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[Grond0]

ArchDragonDranovis wrote...

@Grond0, To the Umar Hills/ Shadow Temple? Again at around the same level as last time? IIRC you were around level 10-12 last time, so if you do go there, it's either fight the Shadow Dragon carefully, or not at all. Your choice, but from what I've seen a few pages ago, you are better off not fighting it. But it's you guys, so my opinion has no meaning to you, and it shouldn't affect your choice anyways. I'm just letting you know how I would go about it, I guess. IF you are going to fight the Shadow Dragon, good luck!
Wonder what's considered a safe dragon fighting level. Would it be 12/13 or 15/16?

Thanks for thinking of us.  You're right that a fair fight with a dragon at our levels is not a good option for a no-reload, so we could well just bypass him and come back later. 

However, a particular problem last time was that neither character had an immunity to level drain that would allow missile use while equipped (and could not thus hide under the canopy and just shoot at him).  This time Cyill can make use of the Amulet of Power so that would be a possibility; it would probably take quite a while using just a sling, but Scion could tank intermittently using his 3 rages to help speed things up.  We'll probably see how we feel about taking him on when we get there.

In general it's hard to say what levels are correct for dragon hunting.  Immunity to breath makes a huge difference and so does availability of magical support - a couple of casters starting with lower resistances and then using damage spells can make a mess of a dragon pretty quickly.  So can a group of melee fighters if protections can be dispelled, though that strategy can be disrupted by a well-timed wing buffet.  I would think 10th level would be reasonable for a full party with a decent strategy, but a solo character would probably need higher levels generally (the Shadow Dragon can be done at any level by a character willing to hide under the canopy with immunity to level drain).

Modifié par Grond0, 11 juin 2012 - 06:22 .

[corey_russell]

With only 2 party members, there's hardly any need to fight the shadow dragon, for sure. Plenty of experience to be had. I would recommend coming back after they get a few HLAs under their belts, this should happen in chapter 2 I would think with 2 party members.

[PPewt]

Or with mace of disruption on one character and amulet of power on the other.

[Gate70]

I can see there are options for Scion/Cyill but our three no-reloads against it at similar levels support the opinions of ADD & Corey.

1 Nawgrim/Peer got a kicking after a strong start. Won by using an entire wand of cloudkill from the arches.
2 Nadir/Kaxir started OK then struggled until the dwarven throwing hammer turned the tide (not an option this time)
3 Boor/Perry ran into PfMW and/or stoneskin. Expiring NPP buffs proved fatal.

I'd rather come back with a bit more experience than have another early bath.

Modifié par Gate70, 11 juin 2012 - 05:35 .

[corey_russell]

Heh, don't forget Gate70, I was also talking from the point that my 5 paladins/fallen paldins gave it a go slightly below your levels, and got slaughtered - well, we did get it to badly injured, but that doesn't help if the entire party is dead...

[Grond0]

Scion (human berserker, Grond0) and Cyill (half-elf cleric/ranger, Gate70) Session  1h 55m (total 8h 40m)

The duo travelled from Umar Hills to the ruined temple to investigate various undead.  Cyill's ability to stealth into areas and then turn undead was put to good use - the weaker ones exploding and the stronger trying to claw their way through walls while being attacked by Azuredge.  I noted that Cyill got hit by one flame strike by the statue - a pretty good effort, although not up to the last run's standard where Gate70 got all the answers correct for the first time (I never have).  We waved at the dragon as we passed and said see you later.  The Shade Lord used pierce magic on Cyill, but didn't last long enough thereafter to really take advantage of his weakened condition (Cyill level 10 ranger).

Back in the Umar Hills Valygar was recruited, but we didn't report back to the mayor (saving experience for later).  So it was off to the city to open up the Planar Sphere before dumping Valygar again.  Then the duo did some tasks for Aran Linvail allowing them to access the vampire dwelling beneath the Graveyard.  Tanova and Lassal were left for now, but the rest were dealt with in order to get the mace of disruption.  Staking a couple of vampires got Scion to level 13 and he dualled to mage (after going back to their holding container in the Promenade).

