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[Vaclavc]

Another short update on dual classed cleric7/mage Eldrymon:

Eldrymon cleared area north of Lighthouse from Ogres and Sirines and advanced to level 7. At that point, I dual classed him to mage (and changed his avatar accordingly ). Through intensive questing and monster hunting, he advanced to level 6.


I expect him getting level 7 from Basilisk hunt. The last remaining level will be (hopefully) gained from hunting Sirines near Lighthouse and clearing Nashkel mines and bandit camp.

V

Modifié par Vaclavc, 22 décembre 2011 - 07:06 .

[Grond0]

After5CST wrote...

Shadow_Leech07 wrote...

I was kind of wondering, does anyone think that a party of level one characters could make it through the game?

Earlier in this thread (and on others), it's apparently been proven that you can win BG1 with a single character.  At level 1.  And without accumulating any XP prior to Sarevok, IIRC.

That accomplishment (I am quite sure) requires a great understanding of the game mechanics.  Even so, I'm guessing a party of L1 characters should be very doable.

I'm not sure that a party would necessarily be easier than a solo character.  For nearly all the game a solo character can charm surrounding creatures to give them the same meat shield protection as using a party, but with less difficulty about controlling movement - no worries about getting all the party in position before being able to exit a map for instance.  The only fight I can think of that might be a bit easier in vanilla with a party would be the final battle with Sarevok.

[AnonymousHero]

Grond0 wrote...
I'm not sure that a party would necessarily be easier than a solo character.  For nearly all the game a solo character can charm (snip excellent points about placement)

There's also the question of resources (potions, scrolls, wands, etc.)

[After5CST]

Update: Ja'kal M E Sorc

After defeating the Amazons, a hasty decision was made to go ahead and clear the current map, while trying to avoid the jelly mage until better prepared ( at this point, the party has ZERO magical melee weapons and a sparse handful of magical ammo ). Clearing the outskirts seemed to be a trivial matter, and an attempt was made on the three ghasts ( want the Wand of Monster Summoning ). This was far more challenging than first thought, as without summons, and trying hard not to invaded Neen's space, the party still ended up drawing some random monsters into the fray ( kobold archer and gnolls, IIRC ).

Trying to keep Ja'kal from being filled with arrows, and trying to still stay away from the ghasts, Ajantis ended up taking a chance of engaging one that was persistent about trying to reach Ja'kal. It was hoped that his armor class would allow him to last a round or two, drawing the attention of the ghast, and then move away so that Imoen and Ja'kal could stop running from ghasts and start filling them with arrows and throwing daggers. (Due to an oversight, Dynaheir was out of darts, and was useless once spells were spent).

Of course, Tymora was still peeved with Tiela's lack of faith in the previous run-through, so that “round or two” turned into an immediate critical hit from the ghast on Ajantis, a failed save, and shortly after Ajantis “joined the bleedin' choir invisible” as they say.

With some more maneuvering, and by exhausting a Wand of Magic Missile, the three intrepid adventurers won the day against the ghasts (and kobold), collected Ajantis' items, and headed with all speed towards the Nashkel temple.

Tymora refused to give them a smile, though, and they were ambushed by wolves (and something else, I think gnolls). Dynaheir fell almost immediately, and Imoen made a valiant attempt to draw off the attackers from Ja'kal, also resulting in her death. However, Ja'kal remembered the newly acquired Wand of Monster Summoning, and burned one of the precious charges on the wand to draw out some Hobgoblin Elites, who made short work of the ambush.

Gathering Dynaheir's and Imoen's items, he then made his way to the temple.  After some generous donation, the party was made whole again.

Jakal Raises the Dead on Flickr

(Ja'kal has gone much further than this, but this post is too long as it is... will update more later).

Modifié par After5CST, 22 décembre 2011 - 08:33 .

[Gate70]

Parr, LG human male cavalier travelling through core BGT Ascension.


The Candlekeep quests prepare me to help Marl, Firebead Elvenhair, Captain Brage, Bjornin, Mirianne, Prism, Samuel, the dryad of the Cloudpeaks and Drienne.

