122 réponses à ce sujet

[Nerevar-as]

Just want to play Warden and not Hawke if they finish Morrigan´s tale. And don´t pull a Viconia.

[TuringPoint]

It's possible for them not to make something canon about Morrigan in this manner. "Flemeth" may not be the same old lady, also. If you recall what "flemeth" truly was...

[Jaysonttt]

I think Flemeth hides her grimoir because the grimoir itself is full of her immortality secrets, and only accessible with her daughter. In case she dies, the one who owns the grimoir has the instant knowledge about how to be immortal. Maybe that is the reason why Morrigan wants to be pregnant with the soul of an old god because her daughter would be powerful in case Morrigan transfers in her daughter's body soon, which half of the daughter's soul is a soul of an old god. Then she would use the name Flemeth because the name itself is a legend. Then in her daughter's body, she can become the heir to the throne. (Well, just a thought...)

[Arttis]

I see a flemeth vs Morrigan choice.

[The Edge]

I hope that Flemeth didn't possess Morrigan or something, but Flemeths reappearance certainly makes Morrigan a little bit vulnerable. Maybe Hawke will be a tool to Flemeth to accomplish her intent of taking Morrigan's body, and Morrigan's trying to use the god-child for something different.



That would be interesting... if you worked with Flemeth in DA2, and then you were forced to help her or Morrigan in the end... which would you chose?

[Riona45]

The Edge wrote...


That would be interesting... if you worked with Flemeth in DA2, and then you were forced to help her or Morrigan in the end... which would you chose?

I'd say I would need more context to answer that question.  My Warden might be more inclined to help Morrigan out of friendship (though she wouldn't do *anything* for her), but Hawke wouldn't necessarily have any such history with Morrigan.

[wikkedjoker]

It makes sense that Morrigan would return, after all she is the main character, and really when you think about it does that surprise anyone?
 
Look at the facts

*The Battle at Ostagar is botched, and Flemeth saves you.
*Femith than tells you to take Morrigan with you, as the price for her saving your life.  
*Over all Morrigan has a great deal more character development. Going form scared child in a woman’s body, mentally. To coming into her own, and learning to trust the rag tag band of heroes assembled.
Even to the point of falling in love with the Warden.
And if you remember what her mother teaching of what love is, than you know that was a big step for her to pull away form that, and open up to the warden and fall into a fulfilling love.

But than she does fall in love with the Warden, she had only originally been sent there to have his child, and have that child be the host for the Old Gods soul.

Her and the Warden  conceive a child, and she does her job thinking she is saving the man she loves life. But really she’s just a pawn for Flemeth.

However it seems that Morrigan, knows more about the “God Child” than she lets on. Probably based off something Flemeth told her, something along the lines that it’s dangerous, or could be. So for the safety of the people she cares about she leaves Ferelden.

But this is probably what Flemeth wants.

Do you honestly believe that someone as old and wise and as powerful as Flemeth would be killed as easy as she was? Think about what it took to kill the Archdemon, I would imagine it wouldn‘t be that hard, but not as easy as it was.

Anyways  this is when we get to DA2.

The start Dragon Age 2 takes place, just before the final battle, so in the first year of DA2 we know our Warden is in  Denerim and Amaranthine

However Hawke was making his was to Kurkwall, or more likely the Free Marches. On his way there its likely that Flemeth, not the old hag we know, but the young beautiful woman we have seen in the concept art, saves his life form Hurlocks. The two team up, after all Hawke also has a Mage sister he needs to protect. My guess is they want to go as far North as they can, to someplace controlled by the Tevinter Imperium. Flemeth of course is not in anyway a good person, and is plotting. Her plot all along was to eventually create a “God Child”. to what end we don’t know. but I can guess.

On a side note it would be interesting to see just how far this plot goes.  We know that three is something off with the Architect for some unknown reason he was born different. We also know that he was able to find Urthemiel, faster than what he should have. I wonder just how much influence Flemeth had in this? Maybe she created the Arhitect and, sent him on his way to find the Old God faster, to start the Blight in the life time of Morrigan, so Morrigan could conceive the “God Child.”

