17 réponses à ce sujet

[Son of Imoen]

I just started my very first BG2 game (having only played BG1 for years so far) and I'm a bit amazed by the starting xp Aerie got, compared to Nalia: when I rescued her from the circus, Aerie had a total of 400.000 xp (200.000 in each class), making her a Cleric/Mage level 8/9 (my main character, imported from BG1, had almost 264.000 xp at the time. But when I met Nalia in the Copper Coronet, Nalia only had 166.000 xp (5.000 Thief + 161.000 Mage). Which makes Nalia lag behind on Aerie in xp invested in the Mage class at this time.

At www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/Walkthrough/level.php however, the NPC guide tells me Aerie would be a C/M level 8/8 and Nalia a T/M level 4/11. Is my game bugged? What is normal for the  starting levels of these two characters?

(Imoen started at 135.000 xp: Thief 40.000 (level 7)/Mage 95.000 (level 8)).
Are these huge xp differences for these 3 mage-characters normal?

[Irrbloss]

Which version of the NPC you get is determined by the contents of this file. Presumably you picked them up with a level 9 protagonist, which would net you a Nalia with 161k XP and a Aerie at 400k XP. It's completely normal.

[Ponce de Leon]

I don't know exactly the levels and experiences of the NPCs when you get them. I am pretty sure though that there are more "initial" joinable NPCs, for example, I believe there are 3 different Imoens. It might be that the 400K XP Aerie was closer to your XP or level than any other Aeries, as well as the 166K XP Nalia was the closest to any later or former Nalia (with more or less XP).

Edit : :ph34r: I got ninja'd

Modifié par dark-lauron, 14 juillet 2010 - 09:37 .

[Argent77]

I think that some NPCs have a rather high XP value when they join you. Anomen had almost 700k XP when he joined, while my protagonist barely hit the 300k barrier.

[Humanoid_Taifun]

Irrbloss wrote...

Which version of the NPC you get is determined by the contents of this file. Presumably you picked them up with a level 9 protagonist, which would net you a Nalia with 161k XP and a Aerie at 400k XP. It's completely normal.

Didn't a couple of weeks ago somebody do some testing with Imoen?
I believe the result was that the average level of the entire group decided at what level she would spawn at in Spellhold. (but don't ask me to be more specific - I'm H_T, I get wrong when I get specific!)

[Ponce de Leon]

So it's based on level, and not on XP? Whoa, that would be a mess if you are a druid only party!

[Irrbloss]

Yes, yes, regardless of what 9 refers to, if it is 9 you can get Aeries with 400k XP and Nalias with 161k XP. My point was it is possible and normal.

[Son of Imoen]

Thanks everybody, especially Irrbloss for posting the link to the proper 2da file. It could be true though, it's the average level of the party that counts. My protagonist is an 11th level Blade, not a 9th level character (though he would be with the same amount of xp if he were a fighter).



xp got even heftier with Anomen. After my opening post, I went to see Anomen's level: it's level 7 Fighter>level 11 Cleric. But that's even beyond the highest level in the 2da file. Maybe it was altered by one of the mod's I installed? Can't check now though what those mods are, I'm on another computer now.



I'd say "weird things have been afoot lately"...

[Irrbloss]

Son of Imoen wrote...

I went to see Anomen's level: it's level 7 Fighter>level 11 Cleric.

That's anomen9.

[Morbidest]

Remember that since Nalia is a human Dual NPC, she will advance much quicker as a mage than elven Multi Airhead if you keep both of them - so maybe that's why they handicapped Nalia at the start; in the vanilla game Nalia becomes the strongest mage IF you always have her in the party.

[Son of Imoen]

Though role-playwise my character has more faith in Aerie, even though even Aerie couldn't help herself getting captured. The first impression of Nalia is that of idealistic, but still so much in her puberty - masking insecurity with some sense of being greatly important. It might be because she reminds me too much of someone I met on the net, who is a bit too much narcistic. The meta-gaming knowledge of a possible romance with Aerie appeals as well. So my Blade will take Aerie, even though Nalia becomes the strongest mage.

Kheltick's hope is to rescue Imoen eventually and then there'll will be a Thief>Mage in the party.

It's an enigma though, when and where Imoen learned to cast al those spells? When they defeated Sarevok together, Imoen was a Thief without any magical skills. And when my Blade awoke in Irenicus' dungeon, there was Jaheira who claimed she had travelled the Swordcoast with him - when in fact they didn't get any further than Beregost or thereabout, where Finch became my healer. And Kivan wasn't there anymore and had suddenly become Minsc. Queer things have been afoot lately. But Kheltick will just continue with new companions.

Modifié par Son of Imoen, 16 juillet 2010 - 09:53 .