Time to collect a pair of belts.


I have used potions of freedom against Bassilus and Mulahey, and been confused twice (by a sirine then by Bassilus). Mulahey casts a spell that ignores my potion of freedom?


Dead again, don't potions of freedom protect against hold person? Will have to brush up on what would work against Mulahey.

[corey_russell]

Gate70: potions of freedom don't protect from hold person in vanilla BG 1 - I think it does with fixpack.

[Grond0]

Gate70 wrote...
Dead again, don't potions of freedom protect against hold person? Will have to brush up on what would work against Mulahey.

You should have been OK in BGT - sounds like a bug to me.  It seems a shame to let such a fine-looking cavalier perish in an untimely death.

[Alesia_BH]

After5CST wrote...
 Even so, I'm guessing a party of L1 characters should be very doable.

I'll also add that it is possible to solo most of the major vanilla SoA battles with a Level 1 character. My Jester, Alisa, has done so CLUAed into various battlegrounds.

Completing the adventure from begining to end would be another matter entirely however.

Best,

A.

[Alesia_BH]

Gate70 wrote...
Dead again, don't potions of freedom protect against hold person? Will have to brush up on what would work against Mulahey.

Potions of Freedom should stop Hold Person. There was likely a bug of some kind at play.

I'm curious though. When did you drink the Potion exactly? It is possible to quaff and have the spell effect hit before the potion kicks in. That could lead to a held character with a Free Action icon.

Best,

A. 

[Grimwald the Wise]

Gate70 wrote...
Dead again, don't potions of freedom protect against hold person? Will have to brush up on what would work against Mulahey.

I had problems that way, even using the Greenstone amulet. However, with the sub-race mod I used an Air Genasi who can use a freedom of action spell which does seem to work.

Rajkumari Cavalier update.

She has now cleared everything except the Final Battle against Sarevok.

Then completed the Stone of Askavar quest.

Now in the process of doing the Grey Clan Quest. One scroll of protection against the undead made the first set of summoned skeletons a walkover. However the scroll didn't work against the second set.
Obviously a bug. Rajkumari therefore went to High Hedge to recharge her necklaces of missiles. Hopefully that will enable her to wipe out Gartuffe. We'll see. At least at this stage I have the option of running away.

Modifié par Grimwald the Wise, 23 décembre 2011 - 05:57 .

[Grond0]

Alesia_BH wrote...

After5CST wrote...
 Even so, I'm guessing a party of L1 characters should be very doable.

I'll also add that it is possible to solo most of the major vanilla SoA battles with a Level 1 character. My Jester, Alisa, has done so CLUAed into various battlegrounds.

Completing the adventure from begining to end would be another matter entirely however.

In testing for this topic I didn't restrict a character to level 1, but I don't think the play would change much.  The chance of death seems pretty low using that sequence; I had four deaths during testing, but 3 of those were due to trying to regain familiarity with vanilla BG1:
- first death occurred when trying to go into inventory during an encounter.
- second death against Daveorn as a result of different behaviour from scroll of magic resistance.
- third death was in an ambush.
- fourth death when I forgot Sarevok's different scripting (compared to SCS).

I had always intended to run a character through from start to finish, so will give that a go with this one. 

I will restrict her to level 1 and never use a spell.  I had intended to take the first set of stats rolled, but they included 18 strength and 17 constitution and I didn't want her to have any stat benefits.  It was actually not until the 5th roll that I got a suitably poor character!

[Shadow_Leech07]

I think I will play a level 1 game as well, putting aside my solo thief. But my game will have characters built specifically for the occasion as I see fit. I'm actually still learning about this game.

[Grond0]

Shadow_Leech07 wrote...

I think I will play a level 1 game as well, putting aside my solo thief. But my game will have characters built specifically for the occasion as I see fit. I'm actually still learning about this game.

Best of luck.

First stupid mistake of the day with Gen-mage!  One significant difference for level 1 characters that I didn't put in my write-up is that they don't die from a single hit if they currently have max HPs - this makes it far easier to survive ambushes or traps.  I intended to use this behaviour in the mines so that I didn't need to worry about getting hit by a kobold archer.  Unfortunately, after successfully charming a kobold I didn't change his targeting and got killed by a follow-up shot.

