go.

But anywho, I don't want BG2 combat in DA2, I think Bioware has it in them to do better, I'm just hoping they flesh out the combat options a bit more (enemies combat options specificaly) and spruce up the AI a bit.

Modifié par relhart, 11 juillet 2010 - 05:23 .