271 réponses à ce sujet

[iTomes]

"spoilers!!!!!!!!!!!


1: taking David or not
2: Rewriting the Geth or not
3: Keeping the base or not
4: Keeping the Genophage cure or not
5: Killing the Rachni queen or not.

These choices if you don't metagame are very hard. I puty self into Shepard kept thinknig on what would happen iand thinknig of what would happen. I am a Paragade, my moral is like mordins. The system in ME is not perfect and can be better and I hope DA2 system is alot better but till, ME and ME2 had alot of hard choices if you don't metagame."


i hadn't  trouble with those. problem was, that i always chose Paragon first when i was Paragon to get some points. now shepperd tells me a hundred good reasons to do the paragon thing.  so after all my character convinces me to DO the paragon thing. if im renegade it goes the other way round and my shep convinces me to do the renegade thing. so i have to choose before the whole convincing dialoque really begins. but thats something a can't do because i propably don't have the info to do chose a site.

[wrexingcrew]

bobobo878 wrote...
That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

Your image-posting skills will no doubt make her reconsider her well-considered points, spelled out in hundreds of words. That picture of a crying child...that'll teach someone to have a reasonable opinion on the internet.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

Massadonious1 wrote...

A technical standpoint? You personally know someone who has been resuruected from re-entry into a fictional planet with a fictional atmosphere? Do you know how it should of been done?

Also, it's the future not the present. From a species, hell, from a universe that has learned to build interstellar spaceships and shoot blue bolts of pure matter from their fingertips, I'm pretty sure the current modern day limitations on medical science, and science in general doesn't apply to them. They may very well how to reconstruct and restore someone's personality from a single bone, or even a single cell.

I guess you're cool with Flemeth being brought back from the dead, then. It's completely fantasy and mystical without any hint of applied realism, therefore, they can get away with it.

This isn't about modern realism; it's about establishing something in your IP setting and meaningfully integrating it into the plot.

So, yes, I know how the Lazarus Project should have been done. It should have been explained. Shepard should have been allowed to actually find out how she was resurrected and how the Project fits into the established Mass Effect technology. The simple truth is that this never happened. The Lazarus Project is completely glossed over, never explained, and never brought up again in any real way once Shepard leaves the station. This was deus ex machina, a meaningless plot device thrown in to explain away a random plot thread and never be explored. It's lazy; it's poorly written (in that it's barely written at all), and it brings up serious questions about the nature of Shepard's existence that are 100% ignored. It's not good.

And if that's the kind of meaningless plot device BioWare doesn't mind introducing then I fear for the future games BioWare is going to put out. But I'm hoping this is limited to ME2, as ME2 has many poorly written moments just like this.

[kraidy1117]

iTomes wrote...

"spoilers!!!!!!!!!!!


1: taking David or not
2: Rewriting the Geth or not
3: Keeping the base or not
4: Keeping the Genophage cure or not
5: Killing the Rachni queen or not.

These choices if you don't metagame are very hard. I puty self into Shepard kept thinknig on what would happen iand thinknig of what would happen. I am a Paragade, my moral is like mordins. The system in ME is not perfect and can be better and I hope DA2 system is alot better but till, ME and ME2 had alot of hard choices if you don't metagame."


i hadn't  trouble with those. problem was, that i always chose Paragon first when i was Paragon to get some points. now shepperd tells me a hundred good reasons to do the paragon thing.  so after all my character convinces me to DO the paragon thing. if im renegade it goes the other way round and my shep convinces me to do the renegade thing. so i have to choose before the whole convincing dialoque really begins. but thats something a can't do because i propably don't have the info to do chose a site.

Hmm I don't play that way...

[kraidy1117]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Massadonious1 wrote...

A technical standpoint? You personally know someone who has been resuruected from re-entry into a fictional planet with a fictional atmosphere? Do you know how it should of been done?