At this point Gate70 wandered off for about 20 minutes while Scion sorted his equipment out and learnt all the scrolls found so far (taking a couple of potions of genius to give himself 100% chance).  In standard BG2 this would have been worth 300,000 XP, but BGT has rewards for spell learning and thief skill use heavily nerfed in order to avoid unbalancing BG1.  Therefore Scion's half share of the experience was only 1,500 - not even enough for a single level!

There are a number of quests with final rewards outstanding that will allow Scion to quickly get up to a competetive level.  The last action of the evening was the first of these - returning a bear to a little boy's ghost.

Scion B 13 (inactive) / M 4, 138 HPs (including 12 from familiar, 12 from ioun stone), 594 kills (59 in session).
Cyill Cl 10 / R 10, 84 HPs (including 5 from helm), 309 kills (24 in session).
Cyill will be the lead character for a while now, so should start to claw back Scion's lead.

Still no deaths in this BGT run, though there was one relatively close encounter for Cyill in the session that was quite amusing.  In the vampire lair Scion encountered a clay golem, but didn't have a magic blunt weapon on him.  Rather than swap equipment he just stepped aside to give Cyill a go.  Cyill got it to near death, but was within one hit of dying himself so he stepped back while Scion tried to attract the golem's attention onto him (with the intention that Cyill could then come back in to make the final blow).  Just for the hell of it Scion swung Stonefire at the golem - and found that it was only partially resistant to fire.  The 1 HP fire damage was enough to kill the golem - a perfect example of goal hanging!

[ArchDragonDranovis]

Nice Clay golem kill!
And I laughed at the load screen text on your shadow dragon pic!

no one can do everything alone. use the strengths of all your party members!

A duo doesn't have that many party member strengths. But they do cover almost ALL the bases.
I found it funny simply because it was the two of you staring at the shadow dragon.

[Krazy Solo]

Deek the Halfling Fighter/Thief died at the hands of tabitha after the group left deek behind trapping him in one of the cells. I'm wondering if the AI in the game isn't faulty at times. 3 of the 4 member group retreated, but deek stayed behind fighting even after I forced moved him. Anyway another dead hero. Starting to think the so called power classes aren't all that good. I mean had an far easier time playing a shapeshifter, vanilla one at that.

Back to the drawing board as they say. At least I don't have to worry about doing BG1, so my attachment to these characters are superficial rather than reality.

[Gate70]

Had you assigned a script for Deek, e.g. an aggressive script with AI turned on will cause that sort of behaviour (other reasons are confusion or rigid thinking but shouldn't be happening in that area).

[Krazy Solo]

I believe I had him on Standard Fighter same as Jaheira. Jaheira backed even being engaged. Not sure why Deek stayed to fight unless his pathing was blocked forcing him to auto attack instead of moving. Regardless he died an unfortunate death.

As far as my next entry I'm undecided. Hopefully I can make up my mind.

[corey_russell]

That definitely sounds like a script thing. If you have any party member with attacking scripts (rather than defensive), you should turn off the AI when you retreat. Probably the only reason Jaheira successfully retreated was she wasn't attacked. Characters with attacking scripts, when attacked, will immediately fight their attacker, which is why it's important to turn off the AI when retreating OR if you want the fighter/melee to ignore who is attacking them and go for a higher priority target (like an enemy mage or cleric).

[PPewt]

Krazy Solo wrote...

Deek the Halfling Fighter/Thief died at the hands of tabitha after the group left deek behind trapping him in one of the cells. I'm wondering if the AI in the game isn't faulty at times. 3 of the 4 member group retreated, but deek stayed behind fighting even after I forced moved him. Anyway another dead hero. Starting to think the so called power classes aren't all that good. I mean had an far easier time playing a shapeshifter, vanilla one at that.

