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[JamieCOTC]

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

edit: top



Smile, what's the use of crying?
You'll find that life is still worthwhile
If you just smile.

(blowing sh*t up works too.)

Modifié par JamieCOTC, 07 octobre 2011 - 09:29 .

[Tup3x]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

I honestly don't know. Story? Shepard as character? Voice acting? The fact that you can shape your Shepard to what you want? Or maybe it's all of them that makes her stand out.

Modifié par Tup3xi, 07 octobre 2011 - 09:42 .

[CrazyRah]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

I can't point on one exact reason why, it's more the combined effect of everything that makes FemShep this special and great. FemShep just feels right for me and that's the important part

[Sinapus]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

Well, she's this lady...



...who is pretty darned strong.



...not much of a dancer, though.



*cough*

[khevan]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

*topshepawesomepicsnip*

I'm editing this because I used too many words to say too little.  The essense of my post is summed up in its final few sentences:

Because of how she's written, and how Jennifer Hale takes her dialogue and makes them into something...more, Commander Shepard is a female character who doesn't shatter the stereotype, she's a character who ignores the stereotype, and that is a much, much more powerful thing indeed.

Modifié par khevan, 08 octobre 2011 - 06:58 .

[Quething]

Because she's a female character who was written by someone who thought of themselves as writing a man. And therefore she's actually a strong, charismatic, effective and admirable character completely unburdened by the male-gazey hypersexualization and other various sexist bullspit and cliches that inevitably surround any action hero designed from the start by someone thinking "I'm writing a chick" (and subconsciously, "chicks are Like This," or "chicks have to be Like This to sell or be believable to the audience").

Same reason Ripley's so awesome in Alien.

We don't get a lot of respected-by-both-canon-and-fans, untarnished-by-cultural-grossness women like that in pop culture. So a lot of us really starving for them and pretty wild about them on the rare occasion they actually show up.

Modifié par Quething, 08 octobre 2011 - 12:05 .

[sagefic]

Quething wrote...

Because she's a female character who was written by someone who thought of themselves as writing a man. And therefore she's actually a strong, charismatic, effective and admirable character completely unburdened by the male-gazey hypersexualization and other various sexist bullspit and cliches that inevitably surround any action hero designed from the start by someone thinking "I'm writing a chick" (and subconsciously, "chicks are Like This," or "chicks have to be Like This to sell or be believable to the audience").

Same reason Ripley's so awesome in Alien.

We don't get a lot of respected-by-both-canon-and-fans, untarnished-by-cultural-grossness women like that in pop culture. So a lot of us really starving for them and pretty wild about them on the rare occasion they actually show up.

I think this is nicely put.

I also have been thinking a lot about that Felica Day interview i read not long ago, re: gaming/her DA2 dlc. 

she commented that avatars in game let us experiment with the way we see ourselves and who we want to be - or something to that effect.

i think femshep is kind of the ultimate avatar/character hybrid: she's her own person, but you get to step into those shoes. she's not just 'you in space' - that would be boring, but she's not some other person you can't get a read on either. it's this unique experience i've never seen before really. a lot of that is hale's doing, a lot is the gender-neutral writing that just totally works for the story, and a lot of it is what the fans bring to it

[Obsidian Gryphon]

Never gave it much thought actually.   I'm just glad to see a steady, strong female protaganist in a Action/RPG game. Seeing, hearing and playing male chars all the time in games can be tiring so it's a refreshing change. Adding a voice, JH's voce, gave the char greater depth. More like a living person.

I like Shep but strangely, even though I did try to give her a first name, it never stay. Originally, I want her to be like A / HH, two fav female protaganists but even though Shep shares some similar traits, she's different. She's just Shepard. A soldier who knows where her duty and priorities lie. A commanding officer who knows how to engage her crew as a figure of approacheable authority, who would never let them down. She's similar to HH in many ways and I wish there are more opportunities to further explore her char, her interactions with the ppl around her, expositions on her inner thoughts. However, it can only be done in books as there are limitations in a video game. 

I wish though, she kept a diary / journal. Like A in TLJ. It brings the char much closer, a window to peer into. In any case, I'm just glad Shep is in existence.  

