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[TMA LIVE]

tmk wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

Yana Montana wrote...

Tali is such a tease! She flirts with FemShep shamelessly and then what... nothing!

Lol. What was that line she told femshep? "Last time I was (something) with my bosh'tet Captain, I took the ship name and everything!"

When does she say that? The last thing I remember from her is something along the lines of "I'd love to... umm... link our suit environments...  I mean if you were a quarian and we weren't on a mission! :innocent:"

Ask if she's blushing. 

[Valentyna]

Double Post... somehow

Modifié par Valentyna, 26 juillet 2010 - 04:23 .

[Fraevar]

mashavasilec wrote...

 poor dudeshep, nobody asks him about his feelings. and here we go talking about how femshep romance suck 

Warning: Game design critisism incoming:


Actually it's not so much about having that particular line. It's more the fact that Shepard, male or female gets zero character development in ME2. You could argue that this applies across the board for most of the crew, but for discussion purposes let's keep the focus on Shepard.

BioWare spent all this time saying how this game would be about re-discovering the nature of humanity and they then go to all the trouble of creating that lavish intro of Shepard getting blown into space. And they then proceed to do...nothing with it, at all. They use it to skip ahead two years, and then they have Shepard and most characters (asides from shopkeepers, apparently) ignore it ever happened. That annoys me, because it makes Shepard less interesting. It turns Shepard into a cardboard cutout (though Hale manages to inject enough personal quirks into her VO performance to offset this a bit for femShep) who doesn't really have anything to say or do about anything that happens to her.

And to me, that's just bad character writing. BioWare keeps going on and on about how the defined protagonist lets them be more "cinematic" in their approach, but in the case of Shepard they failed the number one rule of cinema: Giving the protagonist a personal journey to go on, and let them grow as a result of it.

And hey, even if Garrus and Tali were to ask if Shepard were doing ok, you could've still put in the option of just saying: "I'm fine, don't worry about it." if you didn't want to go through the scene.

But I do think it feels like BioWare completely forgot to further develop Shepard as a character, or rather - giving the player the option of doing so, if they wish - and that's ultimately my major annoyance with ME2: The death-plot could have been used for some really great developments, but BioWare just completely drops the ball on it after you get aboard the SR2.

[Nynaeve]

Jade Elf wrote...

JamieCOTC wrote...

rynluna wrote...

I am freaking out!!!!!!
FemShep at Comic Con

That was awesome!!! 

Awesome indeed!

That gave me goosebumps.

That is by far the most amazing thing I have ever seen in my life...major win...wow....just wow:O:O:O

[Fiery Phoenix]

Female Shepard and Thane goodness:

[tmk]

 Code?

[JamieCOTC]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

mashavasilec wrote...

 poor dudeshep, nobody asks him about his feelings. and here we go talking about how femshep romance suck 

Warning: Game design critisism incoming:


Actually it's not so much about having that particular line. It's more the fact that Shepard, male or female gets zero character development in ME2. You could argue that this applies across the board for most of the crew, but for discussion purposes let's keep the focus on Shepard.

BioWare spent all this time saying how this game would be about re-discovering the nature of humanity and they then go to all the trouble of creating that lavish intro of Shepard getting blown into space. And they then proceed to do...nothing with it, at all. They use it to skip ahead two years, and then they have Shepard and most characters (asides from shopkeepers, apparently) ignore it ever happened. That annoys me, because it makes Shepard less interesting. It turns Shepard into a cardboard cutout (though Hale manages to inject enough personal quirks into her VO performance to offset this a bit for femShep) who doesn't really have anything to say or do about anything that happens to her.

And to me, that's just bad character writing. BioWare keeps going on and on about how the defined protagonist lets them be more "cinematic" in their approach, but in the case of Shepard they failed the number one rule of cinema: Giving the protagonist a personal journey to go on, and let them grow as a result of it.

And hey, even if Garrus and Tali were to ask if Shepard were doing ok, you could've still put in the option of just saying: "I'm fine, don't worry about it." if you didn't want to go through the scene.

But I do think it feels like BioWare completely forgot to further develop Shepard as a character, or rather - giving the player the option of doing so, if they wish - and that's ultimately my major annoyance with ME2: The death-plot could have been used for some really great developments, but BioWare just completely drops the ball on it after you get aboard the SR2.