Back to the drawing board as they say. At least I don't have to worry about doing BG1, so my attachment to these characters are superficial rather than reality.

The power classes (F/M, F/T, F/M/T, their dual class equivalents, C/R, and Sorcerer) are the best, but they're also the hardest to play (well, compared to vanilla Fighters, Druids, Clerics etc) and can in some cases (all but C/R really) be very weak if you don't know how to play them. Think of them as classes with a higher minimum knowledge/experience requirement to succeed but also a higher potential.

Modifié par PPewt, 13 juin 2012 - 12:35 .

[Krazy Solo]

IMHO it personally comes down to what your good at not so much what is good. I'm style of play is unique and hard to translate into party base games.

[ArchDragonDranovis]

@Krazy Solo, I know what you mean. I love the offensive spellcaster more than other classes, but I always try to enjoy other classes simply because it's refreshing!

[PPewt]

Krazy Solo wrote...

IMHO it personally comes down to what your good at not so much what is good. I'm style of play is unique and hard to translate into party base games.

To an extent sure, but you can do a lot of things with those classes which are just not possible with weaker builds.

[Grond0]

Scion (human berserker, Grond0) and Cyill (half-elf cleric/ranger, Gate70) Session 4 2h 0m (total 10h 40m)

The bulk of the session was taken up with completing quests left unfinished previously to get some easy XP to get Scion competitive again after dualling to mage.  It didn't take long to get up to level 9 doing that.

There was an intentionally slightly more adventurous excursion to the southern tombs, although Cyill did nearly all the work there with his turning ability and the MoD. 

In addition there was a nasty encounter in the Bridge District started when Tanova and a few vampires were spotted.  I made my normal mistake of using a mage spell in the city and some cowled enforcers teleported in while we hurried out of sight.  A succession of summons sent round the corner (and some in-fighting between the enforcers as a consequence of that) got rid of all their offensive spells.  In preparation for finishing them off Scion cast another spell - only for a new lot of enforcers to appear (I thought only 1 lot would turn up at once).  That meant the duo quickly running away again; Scion had to survive a domination attempt by Tanova who was still lurking around, but they got safely away.

With the easy XP banked they went on to complete the Sir Sarles quest (and upgrade to IMoD).  Then went to finish off the vampire lair.  Tanova was neutralised by a succession of summons and some more summons also helped with the downstairs mob.  After a rest yet more buffed summons were set in place waiting for Bodhi - she failed to last out a single round.

Retrieved the Lathander relic from the slums and then reported back to Aran Linvail, but chose not to take ship to Spellhold just yet.  The session ended having just talked to Bloodscalp to open up the Mae'Var quests.

Scion B 13 (inactive) / M 10, 138 HPs (including 12 from familiar, 12 from ioun stone), 608 kills (14 in session).
Cyill Cl 11 / R 10, 85 HPs (including 5 from helm), 363 kills (54 in session).

[Grimwald the Wise]

My Fighter/Cleric and Illusionist/thief svirfneblin in BG1 were played with Exp Cap removed in order to play the Drizzt Saga. However that means that they will be overpowered when it comes to BG2.

I am wondering what is the best way to get them into BG2 with appropriate experience etc..
(I played BG1 using Tutu)

I am aware that other things will also have changed when levelling up so just using Shadowkeeper to reduce the experience and level will not work.

Another question. What experience should a character have coming from ToSC?

Modifié par Grimwald the Wise, 14 juin 2012 - 07:23 .

[PPewt]

You could always export them when they hit max level and, when you're done BG1, import said exports to BG2.

That said, does it really matter? You level up so quickly in BG2 that it shouldn't make a substantial difference, especially since there are a number of quests which are basically just free xp.