[Sable Phoenix]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

My own personal reason is largely because Jennifer Hale is my voice-acting idol.  I'm something of a voice-chaser.  I know about Peter Cullen and Frank Welker and Gary Chalk and Kevin Conroy and Rob Paulson and Tim Daly and Ali Hillis and more.  But with Jennifer Hale, not only is she the rare star-level, famous female voice actor, she's just one of the best voice actors working today, period.  I love her work and have for a long time.  And I think the fact that she is so skilled and emotionally involving is a big part of her widespread popularity with the fandom.  Everyone's seen this voice acting comparison; her Shepard is just more believable and engaging, and to me that's a notable reason people are more passionate about her character.

I'm sure an even bigger reason than the emotional resonance, however, is the fact that, as other people have noted, Shepard is "written as a man" (although I somewhat object to that phrase, for reasons I'll explain in a minute).  It's no coincidence that she's compared repeatedly to the most enduring female lead in science fiction, Ellen Ripley from the first Alien movie.  In that movie, Ripley's role was originally planned for a male lead and was written as such.  Obviously, Shepard was written to fill the necessary role regardless of gender... and I think this is key.  I think the reason that the two most successful female science fiction icons, in movies and in gaming respectively, are perceived as being "written male" is because writers write male characters as just human, with all the myriad motivations and variations that entails, whereas they tend to write female characters as stereotypes, which automatically limits the motivations and responses of that character.  Yes, women are usually more emotional than men, but Jennifer Hale handles that aspect of the character purely with her voice acting skills; the motivations and actions of men and women aren't all that different when you get right down to it, because we're all human, and ultimately that's a far larger chunk of a character than which half of the species' procreation they're responsible for.

FemShep is the perfect amalgamation of the two; the competent and hardassed...


...with the feminine and sexy...


...brought to us by a fusion of the efforts of the actress and the writers behind her.  The beauty of it all, and the reason she's so successful and so loved as a character, is that neither of the aspects are forced--they just are, simple manifestations of the character that grow organically out of her motivations and the situations she's faced with.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 08 octobre 2011 - 09:52 .

[Tup3x]

Obsidian Gryphon wrote...

Never gave it much thought actually.   I'm just glad to see a steady, strong female protaganist in a Action/RPG game. Seeing, hearing and playing male chars all the time in games can be tiring so it's a refreshing change. Adding a voice, JH's voce, gave the char greater depth. More like a living person.

I like Shep but strangely, even though I did try to give her a first name, it never stay. Originally, I want her to be like A / HH, two fav female protaganists but even though Shep shares some similar traits, she's different. She's just Shepard. A soldier who knows where her duty and priorities lie. A commanding officer who knows how to engage her crew as a figure of approacheable authority, who would never let them down. She's similar to HH in many ways and I wish there are more opportunities to further explore her char, her interactions with the ppl around her, expositions on her inner thoughts. However, it can only be done in books as there are limitations in a video game. 

I wish though, she kept a diary / journal. Like A in TLJ. It brings the char much closer, a window to peer into. In any case, I'm just glad Shep is in existence.  

Yeah, indeed.

[Obsidian Gryphon]

^   I've even given up on DX:HR. This makes it the 3rd Deus Ex I never complete, this title is jinxed for me. The stealth play is nice but I'm not inpsired by Jensen. He's also outmatched in terms of gameplay by Ezio in Assassin's Creed Brotherhood. I'd prefer a up close and the sharp slick of a dagger to take down the enemy. Besides, Ezio's a better monkey and the panorama in game is more breathtaking.  

In any case, strong female protaganists in video games are rare. There are 3 in my list to date; Lara Croft, April Ryan and Shepard. Out of these 3, April Ryan is the one I'm most concerned with, followed by Shepard. LC is a nice char but she doesn't move me as much as the first 2.

