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[LPPrince]

Tinxa wrote...

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...

(however I have no idea why the mage needed a fixed surname as he/she had no real family and I cant remember once where the surname was ever used in any conversation)

The surnames were only important in noble origins but making fixed surnames for some origins and leaving surnames open in others proved difficult and/or caused some problems so it was easier to just put fixed surnames for everyone

Hawke doesn't imply any traits for me I just think it sound too modern or something. Like the last name of a hero in some detective novel or a hero in an action movie or something.
But when I first heard Cousland it sounded very strange to me but then I got used to it, I liked the name Aeducan very much however... I'm sure Hawke will grow on me eventually

Here we go again-

History of the name Hawke-

This ancient and distinguished surname is of Anglo-Saxon origin, and may belong to any of three distinct surname categories. Firstly, Hawke may derive from the Olde English pre 7th Century male given "H(e)afoc", Hawk, originally a byname denoting a fierce, rapacious person, or one with a large hooked nose. "Hauok" (without surname) was recorded in the 1066 Winton Book of Hampshire, and an Osbertus filius (son of) Hauoc was noted in the 1115 Old English Byname Register of Oxfordshire. The second possibility is that Hawke is a metonymic occupational name for someone who bred and trained hawks, from the Middle English "hau(l)k, haueke" (Olde English "heafoc"). Hawking was a major medieval sport, and the provision and training of hawks for a feudal lord was a not uncommon obligation in lieu of rent. One Robert Hauk was recorded in the 1269 Assize Rolls of Northumberland, and in 1379, an Adam Hawke appears in the Poll Tax Returns of Yorkshire. Finally, Hawke may be a topographical name from residence by a nook or crag, from the Middle English "halke" (Olde English "halh"), angle, corner, recess, as in William del Halk (Suffolk, 1188). Edward Hawke (1705 - 1781) became admiral of the fleet in 1768 following a distinguished naval career, and was created Baron Hawke of Great Britain in 1776. The Hawke Coat of Arms is a silver shield with a chevron erminois between three purple pilgrims' staves. The first recorded spelling of the family name is shown to be that of Ralph Hauoc, which was dated 1130, in the "Pipe Rolls of London", during the reign of King Henry 1, known as "The Lion of Justice", 1100 - 1135. Surnames became necessary when governments introduced personal taxation. In England this was known as Poll Tax. Throughout the centuries, surnames in every country have continued to "develop" often leading to astonishing variants of the original spelling.

[Demx]

LPPrince wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Why should a surname imply anything at all about someone's personality?

Exactly?

In real life, I'm a Prince. I won't give out my whole name or anything, but I've got the royal blood of Sikh Rajputs in my veins, yet my last name is Mohan.

Mohan is IRISH. Does that mean I'm supposed to have every stereotype of an Irishman be true of me?

I thought Mohan was Hindu

[_-Greywolf-_]

Aetheria wrote...
...What? That doesn't make sense. How are the surnames in DA:O more vague?

Well what the hell do names like Cousland, Broska or Aeducan mean? I am not sure if they mean anything in another language but as far as I know they are farily vague and dont really say much about the character.

However a name like Hawke can imply many things, when writing fantasy I know a lot of writers use the name Hawke when creating characters like scouts, archers or rangers, is this coincidence? Lets look at the aspects of a hawk, hawks are birds of prey and are naturally good hunters, the name Hawke could imply that the character has good eyesight, is a sharp shot with a bow or is a natural born hunter.

Now I am not saying that this is Bioware's intention with the name Hawke, what I am saying is this is what I assume has people so worried about the name Hawke.

[LPPrince]

Siradix wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Why should a surname imply anything at all about someone's personality?

Exactly?

In real life, I'm a Prince. I won't give out my whole name or anything, but I've got the royal blood of Sikh Rajputs in my veins, yet my last name is Mohan.

Mohan is IRISH. Does that mean I'm supposed to have every stereotype of an Irishman be true of me?

