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#13751
Alesia_BH

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Arkona, Halfling Barbarian: Testing 1,2,3

 

As some of you know, I'm conducting a test run with a barbarian named Arkona. Arkona is running through a BG Classic Edition (AKA-Non-EE) SCS v15, Fixpack v10, ATweaks v4.4.2 install. 

 

Even though this is a test run, Arkona has been fun. I've rediscovered the art of warrior play for the first time since my paladin, Alessandra. This run has been a blast, the install is sound and stable, and Arkona has shown potential: real potential. It's time to let her out of her cage. Below you'll find a semi-recent shot of Arkona's character record, followed by a similarly semi-recent shot of her inventory. Arkona has since graduated to HLAs and dual-wielding. She prefers the Defender and Belm, although Ages does see use.

 

Screen%20capture%2055_zpswmzaisko.jpg

 

Spoiler

 

Current Proficiencies: Axes x 2, Flails x2, Scimitars x2, Short Bows, Darts, Slings, Two Weapon Fighting x 2

 

Arkona's theme song is Monster by L7.

 

 

I'm semi-certain that this install is stable, and I'm semi-certain that I intend to see this run through. It's time to share. I'll provide some catch-up coverage relatively soon. Yay, halfling barbarians! Yay, Arkona! 

 

Best,

 

A. 


  • ussnorway, The Potty 1 et Hansefar aiment ceci

#13752
Alesia_BH

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@The ATweaks players. Some questions. In SCS v15, mages frequently summon demons, typically glabrezus, cornugons and nabassus. I just Gaius in v15 with the ATweaks installed. He summoned a cornugon and a gelugon. I found them nerfy and disappointing.

 

The cornugon, for example, was incapable of detecting the invisible via script...

 

Spoiler

 

and he was insta-killed by a Crimson Dart Greater Deathblow.

 

Spoiler

 

Is this right? Should cornugons be incapable of detecting the invisible via script? And did ATweaks intend these demons to be leveled such that they can be GDBed?

 

This is a problem for my purposes. The mages in v15 do an excellent job of leveraging the SCS demon abilities to detect the invisible via script and Teleport Without Error. That's one of the things I always liked about v15, and one of the things I was looking forward to in my barbarian play through. So far, the ATweaks fiends have wrecked it, sadly.

 

The ATweaks elementals, undead, mephits, and fey creature have all pleased so far, but I've been disappointed with the mid-tier demons. I'm also unfond of the balor vorpal without a save from a balancing perspective. I feel like I'm getting a whole lot of nerfy and a smattering of over-powered. I appreciate the effort: it's good work. It just doesn't seem to work out well in the context of a v15 install, given my objectives. Will the ATweaks demons do something to justify themselves later on? Is it fiendish gating or go home as I'm beginning to suspect? 

 

Going forward, I'm thinking ATweaks, but with SCS demons: sans fiendish gating solo, with fiendish gating in party play. Make sense? 

 

Best,

 

A.



#13753
Serg BlackStrider

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@The ATweaks players. Some questions. In SCS v15, mages frequently summon demons, typically glabrezus, cornugons and nabassus. I just Gaius in v15 with the ATweaks installed. He summoned a cornugon and a gelugon. I found them nerfy and disappointing.

 

 

Is this right? Should cornugons be incapable of detecting the invisible via script? And did ATweaks intend these demons to be leveled such that they can be GDBed?

 

This is a problem for my purposes. The mages in v15 do an excellent job of leveraging the SCS demon abilities to detect the invisible via script and Teleport Without Error. That's one of the things I always liked about v15, and one of the things I was looking forward to in my barbarian play through. So far, the ATweaks fiends have wrecked it, sadly.

 

The ATweaks elementals, undead, mephits, and fey creature have all pleased so far, but I've been disappointed with the mid-tier demons. I'm also unfond of the balor vorpal without a save from a balancing perspective. I feel like I'm getting a whole lot of nerfy and a smattering of over-powered. I appreciate the effort: it's good work. It just doesn't seem to work out well in the context of a v15 install, given my objectives. Will the ATweaks demons do something to justify themselves later on? Is it fiendish gating or go home as I'm beginning to suspect? 