So in DA2 Morrigan is on the run, and has probably already had the “God Child.” Well what better way to find someone than to have entire nations looking for her, and if they believe this child could start the next Blight or something like that, because it has the soul of an Old God, and there is reason enough to believe that it would be powerful.

However there is no reason to believe that Morrigan is utterly stupid, and it wouldn’t be unrealistic to believe that she has ether been given power by the Old God to protect its undeveloped child body, or that the child her self is in full control of her God power, enough power to fake the return of  Andraste, and raise a cult like army.  One that would take the resources of 10 years to find and combat.

I don’t think that this is Hawke’s story. I think we will see the story of a man being used by Flemeth to achieve her ultimate goal, a goal that if I had to guess would be the power of the God child, ether though its body or Morrigan/Morrigan’s body.

I think we will see a sneaky villain in the guise of our “friend” Flemeth. As she manipulates us in to creating a new world, maybe by using our sister who is a mage as bate so to say. Or manipulating us through romance so that we would do what ever  it takes to create a world in which out mage sister and lover could be safe. Ultimately however it’s only a ploy to use us to find and get Morrigan     

Modifié par wikkedjoker, 19 juillet 2010 - 09:29 .

[wikkedjoker]

The Edge wrote...

I hope that Flemeth didn't possess Morrigan or something, but Flemeths reappearance certainly makes Morrigan a little bit vulnerable. Maybe Hawke will be a tool to Flemeth to accomplish her intent of taking Morrigan's body, and Morrigan's trying to use the god-child for something different.

That would be interesting... if you worked with Flemeth in DA2, and then you were forced to help her or Morrigan in the end... which would you chose?

Morrigan, simply because, you know she’s not evil. Scarred and alone maybe, but not evil.

Flemeth is evil, we know it, we know it from the legends, we know if from what Morrigan said, and if you look at the plot of DAO, Flemeth manipulated a lot of the events, but to what end? I don’t think it’s for the betterment of man kind.   

[Wynne]

Flemeth isn't even necessarily evil despite what she's done. If she is a chessmaster, she may be doing evil for a good cause. Much like Dexter or Jim Profit. But she would have no illusions about being the heroine. She knows what she is.

I like to think that maybe she even loved Morrigan, in her own twisted way. Maybe Morrigan was her real daughter, unlike the others, and she had other plans than taking over her body. But she wouldn't show it. She couldn't deal with the bond that would form if Morrigan knew she was loved, and she thought it would make the girl "weak", which she could not be if they were going to do what they had to do. To stop the Blight, amongst other things.

No, I'm not convinced that Flemeth is all-out evil. I think there's more to her character than a mere cartoonish specter. I think her agenda is more complex than immortality alone. Who says she didn't write that grimoire specifically to manipulate Morrigan? Everything is survival, making her pawns stronger... maybe fighting her was to ready you for the battle to come.

Who knows what Flemeth is really up to? Not me. But I'd wager anything that it's not as cut and dried as it looks.

[Arrtis]

Now i believe Morrigan will be a possible companion and if you import with your warden and her in love she may talk about it....

[ganstamaori]

Not everyone romanced Morrigan and/or tapped dat.

[Arrtis]

ganstamaori wrote...

Not everyone romanced Morrigan and/or tapped dat.

Your point?

[wikkedjoker]

Wynne wrote...

Flemeth isn't even necessarily evil despite what she's done. If she is a chessmaster, she may be doing evil for a good cause. Much like Dexter or Jim Profit. But she would have no illusions about being the heroine. She knows what she is.

I like to think that maybe she even loved Morrigan, in her own twisted way. Maybe Morrigan was her real daughter, unlike the others, and she had other plans than taking over her body. But she wouldn't show it. She couldn't deal with the bond that would form if Morrigan knew she was loved, and she thought it would make the girl "weak", which she could not be if they were going to do what they had to do. To stop the Blight, amongst other things.

