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[iTomes]

"The plague in Europe was also in a way christianity's fault, because they slaughter the majority of the cats, so the rats spread."



and the people created giant communitys (in some of them people with the plague were even allowed) to meet up and pray together to be salvated from the plague. reason was, that many got healthy again because they went to a lonely place and meditated

[Jimmy Fury]

joriandrake wrote...
there is a bit more to it than "not liking" to it, you are a minority against the majority of normal people, there is no necessity to fulfill your sexual fantasies because time spent on creating deeper normal healthy relationships is for sure gathering more interested buyers and thus the developer makes more cash aswell

from a purely production perspective adding options for abnormal minority just doesn't pay them as much as focusing on heterosexual relationships in the game, the only cause they even include lesbian option now and then is because that is also much popular with males and thus adding that option is of a reasonably low risk level

All of your biased and slightly absurdist language aside, your entire argument has one very big problem...
That's not what "the Majority" wants. The majority doesn't even want a fantasy game at all let alone a "dark epic fantasy RPG"
Majority is determined by, obviously, "the most". In terms of what video game players, as an entire market, want we have to look at sales.
Do you know what the best selling console games of all time are? Wii games, Mario games, DS games, and pokemon games. Literally the entire top ten is made of that.

• Wii Play
• Nintendogs
• Wii Fit
• Mario Kart Wii
• New Super Mario Bros.
• Pokemon Red, Blue, and Yellow
• Brain Age
• Super Mario Bros 2
• Mario Kart DS
• Pokemon Diamond and Pearl.

So if we wanted to make sure The Majority was getting a game that The Majority would enjoy, DA2 would have to be a Wii/DS game about a plumber driving a car around a racetrack to catch weird japanese monsters. Ah but what about the PC? That's the top list of console games, but surely the PC list is topped off with some super hardcore RPG that targeted a supremely heterosexual market... right?
#1 game, of all time, for the pc....
The Sims.
#2 is... wait for iiiit... The Sims 2!
(both allow s/s relationships too... just FYI, so clearly "the majority" of people who want a PC game don't give a rat's behind about s/s relationships being an option...)

the rest of the PC top ten is WoW, Starcraft, Half-life, half-life 2, guild wars, Myst, Doom, and Counter Strike.
So... ya know... MMORPG, strategy, fps, fps, mmo, first person... puzzler?, fps, and fps....
Clearly the majority either wants the Sims, an FPS, or an MMO.

Should Bioware go for the big bucks and just do that? Make some hideous mario-pokemon-sims FPS MMO?
Or do we ALL want them to stick to the minority Fantasy RPG market and make a game for all the freaks, geeks, weirdos, and other abnormal personalities that make up that market?

[/list]

Modifié par Jimmy Fury, 21 juillet 2010 - 03:53 .

[Wittand25]

To get back on topic:

While I agree that the audience for m/m is smaller than those for m/f and f/f, one thing that one should not forget when talking about romances is that adding new romances to a game only gives a diminishing return, that is to say two options are a lot better than one, but four options are only marginally better than three. So saying that it always would be better to add straight romances than adding a gay or lesbian ones is not right, if there is only one romance naturally it should be straight, if there are two romance-able NPCs of one sex and both straight are ok too, but I honestly believe that the six romances in DA:O had a bigger audience than the six romances in ME2 and were less work and cheaper to produce because you only had four LI instead of the six of ME2.

[Addai]

Malira wrote...

The plague in Europe was also in a way christianity's fault, because they slaughter the majority of the cats, so the rats spread.

And what accounts for the spread of plague in Persia and China?

Really, this discussion is too absurd.  Y'all need to go back to talking about pixel porn.

[joriandrake]

Jimmy Fury wrote...
...Clearly the majority either wants the Sims, an FPS, or an MMO.

Should Bioware go for the big bucks and just do that?

Hm, Bioware works on an MMO right now, ME2 is according to the opinion of many already more FPS than an RPG, and we can say that every RPG is a bit simulator/Sims-like to begin with, and recently RPG-s include more and more costumization options, even castle or house costumizations, which resemble options from Sims too

[joriandrake]

Addai67 wrote...

Malira wrote...

The plague in Europe was also in a way christianity's fault, because they slaughter the majority of the cats, so the rats spread.

And what accounts for the spread of plague in Persia and China?