I thought Mohan was Hindu

History of Mohan-

This famous Irish surname recorded in such diverse spellings as O'Mahon, Mahon, Moan, Moen, Mowne, Mohan, Mohun, Mowen, Maughan and Vaughan, has two possible derivations. The first is from the ancient Gaelic O'Mochain, apparently translating as "the son of the descendant of the early one" a reference to the first chief, whilst the second is of Norman origins, and derives from the "de Mohun" family, who accompanied Strongbow, earl of Pembroke, on his original expedition to Ireland in the year 1169. There are now two separate clans or septs, one in Connacht, the other in Munster, where to add confusion the name is usually spelt Vaughan. In County Galway, the name is most usually spelt as Mahon, although sometimes as Maughan or Mahan. In County Roscommon in the 13th century the clan were "erenaghs" or hereditary lords, responsible for the upkeep of the church and church property in their region. The transmutation of the surname from Mochain or Moghan to Vaughan, a Welsh surname, which arrived in Ireland in its own right before the 15th century, and which occurred particularly in counties Cork, Limerick and Clare, is one of life's little curiosities. The name spelling as Moan, Mowen, etc. is most popular in Ulster. Amongst the early recordings are those of Denis Mahan, the American soldier (1802 - 1871) whose parents emigrated from Ireland in 1802, and his son Alfred, the leading American naval historian (1840 - 1914). The first known recording of the family name is probably that of Gregory O'Moghan, the Archbishop of Tuam, Ireland, who died there in the year 1392. Surnames have continued to "develop" over the centuries, often leading to some amazing variants of the original spellings.

EDIT- It made its way from Ireland to India, hence my last name.

Modifié par LPPrince, 11 juillet 2010 - 11:14 .

[camomandoom]

Hawke obviously means hes very warlike. This angers me because I don't want to be forced to be a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer. I want to be a peaceful, diplomat who changes the world through talking and feeling-sharing. I hate you BioWare for forcing this on me.

[LPPrince]

camomandoom wrote...

Hawke obviously means hes very warlike. This angers me because I don't want to be forced to be a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer. I want to be a peaceful, diplomat who changes the world through talking and feeling-sharing. I hate you BioWare for forcing this on me.

And where was it confirmed that he was a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer?

[LPPrince]

Oh, and if you're wondering, I was born in NYC, and am of Cuban and Indian(where the royal line lies) blood.



Since my last name is Irish at the core, I doubt that means I should love beer and potatoes, as the stereotype entails.



I mean its true, but still.

[Remaix]

Because calling someone 'Warden' is so much more preferable than an actual name?

[camomandoom]

LPPrince wrote...

camomandoom wrote...

Hawke obviously means hes very warlike. This angers me because I don't want to be forced to be a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer. I want to be a peaceful, diplomat who changes the world through talking and feeling-sharing. I hate you BioWare for forcing this on me.

And where was it confirmed that he was a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer?

I thought I was pretty obvious in my sarcasm. I can't think of dragon age origins attracting the peaceful, diplomatic people who hate violence. My post was pretty ridiculous wasn't it? especially for a game like Dragon Age.

[Jimmy Fury]

MaxQuartiroli wrote...

Mary Kirby wrote...
And you are totally not going to trick me into talking about what the romance options are yet. Don't even try.

At least he makes you admit indirectly there are romance options.. It's better than nothing

good catch! WOOHOO! 

As for the surname things. My surname means two different things in two different language. It's a really crappy profession-based name in english and something to do with conquering-hero or some nonsense in french. Big difference. Yet i'm neither french nor english so it means nothing to me in terms of symbolism.
Hawke, as a name, only means what you assume it means. If you want to apply some crazy symbolism to it that's your doing. It's all in your head though. Honestly, it's no more symbolic than giving him/her the last name Smith, Jones, Frost, or Scoobydoo.

[LPPrince]

camomandoom wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

camomandoom wrote...

Hawke obviously means hes very warlike. This angers me because I don't want to be forced to be a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer. I want to be a peaceful, diplomat who changes the world through talking and feeling-sharing. I hate you BioWare for forcing this on me.

And where was it confirmed that he was a pig-dog, barbarian, war-mongerer?

I thought I was pretty obvious in my sarcasm. I can't think of dragon age origins attracting the peaceful, diplomatic people who hate violence. My post was pretty ridiculous wasn't it? especially for a game like Dragon Age.

Sarcasm's very hard to convey online. For future attempts try something like this-

[sarcasm]Sure, that was HILARIOUS.[/sarcasm]

[Tinxa]

LPPrince wrote...

Tinxa wrote...

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...