Oh, god.  I could not agree more.  Makes me want to do a Streets of San Francisco parady for ME2. 

Mass Effect 2

Starring - Martin Sheen

Also starring - Yvonne Strahovski!

With Guest Stars - Carrie-Anne Moss, Adam Baldwin, Tricia Helfer, and Seth Green!

Special Guest Star - Jennifer Hale as Commander Shepard!

Tonight's Episode - The Collectors!

[Fraevar]

Oooooh, oooooh! Doo eeeeet, Jamie!



And great art, FieryPhoenix

[Valentyna]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

Female Shepard and Thane goodness:

Hmm!  New wallpaper!  XD

[Valentyna]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

mashavasilec wrote...

 poor dudeshep, nobody asks him about his feelings. and here we go talking about how femshep romance suck 

Warning: Game design critisism incoming:


Actually it's not so much about having that particular line. It's more the fact that Shepard, male or female gets zero character development in ME2. You could argue that this applies across the board for most of the crew, but for discussion purposes let's keep the focus on Shepard.

BioWare spent all this time saying how this game would be about re-discovering the nature of humanity and they then go to all the trouble of creating that lavish intro of Shepard getting blown into space. And they then proceed to do...nothing with it, at all. They use it to skip ahead two years, and then they have Shepard and most characters (asides from shopkeepers, apparently) ignore it ever happened. That annoys me, because it makes Shepard less interesting. It turns Shepard into a cardboard cutout (though Hale manages to inject enough personal quirks into her VO performance to offset this a bit for femShep) who doesn't really have anything to say or do about anything that happens to her.

And to me, that's just bad character writing. BioWare keeps going on and on about how the defined protagonist lets them be more "cinematic" in their approach, but in the case of Shepard they failed the number one rule of cinema: Giving the protagonist a personal journey to go on, and let them grow as a result of it.

And hey, even if Garrus and Tali were to ask if Shepard were doing ok, you could've still put in the option of just saying: "I'm fine, don't worry about it." if you didn't want to go through the scene.

But I do think it feels like BioWare completely forgot to further develop Shepard as a character, or rather - giving the player the option of doing so, if they wish - and that's ultimately my major annoyance with ME2: The death-plot could have been used for some really great developments, but BioWare just completely drops the ball on it after you get aboard the SR2.

I could not agree more, really.  Not that I want Shepard to spend the whole game crying, or anything.  In fact, it hasn't been very long for _her_ at all, I suppose (she just woke up).  But I just can't help thinking she's either coping, or repressing, _awfully_ well for someone who wakes up in an enemy facility, their last memory being a horrific (and certainly violent) death by vacume exposure, and finds themselves more or less hung out to dry by everyone they used to work for.

*Le sigh*  Ahh well...

[Fraevar]

Valentyna wrote...

I could not agree more, really.  Not that I want Shepard to spend the whole game crying, or anything.  In fact, it hasn't been very long for _her_ at all, I suppose (she just woke up).  But I just can't help thinking she's either coping, or repressing, _awfully_ well for someone who wakes up in an enemy facility, their last memory being a horrific (and certainly violent) death by vacume exposure, and finds themselves more or less hung out to dry by everyone they used to work for.

*Le sigh*  Ahh well...

I think this is where a lot of people wrongfully equate self-reflection or conflict with emo. It doesn't need to be, and I just think it would make sense for Shepard to actually need to reflect on the fact that she died and everyone she cared about moved on with their lives. She deals with everyone's issues, except her own, which doesn't really make sense if you have old friends around. There was plenty of opportunity for Garrus, Tali or Kelly to try to get more inside Shepard's head there.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Glad you guys liked the picture, though allow me to point out that it is NOT by me. Someone posted it in the Thane thread a while back, and I've had it saved since. Might as well share it in the official FemShep thread. :-)

[ADLegend21]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

Valentyna wrote...

I could not agree more, really.  Not that I want Shepard to spend the whole game crying, or anything.  In fact, it hasn't been very long for _her_ at all, I suppose (she just woke up).  But I just can't help thinking she's either coping, or repressing, _awfully_ well for someone who wakes up in an enemy facility, their last memory being a horrific (and certainly violent) death by vacume exposure, and finds themselves more or less hung out to dry by everyone they used to work for.