[G_Admiral_Thrawn]

The REASON Imoen is a mage is the devs of BG2 assumed you'd dual her to a mage (why else would she have such a crappy strength, and have like 18 int?). Minsc and Jaheira were canonically in the party at the end of BG. True, you could have a different party setup, but it's supposed to be Minsc, Jahiera, Imoen, Dynaheir, nd Khalid, with you as maybe a cleric- you have 2 mages (Dynaheir and Imoen), a thief (Imoen), 2 and a half fighters (Minsc and Khalid being 2, and Jaheira being half of one), and half a healer (Jaheira is decent as a healer).

[Carinna]

Actually, I believe Imoen was dualled to a mage so that the plot could progress. Without an ability for her to cast spells, she would not have used that ability to attack Irenicus in Athkatla and given an excuse for the cowled wizards to arrest her. Considering that Irenicus planned the entire scenario so the PC's abilities would increase, he may have taught Imoen her magic skills himself (i.e. she was taught by Irenicus, whether she remembers it or not). Because without that ability, his plans would not have worked so well.

[G_Admiral_Thrawn]

but still, why does she have such a high int in BG if she WASN'T meant to be dualed into a mage?

[Son of Imoen]

The REASON - well, one of the reasons - Baldur's Gate has such a great replayability value is, you can vary your party to incredible extents. I've started over a dozen campaigns, some of them stranded halfway, most of them still current. And I don't always dual Imoen into a mage. Imoen as a thief is great fun too, as is Alora as your pure Thief, or Coran. Not to mention that Ajantis is such a great party leader, Xan is great fun if you like some gloominess as much as I do. So yes, there is a canonical party, but it would be very boring if you ran each campaign with the canonical party. And my first character I actually finished the game with, Kheltick the Blade mentioned above, had a non-canonical party.

That's the thing that would make BGT great to play. It's just such an amount of work getting the setup right with all the mods I want to use. It's nearly double the amount of time as a Tutu setup, and nearly double the time wasted if the setup ends up in a corrupt install. I guess I'm a bit of a mod-junkie. My average install is tweaked by some 10 different mods at the same time.

Modifié par Son of Imoen, 16 juillet 2010 - 09:46 .

[Son of Imoen]

G_Admiral_Thrawn wrote...

but still, why does she have such a high int in BG if she WASN'T meant to be dualed into a mage?

Maybe it's because of her witty character, maybe she was meant to be dualed into a mage (Bioware had a lot of foresight into what other games they planned to make, there's even mentioning of Neverwinter by Lord Foreshadow (!)). But at the time I decided to keep Imoen a pure Thief, I didn't know anything about Cowled Wizards or the start of BG2. I've had the Box Set for some 2-3 years now, but up to this time BG1 has kept me enjoyed and busy and just only a month ago I started BG2 for the first time and last week I discovered this strange discontinuity. It makes me think again about my decision to stick to Tutu.

With BGT, are there other characters than Imoen who free you and other characters locked in the cells, if you didn't use the canonical party?

[Humanoid_Taifun]

Son of Imoen wrote...
Maybe it's because of her witty character, maybe she was meant to be dualed into a mage (Bioware had a lot of foresight into what other games they planned to make, there's even mentioning of Neverwinter by Lord Foreshadow (!)).

What kind of game you're going to make is a little easier to know than such a little detail, especially if we consider the fact that Imoen was not once but twice added as an afterthought.
First they realized that a level 1 PC would need some kind of bodyguard to get to the Friendly Arms Inn, so they added Immy (as far as I know).
Then in BG2 they realized that people actually liked Imoen, and that they couldn't just kill her off to warn you about the after-effects of losing your soul - so they allowed you to keep her instead (but because of that she's pretty silent throughout the game).

With BGT, are there other characters than Imoen who free you and other characters locked in the cells, if you didn't use the canonical party?

Not to my knowledge. (memory kicking in - Damnit, I've never finished  BGT BG1 without Immy in the party! Hm. Still I believe that she will save you anyways. Other characters will not be imported without mods either.)

[Son of Imoen]

Come to think of it, if I remember all BG1 campaigns I started well, I actually never played the canonical party. Would be a great new first. Of my 7 BG1 campaigns ongoing right now, 5 have Imoen, 1 has Khalid and Jaheira, 1 has Minsc and Dynaheir, the rest are other NPC's. Another great favourite of mine is Finch, from the Finch npc mod. Though she appears only in one of the current campaigns. She helped the first and of yet only time I beat the big S. And some campaigns sadly ended in bugs (there was a Stalker who couldn't stalk into the next Cloakwood area as it didn't appear on the map - and no-one had an answer for me forums.bioware.com/myviewtopic.html.

Modifié par Son of Imoen, 16 juillet 2010 - 10:32 .