Also, it's the future not the present. From a species, hell, from a universe that has learned to build interstellar spaceships and shoot blue bolts of pure matter from their fingertips, I'm pretty sure the current modern day limitations on medical science, and science in general doesn't apply to them. They may very well how to reconstruct and restore someone's personality from a single bone, or even a single cell.

I guess you're cool with Flemeth being brought back from the dead, then. It's completely fantasy and mystical without any hint of applied realism, therefore, they can get away with it.

This isn't about modern realism; it's about establishing something in your IP setting and meaningfully integrating it into the plot.

So, yes, I know how the Lazarus Project should have been done. It should have been explained. Shepard should have been allowed to actually find out how she was resurrected and how the Project fits into the established Mass Effect technology. The simple truth is that this never happened. The Lazarus Project is completely glossed over, never explained, and never brought up again in any real way once Shepard leaves the station. This was deus ex machina, a meaningless plot device thrown in to explain away a random plot thread and never be explored. It's lazy; it's poorly written (in that it's barely written at all), and it brings up serious questions about the nature of Shepard's existence that are 100% ignored. It's not good.

And if that's the kind of meaningless plot device BioWare doesn't mind introducing then I fear for the future games BioWare is going to put out. But I'm hoping this is limited to ME2, as ME2 has many poorly written moments just like this.

and so did ME.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

bobobo878 wrote...
*snip
That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

It makes you feel like a crying child?

I'm sorry; I didn't mean to hurt your feelings.

[Altima Darkspells]

wrexingcrew wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...
That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

Your image-posting skills will no doubt make her reconsider her well-considered points, spelled out in hundreds of words. That picture of a crying child...that'll teach someone to have a reasonable opinion on the internet.

Now if only someone had a picture of Brakka (from Farscape) for bobobo878...

[kraidy1117]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...
*snip
That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

It makes you feel like a crying child?

I'm sorry; I didn't mean to hurt your feelings.

Mys, have I ever told you, your amazing when you make sly coments?

[iTomes]

@kraidy: usually don't want to play that way too but ME2 just wont leave me a choice. if i want to get throught the game i HAVE to chose a site for the dialoque options. and if i don't i have 2 unloyal party members what usually was enough to make one partymember die (i don't do that much mining and i don't reload if someone dies).

[Kaiser Shepard]

I actually feel sort of sad for Mystranna, as I see where she's coming from and once also felt like one of my favorite developers (Nintendo) was making all the wrong choices. Looking back at that, it would be hard to simply tell her to cheer up and have faith in Mary and the rest of the team. I simply can't tell her that it's impossible for them to ruin that much, especially when she feels that the Mass Effect team did just that last time.



I truly feel sorry for what you're going trough.

[Massadonious1]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...
So, yes, I know how the Lazarus Project should have been done. It should have been explained. Shepard should have been allowed to actually find out how she was resurrected and how the Project fits into the established Mass Effect technology.

I'll continue to respectfully disagree. I can see no viable reason that Shepard as a character would need to know. He's a marine, not a scientist. Nothing he could glean from how he was brought back to life will make a difference to the overall narrative.

But, I'm curious, if it was explained, like in the codex or something, how would that make the story better? You could honestly tell me you would be satisfied if you found out that the Lazarus Project was nothing but Miranda and Jenkins performing naked voodoo magic? I'm exaggerating, of course, but no matter what they did, however eloquently or well written they made it, it wasn't going to make sense. It certainly wouldn't of helped me interpret or understand the story any better. Quite frankly, I could of very well lived without their "thermal clip" explanation as well.

[Onyx Jaguar]

wrexingcrew wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...
That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

Your image-posting skills will no doubt make her reconsider her well-considered points, spelled out in hundreds of words. That picture of a crying child...that'll teach someone to have a reasonable opinion on the internet.

I can write thousands of words without saying anything, while I can write two sentences while saying more.  This OP bores me as I've read it before, its just the director's cut version.