[Grimwald the Wise]

Due to the extra quests done in Grey Clan Episode, The Secrets of Bone Hill, The Stone of Askavar, The Drizzt Saga etc. they have experience of 520,000 each. Whilst that experience was necessary for doing those mods, I think that it is a trifle too much for BG2.  The Drizzt Saga enemies are much tougher than the BG2 ones that you start with.

Sadly I did not export on reaching the experience cap, however, I have had an idea which I think should work. Comments please, as I am not too sure of this.

Open the starting game in Shadow keeper. Adjust stats to be the finishing ones in ToSC. Adjust experience to the experience cap. Add the Bhaalspawn powers. Add known spells.

Open the game and level up adding proficiencies as per the game.

Export the characters.

Import them to BG2.

Anything else that I should do?

Modifié par Grimwald the Wise, 14 juin 2012 - 08:30 .

[PPewt]

You may have to CLUA in items if you are trying to import any.

[Gate70]

Why not just reroll them in BG2 then shadowkeeper the stats. Not sure but wouldn't Bhaalspawn powers default, and is the loss of learned spells significant as lots of scrolls and more xp?
The original caps were 89,000 for BG1 and 161,000 from TotSC.

[PPewt]

Gate70 wrote...

Why not just reroll them in BG2 then shadowkeeper the stats. Not sure but wouldn't Bhaalspawn powers default, and is the loss of learned spells significant as lots of scrolls and more xp?
The original caps were 89,000 for BG1 and 161,000 from TotSC.

BG1 bhaalspawn powers are based on your reputation at the time of the chapter dreams, so it's possible to select any combination that you want.

[Gate70]

Yes, appreciate that but you(*) may be the only person who runs the reputation up and down to get a mix of powers.

* - I'm blatantly lying as Grond0 does this whenever possible so it may be I'm the only person who doesn't!

[corey_russell]

Gate70 wrote...

Yes, appreciate that but you(*) may be the only person who runs the reputation up and down to get a mix of powers.

* - I'm blatantly lying as Grond0 does this whenever possible so it may be I'm the only person who doesn't!

Not to worry Gate70 - you are definitely NOT the only person who doesn't fiddle with their reputation to get specific powers. I almost never meta-game in this way, I just take what I get. Also, if I'm good aligned party, try to stay at 20 rep and if evil around the middle and that's about it for my intentional reputation fiddling.

[Grond0]

Scion (human berserker, Grond0) and Cyill (half-elf cleric/ranger, Gate70) Session 5 1h 30m (total 12h 10m)

The session started with a bit of lich hunting.  The one at the City Gates needed a grand total of 1 hit from the IMoD to deal with him and give access to Daystar.  The one at the Bridge did a bit better - surviving about a round.

The intention was to do the Mae'Var quests, but it was the wrong time of day for getting the amulet, so there was a diversion to the temple sewers.  The troll was quickly dealt with to please Roger before a somewhat sterner test against Tarnor's party.  Cyill used some summons and smites to cause general chaos while he concentrated on the casters; he made good inroads there, but there were still 3 enemies active when he needed to retreat.  Sanctuary allowed him to heal back up and then finish them off.

After resting, the amulet was picked up before coming back to the sewers and taking out the rakshasa.  Cyill then showed his prowess at exploding shadows while opening up the Unseeing Eye quest.  The Shade Lich there put up a good fight; a couple of misleads kept him going quite a while and a ADHW came quite close to killing Cyill.  Slightly oddly it was the berserk warrior that eventually got the killing blow (Scion L11).

Rather than carry on with the Eye quest the duo came back to deal with Mae'Var.  No problems with the quests or the final take-over of the guild.  A combination of 2 fireballs and 2 holy smites didn't leave much of Mae'Var's gang to give him support (Cyill cleric 12).

Scion B 13 (inactive) / M 11, 138 HPs (including 12 from familiar, 12 from ioun stone), 642 kills (34 in session).
Cyill Cl 12 / R 11, 87 HPs (including 5 from helm), 428 kills (65 in session).

Modifié par Grond0, 15 juin 2012 - 10:14 .