(however I have no idea why the mage needed a fixed surname as he/she had no real family and I cant remember once where the surname was ever used in any conversation)

The surnames were only important in noble origins but making fixed surnames for some origins and leaving surnames open in others proved difficult and/or caused some problems so it was easier to just put fixed surnames for everyone

Hawke doesn't imply any traits for me I just think it sound too modern or something. Like the last name of a hero in some detective novel or a hero in an action movie or something.
But when I first heard Cousland it sounded very strange to me but then I got used to it, I liked the name Aeducan very much however... I'm sure Hawke will grow on me eventually

Here we go again-

History of the name Hawke-

I realise the name was probably very old and such, I was just trying to explain what it sounded like to me. When I first heard it that is what I thought of  It makes no sense why it would remind me of a detective in a trenchcoat and a hat it just does for some reason. But thank you for explaining the history... very interesting

[Bryy_Miller]

OriginsIsBest wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

OriginsIsBest wrote...

Why is so many people interested in gay romance options? it freaks me out a little .... I can understand Girls on girls sort of thing but guys on guys!?

If you are going to troll, do it better.

Im not trolling. Im just saying I dont find guy on guy interesting. Why do you?

So, you're saying - you're actually saying - that female homosexuality is okay because you get a boner from girls kissing?

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

I guess I didn't get that memo. What was Shepard supposed to convey in ME, exactly?

Shepard-Shepherd-Messainic-protector figure.

To me, having a predetermined character isn't necessarilly the end of the world.  Some of the better rpgs I've played have used them. 

Exibit A being The Nameless One in Plaescape: Torment.  Your a human(ish) fighter to start out, but the whole rest of the game came down to defining who his is.  In fact, the whole theme of the game came down to the riddle that kept cropping up "What can change the nature of a man?"

[LPPrince]

Tinxa wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

Tinxa wrote...

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...

(however I have no idea why the mage needed a fixed surname as he/she had no real family and I cant remember once where the surname was ever used in any conversation)

The surnames were only important in noble origins but making fixed surnames for some origins and leaving surnames open in others proved difficult and/or caused some problems so it was easier to just put fixed surnames for everyone

Hawke doesn't imply any traits for me I just think it sound too modern or something. Like the last name of a hero in some detective novel or a hero in an action movie or something.
But when I first heard Cousland it sounded very strange to me but then I got used to it, I liked the name Aeducan very much however... I'm sure Hawke will grow on me eventually

Here we go again-

History of the name Hawke-

I realise the name was probably very old and such, I was just trying to explain what it sounded like to me. When I first heard it that is what I thought of  It makes no sense why it would remind me of a detective in a trenchcoat and a hat it just does for some reason. But thank you for explaining the history... very interesting

You are very welcome. It comes from the same area and time period as Howe, so when I hear people saying Howe is fine and Hawke is not, I facepalm hardcore.

[MnMH]

LPPrince wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Why should a surname imply anything at all about someone's personality?

Exactly?

In real life, I'm a Prince. I won't give out my whole name or anything, but I've got the royal blood of Sikh Rajputs in my veins, yet my last name is Mohan.

Mohan is IRISH. Does that mean I'm supposed to have every stereotype of an Irishman be true of me?

In life it doesn't. However, names are often used as literary devices to inform readers about some aspect of the character--it's used far more often in literature than in video games, but it's arguable that Bioware has a recent history of doing so (look up the meaning of the name "Shepard" for instance). 

The first literary reference that comes to mind is Richard from The Sword of Truth novels. Richard means "wise power" or "noble power" which is  a pretty apt description of his character. 

[Mihura]

It does not bother me if the default name is Hawke but I think that _-Greywolf-_ is right the name has a meaning and it is really easy to see it in the artwork



Even the way he has the sword in his hand is kinda strange and the claw too, it kinda of reminds me of the same thing has Altair with is tunic.

Modifié par Mihura, 11 juillet 2010 - 11:50 .

[Ecael]

Mary Kirby wrote...

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...

Yes we have heard Hawke will be more flexible than Shepard but will he be as flexible as a single origin in Origins? Or will Hawke still have somewhat of a predefined view on the world and certain things such as homosexuality?

Worldview is one of the things that Dragon Age is about.  Your character's personal perspective on the issues and events of Thedas were a crucial part of the story, and we'd like to keep it that way for DA2.

And you are totally not going to trick me into talking about what the romance options are yet. Don't even try.

Commander Shepard for love interest and companion in Dragon Age 2!