[ObserverStatus]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...
*snip
That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

It makes you feel like a crying child?

I'm sorry; I didn't mean to hurt your feelings.

It's not you, your post made me realise that DA2 might suck, and that's what makes me feel bad.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

I actually feel sort of sad for Mystranna, as I see where she's coming from and once also felt like one of my favorite developers (Nintendo) was making all the wrong choices. Looking back at that, it would be hard to simply tell her to cheer up and have faith in Mary and the rest of the team. I simply can't tell her that it's impossible for them to ruin that much, especially when she feels that the Mass Effect team did just that last time.
I truly feel sorry for what you're going trough.

Well, it's not that big a deal.

There are plenty of other games I can play. I don't think there's a BioWare game on my top ten list at all atm. Well, maybe DAO, but it'd be closer to 10.

Massadonious1 wrote...

I'll continue to respectfully disagree. I can see no viable reason that Shepard as a character would need to know. He's a marine, not a scientist. Nothing he could glean from how he was brought back to life will make a difference to the overall narrative.

But, I'm curious, if it was explained, like in the codex or something, how would that make the story better? You could honestly tell me you would be satisfied if you found out that the Lazarus Project was nothing but Miranda and Jenkins performing naked voodoo magic? I'm exaggerating, of course, but no matter what they did, however eloquently or well written they made it, it wasn't going to make sense. It certainly wouldn't of helped me interpret or understand the story any better. Quite frankly, I could of very well lived without their "thermal clip" explanation as well.

See, you have different standards for your character than I do. My Shepard would be terribly interested in figuring out the extent of her injuries, how she was brought back, etc. She'd even contemplate philosophically about the whole situation.

Quite frankly I dislike their completely shoddy execution because it killed my character, both literally and figuratively. I don't know how she was brought back, so I can no longer relate to her, nor can I be even remotely sure that she's still the same person I made her to be. Many people probably don't care. I do. I was trying to roleplay a character and BioWare threw a life-changing deus ex machina at her without the courtesy of explaining it. And they did that multiple times in ME2. It's truly puzzling how much crap I have ignore in order to see Shepard as the same character, because she's forced to act a very specific way.
I don't play Mass Effect for the shooting and badass one liners. I was trying to immerse myself into a sci-fi world, and that's near impossible to do when the writers themselves make terrible decisions for their established setting.

Modifié par Mystranna Kelteel, 16 juillet 2010 - 07:29 .

[TMZuk]

bobobo878 wrote...

@OP

*picture edited out*

That's pretty much how this post makes me feel.

Yes, that is a rich and intelligent reply to someone who took the time putting together an analysis you happen to disagree with. Ridiculing is the response of immature persons. If there's a crying child present, it would seem to be you.

I by and large agree with OP, this game strikes me as a linear actionadventur with RPG elements, and not as a true RPG at all. It's ME2 more than it is DA:O.

I liked DA:O because it was a step back towards games I've played a lot, and loves. All the news released so far about DA2 points in the opposite direction, which seems an odd way to make a sequel to a succesfull game.

Modifié par TMZuk, 16 juillet 2010 - 08:55 .

[Aratham Darksight]

kraidy1117 wrote...

Why the ME writing team does not talk with there fans is beyond me, it's plain stupid.

They used to, back in the days of the previous forums. People treated them like crap. Then, one by one, they stopped posting. It's a very mysterious sequence of events.

[Tirigon]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

Alrite, let's play:
Decipher the Double-talk!!

Round 4! LITHE SUPER-NINJA SPARTANS!!!
Apparently combat is being reworked rather thoroughly, or at the very least "redesigned". Mike Laidlaw says he wants the classes to play like "unstoppable juggernaut, a lithe super-ninja, or field artillery."
respectively to warriors, rogues, and mages. And we've all read the "fight like a Spartan!" tagline on the main site. So, I'm hoping those are hyperbole because that sounds dreadful for an RPG. He also goes on about wanting players to get in enemies' faces and cut heads off and making everything feel faster. That also sounds a little extreme. They say we can still play tactically, or "like a general", but is this going to be some stylized, watered-down action game or something?