Take 2.

Modifié par Grond0, 23 décembre 2011 - 08:02 .

[BBMorti]

GL Grond0!

I remember reading about a guy who completed BG1 with what he called a minimalist character (minimum in all stats) It was a mage from what I remember, this was on top of staying level 1 the whole game.. so everything is possible =)

[SpiffyKeen]

Alesia_BH wrote...

1.  AC at -4 almost makes sense to me

As Serg noted, Shield sets AC to 4 with an addional -2 against missles. The buckler takes off 1. The Ring takes off another one. The Skald song subtracts 2. The Dex adjustment accounts for the rest. 

How do you use the bard song and attack?

The Bard Song takes a little time to activate. However, it last one round after activation. What she is essentially doing is activating the song before attacking and then reactivating as soon as she gets her attack roll off. Once the Bard song refreshes, she then rengages. It works best with a quick weapon.

How can Greywolf miss on a 19+4=23 attack roll? 

He had already been Blinded at that point.

Best,

A.

Alesia_BH wrote...

@ Serg. When you are Blinded, it adjust your base THAC0 rather then being applied as a penalty to the roll.

I'll
also note that he had fail his save against Chill Touch a few times by
then. His THAC0 would have been near 30 at that point.

Perfect.  Thanks.  It just seemed so impressive to have Greywolf miss all the way up to a roll of 19!  I'll have to look into using blindness more often. 

[Shadow_Leech07]

While technically I didn't die in my level one game I decided that I'm probably not ready for the challenge. Perhaps the way I'm playing is incorrect. Whatever the case, when I realized I was relying too much on a crutch(Algernon's Cloak) it was time to move on. I'm back to playing a solo thief, which I rerolled because my previous thief game crashed and I just didn't feel well about loading that one up again. Anyways that's my update.

[Vaclavc]

Grond0 wrote...
One significant difference for level 1 characters that I didn't put in my write-up is that they don't die from a single hit if they currently have max HPs - this makes it far easier to survive ambushes or traps. 

I am not sure I understand this, Grond. More precisely, I am sure I don't understand this, could you please explain it?


Update on dual class cleric/mage Eldrymon:
Hunting basilisks yielded Eldrymon enough XP for advancing to level 7 as a mage. Then, he started to feel strong enough to hunt Sirines.
http://i264.photobuc...on/Baldr066.jpg

Eldrymon investigated Nashkel mines where he killed Mulahey,
http://i264.photobuc...on/Baldr071.jpg
then Nimbul in Nashkel and Tranzig in Beregost.

South of Lighthouse, he obtained statue of Talos and killed Doomsayer.
http://i264.photobuc...on/Baldr077.jpg

South of High Hedge, he defeated mad cleric Bassilus. North of Friendly Arm, Eldrymon killed Anheg
http://i264.photobuc...on/Baldr082.jpg
and finally advanced as mage to one level above his old cleric profession.



With his clerical powers activated, he stormed bandit camp and obliterated all opposition.


Eldrymon is currently cleric7/mage8 with 58 hp.

V

[corey_russell]

Good luck with your cleric/mage, Vaclavc - perhaps yours will be the one that goes all the way, to avenge the deaths of the other cleric/mages recently.

[Grond0]

Vaclavc wrote...

Grond0 wrote...
One significant difference for level 1 characters that I didn't put in my write-up is that they don't die from a single hit if they currently have max HPs - this makes it far easier to survive ambushes or traps. 

I am not sure I understand this, Grond. More precisely, I am sure I don't understand this, could you please explain it?

Sure.  This was the developers concession to the game being difficult for starting characters.  If your character is level 1 and is at their maximum HPs (which for my mage would be 4) then a single hit will not kill you, i.e. for my mage it would do a maximum of 3 HPs damage.  However, it won't protect you from a single attack with multiple components, e.g. magic missiles, or a single attack with more than one type of damage, e.g. acid arrows.