I've tried to see the April in Shep but their chars and the worlds they occupied are diverse and vastly different. April ... April has her pains, her fears, her demons and her fate .. is unknown. I "live" this char through her diary, her thoughts as she was sent through a series of bewildering hoops that brought her up and then sent her crashing. I cannot help but feel for her as she struggled to find the answers. Sometimes, I wanna reach out and shake her (go*damn it April, come to your senses, What's the matter with you? You have suffered, yes, but this, this isn't you. You are better than this). When Crow suggested hitting her over the head with a saucepan, it was funny but also sad.  I understand why, all the possible reasons why she would take the stance she did and it pains me to think of what she went through. When the game / story came to an end, I have only a thought (live April, you must live. You have tried so hard. There is no justice, no fairness to it all in the years you have fought, to come to this.) 

Tis really good writing on the author's part if he can evoke such feelings for a char and such a  slew of mysteries that sent the fans going up and down, trying to figure everything out with the clues tossed out in the dialogues and other stuff in the game.  We tried our best but with the story incomplete, we're at a dead end.


Shepard is different. There's actually very little to let one know what really makes her tick (for me anyways). I only know she is stubborn, with a unshakable will that she will fight to the very end. To save the galaxy. That is the gerneral aspect of this char. I view Shep as a strong leader with all the best qualities there are and there lies the problem. Where / what are her weaknesses?  Her behaviour to her crew, the ppl she encountered, the various decisions she took, as directed by the players, determined the personality of this char. A female personality that's outstanding and yet ...tangible only on the surface. I'm lesss emotionally involved with this char. There's no quirk about her that will make me laugh with empathised humor, agree with her opinions, shock / amazement, etc.. I feel the writers for ME is really missing a great opportunity to fully flesh out Shepard (femShep). They have the money to make a trilogy for this char / story but they are not up to par with another with little $$ to work with, not so great gameplay (downright retarded fightouts and movements) and yet wrote and created great chars along with great voice acting.  If the ending for Shepard in ME3 is bad, I would be sad but it would not evoke that feeling of lost and grief as the  conclusion for April Ryan in DF did.

*images removed

P.S. Dreamfall is the sequel to TLJ and does not fully introduce players to April Ryan, her background or explain concisely why she was where she was in DF. She became a secondary char in DF as a new protaganist (which upset many TLJ fans) was intro for DF. We waited 7 years for the sequel, only to be thrown into despair at the end and we  will never know if April lives or dies. There is only the beginning / ending of TLJ that gives a glimmer of hope. April Ryan has fulfilled only one part of the prophecy; she has healed but she has yet to break the worlds and end the tenure of the Guardian. To do so, she has to find herself again. No easy task. Shepard, well, either she succeeds or she fails. As plain as that.

Modifié par Obsidian Gryphon, 09 octobre 2011 - 12:35 .

[KyreneZA]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

One of the big reasons I play Jane is:

(yeah, I finally managed to get that image done)*

I don't prefer her to John. I don't prefer Hale's voice to Meer's. Hell I've only got the two characters in my lineup for ME3. I just like voting for the underdog. And femShep is that underdog. Even now, after getting herself a makeover and an 'official' status for ME3 marketing. She's that renegade choice, that non-mainstream choice (even if that 18% stat is total bullsh*t). And really, the only reason John is my canon playthrough is that I played him first.

And, to the ladies in this thread, please forgive me if I say, I think my John's a hunk, but regarding my Jane: "I'd tap that in a second!"

* I'm not good with motivationals, so if anyone feels inspired, feel free to use that image to make some further femShep commentary.

[KyreneZA]

Not really getting anywhere with my other games (except the LAN game of Titan's Quest my wife and I play some evenings), I decided to move my final playthroughs of John and Jane up by a couple of months. It allowed for a tweek or two in the CC, as well as motivating them a little more by putting both in Cerberus colours for their armour. Jane is a little more comfortable in hers, but what I really like is her hair this time round:

[Tup3x]

Obsidian Gryphon wrote...

^   I've even given up on DX:HR. This makes it the 3rd Deus Ex I never complete, this title is jinxed for me. The stealth play is nice but I'm not inpsired by Jensen. He's also outmatched in terms of gameplay by Ezio in Assassin's Creed Brotherhood. I'd prefer a up close and the sharp slick of a dagger to take down the enemy. Besides, Ezio's a better monkey and the panorama in game is more breathtaking.  