 

Going forward, I'm thinking ATweaks, but with SCS demons: sans fiendish gating solo, with fiendish gating in party play. Make sense? 

 

Yes, while Gelugons are able to see though the invisibility by script Cornugons are not. And yes, as I told before, most of them, sans the highest ones (Balors and Pit Fiends), have less then 12HD so could be GDB-ed.

 

As this is the first time I play with aTweaks I have //PnP Fiends -> Mod-added fiends are also affected: v4.32// option installed. aTweaks readme have far (far) better/convenient description of fiends' statistics and abilities then SCS one (IMO) so I wanted to try that option first. Truth be told, yes, they are inferior to the SCS Fiends in general (Underdark aTweaks Demon Knights are cubs compared to SCS ones) but I do think fiendish gating option strengthen them a bit. 

 

Personally, I'm too think of using aTweaks mod with SCS Fiends in the future. I only might wish of SCS provide their description like aTweaks do... oh well  :unsure:


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#13754
Alesia_BH

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Yes, while Gelugons are able to see though the invisibility by script Cornugons are not.

 

Noted. Thanks.  :)

 

 And yes, as I told before, most of them, sans the highest ones (Balors and Pit Fiends), have less then 12HD so could be GDB-ed.

 

 

I remember your comment. That's why I took GDB.  :P

 

I was wondering whether this was an oversight or by intent. I guess none of us are in a position to know the answer to that. Presumably the levels were taken straight from PnP?

 

 

As this is the first time I play with aTweaks I have //PnP Fiends -> Mod-added fiends are also affected: v4.32// option installed

 

Noted.

 


 Truth be told, yes, they are inferior to the SCS Fiends in general

 

I agree. The ones I've encountered have been far, far weaker.

 

An obvious exception is the balor vorpal without a save ability, which I dislike. Nerfy with a touch of over-powered. That's what I'm getting. 

 

I respect the work, but I want my SCS demons back. 



I do think fiendish gating option strengthen them a bit. 

 

That's the impression I'm under. With ATweaks, its either fiendish gating or go home.

 

The low/mid level tier demons are too nerfy to be dangerous in small numbers. They need to be able to swarm you.


 

Personally, I'm too think of using aTweaks mod with SCS Fiends in the future. 

 

I think that's the call. I just hope I can keep the pretty colors from ATweaks! That's pretty much the only thing I like about the ATweaks demons so far.

 

The ATweaks mephits, elementals, undead and feys seem solid. I'll probably keep ATweaks for them.

 

Overall: very high quality work. David's demons just fit the game world better- at least in my current install, given my style of play.

 

Best,

 

A.


  • Serg BlackStrider aime ceci

#13755
Alesia_BH

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Btw. Arkona just took down Tolgerias. He summoned a balor and three glabrezus. I experimented with them a bit. They seem ok. I liked some things about them. 

 

Best,

 

A.

 

As an aside, the balors are slow enough to make their vorpal ability largely irrelevant (although I have no idea how to protect Balthazar from them without ATweaks Death Ward or Imprisonment). GBD for the Glabrezus, Oil of Speed->Azuredge WW for the balor basically solved that encounter. The balors could use some stoneksins.


  • Serg BlackStrider et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13756
Alesia_BH

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Btw. I absolutely loved what ATweaks did for the elemental rooms. That's a huge win for ATweaks!

 

I completely didn't expect the fire room mephits to open the door while I was fighting the ice critters, and I loved the creature improvements. 

 

I'm still undecided on the ATweaks demons -I'll need to complete an entire adventure to render a decision on them- but ATweaks has earned a place in my BG life going forward. 

 

I appreciate the efforts of every modder in the BG community, but there are very few mods that I've felt compelled to use- very few that I couldn't play without. Ascension, certainly. SCS, absolutely. Tactics, back in the day. The Questpack, back in the day. I'm still undecided on the ATweaks demons. Nonetheless, ATweaks has, for me, quickly moved into the rarefied "must use" category. It's very well done. I'm still hatin' on the nerfy cornugons, but ATweaks represents a formidable body of work. It merits consideration.