It does mean that characters are a bit less vulnerable to ambushes than they otherwise would be as a single missile user should have no chance of killing the PC (as they can heal between shots and should be able to run away before more than 2 shots are released).

However, I have seen several characters die when they should have been protected by this effect; I think the protection is a bit buggy and should not really be relied upon in a no-reload game.

[After5CST]

Update: Ja'kal M E Sorc
Party: Imoen, Ajantis, Dynaheir

After raising the dead, Ja'kal headed up to Beregost, and Algernon helped him defeat Tranzig (but perished in the attempt), and Ja'kal and Co. headed up to the Bandit Camp.

Clearing the exterior of the camp proved fairly simple once Taugosz had been Blinded.  A minor setback was that even blinded, it was requiring near-critical rolls to hit Taugosz, so the (now three) casters fell back to using Magic Missile on him, since otherwise it might have taken five turns or so to get enough hits to bring him down.

Following a variant on Tiela's strategy, the two warriors in the tent were lured outside and then Blinded and cut down.  After that (and a rest to renew spells), the party charged the tent, with Imoen, Dynaheir and Ja'kal using Magic Missile to ensure the wizard never finished a spell, while Ajantis rushed the archer and defeated him in melee.  Easy victory, it appears I'm getting better at this battle.

On the first Cloakwood map, the party added Coran.  I wasn't really expecting to do this, but I wanted to have a thief ( Imoen still was a long way from regaining her thief skills ), and he was a pleasant surprise when I played with him for the first time during the last run through.

The spider map used a new strategy, one that worked but was not recommended.   I (based on advice from the board) made Ajantis Invisible, and he ran through the map triggering as many traps as possible) made the decision to invade the lair, and grab the two-handed sword...  found out that such an action made him visible.

That turned into a sprint through the spider map, and he came rushing back to the party at the map entrance with somewhere around ten spiders in pursuit (in particular the phase spiders).  A Stinking cloud slowed down the non-teleporting pursuit and the party dispatched the remainder with the use of a couple of Antidotes.

Coran's wyvern cave was easily handled.  Dynaheir popped inside, hit everything with a Fireball, and then ran outside where Ajantis was ready to engage in melee (with some posion potions at the ready), Coran ready at the bow, and Ja'kal ready with a full load of Magic Misisle and Blindness spells to wear them down.  Imoen used her paltry spell or three but was relatively useless.

Outside the mines was also no problem.  Two stinking clouds from Dynaheir, blindness  spells from Ja'kal, and Coran used arrows on the (unconscious) mages while Ajantis carved up the blinded melee warriors.

Hareishan was also easily handled.  Coran removed traps, Dynaheir went Invisible, dropped a Stinking Cloud in the room, and ran back out to the party.  The fighters who saved against the cloud pursued right into Ajantis and Coran.  Once they were dealt with, Dynaheir stepped around the corner again and fired off a Fireball, damaging and drawing most of the rest of the fighters (with the Hareishan still mostly incapacitated).  By the time Stinking Cloud ended, the room was empty except for a badly hurt Hareishan and one fighter... easy pickings for a back-stabbing Coran and then a rush by Ajantis on the fighter.

At this point, we finally added L5 Yeslick (first time to use him) to the party, so we now had a divine caster for the first time.

Moving downstairs, the party charmed the guard and walked him down to Davie, which in hindsight wasn't the best plan.  Davie's Lightning bolt went right through him and bounced up the corridor to the unprepared and out-of-sight adventuring party, causing some damage... but thankfully nothing too serious.  Yeslick used Animate Dead and walked them down the corridor to Davie, and Coran engaged with bow, causing Davie's dialog to start.  Yeslick followed up with a successful Silence spell, and we managed to take Davie down for the first time from the other side of the traps.

Jakal and Davaeorn on Flickr

After that, it was easy enough to trigger the traps one by one for a pair of victory against the Horrors, and then the mines were done.  At this point, the group headed back to Beregost and then spent some time clearing all pre-ToSC maps outside of Baldur's Gate... stories of which I'll omit because this is already too long.