In any case, strong female protaganists in video games are rare. There are 3 in my list to date; Lara Croft, April Ryan and Shepard. Out of these 3, April Ryan is the one I'm most concerned with, followed by Shepard. LC is a nice char but she doesn't move me as much as the first 2.

I've tried to see the April in Shep but their chars and the worlds they occupied are diverse and vastly different. April ... April has her pains, her fears, her demons and her fate .. is unknown. I "live" this char through her diary, her thoughts as she was sent through a series of bewildering hoops that brought her up and then sent her crashing. I cannot help but feel for her as she struggled to find the answers. Sometimes, I wanna reach out and shake her; go*damn it April, come to your senses, What's the matter with you? You have suffered, yes, but this, this isn't you. You are better than this. And yet, I understood why, all the possible reasons why she would take the stance she did and it pains me to think of what she went through. When the game / story came to an end, I have only a thought; live April, you must live. You have tried so hard. There is no justice, no fairness to it all in the years you have fought, to come to this. 

Tis really good writing on the author's part if he can evoke such feelings for a char and such a  slew of mysteries that sent the fans going up and down, trying to figure everything out with the clues tossed out in the dialogues and other stuff in the game.


Shepard is different. There's actually very little to let one know what really makes her tick (for me anyways). I only know she is stubborn, with a unshakable will that she will fight to the very end. To save the galaxy. That is the gerneral aspect of this char. I view Shep as a strong leader with all the best qualities there are and there lies the problem. Where / what are her weaknesses?  Her behaviour to her crew, the ppl she encountered, the various decisions she took, as directed by the players, determined the personality of this char. A personality that's ...tangible only on the surface. I feel the writers for ME is really missing a great opportunity to fully flesh out Shapard (femShep). They have the money to make a trilogy for this char / story but they are not up to par with another with little $$ to work with, not so great gameplay (downright retarded fightouts and movements) and yet wrote and created great chars along with great voice acting.  If the ending in ME3 is bad, I would be sad but it would not evoke that feeling of lost and grief as April Ryan did.


/snip

*images will be removed in 24

P.S. Dreamfall is the sequel to TLJ and does not fully introduce players to April Ryan, her background or explain concisely why she was where she was in DF. She became a secondary char in DF as a new protaganist (which upset many TLJ fans) was intro for DF.

Jun'Ko Zane (Juni) is one of my favourite characters in games. She's not player character but it doesn't really matter.



Video:
Freelancer - Meeting Jun'Ko Zane the first time

Hale really rocked in that game.

Modifié par Tup3xi, 08 octobre 2011 - 05:10 .

[thompsmt]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

My "Take?"

FemShep allows a lot more personalization of the character than DudeShep because there is no one true Shepard shown in advertising that you almost expect to see being played.  Also, I've found Jen Hale's performance of Shepard's lines more emotional than Meer's.  Even the most stoic professional emotes on occasion, and the human touch she provides makes the game better.

[NM7]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

I would say Jennifer Hale's voice acting was the thing that initially made FemShep such an interesting character. I played through ME1 for the first time with default ManShep and while I enjoyed the story, setting and characters, Shepard felt a little bit boring and flat.

When I played the game for a second time using a female Commander Shepard things were much more interesting. The dialogue, story, etc were all the same but the whole game was just better with FemShep. She felt like a real person, rather than an avatar. At the time my Shepard (who has long since been binned, the poor girl), had no personality or backstory. I just did what I wanted with regard to choices and conversation options. Even then she was still an interesting character. The fact Shepard was a woman made no difference to how the story played out, or how NPCs interacted with her. It didn't matter. She was just Shepard. Of course now that I have a Shepard with her own personality and backstory, I love her even more. She's also unique to me. Everyone plays through the same story, but my Shepard is mine and the way she progresses through the game's story is different for me than for everyone else.

If it wasn't for FemShep I don't think I would be such a big fan of the Mass Effect series. They're great games, but she makes them stand out from the crowd for me.

[Quething]

It's true, one cannot overstate the importance of Hale. I think that's one of the reasons BioWare has become so well known as "great storytellers" despite stories that often aren't all that great; they've cultivated a fantastic stable of voice actors, and it makes such a huge difference.