 

Best,

 

A.


  • Serg BlackStrider et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13757
Serg BlackStrider

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Btw. I absolutely loved what ATweaks did for the elemental rooms. That's a huge win for ATweaks!

 

I completely didn't expect the fire room mephitis to open the door while I was fighting the ice critters, and I loved the creature improvements. 

 

I'm still undecided on the ATweaks demons -I'll need to complete an entire adventure to render a decision on them- but ATweaks has earned a place in my BG life going forward. 

 

I appreciate the efforts of every modded in BG community, but there are very few mods that I've felt compelled to use- very few that I couldn't play without. Ascension, certainly. SCS, absolutely. Tactics, back in the day. The Questpack, back in the day. I'm still undecided on the ATweaks demons. Nonetheless, ATweaks has, for me, quickly moved into the rarefied "must use" category. It's very well done. I'm still hatin' on the nerfy cornugons, but ATweaks represents a formidable body of work. It merits consideration.

 

Yeah, me love the mod very much too. A must for me, definitely.

BTW, note, that even with //PnP Fiends -> Mod-added fiends are also affected: v4.32// not all of them are affected. So you might face Glabrezus invulnerable to GDB someday unexpectedly (the ones accompanied Jon in Hell, for example). I'm not 100% sure, but looks like those summoned ones are aTweaked but those who are already there (WK Demon Maze?) not necessary. 

 

For example, I have 24 (twenty four!) Glabrezu cre files in my install. Some of them are 10HD, some 12HD and 8 are 17HD.


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#13758
Alesia_BH

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 //PnP Fiends -> Mod-added fiends are also affected: v4.32// not all of them are affected. So you might face Glabrezus invulnerable to GDB someday unexpectedly (the ones accompanied Jon in Hell, for example). I'm not 100% sure, but looks like those summoned ones are aTweaked but those who are already there (WK Demon Maze?) not necessary. 

 

Noted. Thanks, Serg!

 

Best,

 

A.



#13759
Alesia_BH

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Quick Note on Arkona's Game: A Note on Restrictions (Remember my words: Hold me too them)

 

Since I'm not posting on Arkona's run, I've done some things differently- mostly because I'm less fearful of an early death. I'd like to submit a preliminary list of things that I should never let myself do again- things that I should add to my list of no-nos. I'll start with three general ones and then move on to some quest specific ones. I'll then end with one more general one. Note that this list is for me, not others. Everyone should feel free to play as they like. I think I'll enjoy the game world more if I stick to these restrictions. I'm weak willed, though: I give in to temptation. A public declaration may help.

 

Three general restrictions:

  • No more sneak-attacking mages before they get their buffs up: No more insta-kills, no more opening Darts of Stunning
  • No more separating enemies via invisibility detection of area transitions (NW: I already restrict this, but I should be firmer
  • No more Protection from Undead

And the quest specific restrictions- up through SoA Chapters 2/3 (I tend to cut more corners early in the adventure)

  • Slaver Quest: No more juking the Copper Coronet prison guards to avoid the mages
  • Umar Hills: No more Pro Undead against the Shade Lord (covered by the general restrictions, but worthy of particular note)
  • Mae'Var's Guid Hall: No more sneak-attacking Rayic or Mae'Var (again, covered by the general restrictions). No more killing Edwin for the key
  • Trademeet: No more stealthing through the Druid Grove. No more killing the djinnis and opening the shops before killing Faldorn
  • De'Arnis Keep:  No more separating the Big T via invisibility detection (covered by the general restriction). No more dooring the Iron Golem
  • Planar Prison: No more separating the Warden via invisibility detection (covered by the general restriction)
  • Planar Sphere: No more using the Guardian Golem! Fight the Elder Orb! (joke...) 

Also, I have for years I've talked about using an XP progression nerf in solo play. Once Arkona finishes SoA, I intend to run her through again with a 50% experience progression nerf. I think it's time that I finally tried it. 

 

Anyhoo. Sorry for the tangent. I may start posting on Arkona this afternoon.