Really, this discussion is too absurd.  Y'all need to go back to talking about pixel porn.

I agree, and btw I point it out again that I was actually supporting you people to have your own sexual orientated ingame dialogue options

[Tirigon]

Addai67 wrote...

Y'all need to go back to talking about pixel porn.

We´re not in the Alistair thread, no pixel porn here.

[Jimmy Fury]

joriandrake wrote...

Jimmy Fury wrote...
...Clearly the majority either wants the Sims, an FPS, or an MMO.

Should Bioware go for the big bucks and just do that?

Hm, Bioware works on an MMO right now, ME2 is according to the opinion of many already more FPS than an RPG, and we can say that every RPG is a bit simulator/Sims-like to begin with, and recently RPG-s include more and more costumization options, even castle or house costumizations, which resemble options from Sims too

Ignoring my point does not actually change my point you know.
The majority of console players want a Wii game, the majority of PC players don't mind s/s romance.
Your argument of majority rule is both invalid and unsound.

Modifié par Jimmy Fury, 21 juillet 2010 - 04:01 .

[C9316]

[/quote]

The plague in Europe was also in a way christianity's fault, because they slaughter the majority of the cats, so the rats spread.[/quote]
Oh boy it's blame the christians time!

But seriously, enough of this. Let us get back to the topic.

[Tirigon]

joriandrake wrote...

I agree, and btw I point it out again that I was actually supporting you people to have your own sexual orientated ingame dialogue options

That´s great of you:kissing:, but I really don´t understand why it is, then, that you insult homosexuals whenever possible...

[joriandrake]

Jimmy Fury wrote...

joriandrake wrote...

Jimmy Fury wrote...
...Clearly the majority either wants the Sims, an FPS, or an MMO.

Should Bioware go for the big bucks and just do that?

Hm, Bioware works on an MMO right now, ME2 is according to the opinion of many already more FPS than an RPG, and we can say that every RPG is a bit simulator/Sims-like to begin with, and recently RPG-s include more and more costumization options, even castle or house costumizations, which resemble options from Sims too

Ignoring my point does not actually change my point you know.
The majority of console players want a Wii game, the majority of PC players don't mind s/s romance.
Your argument of majority rule is both invalid and unsound.

... I just pointed out that streamlining does slowly get its first victims everywhere, and also that I am actuall supporting homosexual romance options, aslong they "don't jump into your face" or you can't avoid it (quoted from either a poll or some other thread)

[Bobad]

joriandrake wrote...
there is a bit more to it than "not liking" to it, you are a minority against the majority of normal people, there is no necessity to fulfill your sexual fantasies because time spent on creating deeper normal healthy relationships is for sure gathering more interested buyers and thus the developer makes more cash aswell

from a purely production perspective adding options for abnormal minority just doesn't pay them as much as focusing on heterosexual relationships in the game, the only cause they even include lesbian option now and then is because that is also much popular with males and thus adding that option is of a reasonably low risk level

Normal people, I love that phrase, nothing better than opinion expressed as fact. 

Maybe people do not wish to be the norm, maybe they wish to do things because that's what they want to do, rather than to conform to the consensus of their peers?.
As to what a healthy relationship is I am at a loss, however I can pretty much take your own connotation as being heterosexual given the tone of your post, and there are a lot of unhealthy heterosexual relationships out there, as well as some homosexual ones I don't doubt.

Oh and apart from being vicarious and cathartic I don't think there's anytthing deep in any game romance, a story is still just a story.

[Tora Panthera]

There's an article about it here - http://ezinearticles...vived&id=161249, the plague was in other area's but it hit Europe the hardest. 

edit: I'm sorry for adding more of this to this thread about this, but I wanted to at least show some proof for my previous post

Modifié par Malira, 21 juillet 2010 - 04:08 .

[Quercus]

Tirigon wrote...

joriandrake wrote...

I agree, and btw I point it out again that I was actually supporting you people to have your own sexual orientated ingame dialogue options

That´s great of you:kissing:, but I really don´t understand why it is, then, that you insult homosexuals whenever possible...

Well the homosexual conection with incest wasn't really an insult.
Incest is just as nice, as long as there is love infolved. I've never seen anything bad about incest apart that the kiddies born from it can wind up with some lackings or extra attachments. But the type of love isn't bad.
At least in my opinion.