I do think that's one place where the "girliness" of femShep may actually provide an advantage, come to think of it; Meer's actually a fantastic voice actor (does anyone not love Jethann or Niftu Cal? anyone? Bueller?), they just seem to want him to be flat and useless as Shep for some reason. I suspect that reason is that "badass space marines don't have emotions." But femShep is a girl, so she's allowed to have a bit more passion, because girls are silly emotional things even if they are marines.

(Also, she smirks better than dudeShep. XD)

[Sable Phoenix]

A couple new screenshots of Jessica, just because until last night I haven't put her on this thread for maybe twenty pages at least.


"Are you my mummy?"


"Muuuummyyyy..."

(I recently watched the creepy Dr. Who episode "The Empty Child", which the captions are a reference to, for anyone who doesn't get it.)

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 08 octobre 2011 - 08:39 .

[Shadow_Soul]

Sable Phoenix wrote...
(I recently watched the creepy Dr. Who episode "The Empty Child", which the captions are a reference to, for anyone who doesn't get it.)

Yes, that episode is kinda creepy. Though wait for the Weeping Angels, maker those things are.....creepy to say the least. Yeah, I'm a HUGE Doctor Who and TorchWood fan.


Lili: Holy sh*t! A flying blue box! Guys look!
Zaeed (off screen) : I don't see anything but goddamn fire, Commander.
Garrus (off screen) : Shepard, you've been watching too many vids.
Lili: No seriously. It muct be the Doctor. Oh that'd be awesome. Maybe Captain Jack is with him! Or Donna!
Zaeed and Garrus (off screen) :.....

[Sinapus]

@Shadow: "I'm Commander Shepard and you're the biggest library in the universe. Look me up."

(If we're mashing stories together, that is.) *evil grin*

Edit: Though, "Hello. I'm Commander Shepard. Basically: RUN!" also works.

Modifié par Sinapus, 08 octobre 2011 - 09:30 .

[Shadow_Soul]

@Sinapus
YES! So much win! Ooh and "Trust me, I'm commander Shepard."

[Sinapus]

"Run."

[Sable Phoenix]

Shadow_Soul wrote...
Yes, that episode is kinda creepy. Though wait for the Weeping Angels, maker those things are.....creepy to say the least. Yeah, I'm a HUGE Doctor Who and TorchWood fan.

Oh I know about them already.  "Blink" is one of the best episodes of television I've ever seen.

[100k]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

It's everything, I guess. I don't like to say "femShep is X, Y, and Z" because I know that that doesn't apply to everyone's Shepard. However, the wide range of possibilities that anyone can give her, in personality, in casual life, in sexualization, in combat, in odd or funny situations, all of it is very entertaining. I no longer see femShep as an individual who has a wide range of personalities and appearances. I see femShep as "they", and they are all different. We are no longer many eyes looking at the same thing. We are many eyes looking at many things.

As to the actual work put out there (CGI, anime, cartoons, comics, etc etc)... certainly there is some stuff that I like more than others, but I will never say that one style, or one artist, or one moment isn't femShep appropriate. 

I may not like it all, but I appreciate it all. People put in hard work, not only for their CCs, but their expanded universes as well. I'd have to be a real ass to tell them that they are "wrong".

<3

[ADLegend21]

JamieCOTC wrote...

So, femShep seems to have a lot of passion surrounding her, fanfic, fanart, pics, photomanips, rants, praise, opinions, snide remarks and even a website.

Why? What's your take on the "femShep phenomenon?" Is it just the voice or is it more? Does it matter? If so, why?

Well the phenomenon is that it showed me just how much females were into gaming. In my first few years of XBL, I never really ran across girls, and when I did they were ditzy and sucked (excluding my Halo run in with the PMS Clan, who are phenomenally talented) but coming on here and seeing the thread, and the community was invigorating and partially the reason Iw as so addicted to ME because I could play ME and then hop on here and chat about it from all angles. It made the same 30-60 mission more enjoyable each time even though I knew exactly what was going to happen and when it was going to happen. Plus it lets you explore the human psyche. I've created shepard's of different backgrounds, ethnicities, mental faculties, and degrees of badass. It's wuite amazing.