No, I'm not convinced that Flemeth is all-out evil. I think there's more to her character than a mere cartoonish specter. I think her agenda is more complex than immortality alone. Who says she didn't write that grimoire specifically to manipulate Morrigan? Everything is survival, making her pawns stronger... maybe fighting her was to ready you for the battle to come.

Who knows what Flemeth is really up to? Not me. But I'd wager anything that it's not as cut and dried as it looks.

I dont know about good or evil but she had been plotting the God child
thing for a long time.

From the DA wiki.
"While on the run from Orlesian
sympathizers, Maric and Loghain are captured by the Dalish, who deliver them to Flemeth. She tells
Maric that Loghain will betray him if he keeps him close, "Each time
worse than the last." She also tells him that a Blight will come to
Ferelden after his death. In exchange for leading them out of the
Wilds, she requests that Maric make a promise to her that he may not
share with anyone.
"


And this is something interesting as well.

"The true reason for Fiona's journey to Denerim had been to reveal she
had Maric's son. She made Maric promise the child would be told that his
mother was human and deceased. Duncan promises to monitor the child's
progress. Fiona's current whereabouts are unknown."

Oh and dramatic plot twist Fiona's an elf.

I wonder if this has anything to do with the promise made to Flemeth. .  . You
should be able to guess who the child is. . . Alister anyone?

Alister is half mage elf. Didn't see that coming.

Modifié par wikkedjoker, 19 juillet 2010 - 11:04 .

[wikkedjoker]

ganstamaori wrote...

Not everyone romanced Morrigan and/or tapped dat.

The God child however is Canon.

[Arrtis]

send that to SirShrek he would love to hear that.

[Riona45]

wikkedjoker wrote...
I wonder if this has anything to do with the promise made to Flemeth. .  . You
should be able to guess who the child is. . . Alister anyone?

Alister is half mage elf. Didn't see that coming.

There's no such thing as a "half-mage," and Alistair was never confirmed as Fiona's child.  The "god-child" wasn't confirmed as canon either, sorry.  I guess you aren't as clever as you thought.

[errant_knight]

TemplarofSteel wrote...

To those who have read the article, there was a certain statement made by Mike Laidlaw concerning Morrigan. The question presented to him was if there would be any Origins characters coming back for the DA2. His response was "We are certainly not done with Morrigan's story I can say that." 

Could this mean we could see not only Flemeth, but also Morrigan in DA2. If so what type of role could see be playing a major or a minor role? 

My opinion is that she's going to be playing a minor role for the time being for this game.

I think they probably have the story planned out through more than just 2 games. That could easily mean that Morrigan could return in a future game, or an expansion.

[Malanek]

I don't think it was ever Flemeths intention to steal Morrigans body. A grandaughter would do just as well as daughter and she has manipulated events (assuming the ritual was performed) just as she intended. A godchild is even more enticing for her. She hasn't been destroyed and is waiting to make her return. If the ritual wasn't performed guessing Morrigans and Flemeths intentions is a bit harder.

[wikkedjoker]

Riona45 wrote...

wikkedjoker wrote...
I wonder if this has anything to do with the promise made to Flemeth. .  . You
should be able to guess who the child is. . . Alister anyone?

Alister is half mage elf. Didn't see that coming.

There's no such thing as a "half-mage," and Alistair was never confirmed as Fiona's child.  The "god-child" wasn't confirmed as canon either, sorry.  I guess you aren't as clever as you thought.

Stalking me, eh you know we really need to quit meeting like this, every time we do, I make you look like a raving lunatic, its probably not the image you want people to see, eh?


But enough pleasantries lets get to me proving you wrong with Dragon Ages own mythology.

DA Wiki
"The true reason for Fiona's journey to Denerim had been to reveal she
had Maric's son. She made Maric promise the child would be told that his
mother was human and deceased. Duncan promises to monitor the child's
progress. Fiona's current whereabouts are unknown."