[Gate70]

Corey
Gate70: potions of freedom don't protect from hold person in vanilla BG 1 - I think it does with fixpack.

I'm in BGT with Ascension but no fixpack. Had stopped using it because I objected to something, can't remember what. Have just re-read the documentation and decided I should add the core fixes back as everything appears to be a sensible addition or correction.

Grond0
You should have been OK in BGT - sounds like a bug to me. It seems a shame to let such a fine-looking cavalier perish in an untimely death

My thoughts too, although I had decided to use a different portrait part way through character creation and forgot to edit it.

Alesia
I'm curious though. When did you drink the Potion exactly? It is possible to quaff and have the spell effect hit before the potion kicks in. That could lead to a held character with a Free Action icon.

I'd glugged the potion after killing the four kobolds, then went to talk to Mulahey and followed him so plenty of time for the potion to be active.

On reflection I will try & continue if that's OK. If he gets held again I'm going to have lost faith in this install (modding multiple installs on Linux is a bit more complicated than on Windows).

[corey_russell]

@Gate70: As you know, the rules clearly state you can reload due to bugs (can't tell you how many times I have to reload due to that win7 bug of being unable to talk to anyone, though I should be able to - this bug never happens on my win98 machine) If the consensus is that this is a bug, then I certainly have no objection to you continuing your character.

[Gate70]

Right. Parr, LG human male cavalier travelling through core BGT Ascension with a belated fix pack (core fixes, game text update, spell animations) then re-biffed. Also a revised portrait more suited to a sword/shield style.


Mulahey fails to cheat his way past me a second time. Nimbul curses my constitution as he uses several sets of magic missiles, only stopping after I chop both his arms off. Tranzig is easier to kill.

Corey, did you install outside the program files location. I can't see why it should be worse under W7 than Vista. I would have thought your vanilla build would be OK outside the program file location unless scripts aren't completing. I did wonder if certain actions (force talk, running away before a conversation can start - e.g. Noober, Nashkel guard,etc) made it worse.

Modifié par Gate70, 23 décembre 2011 - 06:50 .

[Gate70]

Parr, LG human male cavalier.

Bandit camp.
I'm tough enough to drop Ardenor Crush, Taugosz Khosann and their bandits without resorting to potions. I try a greenstone amulet before entering the main bandit tent. Venkt Melfs me once before expiring. Raemon is next, then Hakt. Britik is last.

Cloakwood.
I have to help Aldeth, then Chelak who suggests I use my remaining potion of freedom. Thus prepared, I slice through spiders, ettercaps and Centeol. A hamadryad is next.

Cloakwood mine exterior.
Charge two of the greenstone amulet is enough to deal with Rezdan and Kysus. Drasus and Genthore are foiled by a magical shield and a girdle ac of -6, +4 vs crushing.

EDIT. Bodes well for later as not having to consume potions, meaning they can be used later.

Modifié par Gate70, 23 décembre 2011 - 10:54 .

[Grond0]

Nice progress Gate - keep it going.

Just a few mini-sessions with Gen-mage today, so limited progress.  I thought I would try and restrict her XP to justify keeping her at level 1, so most encounters have been engineered so that only enemies kill anything.  She now has 929 XP - nearly all from returning the revenant's dagger in order to get the invisibility potions safely - and is about to take on Tranzig.  Progress included:
- in Candlekeep only thing bothered with was collecting the healing potion and antidote.
- went to Beregost via High Hedge to get Algernon's cloak.
- collected potion from Jaheira - Khalid coming to his senses dismayed to find her blood on his sword. 
- on second mine level used a couple of charges of wand of sleep to make sure no kobolds got a shot off.
- on third level used the engine quirk providing protection for level 1 characters to survive the 2 traps on the bridge.
- charmed kobolds to block Mulahey and give him no chance to talk.  He then attacked the kobolds with his fists.
- the kobolds outside the cave had been tamed using wand of sleep to ensure there were enough to run interference while Gen-mage slipped out the back door past the oozes.
- I wanted Nimbul's boots to help with ambushes so he was first charmed and then set attacking some guards.