 

Best,

 

A.


  • Serg BlackStrider et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13760
Serg BlackStrider

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Quick Note on Arkona's Game: A Note on Restrictions (Remember my words: Hold me too them)

 

Since I'm not posting on Arkona's run, I've done some differently- mostly because I'm less fearful of an early death. I'd like to submit a preliminary list of things that I should never let myself do again- things that I should add to my list of no-nos. I'll start with three general ones and them move on to some quest specific one. I'll then end win one more general one. Note that this list is for me, not others. Everyone should feel free to play as they like. I think I'll enjoy the game world more if I stick to these restrictions. I'm weak willed, though: I give in to temptation. A public declaration may help.

 

Three general restrictions:

  • No more sneak-attacking mages before they get their buffs up: No more insta-kills, no more opening Darts of Stunning
  • No more separating enemies via invisibility detection of area transitions (NW: I already restrict this, but I should be firmer
  • No more Protection from Undead

And the quest specific restrictions- up through SoA Chapters 2/3 (I tend to cut more corners early in the adventure)

  • Slaver Quest: No more juking the Copper Coronet prison guards to avoid the mages
  • Umar Hills: No more Pro Undead against the Shade Lord (covered by the general restrictions, but worthy of particular note)
  • Mae'Var's Guid Hall: No more sneak-attacking Rayic or Mae'Var (again, covered by the general restrictions). No more killing Edwin for the key
  • Trademeet: No more stealthing through the Druid Grove. No more killing the djinnis and opening the shops before killing Faldorn
  • De'Arnis Keep:  No more separating the Torgal via invisibility detection (covered by the general restriction). No more dooring the Iron Golem
  • Planar Prison: No more separating the Warden via invisibility detection (covered by the general restriction)
  • Planar Sphere: No more using the Guardian Golem! Fight the Elder Orb! (joke...) 

Like this! More or less this is how I play myself (there are some I still use - dooring the Iron Golem in De'Arnis Keep early on - but I'm inclined to forbid this as well. And I envision SCS v.21 Vampires to be great pain without Pro Undead, but still...). Far more satisfaction this way  :)

 

And I'm looking forward for Arkona's *true* run!


  • Alesia_BH et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13761
Alesia_BH

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And I'm looking forward for Arkona's *true* run!

 

As am I. The questions now are:

 

1) whether we'll use Classic SCS v15 or EE SCS v30, and

2) whether we'll use the ATweaks demons of SCS demons

 

I need to run through WK and Ascension with the ATweaks demons, and then stability test the EE SCS v30 install before I finalize my decision. It'll take some time. That said, Arkona should finish up SoA this evening and I expect her to finish ToB within a few days.

 

For the record, Arkona is still reload free and I estimate that there is a significant chance that she will successfully No Reload the Trilogy in her test run. I'll let everyone know how that turns out. Even if she succeeds, however, I'm going to request that Arkona not be placed in the Hall on the basis on this run. The Hall is for documented, proper entrants. Further, I've done some side testing during this run and I intend to do more. Testing compromises the integrity of the run, in my opinion. Arkona will enter the Hall when she deserves to enter the Hall: no sooner.

 

Best,

 

A. 


  • Serg BlackStrider, Grond0 et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13762
Alesia_BH

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A further note on beholder slaying.

 

Here's a variant of the Massive Attack strategy, which is suitable for high level warriors.

 

Approach invisible. Activate Greater Deathblow (do not attack yet). Recall that GDB lasts two rounds.

 

Spoiler

 

When your aura clears, activate Greater Whirlwind

 

Spoiler

 

Time to break invisibility. Attack with a range weapon so you don't waste time moving. I chose Seeking (Btw. The Sling of Seeking is my favorite BG2 weapon)

 

Spoiler

 

Change targets as each carcass falls

 

Spoiler

 

You can eliminate an entire crew in a round

 

Spoiler

 

Yay!

 

Best,

 

A.


  • Serg BlackStrider et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13763
Serg BlackStrider

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A further note on beholder slaying.