DA Wiki
"Alistair believes his mother to have been a serving maid who died giving birth to him. He was raised by Arl Eamon Guerrin of Redcliffe. The arl's wife, Arlessa Isolde suspected the reason her husband took an interest in the welfare of a servant's child was that Alistair was Eamon's son. She insisted the boy be sent away to the Chantry. Isolde's suspicions were unfounded, however. Alistair was not Eamon's son, but King Maric's. Maric sheltered the boy to hide his existence from Queen Rowan, Maric's wife, on the advice of his friend Teyrn Loghain Mac Tir. Since Alistair's father was the last King of Ferelden, he is a possible heir to the throne after the demise of his half-brother King Cailan. "

Some odd wording in the passage about Alistair don't you think? "Believes" in this context would imply that its not the truth, but something he has been lead to believe, don t you think?

Now some other alarming parallels.

"She made Maric promise the child would be told that his mother was human and deceased."

"Alistair believes his mother to have been a serving maid who died giving birth to him."

Now just on a logical stand point, many mistresses could this guy have who die, or are said to be dead after a child comes along? And why is Alistair the only one brought up?

Alistair is the child between Fiona and Maric. 
The reason he has NO elf like characteristics is because a child between a human and an elf is ALWAYS human. Probably because , Humans and elves share a majority of the same genetic make up, only the Elf’s genetics are slightly mutated.

However because the Elf carries the same genetic characteristics as a human, hence why they can have children together. The child would look human, because the human DNA would be more dominant than the elf DNA. 


Do you want more proof?

"Duncan promises to monitor the child's progress."

Duncan is the one who recruited Alistair to be a Warden.

And if you know anything about genetics this was a good bet, simply because Alistair’s mother was a Gray Warden, the chance of him being a Gray Warden and surviving would be greater, since ONE. he had the genetics to become one, and two he's predisposed to the taint.

There's no such thing as a "half-mage,"

Genetically speaking?

If someone is a mage and someone is not a mage, and they have a child, and the gene for becoming a mage and being normal holds the same value than the child has a 50% chance of becoming a mage, and there child has the chance as well. And the Gene could be recessive dominate, skipping generations.  

So even if he is not a mage he has the ability to pass the genetic markers to his child.

Genetically he has half of the genetic markers to become a mage. SO in all due logic, and fact he is half mage.

 

 
The God Child is not canon?

Really. . . ?

You do know what IS considered as Dragon Age Canon right?

Human Noble Male, Warrior, shield and sword.

See canon is made when a company comes out and says this character exists.

And they did.





But ignoring that, we can look at multiple facts. The Morragan child
ending has the MOST possible ways to happen its almost insane, its is
100% obvious that they want you to pick that choice. Its like taking a
multiple choice test and 3 out of the for answers are the same right
answer and the 4th is wrong.

Awakening was meant to be played as your Warden.

The only reason there is a preset Warden is because he’s the everything went HORRIBLY wrong Warden.  

Think an alternate continuity.

Now we know that if you do not do the Dark Ritual she will leave, BUT if you played the Dark Spawn chronicles she IS there. Showing that even in another alternate continuity the choice was important.

There is too much importance on this single choice, for it to NOT be continuity, if you really look at Dragon Age it has a glaring sign saying " THE GOD CHILD WILL BE IMPORTANT IN OTHER GAMES"

And then there is Flemeth, and her involvement in Dragon Age 2. Honestly if the God Child wasn't a big part of the story, do you think the dev's would have brought her back, almost like she's the face of the game.
 

Modifié par wikkedjoker, 20 juillet 2010 - 09:17 .

[Skiffee]

 The only way i'd want to see Morrigan come back in any of the future DLC is the "ritual baby" and how that is all working out... and I really want to see that in a DLC lol
I'm dying to know how that baby turned out! 

[GodWood]

wikkedjoker wrote...
You do know what IS considered as Dragon Age Canon right?
Human Noble Male, Warrior, shield and sword.
See canon is made when a company comes out and says this character exists.
And they did.

Wrong

[NRO TYN]

I wonder if Hawke is to mentor the God Child when he/she is old enough??