This is good imo. Combat must be full of action, blood and gore.

[Grommash94]

Rubbish Hero wrote...

Depth VS breadth just sounds like code to make it more manageable on  consoles (which is the lead platform). Expect 5 skills with simple  leveling perks like Mass Effect, for maximum control pad efficiency.

That is not true. That is just your speculation.

[iTomes]

why does everybody think the console will be the lead platform? there will ne different combat for both, so why assuming one is prefered. and besides, the warrior for example didn't have much skills in DA1 either, but he was still well liked.

[SithLordExarKun]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...
 I was trying to immerse myself into a sci-fi world, and that's near impossible to do when the writers themselves make terrible decisions for their established setting.

Honestly  i find it incredibly hard to immerse myself in both ME1 and ME2 which is why i think DAO is a vastly superior RPG to both of those games(that being said ME2 is my favourite overall game between the three). I just don't see ME1 as an RPG at all but a ****** poor attempt to try to mash shooting and RPG together which IMO, none of those 2 aspects nailed properly. ME2 may have been more shootery, but it at least got one thing right which scarificing the RPG side.

That being said, i am very worried about DA2's direction with Hawke having a voice, a conversation wheel and the way the story is being told.

[Waage25]

I agree with OP over all so far it sounds like they are making the next action adventure pop-a-mole game and removing a lot of the RPG aspects of the game.

Modifié par Waage25, 16 juillet 2010 - 11:36 .

[Darkieus]

"Round 5! Depth vs. Breadth

This one's straight-forward. They're saying the focus on DA2's combat skills will be on "depth" and not "breadth". Yeah, that's just fancy-speak for saying that we'll have fewer combat abilities. Granted this is countered by them claiming that we will be able to alter or improve our abilities as we go. The example given is the fireball, with claims that it will let you tailor this spell to the way you want it to be. Now, as a realist who has played many games, this sounds like a puffed-up way of saying that you're going to offer spell evolution at fixed points, such as "Reach level 5: Choose if you want your fireball to have a wider AOE or cause more damage!". That doesn't change the spell or gameplay in any specific way. Maybe I'm wrong, but, hey, I'm only being realistic. I don't see this "depth" they're claiming to be very deep."



---



Sounds exactly like Mass Effect 2's skill system, where once a skill was leveled up enough, you had a choice of modifying the stats between two types.



This game is looking worse and worse. I want to see a real sequel to Dragon Age: Origins, not a bunch of half-baked Michael Jackson's wearing armor.

[Amyntas]

Grommash94 wrote...

Rubbish Hero wrote...

Depth VS breadth just sounds like code to make it more manageable on  consoles (which is the lead platform). Expect 5 skills with simple  leveling perks like Mass Effect, for maximum control pad efficiency.

That is not true. That is just your speculation.

Bioware said in the GI article that they found it hard to port from the PC to consoles and that it is easier to port from consoles to PC because the PC is more flexible. So it makes sense to assume that they developed DA2 for the consoles first. I don't like it either, but he seems to be right.

[Lord_Saulot]

Amyntas wrote...

Grommash94 wrote...

Rubbish Hero wrote...

Depth VS breadth just sounds like code to make it more manageable on  consoles (which is the lead platform). Expect 5 skills with simple  leveling perks like Mass Effect, for maximum control pad efficiency.

That is not true. That is just your speculation.

Bioware said in the GI article that they found it hard to port from the PC to consoles and that it is easier to port from consoles to PC because the PC is more flexible. So it makes sense to assume that they developed DA2 for the consoles first. I don't like it either, but he seems to be right.

Didn't the same quote, just before that part, say they were developing simultaneously?