 

Here's a variant of the Massive Attack strategy, which is suitable for high level warrior.

 

Approach invisible. Activate Greater Deathblow (do not attack yet). Recall that GDB lasts two rounds.

 

Spoiler

 

When your aura clears, activate Greater Whirlwind

 

Spoiler

 

Time to break invisibility. Attack with a range weapon so you don't waste time moving. I chose Seeking (Btw. The Sling of Seeking is my favorite BG2 weapon)

 

Spoiler

 

Change targets as each carcass falls

 

Spoiler

 

You can eliminate an entire crew in a round

 

Spoiler

 

Yay!

 

Best,

 

A.

Yet another confirmation that Greater Deathblow rocks!  :) You don't even need Greater Whirlwind in most cases (Improved Haste via mage's buff, Ring of Gaxx/Braces of Blinding Strike should be enough). Mazzy with Tuigan Bow under IH will have 9APR and so up to 18 creatures (Beholders) nixed with single GDB. Furthermore, to get one GDB and one GWW you should pick 4 HLAs while spending those 4 HLAs only for DB/GDB you'll get 3 GDB. Which route is *better* each player decides by himself but my choice is pretty obvious, I think.  


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#13764
Alesia_BH

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Improved Haste via mage's buff, Ring of Gaxx/Braces of Blinding Strike should be enough

 

Agreed- assuming you've acquired those items.

 

Crimson Dart, for example, and IH will work fine.

 

Best,

 

A.



#13765
Alesia_BH

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Quick Note on Arkona's Game:

 

What's up with this? Why am I seeing double?

 

Spoiler

 

Best,

 

A.

 

FYI: Arkona survived. Hooray for Arvoreen and Adratha's potion stock.


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#13766
Alesia_BH

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Yet another confirmation that Greater Deathblow rocks!  :)

 

It's nice. 

 

The problem I've always had with GDB is that it becomes irrelevant in the endgame: there's little use for GDB at the Throne.

 

Arkona could have killed the beholders without GDB. And by the final fight, she'd prefer to have something else.

 

If there is one thing I like about the vulnerability of ATweaks fiends to GDB it's the fact that it makes GDB more relevant in the endgame- assuming the fiends in the Demon Battles are vulnerable, that is.

 

Best,

 

A.


  • Serg BlackStrider et Grond0 aiment ceci

#13767
Serg BlackStrider

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Quick Note on Arkona's Game:

 

What's up with this? Why am I seeing double?

 

Spoiler

 

I don't know a proper answer, I could only speculate. May be (just may be) one of those Fallen Planetar is from pre-buffs (chain contingency) while another one was gated in later *normal* way. I have experience with liches when they had one Spell Shield via pre-buffs and then immediately another one via trigger or similar so I should remove both of them with spell removals. I think, it's not normal to have two Spell Shields active at the same time but those liches had them. May be something similar has happened in your case?

 

edit: no, Planetars can't be *chained*...  :huh: so may be something wrong with the scripts?


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#13768
Grond0

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It's nice. 

 

The problem I've always had with GDB is that it becomes irrelevant in the endgame: there's little use for GDB at the Throne.

 

Arkona could have killed the beholders without GDB. And by the final fight, she'd prefer to have something else.

 

If there is one thing I like about the vulnerability of ATweaks fiends to GDB it's the fact that it makes GDB more relevant in the endgame- assuming the fiends in the Demon Battles are vulnerable, that is.

I do like GDB, but mainly for the convenience factor.  As Alesia suggests, in the fights where you really need HLAs it tends to be of limited use.  I suspect that it may fit more comfortably within a party, but for a solo character I wouldn't want more than one GDB ...



#13769
Guest_GrimJim_*

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Despite my whining about classes earlier, I've decided to continue Jim's run. His story isn't finished yet and it wouldn't feel right moving on to another character until it is.

 

Part 19: Jim vs. Illasera and Pocket Plane Challenge 1

 

Jim begins the Illasera fight with a rather prescient trigger.

Spoiler

He also takes Divination immunity via Contingency.

 

Illasera vanishes as well though. I thought that Jim's Wilting Chain was set to trigger on hit, but apparently I set it to on sight. One down, at least.