[joriandrake]

Tirigon wrote...

joriandrake wrote...

I agree, and btw I point it out again that I was actually supporting you people to have your own sexual orientated ingame dialogue options

That´s great of you:kissing:, but I really don´t understand why it is, then, that you insult homosexuals whenever possible...

What I said was not meant to be an insult at all, I know 2 homosexual girls myself, they know that they are not normal but it doesn't matter to them, they smile and say it that the relationship they have is worth not getting children or be married and they don't mind,
I do have respect for them and they don't try to force their sexuality or the acceptance of it onto others neither. I never said myself that you people need to "stop being gay" neither, plus I am a hobby author in my home and wrote about lesbian romances in two of my novels too, plus I am a pnp-er and my character is many times female despite that I am male.

[iTomes]

ok, guys. we all have an opinion, wether we are straight/gay/lesbian/bi/asexual/whatever else is running around out there and we all think were right, but were also civilised adults (or at least the most here are adults) and simply can agree to disagree. but yelling at each other propably will only result in this thread getting closed and we feeling the banhammer, so i suggest we just stop that insulting and get back to the topic (whatever that was...).

[C9316]

iTomes wrote...

ok, guys. we all have an opinion, wether we are straight/gay/lesbian/bi/asexual/whatever else is running around out there and we all think were right, but were also civilised adults (or at least the most here are adults) and simply can agree to disagree. but yelling at each other propably will only result in this thread getting closed and we feeling the banhammer, so i suggest we just stop that insulting and get back to the topic (whatever that was...).

I agree. But the topic, wasn't it somthing about male romance?

[joriandrake]

Shiroukai wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

joriandrake wrote...

I agree, and btw I point it out again that I was actually supporting you people to have your own sexual orientated ingame dialogue options

That´s great of you:kissing:, but I really don´t understand why it is, then, that you insult homosexuals whenever possible...

Well the homosexual conection with incest wasn't really an insult.
Incest is just as nice, as long as there is love infolved. I've never seen anything bad about incest apart that the kiddies born from it can wind up with some lackings or extra attachments. But the type of love isn't bad.
At least in my opinion.

Exactly, if both partners know what they do, are mature enough to understand it, and neither of them are forced to it then it is not bad, with exception of the danger that their child may not be normal if one is born, this is atleast not a danger to homosexual couples and can be more at ease then them.

Not to mention, sometimes love just happens between relatives without their knowledge, this is especially true if they never met eachother before and only got to know about being relatives after they fell in love, or in a more dramatic situation: when they sign the marriage papers. Sometimes even then it may not be known despite having the same surname because there are many families with the same surname without being relatives, expecially in europe, names like "Smith" or "Baker" which came from the occupation of ancestors during the medievals are a good example of such misleading surnames.

[Tirigon]

C9316 wrote...

I agree. But the topic, wasn't it somthing about male romance?

I thought it was "let´s discuss stuff and flame a bit!!"

Might be wrong though...

[C9316]

Tirigon wrote...

C9316 wrote...

I agree. But the topic, wasn't it somthing about male romance?

I thought it was "let´s discuss stuff and flame a bit!!"

Might be wrong though...

In that case, Global Warming anyone?

[Tirigon]

joriandrake wrote...


Exactly, if both partners know what they do, are mature enough to understand it, and neither of them are forced to it then it is not bad, with exception of the danger that their child may not be normal if one is born, this is atleast not a danger to homosexual couples and can be more at ease then them.

Not to mention, sometimes love just happens between relatives without their knowledge, this is especially true if they never met eachother before and only got to know about being relatives after they fell in love, or in a more dramatic situation: when they sign the marriage papers. Sometimes even then it may not be known despite having the same surname because there are many families with the same surname without being relatives, expecially in europe, names like "Smith" or "Baker" which came from the occupation of ancestors during the medievals are a good example of such misleading surnames.

Ok, maybe I overreacted a bit. But after I heard you talking about "abnormal" homosexuals I immediately thought you think on the line of "they´ll all burn in helll, these abominations".... Sadly, Ive read enough posters here who did indeed think like that so it´s not as far-fetched as one might think.

[iTomes]

oh hey global warming! like that topic... one of the biggest political hypes of all time imo and only created for politicians to make some PR^^