[LPPrince]

MnMH wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Why should a surname imply anything at all about someone's personality?

Exactly?

In real life, I'm a Prince. I won't give out my whole name or anything, but I've got the royal blood of Sikh Rajputs in my veins, yet my last name is Mohan.

Mohan is IRISH. Does that mean I'm supposed to have every stereotype of an Irishman be true of me?

In life it doesn't. However, names are often used as literary devices to inform readers about some aspect of the character--it's used far more often in literature than in video games, but it's arguable that Bioware has a recent history of doing so (look up the meaning of the name "Shepard" for instance). 

The first literary reference that comes to mind is Richard from The Sword of Truth novels. Richard means "wise power" or "noble power" which is  a pretty apt description of his character. 

That would explain why Shepard's name was Shepard.

[LPPrince]

Ecael wrote...

Mary Kirby wrote...

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...

Yes we have heard Hawke will be more flexible than Shepard but will he be as flexible as a single origin in Origins? Or will Hawke still have somewhat of a predefined view on the world and certain things such as homosexuality?

Worldview is one of the things that Dragon Age is about.  Your character's personal perspective on the issues and events of Thedas were a crucial part of the story, and we'd like to keep it that way for DA2.

And you are totally not going to trick me into talking about what the romance options are yet. Don't even try.

Commander Shepard for love interest and companion in Dragon Age 2!

No, E. No.

[sodomitebastard]

Mary Kirby wrote...

Commander Shepard is a much more specific character than Hawke is. Shepard is one very particular marine chosen to do a particularly challenging job. Hawke is somebody who goes from being a refugee to being important to Thedas history somehow.  Defining who Hawke turns out to be and how that happens is sort of where the player comes in to the story.

Ah, Mary... This made my day (night)
Reading this quenched the few doubts I had, and now I'm almost only looking forward to Dragon Age 2... Were you not a woman I'd consider proposing to you! 

[phaonica]

Mary Kirby wrote...

Commander Shepard is a much more specific character than Hawke is. Shepard is one very particular marine chosen to do a particularly challenging job. Hawke is somebody who goes from being a refugee to being important to Thedas history somehow.  Defining who Hawke turns out to be and how that happens is sort of where the player comes in to the story.

Forgive me if this has been addressed somewhere already, but I wanted to ask.
There is a difference between a predefined character, and a sandbox one, I certainly see that and get the impression that a sandbox character is intended for DA2. I'm curious if Bioware considers DA2 to be a first or third person narrative. I know that some are arguing that simply by adding VOs, the narrative is by default third-person. Is the intention to attempt a first-person narrative with VOs? Or is the game being designed with a third person narrative in mind?

Is this even something that can be answered now?

[Bryy_Miller]

Mihura wrote...

It does not bother me if the default name is Hawke but I think that _-Greywolf-_ is right the name has a meaning and it is really easy to see it in the artwork



Even the way he has the sword in his hand is kinda strange and the claw too, it kinda of reminds me of the same thing has Altair with is tunic.

Greywolf Hawke.... thanks for naming my male for me. I did love Howard, but Greywolf is epic.

[LPPrince]

sodomitebastard wrote...

Mary Kirby wrote...

Commander Shepard is a much more specific character than Hawke is. Shepard is one very particular marine chosen to do a particularly challenging job. Hawke is somebody who goes from being a refugee to being important to Thedas history somehow.  Defining who Hawke turns out to be and how that happens is sort of where the player comes in to the story.

Ah, Mary... This made my day (night)
Reading this quenched the few doubts I had, and now I'm almost only looking forward to Dragon Age 2... Were you not a woman I'd consider proposing to you! 

Propose to her regardless. It'd bring much lulz.

[condiments1]

iakus wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

I guess I didn't get that memo. What was Shepard supposed to convey in ME, exactly?

Shepard-Shepherd-Messainic-protector figure.

To me, having a predetermined character isn't necessarilly the end of the world.  Some of the better rpgs I've played have used them. 

Exibit A being The Nameless One in Plaescape: Torment.  Your a human(ish) fighter to start out, but the whole rest of the game came down to defining who his is.  In fact, the whole theme of the game came down to the riddle that kept cropping up "What can change the nature of a man?"

The nameless one is one of the most rich and interesting characters in all of gaming, but the options to roleplay him were vast. If Bioware can provide a similar experience, I would be quite happy.

However forgive me for having low expectations.