Spoiler

 

Jim then casts Improved Alacrity and ProMW and summons a planetar to bait Illasera out. Once she's visible Jim lowers her MR and unloads with his single target spells. The planetar ends up stealing the kill.

Spoiler

 

On to the Pocket Plane Challenge. Jim enters fully buffed and immediately summons an image who in turn immediately summons a planetar.

Spoiler

 

Together they work their way though the first two waves. The planetar does most of the work but the Jimage contributes with some Wiltings.

Spoiler

 

The drow wave is a pain due to their magic resistance and the fact that the planetar can't easily dispatch them.

Spoiler

 

The plan here was for the Jimage to assist with Dragon's Breath before destroying itself with Flame Arrows. This works, but there are more waves than I remember and the second Jimage is forced to use some of his Dragon's Breaths to clear the waves quickly.

Spoiler

(This is still the first Jimage.)

 

My timing is better than my memory, though, and by the time Irenicus arrives the Jimage is under Improved Alacrity and is reasonably buffed.

Spoiler

 

Another day, another Irenicus without fire or Abjuration immunity. He gets dispelled and Ruby Rayed anyway, but this turns out to be unnecessary as two Dragon's Breaths do the job.

Spoiler

The image probably should have been standing closer to reduce projectile travel time.

 

Bodhi and Sarevok get caught in the AoE too, and the planetar and a Wilting finish them.


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#13770
Alesia_BH

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I do like GDB, but mainly for the convenience factor. 

 

I can see that. It does save time.

 


As Alesia suggests, in the fights where you really need HLAs it tends to be of limited use.

 

Yes. It's spell for hastening the inevitable.

 

I only took it this time because of ATweaks. Clearing a room full of demons in a single round is an irresistible bargain.

 

And again, that may be the unintended upside of the under-leveled ATweaks demons: they make GDB relevant.  

 


 I suspect that it may fit more comfortably within a party, but for a solo character I wouldn't want more than one GDB ...

 

 

Makes sense. In party play it's easier to make room for it.

 

Best,

 

A.



#13771
Alesia_BH

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Glad to see you back in action, Grim Jim!

 

Best,

 

A.



#13772
biowherewolf

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I remember you, BWhere! It's good to see you again!

 

Are you ready for another run?

 

Best,

A.

I am getting the itch :)

I picked up BG2 Enhanced Edition from Steam.... maybe I'll start with that?


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#13773
Alesia_BH

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Quick Note on Arkona's Game:

 

Arkona is packing her bags for Spellhold. Her character record and inventory appear below. The inventory features items representing her completed quests.

 

Screen%20capture%2025_zpsghbu4nsa.jpg

 

Spoiler

 

So far, I really like this install. I miss the at times exquisite attention to detail found in SCS v30, but this setup offers stability, challenge, and an engaging game world. It works. I'm happy with it. I'm still looking forward to trying EE v30. Weidu log below, for the curious.

 

Spoiler

 

Best,

 

A.


  • Serg BlackStrider et Blackraven aiment ceci

#13774
Serg BlackStrider

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I'm curious, Alesia, how is that Arkona got both Helm of Balduran and Claw of Kazgaroth?



#13775
Alesia_BH

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I'm curious, Alesia, how is that Arkona got both Helm of Balduran and Claw of Kazgaroth?

 

The Helm of Balduran is her personal item, basically.

 

I prefer the Claw, even with shorty warriors (Claw/Gaxx/CoP +2/Lavender Ioun Stone is my preferred arrangement for most characters). But if you look at Arkona's portrait, you'll note that she has horns and a spiky mohawk. Since the Helm of Balduran fit her so well, I decided to allow her to import both items.

 

These days, she doesn't even use Balduran typically: she uses the Helm of Defense. I only put Balduran on her for her snapshot, because it looks so much nicer: it has horns, as Arkona should, and the color matches that of Ages.

 

In Arkona's upcoming play-through, I may leave Balduran behind and instead mod the appearance of the Helm of Defense.

 

Best,

 

A.


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