*Le sigh*  Ahh well...

I think this is where a lot of people wrongfully equate self-reflection or conflict with emo. It doesn't need to be, and I just think it would make sense for Shepard to actually need to reflect on the fact that she died and everyone she cared about moved on with their lives. She deals with everyone's issues, except her own, which doesn't really make sense if you have old friends around. There was plenty of opportunity for Garrus, Tali or Kelly to try to get more inside Shepard's head there.

This is true but if you really Think about it, Shepard's a 31 year old Man/woman Who's a hardened veteran of wars so there's not much you can do to develop that (b esides the venting in the Jacob romance) Mass effect 1 tried it's damndest with the history quests (mindoir survivor, former crew mate of your mother, guy from the 10th street reds) but you're not gonna see a war veteran having a pity party or ****ing about something that happened, especially when they're the most influential force in teh galaxy (screw the council, shepard could turn the citadel against them if he/she wanted to) it's really hard to develop a character who's actions (which speak louder than words) aren't set in stone. the way I "develop" my Shepards is to have them go through Me1 as either majortiy paragon or renegade, then switching in Me2 because Death changes their view on life.

[Fraevar]

ADLegend21 wrote...

This is true but if you really Think about it, Shepard's a 31 year old Man/woman Who's a hardened veteran of wars so there's not much you can do to develop that (b esides the venting in the Jacob romance) Mass effect 1 tried it's damndest with the history quests (mindoir survivor, former crew mate of your mother, guy from the 10th street reds) but you're not gonna see a war veteran having a pity party or ****ing about something that happened, especially when they're the most influential force in teh galaxy (screw the council, shepard could turn the citadel against them if he/she wanted to) it's really hard to develop a character who's actions (which speak louder than words) aren't set in stone. the way I "develop" my Shepards is to have them go through Me1 as either majortiy paragon or renegade, then switching in Me2 because Death changes their view on life.

But they could have definately done more with it than a couple of one-liners. Planescape Torment is a great example of a game where there's a lot of self-reflection going on without it becoming emo.
Even if she's a hardened war veteran who would be ok with dying to save her crew, I doubt she would just be 100% ok with being brought back by a terrorist group, being half cybernetic and seeing that almost everyone basically forgot all about her. There was great potential for a good subplot given the less-than-human nature of ME2 Shep, and that's what I felt BioWare dropped the ball on.

[ADLegend21]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

This is true but if you really Think about it, Shepard's a 31 year old Man/woman Who's a hardened veteran of wars so there's not much you can do to develop that (b esides the venting in the Jacob romance) Mass effect 1 tried it's damndest with the history quests (mindoir survivor, former crew mate of your mother, guy from the 10th street reds) but you're not gonna see a war veteran having a pity party or ****ing about something that happened, especially when they're the most influential force in teh galaxy (screw the council, shepard could turn the citadel against them if he/she wanted to) it's really hard to develop a character who's actions (which speak louder than words) aren't set in stone. the way I "develop" my Shepards is to have them go through Me1 as either majortiy paragon or renegade, then switching in Me2 because Death changes their view on life.

But they could have definately done more with it than a couple of one-liners. Planescape Torment is a great example of a game where there's a lot of self-reflection going on without it becoming emo.
Even if she's a hardened war veteran who would be ok with dying to save her crew, I doubt she would just be 100% ok with being brought back by a terrorist group, being half cybernetic and seeing that almost everyone basically forgot all about her. There was great potential for a good subplot given the less-than-human nature of ME2 Shep, and that's what I felt BioWare dropped the ball on.

But she's not half cybernetic, there are some cybernetics (and biotic implants for some classes)but she's mostly organic with cloned tissue and such and it's not that much different than the gene therapy every human goes through and what would this subplot be?

[Fraevar]

ADLegend21 wrote...

But she's not half cybernetic, there are some cybernetics (and biotic implants for some classes)but she's mostly organic with cloned tissue and such and it's not that much different than the gene therapy every human goes through and what would this subplot be?

That she died and nothing she did mattered? Gene therapy is one thing, and granted - the cybernetics thing is only something we know because we've seen how it turns out if you go Renegade. Space marine or not, I just don't see it feasable that anyone would keep going without batting an eyelash after spending two years dead. The only people who do that are action stereotypes in fiction, and I just wish that BioWare would start writing Shepard as more than that.

[tmk]

Well, it is more or less of an action game, and Shepard kinda gets a running start right from the, well, start, without much time to brood on things.

And a game isn't really the best medium for exploring this kind of stuff. Especially not a roleplaying game, where it's more or less up to you to decide how your character feels and how [s]he deals with it, and "exploring it" could make players feel even more like they're dragged along someone else's story rather than making their own.

And the subject is really rather complicated for the "three choices of saying the same thing" dialog system of Mass Effect (and probably for more advanced dialog systems as well).

Modifié par tmk, 26 juillet 2010 - 06:07 .

[ADLegend21]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

But she's not half cybernetic, there are some cybernetics (and biotic implants for some classes)but she's mostly organic with cloned tissue and such and it's not that much different than the gene therapy every human goes through and what would this subplot be?

That she died and nothing she did mattered? Gene therapy is one thing, and granted - the cybernetics thing is only something we know because we've seen how it turns out if you go Renegade. Space marine or not, I just don't see it feasable that anyone would keep going without batting an eyelash after spending two years dead. The only people who do that are action stereotypes in fiction, and I just wish that BioWare would start writing Shepard as more than that.

true, but she really doesn't have time to be all "woe is me, I'm sad that I died and no on remembered me waaaaah" She's got colonists to save and Collectors to kill, She even says "this mission is bigger than our lives" so She's obviously come to grips with being dead then being brought back to life and She appreciates what Cerberus did for her. It suck that the council backslid on the reapers but they don't want to beleive it even though they saw one and they'll just dismiss any evidence shepard brings (Hell I postponed the meeting until AFTEr I finished the suicide mission and brought Legion and they called him "a Trophy bot" then I told them to take their offer of being a specter and shove it up their asses.

[Fraevar]

ADLegend21 wrote...

true, but she really doesn't have time to be all "woe is me, I'm sad that I died and no on remembered me waaaaah" She's got colonists to save and Collectors to kill, She even says "this mission is bigger than our lives" so She's obviously come to grips with being dead then being brought back to life and She appreciates what Cerberus did for her. It suck that the council backslid on the reapers but they don't want to beleive it even though they saw one and they'll just dismiss any evidence shepard brings (Hell I postponed the meeting until AFTEr I finished the suicide mission and brought Legion and they called him "a Trophy bot" then I told them to take their offer of being a specter and shove it up their asses.

And there we run into two real problems:
  1) The weakness of the Collector plot. There is never any real sense of urgency here and the Collectors never make a big enough impression for Shepard to cast aside everything and go chasing blindly after them. Only reason she does so is because TIM tells her to, thus reducing her to errand girl.

  2) Yes it sucks that the Council backslid on the Reaper menace, but why are they still completely unwilling to hear Shepard out? And since we have samples for Mordin to play with, wouldn't it be easy to just take one of those bugs to Anderson and tell him that hey, this is what it's about?

You say that Shepard's come to grips with this, and other say it's either that or she's repressing somethin' fierce. I think it could be either, my point is that since this is supposed to be a living, breathing protagonist that BioWare should let us make that choice. They shouldn't gloss it over, but let us take Shepard through that conflict. And like I said, it's easy to just make it a situation where players can opt out of doing it, if they don't feel like it. It doesn't have to be emo, or OOC for her, but I just think it's necessary to move her from template to a real cinema-like protagonist.

That's my 2 cents on it, anyways

And so as to not go OT, here's a bit of femShep magic, courtesy of AkodoRyu (SP?)



Source

[JamieCOTC]

- Another video of Holly Conrad's femShep at Comicon.

[jlb524]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

And so as to not go OT, here's a bit of femShep magic, courtesy of AkodoRyu (SP?)



Source

Niiiice!

[JamieCOTC]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...


And so as to not go OT, here's a bit of femShep magic, courtesy of AkodoRyu (SP?)



Source

Va-Va-VOOOOOMMM!!!